Health Care

[ariscus99 1]

Where did I say those things? Don't drag my name into this to try to make your case. I make contributions to many charities, too, and they are great to SUPPLEMENT the government programs that help the least among us. But there is no way, NO WAY, that private charities can even begin to address the HUGE needs of the poor in this country. The need for housing, food, healthcare is enormous and charities do help but they don't have the resources to do it all. That is why we need the government programs. That is who we are as a country. When others look to us I want them to see a compassionate country who helps the least among us, whether they are disabled, poor, homeless or in need of healthcare.

From the Hypocrisy of Republicans/Conservatives thread, post 137

You're just another angry, mean-spirited young conservative who thinks everything he got he earned but other people are leeches on society. A dime a dozen.

[BJean 16]

Pure and simple ka-ka-doody. Nice piece of propaganda but sorry, it just doesn't wash.

Stand out of the way and let the people who CAN fix America, get the job done. We've had plenty of your kind of thinking and we all know where it brought us.

This so reminiscent of when the Republicans had the white house under Reagen and Clinton took office. Just get the hell out of the way and wait your turn to screw it up again, please!

[ariscus99 1]

Pure and simple ka-ka-doody. Nice piece of propaganda but sorry, it just doesn't wash.

Stand out of the way and let the people who CAN fix America, get the job done. We've had plenty of your kind of thinking and we all know where it brought us.

This so reminiscent of when the Republicans had the white house under Reagen and Clinton took office. Just get the hell out of the way and wait your turn to screw it up again, please!

November isn't far off.

[Cleo's Mom 257]

From the Hypocrisy of Republicans/Conservatives thread, post 137

That's not what you claimed I said.

[Cleo's Mom 257]

Pure and simple ka-ka-doody. Nice piece of propaganda but sorry, it just doesn't wash.

Stand out of the way and let the people who CAN fix America, get the job done. We've had plenty of your kind of thinking and we all know where it brought us.

This so reminiscent of when the Republicans had the white house under Reagen and Clinton took office. Just get the hell out of the way and wait your turn to screw it up again, please!

Exactly. And as the American people see how this healthcare reform is actually going to play out, they will see how the right wing has lied about it.

So, while America is celebrating this historic program, the angry republicans can be hunkering down, spewing forth their hate with calls of fire Pelosi, impeach Obama, repeal healthcare. I welcome them to run on this hate filled, angry, repeal healthcare, party of no platform. I will even help them get this message out. I already have my letter to the editor in mind.

[ariscus99 1]

That's not what you claimed I said.

It's part of what you said, and you right, I confused what you and BJ said, you all have the same talking points and she rides your coattails so often it's easy to confuse the two of you. But you are right. You said the young mean spirited part and she said the wouldn't help my neighbor, part.

[loserbob 11]

Sanjay Gupta seems to support this plan, He and Obama, good enough for me!

[loserbob 11]

Reform proponents have cited the CBO analysis as evidence that the reforms will bring federal budget deficits down substantially in the decade beginning in 2020, for example. But CBO itself is careful to qualify its forecast.

"It is unclear whether such a reduction in the growth rate of [Medicare] spending could be achieved, and if so, whether it would be accomplished through greater efficiencies in the delivery of health care or through reductions in access to care or the quality of care," the agency says in its report.

When the CBO supports reps point of view, theyre all for it. When it goes against theyre beliefs its a "biased extension of the left wing!

[loserbob 11]

It's funny how everyone profiles you no matter what they actually know or don't know. For instance; yes I'm 25, however I do have a wife and family, she just completed her master’s degree and is a teacher, working a state paid job, with great benefits, I'm a firefighter, I work for a dept that is social security exempt, which I have done since I was 18. During that time I was able to pay for myself, and my wife to go to college, graduate school for her, I'll probably be attending grad school in the next year and a half or so, paid cash for a house, have nice cars, nice things, live the "American dream", still have a nice savings and no credit card debt. But because I'm 25 I get lumped in with every other 25 years old, some of whom have no common sense, no work ethic, little to no morals, and rely heavily on the government for everything. You see them marching for things like tuition increases. Guess what, when the cost of everything else is going up, so will tuition, get a job and stop crying about it. I've never understood the mentality of hand outs. I don't want one, and it would have to be dire circumstances for me to except one, and I would want to pay it back.

