Still questions about having surgery

[pickles123 0]

I had found on most forums that you read there is a lot of complaining about why or how something didn't work. More negative than positive.

I guess that is how people complain.

In these forums most people seem to have good or great success with weight loss surgery. For those that don't, other than for a medical reason, why not? This scares me. I can't imagine spending all the money, going through all the pain and then not losing the weight. What happens? I read the threads about statistics of only losing part of your weight; but people on these boards seem to lose atleast half and usually more. I am determined to lose and I am sure that those that didn't were too. So what happens?

Is this a too psychological question to ask at night?

I have lost before and gained it back. That is where I feel the lap band will come into play. It will not let me gain it back. I am not going to be doing a lot of PBing I can assure you. Because throwing up is one of the worst things for me.

If I decide I don't want it any longer, I will just have it unfilled; but not losing I just don't get it.

Sorry for going on and on I am just not understanding probably the psychology, of those that don't lose.

Please give me viewpoints. Those that lost and those that didn't and why you think it happened?

I have done weight watchers and lost but gained it back. A lot of weight watcher people thing surgery is just not necessary, as I am sure other folks do. Thanks for any information you can provide.

[futurbander2007 24]

Thank you for posting this. I too have often wondered the same thing. Having been banded 18mths ago and having to fight for it I just don't understand how or why it woundn't work. I had reached my original goal 9 mths post op and have since lost and additional 20 lbs. I am not going to sit here and say that I have followed the plan exactly as I was taught but I knew when to stop eating around it and get back on track. I too have tried every plan under the sun and having spent SO much money on these plans I opted for the lap-band. It was the best decision I made for MYSELF and I am so happy with my results. I will keep checking this thread to see exactly where the problems came from (other than medical reasons) Thanks again for posting this.

[pickles123 0]

Thanks for answering. I am glad someone got the point of my question. I wanted to do a poll of who lost and didn't and why but I couldn't figure out how to. I hope we get more answers. I see a lot of views but few answers.

Great work on your lifestyle change. You did great.

I hope to be where you are by next year.

[Headhunter 6]

Hi, Pickles;

You bring up a very good point. Nicely stated.

I've had a number of years to ponder the very same questions. What makes some people successful with the band, and others a failure (like me)? In my case, it was a number of issues, including a poor choice of surgeon, and other issues as well.

I’ve had two weight loss surgeries; one a disaster, the other a wonderful success thus far.

What I’m about to discuss may be a little off-topic to the question you are posing, but it’s all related. How do we know how many people with WLS are successful? And how do we know what the failure rate is? And most importantly, WHY?

This actually covers many more issues than might be obvious. Part of it is statistics.

People love to toss around numbers and statistics when discussing these things, but the fact is that there are no master, cross-referenced, indexed statistics that are readily available to quantify failure/success averages. It’s kind of a big problem. There are stats that are collected by the band Manufacturers, by the surgeons individually, by the various hospitals, by the after care clinics, etc. But no one correlates these statistics. There is no single “clearinghouse” of data that is in contact with ALL of the entities. And then there are thousands of surgeries performed in Mexico and other countries on American patients, where the statistics on outcomes are not even collected, and when they are, they are certainly never shared with American entities that collect/compile such numbers.

And then you really have to be concerned about the QUALITY of the stats that ARE gathered. Inamed certainly does NOT want its Band failure stats to become public. Various surgeons do not want THEIR failures to be in the public record either. And the various Medical Groups that specialize in Bariatric Surgery certainly don’t want to be seen as having anything BUT successful outcomes.

I’m not saying that all Doctors and hospitals are crooked and falsify their numbers….but they ARE businesses. They want new customers. And bad numbers will NOT get them the patients they want.

