Solid high protein diet = high fat too?

[Melinco 1]

Have any of you who are doing a high Protein / low carb pre-op diet with solid foods noticed that the higher the level of protein, the more fat you intake?

I'm not a big fish eater, although I will eat tilapia with no problems, but even if I trim the fat off a pork loin or a steak, or even have a boneless skinless chicken breast, while great in protein, it still has quite a bit of fat.

Do any of you find a problem with this? Does your liver still shrink despite the increased intake in fat? Or is it all related to your carb levels?

My dietician told me to aim for about 150 grams of carbs a day and 105 grams of protein a day. Does the carb level seem high to you? I'm getting most of my carbs in the way of a piece of fruit, veggies, and one day I did have Pasta, but I haven't had any bread since last Tuesday. I guess my surgeon doesn't want me to do any protein supplements at all.

[LindaD 3]

Yes, higher Protein means higher fat, in general, because many of our major Protein sources also have fat.

But in the absence of carbs (or with restricted carb intake), the fat doesn't make you fat.

Many low-carb people lose a lot of weight while eating diets that have way more fat than the typical person would accept.

In fact, many surgeons require severely restricted carb diets as the way to shrink the liver.

There are some good threads on this topic around the board - use the search function and you'll get to read a lot of info about it, even if you don't get a ton of responses to this post.

Good luck!

[Jachut 487]

I think that Protein first and lower carb makes a lot of sense scientifically for weight loss.

In reality, when you read the "what did you eat today" thread, in the average person, Protein first often leads to a truly HORRIBLE diet. Processed animal based foods as the basis of the diet is not healthy in anyone's book! Nobody eats enough vegetables, they all focus on meat, eggs, cheese, processed meats and processed Protein shakes.

This might work for weight loss but not for health. We need more of the good fats and much less saturated fat, hard to do unless you rely mainly on fish, and Protein Shakes - which lets face it are simply another processed food and not any healthier than anything else in large amounts.

Because I'm vocal on this and have always disagreed with it, I've often had pm's from people asking that if I dont do this, them what DO I eat. My diet is as far from perfect as anyone else's and I also eat too much junk, too many processed foods and probably too many carbs.

BUT - I've had at least 50 people over the 4 years I've been here pm me to complain that their blood chemistry has worsened markedly in their year after banding. That's serious. Banding should improve our health, not worsen it, and high protein low carb can improve things in many people. But it can also make it a lot worse.

I dont know any of the answers, I'm no expert, but my personal view is that moderation is the key, dont follow ANY eating philosophy full on until there's utter proof that its the right way to eat for optimum health.

[Melinco 1]

Hi Jachut,

I've read many of your posts, and what you say makes a lot of sense.

During this time before banding, I'm using the solid food high Protein low carb diet to shrink my liver, rather than as a new "life style" for me. I expect once I get my band and have healed, then I am going to eat everything in moderation (or eat what I can in moderation). The one thing I haven't decided up yet if I'm going to cut entirely from my diet post-band is bread. I think that will be more trial and error than anything else.

But for now, it's the high Protein low carb diet for me. Oh, and don't worry, I'm still getting lots of veggies in. Just not potatoes. I'm even eating one piece of fruit a day, but no fruit juice, in order to keep my sugar intake low.

[Jachut 487]

Oh for sure, we all have to do that pre op diet. But I think that's what people dont get. The pre op diet is the shrink the liver and nothign else. it is not meant to be a beacon for healthy eating for the rest of your life, no doctor claims (or should claim) that you reverse high blood pressure, high cholesterol or diabetes with it, its purely to shrink the liver.

And pre surgery, the benefits of shrinking the liver outweight any risks of eating that way, pure and simple.

that's not to say that high Protein, low carb eating cant be VERY healthy, it can. I think most humans could survive with bread, rice or Pasta.

[k-statearmywife 6]

Try vegetarian sources of Protein...they don't have high saturated fat contents like animal sources of Protein (they are superior)

here are some examples and grams of protein per serving size at this site (i tried to copy and paste and it didn't work out)

Protein in the Vegan Diet -- The Vegetarian Resource Group

Edited November 18, 2009 by k-statearmywife

[Ellisa 6]

I'm on a low carb diet as well currently eating below 20 net carbs per day (subtract fiber).

Interestingly I did Atkins (not the induction plan but the on-going weight loss plan) for 2 years at one point and all of my chemistry and vitals improved (though they were in the normal range to begin with).

Of course it was difficult to maintain and once off the wagon I regained all I had lost. With friends. The nice thing about the band, when I go off plan, I don't gain and so it's easier to get back on track because I don't have that discouragement of gaining 10 lbs in a weekend. LOL

When I compared what I ate "normally" (choke choke) my fat intake actually went down low carbing. No fried cheese sticks, no bread to put butter on... you get the picture. And my Protein was about the same (pre-band Atkins).

The only thing I try to avoid is sugar and simple/starchy carbs (white flour, potatoes, rice, pasta). I eat far more healthy veggies and I also eat regular dairy products (not low fat), eggs, berries, pumpkin, flax seed meal, and other lower carb items.

Of course my portions are much smaller with the band, so that makes getting my Protein in (recommended above 60 by my dietitian) a little tougher with my band. But the veggies seem to go down very well.

I also take a daily Vitamin and Calcium supliment which I probably needed more when I was... ah hem, eating "normally." I don't like shakes or bars (flavor/texture thing). I will rarely drink a low carb slim fast for "emergency" situations, but I don't drink them on a daily or even weekly basis. I've drank maybe 4 in a year.

Is my fat-to-carb ratio high? Yes, but if I were eating the same number of servings of starchy/sugary foods as I used to, the ratio would be very low, even with the reduced portion size.

I have great labs, blood pressure is normal, sugar normal. And have all my life even at my heaviest. Let's not forget genetics.

Moderation, moderation, moderation, it really is the key... If I could only follow that advice all the time.

[BetsyB 9]

Jachut, it's pretty tricky, given a banded stomach, to exceed "moderation" when it comes to ANY food.

I think you'd be pretty hard-pressed to find ANY medical or nutrition expert who agreed with you that a diet focused on lean Protein, vegetables, legumes, and a bit of fruit (and even whole grains in moderation)--PARTICULARLY in the amounts permitted by gastric banding--leads to a "truly horrible diet."

I am glad you do well with your version of "moderation." I don't plan to make vanilla slices a part of mine, and am quite certain my health will not suffer as a result.

[LindaD 3]

I also followed an Atkin's type plan for 2 years and lost a pretty good amount of weight and my blood lipids improved SIGNIFICANTLY. I don't disbelieve that others have some different result, and can only share what my own experiences were.

I stay pretty low carb these days. Not Atkins induction levels or anything, but typically about 100 grams or less per day. This type of eating, together with the help from my band, is giving me what I seek.

I hope each and every person here finds that for themselves.

[ElfiePoo 109]

My dietician told me to aim for about 150 grams of carbs a day and 105 grams of Protein a day. Does the carb level seem high to you? I'm getting most of my carbs in the way of a piece of fruit, veggies, and one day I did have Pasta, but I haven't had any bread since last Tuesday. I guess my surgeon doesn't want me to do any Protein supplements at all.

If you eat low carb, you can safely eat high fat according to all the studies that are being done...but low carb is below 60gm with the bulk of those carbs being in vegetables. If you're going to eat 150 grams of carbs, that's not low carb and I'd definitely be watching your fat levels. I only eat 60gm and, again based on studies, there's no real need to eat much more than that. Not only does our body not store protein...but excess protein can cause a glucogenic effect in the body. A problem for diabetics and insulin resistant folks.