People like cleo's mom say I have no compassion, I'm young and mean, and don't want to help my fellow American out. She says I wouldn't help my neighbor if they were down and out. What she and most liberals don't get, for one reason or another isn't that conservatives don't want to help people; it's that most of us don't want to be forced to help people. Let us do it of our own free will, don't tax me to help someone all the while telling me how evil I am for not wanting to help. I'd love to help, I regularly make large donations to different charities, one of my favorites is the wishing tree's at Christmas time, my wife and I ever since we started dating have participated in that, it was one of our first Christmas dates, we picked 5 children and 5 seniors to buy presents for. Because it was something we chose to do on our own. Had barry obama sent me a list of 1 child and 1 senior I had to buy gifts for, I probably wouldn't have, or would have done the bare minimum. I help because I want to, not because I'm told to.

Health care is the same idea, why shouldn't we deregulate some, open healthcare across state borders, do massive tort reform, I read a report on tort reform that was put out there, the only number included in that was money paid out for lawsuits each year. So when you here the dems cry out, it would only be 2%, that’s nothing, well yeah, 2% is nothing, that only a little less than the profit the ins. companies make. But when you factor in doctors mal-practice premiums, the cost of extra test doctors run for fear of being sued etc, etc, that 2% I believe, though the data isn't out there to support me yet, would climb significantly, which if you cut that out, premiums would fall significantly, opening across state borders, creates much higher supply, which if we all remember 4th grade economics, greater supply, less demand, equals lower prices.

Now I work in an ER part time as well, and see the costs of things there, and most are just outrageous, my father-in-law is the CFO of a major hospital in CA and swears the prices are justified because of the cost of doing business(by the way before any greed comments come out, the hospitals he works for are not for profit, which means they have no investors, so they aren’t driving up prices to help out the fat cat wall street investors who are backing the hospital), especially in CA, for example the net cost to build or add on to a hospital, because of all the red tape, taxes, and things you must do in CA, comes in at cool $1 million per bed, well someone has to pay for that so it gets transferred into healthcare cost which push up the cost of premiums, decrease some of these overhead costs to the hospitals, and you’ll decrease costs of the medical care, which will decrease costs of premiums. And all the while you’re not forcing anyone to pay to do anything.

How about fining people who don’t have medical coverage, what a crock that is. I read the argument on here, “everyone needs it”, well no, not true, I know lots of people who are into the 50’s and 60’s who lead active healthy lifestyles who’ve never needed it, rarely go to the dr for more than a checkup which they can pay out of pocket, all you have to do is save and be financially responsible. So why should that person have to have coverage or risk being fined.

And what about the threat of doctors leaving the medical field? Now I have to say I don’t think it’s a very real threat, but if it was, and if like the NE J of M poll said, happens, and over 40% of doctors leave, that would destroy our medical field. I work with several doctors on a regular basis as well as see my personal doctors regularly and I’m still yet to hear one who thinks this healthcare reform is a good idea. Health care reform in general? Yes, it needs to happen, this particular recipe of reform? No, it’s garbage, says most of them.

The tax increases. Only on the wealthiest Americans, the dems say. However the level that makes an American, the wealthiest of them keeps inching down. I’m lucky enough to be in a field that pays phenomenally, my wife is a teacher, so as everyone knows it doesn’t pay that great, however, she does have her master’s degree and a special education credential, she teaches mild to moderate special education, being specialized in that field, earns her a higher salary, so this year, we’re in risk of becoming part of that group of the wealthiest Americans. So now, not only are we going to be paying much higher taxes in general, we’ll also being paying even more taxes to support obamacare. We aren’t rich; we’ve both worked very hard, have got into demanding fields, and would like to reap the benefits of this. However, we’re being penalized for it. We’re just two working class folks, a firemen and a teacher, but here we are paying more in taxes that 20% or Americans will ever pay in taxes. So what does this make us want to do? Well it makes her not want to teach anymore, because if she stops teaching we’ll fall back under the 200k mark and won’t have to pay the extra taxes. She’s a great teacher, loves the children she works with, was blessed with the patience to be able to work with children with special needs, but is getting penalized for it. So she’ll probably work this year, then quit, so we don’t have to pay 50% of our income to taxes. She’ll be a stay at home mom, someone else will have to go through 6 years of college to take her position, and hopefully that person doesn’t have a spouse with a good job or they’ll be in the same position.