You hear a lot of different numbers associated with the various surgeries. People repeat them, often times as though they are Gospel, which they are not. In the case of the Lap Band, they have only been installing it in America for about 8 years. And Lap Band surgeries have only been done in large numbers for the last 3 or 4 years, so the Statistics on the long-term efficacy of the band simply do NOT exist in any usable format or number. It is true that the Lap band has been utilized in other countries in one form or another for over 20 years, but those were in very small numbers, comparatively. And you have to take into consideration that there have been SEVERAL different band technologies that have been in use, AND the methods of installing them have changed several times in the last several years. There has been virtually NO correlation of all of these different sources of information.

And, then you have to look at the Statistical components that are actually gathered. What do they REALLY mean?

Here’s an example: I am a Gastric Bypass Patient. Whenever I enter into a discussion with people about the probable/possible outcome of the Bypass (RNY), they almost always toss out some numbers that they heard “somewhere”. I have heard numbers that are all OVER the map. They tell me that they have heard that the mortality rate is anywhere from .01 to 10. percent, and everything in between. They throw out all of these numbers, and they usually cannot recall where they got them. They sometimes refer me to a web site. When I visit the web site, it usually has a Lap-band bias, and is trying to push you toward a Lap band doctor, getting THEM a commission.

Here’s one that happened today: A very nice lady on THIS forum was discussing the reasons that she chose the Band over the Bypass. This is what she said:

Quote: “I didn't like the surgical risks (5 times higher than the lapband)”.

What does that actually mean? What are the risks that are 5 times higher? I don’t think she actually knew. It was just something she had “heard” somewhere.

What I have learned is that the reality of the Bypass is quite different. But, That is not the point of this thread. The point is that no one really knows about the outcomes of WLS as a “class”. The FDA has tried to compile some stats, but as I noted earlier, that is a GARGANTUAN task. There is ONE organization that is presently attempting to build an outcome database. However, the organization is a for-profit Bariatric INDUSTRY Trade Organization, and I’m not all that certain that their data would be either accessible or reliable, once compiled.

There is a very smart lady over on the verticalsleevetalk.com forum named MacMadame. She had a Sleeve, and she made the observation that the only statistics that mattered to HER were the stats of HER surgeon. He has done over 1600 sleeve surgeries in the last several years, with NO fatalities. She didn’t care at all what the INDUSTRY stats for the sleeve were as a whole; just those of HER surgeon. And I think that makes perfect sense. And, it’s why I always encourage people to investigate their surgeon THOROUGHLY before committing….and make sure you can trust his/her statistics!

One of the reasons I like HMOs for some types of Procedures is because they can collect all of the pertinent statistics IN HOUSE, and make decisions regarding the efficacy of any given procedure based upon those numbers. Those numbers prompted Kaiser Permanente in Southern California to stop performing one particular WLS because of the high failure and complication rates.

Now, as far as how people characterize their experiences on THIS forum, I’ve thought a lot about that as well. People come here for several reasons. Some, to get information. Others, to complain about their problems with the surgery. For others, it’s a social event. The fact is that MOST people who have had WLS don’t go to any forums at ALL. They simply have their experience, good or bad, and move on with their lives. I would conclude that the population here would consist of MOSTLY people who have terrific experiences, or not so good experiences. The people in between, I don’t think they hang out here much, if at all. I could be wrong, but that is my observation.

So, in terms of your original thoughts, I think you need to Not think in terms of what OTHER people’s experience has been; you need to think in terms of what YOU will make YOUR experience into. I wouldn’t worry too much about percentages. Because ultimately, the success of ANY procedure lies in YOUR hands.

You are very smart to ask the questions that you are asking; What makes some people succeed, and others fail? In some self-help and motivation literature, there is concept of “Modeling”, which says that you should emulate people who are achieving what YOU want to achieve….do what the people who are successful are doing. And by asking those questions, that is EXACTLY what you are doing!

Ok, I think I’ve hijacked your thread into something TOTALLY different, and I apologize for that, but this is stuff I have wanted to discuss for a long time, but no one has ever brought it up. I’m glad you did!

I wish you the best of luck in your process….I do think that you will succeed! Please feel free to comment on any of this....if I haven't put you to sleep....