Patty again Im so glad you worked you a$$ off to get where your at! Im sorry I keep looking for handouts but the numbers and info you find is unbelievable. With all this talk and now reform bill passing(YES!!!) why do the insurance companies keep raiseing their prices at a time when everyone is hurting(except for you, you worked your a$$ off and now reaping the rewards,KUDOS to you). Whats going to happen when insurance companies raise prices so high most people cant afford it anymore. We're almost there! Whats your attitude going to be when your employer tells you your going to have to pay a couple hundred more a month to keep coverage. Ya, you wont have to worry about it because the "Anti-Christ" took care of it for you. Theres really something wrong if you dont see a problem with the rapidly riseing costs!

[loserbob 11]

Patty again Im so glad you worked you a$$ off to get where your at! Im sorry I keep looking for handouts but the numbers and info you find is unbelievable. With all this talk and now reform bill passing(YES!!!) why do the insurance companies keep raiseing their prices at a time when everyone is hurting(except for you, you worked your a$$ off and now reaping the rewards,KUDOS to you). Whats going to happen when insurance companies raise prices so high most people cant afford it anymore. We're almost there! Whats your attitude going to be when your employer tells you your going to have to pay a couple hundred more a month to keep coverage. Ya, you wont have to worry about it because the "Anti-Christ" took care of it for you. Theres really something wrong if you dont see a problem with the rapidly riseing costs!

This was posted under the wrong person, Im sure you saw that , its meant for Patty.

[loserbob 11]

It's funny how everyone profiles you no matter what they actually know or don't know. For instance; yes I'm 25, however I do have a wife and family, she just completed her master’s degree and is a teacher, working a state paid job, with great benefits, I'm a firefighter, I work for a dept that is social security exempt, which I have done since I was 18. During that time I was able to pay for myself, and my wife to go to college, graduate school for her, I'll probably be attending grad school in the next year and a half or so, paid cash for a house, have nice cars, nice things, live the "American dream", still have a nice savings and no credit card debt. But because I'm 25 I get lumped in with every other 25 years old, some of whom have no common sense, no work ethic, little to no morals, and rely heavily on the government for everything. You see them marching for things like tuition increases. Guess what, when the cost of everything else is going up, so will tuition, get a job and stop crying about it. I've never understood the mentality of hand outs. I don't want one, and it would have to be dire circumstances for me to except one, and I would want to pay it back.

People like cleo's mom say I have no compassion, I'm young and mean, and don't want to help my fellow American out. She says I wouldn't help my neighbor if they were down and out. What she and most liberals don't get, for one reason or another isn't that conservatives don't want to help people; it's that most of us don't want to be forced to help people. Let us do it of our own free will, don't tax me to help someone all the while telling me how evil I am for not wanting to help. I'd love to help, I regularly make large donations to different charities, one of my favorites is the wishing tree's at Christmas time, my wife and I ever since we started dating have participated in that, it was one of our first Christmas dates, we picked 5 children and 5 seniors to buy presents for. Because it was something we chose to do on our own. Had barry obama sent me a list of 1 child and 1 senior I had to buy gifts for, I probably wouldn't have, or would have done the bare minimum. I help because I want to, not because I'm told to.

Health care is the same idea, why shouldn't we deregulate some, open healthcare across state borders, do massive tort reform, I read a report on tort reform that was put out there, the only number included in that was money paid out for lawsuits each year. So when you here the dems cry out, it would only be 2%, that’s nothing, well yeah, 2% is nothing, that only a little less than the profit the ins. companies make. But when you factor in doctors mal-practice premiums, the cost of extra test doctors run for fear of being sued etc, etc, that 2% I believe, though the data isn't out there to support me yet, would climb significantly, which if you cut that out, premiums would fall significantly, opening across state borders, creates much higher supply, which if we all remember 4th grade economics, greater supply, less demand, equals lower prices.

Now I work in an ER part time as well, and see the costs of things there, and most are just outrageous, my father-in-law is the CFO of a major hospital in CA and swears the prices are justified because of the cost of doing business(by the way before any greed comments come out, the hospitals he works for are not for profit, which means they have no investors, so they aren’t driving up prices to help out the fat cat wall street investors who are backing the hospital), especially in CA, for example the net cost to build or add on to a hospital, because of all the red tape, taxes, and things you must do in CA, comes in at cool $1 million per bed, well someone has to pay for that so it gets transferred into healthcare cost which push up the cost of premiums, decrease some of these overhead costs to the hospitals, and you’ll decrease costs of the medical care, which will decrease costs of premiums. And all the while you’re not forcing anyone to pay to do anything.

How about fining people who don’t have medical coverage, what a crock that is. I read the argument on here, “everyone needs it”, well no, not true, I know lots of people who are into the 50’s and 60’s who lead active healthy lifestyles who’ve never needed it, rarely go to the dr for more than a checkup which they can pay out of pocket, all you have to do is save and be financially responsible. So why should that person have to have coverage or risk being fined.

And what about the threat of doctors leaving the medical field? Now I have to say I don’t think it’s a very real threat, but if it was, and if like the NE J of M poll said, happens, and over 40% of doctors leave, that would destroy our medical field. I work with several doctors on a regular basis as well as see my personal doctors regularly and I’m still yet to hear one who thinks this healthcare reform is a good idea. Health care reform in general? Yes, it needs to happen, this particular recipe of reform? No, it’s garbage, says most of them.

The tax increases. Only on the wealthiest Americans, the dems say. However the level that makes an American, the wealthiest of them keeps inching down. I’m lucky enough to be in a field that pays phenomenally, my wife is a teacher, so as everyone knows it doesn’t pay that great, however, she does have her master’s degree and a special education credential, she teaches mild to moderate special education, being specialized in that field, earns her a higher salary, so this year, we’re in risk of becoming part of that group of the wealthiest Americans. So now, not only are we going to be paying much higher taxes in general, we’ll also being paying even more taxes to support obamacare. We aren’t rich; we’ve both worked very hard, have got into demanding fields, and would like to reap the benefits of this. However, we’re being penalized for it. We’re just two working class folks, a firemen and a teacher, but here we are paying more in taxes that 20% or Americans will ever pay in taxes. So what does this make us want to do? Well it makes her not want to teach anymore, because if she stops teaching we’ll fall back under the 200k mark and won’t have to pay the extra taxes. She’s a great teacher, loves the children she works with, was blessed with the patience to be able to work with children with special needs, but is getting penalized for it. So she’ll probably work this year, then quit, so we don’t have to pay 50% of our income to taxes. She’ll be a stay at home mom, someone else will have to go through 6 years of college to take her position, and hopefully that person doesn’t have a spouse with a good job or they’ll be in the same position.

Wow, Id like to know what fire company that is. Seriously though,good for you, your one or two of the lucky ones to have found good jobs in this tough economic time when most are getting laid off. As far as lumping you into that group(25, single, jobhunting)didnt mean it as a putdown, its just that most 25 year olds are in that situation. I had no clue what I wanted to do when I was 25. I personally have not felt the impact of the economy. Im a self employed plumber. But I feel the impact of healthcare costs when I want to hire people. I have to pay a plumber good wages and would like to pay for healthcare also but the healthcare is holding me back. Im not asking for a handout, I just cant raise my prices high enough to allow me to afford this at this time. Even though you are makeing good money, (again assumeing your benefits are employer paid)think about if you had to pay on your own. When my wife wasnt working I had insurance on my own, it cost me around $21-22000.00 a year($1885.00) a month! Thats rediculous! Something needed done. The reps. had no answers so Im willing to wait and see. The product your hearing about now wont be the same 10 years from now.

[loserbob 11]

Airiscus99, Sorry if its spelled wrong. I have to ask(I asked Patty Green and she didnt have an answer), What has the Bush admin. done for you in theyre 8 years that was helpful?

[ariscus99 1]

Airiscus99, Sorry if its spelled wrong. I have to ask(I asked Patty Green and she didnt have an answer), What has the Bush admin. done for you in theyre 8 years that was helpful?

Protected me and my country from additional terrorist attacks.

[BJean 16]

ariscus: "You said the young mean spirited part and she said the wouldn't help my neighbor, part. "

Clarify please. I don't know what you're referring to and if you're going to quote me, please quote ME and don't quote someone else and attribute it to me.

[ariscus99 1]

ariscus: "You said the young mean spirited part and she said the wouldn't help my neighbor, part. "

Clarify please. I don't know what you're referring to and if you're going to quote me, please quote ME and don't quote someone else and attribute it to me.

Gladly, here; from post 112 of the hypocrisy of repubs thread

And if your next door neighbor "fails out" and has no job, loses their home and can't feed their kids, I'm sure that you're going to be johnny-on-the-spot and invite them to move in with you. You'll feed, clothe and house them until they can get to a place where they are not "failing out", right?

You definitely do not sound like someone who gives one whit about anybody else. You only want to be wealthy and possess material things that are bigger and better than your neighbor's. Just like your die hard Republican brothers and sisters.

You were obviously being sarcastic, meaning I wouldn't do any of those things, this isn't a quote about how nice you think I am.