HH

[Jodi_620 37]

In my opinion the big factor is the fact that the Lap Band is not for everyone. It takes work on your part to really make it successful. You have to cut out the junk, stop grazing and get off the couch. You have to understand what a healthy diet is and be willing to make that change.

I think that if you have been able to lose weight in the past but have had issues keeping it off, then if you stick with the program, the Lap Band will work for you.

There is a small number of people who have never really seriously tried to lose weight before and jumped into the Lap Band surgery thinking it will be some magic fix. They either don't want to, don't know how to or have food issues (addictions or emotional problems) that keep them from doing their part in making it a success. I think of my mom in this example. She has not had the surgery but was very interested after seeing my success. She is not considering it now, but I know that the Lap Band would not work for her. food is too important to her, the center of her life really, and she has never really tried to lose weight before. I have seen others like her that had the surgery before me and told me that I was wasting my time but I knew why they had failed and intended to prove them wrong and I did.

Complications are rare but there is also a small number of people who get the band and for a variety of reasons, it just does not work, their bodies can't tolerate it, they have slippage or erosion or the band fails in some way. This is rare but another possibility.

Most of us worried like you are. Complications and pain from surgery were not nearly as big a worry for me as the fear of failure was. How humiliating it would have been to go to such extremes and spend so much money only to fail again.

If you go into this understanding what is required of you and making sure that you are up to the challenge of eating right, keeping active and maintaining fills, barring any complications, there is no reason why you would not succeed.

Edited July 24, 2009 by Jodi_620

[SuzanneG 1]

I don't know what to say that Jodi and Headhunter haven't already said. I do know of one example where it was clear to see what went wrong.

My daugther works with two ladies that each had lapband. One is losing great and the other isn't losing at all. She said the one who isn't losing seems to know nothing about how to make good food choices. She ate a huge loaded baked potato and then asked DD if it had any protien. She eats candy and slider foods all the time. It goes back to what Jodi said, you have to be willing to make lifestyle changes, the band will give you the boost you need, but you have to do the work.

By the way, MacMadame is also on this site. You can often find her in the Fitness section, look at the C25K thread. She's awesome and would probably be more than happy to chat with you about this as well.

Edited July 24, 2009 by SuzanneG

[Jodi_620 37]

I just remembered another example of how some people simply don't understand how to eat properly.

A woman I worked with, who by the way is a well educated woman was and was raised in Russia by parents who were both doctors. She was a very sweet motherly type who loved to bring food in to share. After my surgery, during my post-op diet period, one day noticed I was not eating at a luncheon meeting and was trying to offer me food. I explained that I had to eat mushy food and she suggested ice-cream. I explained that I can only eat so much and it needed to be nutritious and she was reasoning that it was made from cream and so it had Calcium and Protein. It was sort of amusing and I just couldn't make her understand.

She left the company shortly after and after a few months came back for a visit (and of course, to bring food!). She saw me about 75 pounds lighter and said maybe she should look into getting the band...

[gbakerc 2]

From What the surgeon I am dealing with says, most people that fail, do so because they fail to do so because they fail to follow up. Let there band get out of adjustment, don't make the right choices. Don't exercise. You can beat the bypass as well. they are tools. Granted it sounds like it is a heck of a lot easier than trying to keep off 100 pounds with weight watchers but it sounds like it still takes work. My general feeling is that those who exercise regularly have much greater success. just my 2 cents

Greg

[pickles123 0]

Hi Everyone: Thanks so much for your answers. You are very smart insightful people. You got the point of my question and answered it, as well as more. I REALLY appreciate the time it took to answer this question. It is hard to really ask and explain these types of questions on line. You all gave such well thought out answers I am proud to be associated with a such a great group.

I will be successful with the lap band surgery and your answers have helped, as well as, reinforced my desire to do so.

Thanks for taking the time and I know it took a lot of time to answer my question.

Have a great day

Pickles

Edited July 24, 2009 by pickles123