"Our Government is Officially Insane" (Surprise!!)

[pattygreen 5]

Plain: "Ok, so now the problem will get even worse. More business and jobs going overseas. It's ok though, we'll just blame Bush when the unemployment rates top 11%."

I have 5 friends who work at Pratt and Whitney in Cheshire, CT. They have just announced their moving overseas (Asia) where they can pay their employers less.A Thousand more layoffs coming soon. It would be great if the one who was making $40./hr. making parts could be told to take a 50% paycut or lose the job. (Unions!) They just can't afford to pay these people such high wages. What a shame. My husband's friend works there and so does his wife. They will both be out of work at the same time.

[pattygreen 5]

There seems to be alot of revolution in America underway. What with the Tea parties, Dump Dodd rallies, the 10th Ammendment Sovereignty Movement, The Audit the Fed Bill, and many other events, organizations and publications resisting the federal governments disregard for the Constitution and assaults on our freedoms. The voters have been apathetic at best. We the people, own this country, and we 'hire' officials, via elections to operate it for us. It is our obligation as citizens to supervise them. Instead we have turned our backs on freedom and independence. The people have been propagandized by media and bribed by free handouts into dependence on the government for everything.They've become economic slaves wearing gold shackles in a socialist empire run for the benefit of the political class. Our founders wanted freedom from government not dependence on it. We need to vote the bums out! Repeal the socialist programs and constitutional violations destroying America. Return to a free society with limited government, states' rights and local control!

Some differences I see in most dems and reps:

Republicans believe the constitution means what it says and says what it means. Dems want to pass legislation behind the backs of people in the dead of night. Reps want a public airing of legislation before acting. Dems believe what you work hard for and earn should be taken and given to those too lazy to work. Reps believe you should keep what you earn. Dems believe government should control every aspect of everyday life. Reps believe government should stop intruding. Dems believe they know what is best for you, reps believe you do. The earth has cooled over the last 10 yeras, but Dems believe in global warming. Reps believe more proof is needed and most believe God is in control in that area. In essence, Dems want to control and Reps don't.

[BJean 16]

I feel very sorry for you patty.

And plain, the goverment has historically made jobs for Americans and in the process, it made this country a greater place to live.

But in recent history, the focus has been on personal wealth to the exclusion of most working Americans. Now all but the upper middle class and the wealthy are hurting.

Some people are complaining about unions, which on the surface is understandable. But if you dig a little deeper, you realize why unions came into existence and why they continue to exist. Corporate greed. And the amassing of wealth by a few to the detriment of many.

If everyone played fair, unions wouldn't have become necessary. If everyone played fair, this country wouldn't be in such a melofahess.

[pattygreen 5]

I feel very sorry for you patty.

And plain, the goverment has historically made jobs for Americans and in the process, it made this country a greater place to live.

Don't you see that when the governmant makes the jobs instead of the people, then ALL the people are the ones paying their salaries instead of the individuals who created the jobs. That's the whole reason for why the government SHOULD NOT make jobs. They are then government jobs that have special fringe benefits, and privileges, (like not having to use the public health care program they are coming up with for the rest of us.) AND the rest of the country has to pay for it.

But in recent history, the focus has been on personal wealth to the exclusion of most working Americans. Now all but the upper middle class and the wealthy are hurting.

Everyone in this country has an oportunity to better themselves.

Some people are complaining about unions, which on the surface is understandable. But if you dig a little deeper, you realize why unions came into existence and why they continue to exist. Corporate greed. And the amassing of wealth by a few to the detriment of many.

Why is Joe Shmoe getting wealthy in his own business hurting you? Start your own business then and join him!

If everyone played fair, unions wouldn't have become necessary. If everyone played fair, this country wouldn't be in such a melofahess.

Get real! If there is anyone to feel sorry for, it's people like you who want the government to take away your freedoms. The freedoms all those people fought and died for.

[BeckyinTn 0]

Repubs, Dems, Independents..they are all the same. Where I live we lost a factory under Clinton, 1 under Bush and now 1 under Obama.

Seems to me when any of them open their mouths all that comes out of them is BS! All they care about is the fact their bank accounts are getting bigger.

[plain 12]

And plain, the goverment has historically made jobs for Americans and in the process, it made this country a greater place to live.

When besides FDR's time has this ever happened? And most experts agree that FDR's policy expanded the great depression, not fixed it (good article on that in Time magazine, which is pretty liberal). The most the government can do is to provide temporary jobs.

Edited July 29, 2009 by plain

[BJean 16]

patty, because I want medical reforms I want to take away people's freedoms that Americans fought and died for?

How absurd. Utterly absurd and short-sighted. You've been drinking the "kool-aide" like you Republicans like to say.

[pattygreen 5]

patty, because I want medical reforms I want to take away people's freedoms that Americans fought and died for?

How absurd. Utterly absurd and short-sighted. You've been drinking the "kool-aide" like you Republicans like to say.

No, not because you want medical reform, but because you want the "government controlled" medical reform.

[BJean 16]

Government controlled medical reform?

Who exactly do you think is going to reform our health care system? We left everything up to the insurance companies to figure it all out and look where that got us.

The government MUST get involved now. We really have no choice. That doesn't mean that we are going to get "socialized medicine". That's just a term that is bantied about to scare you. The people who stand to lose if there is change use it a lot and lots of Americans have been scared to death of the idea of any government invovlement in our medical care system. They always think that government involvement means "socialized medicine" and we have many years of negativism to overcome because of that.

Well too bad. We are in a situation where something must be done. If everybody hadn't just kept paying more and more and getting less and less, maybe we could have gotten a handle on it before it got to this point, but we didn't and now we are.

[plain 12]

The government MUST get involved now. We really have no choice.

Now as in "soon", or now as in "pass this turd without any public scrutiny"?

[BJean 16]

Looks like it's been nearly scrutinized to death. With it so watered down, it's probably going to wind up another drop in the bucket of bad health care policies and won't actually solve anything.

I'm all for public scrutiny! But there's so much misinformation and downright lies being set adrift in this ocean of media bullcrap, the public is obviously having a very hard time sorting it all out. But no, that doesn't mean we should pass just any turd that happens to float to the top.

[plain 12]

I'm all for public scrutiny! But there's so much misinformation and downright lies being set adrift in this ocean of media bullcrap, the public is obviously having a very hard time sorting it all out.

See, here's my biggest gripe with this administration (and with most democrats): Why do you think the public is having a hard time sorting it all out? Because there isn't overwhelming support?

As for scrutiny, hows about the bill go on the "transparency" website for a month before congress votes, just so we the people might actually read it? Just a thought.....

[pattygreen 5]

This is a copy of a letter that someone sends her representative after reading the health care bill. I am in agreement with her on every issue.

Julie

Posted August 4, 2009 at 5:12 pm

Here is a copy of my thoughts and the letter I’ll be sending to my representatives

Senator Bayh

As a citizen of Indiana who works in healthcare I have major concerns with the healthcare

bill before Congress. I actually have read the bill that was released by the house ways and means committee and I am shocked by the brazenness of the government’s proposed involvement in the patient physician relationship. The very idea that the government will dictate and ration patient care is dangerous and certainly not helpful in designing a healthcare system that works for all. I agree that we need to fix our healthcare system, but the proposed bills currently making their way through congress will be a disaster if passed.

I ask you respectfully and as a patriotic American to fully read the bill and look at the following troubling lines that I have read in the bill (I have added my concerns to some of the provisions under their respective lines in italics). You cannot possibly believe that these proposals are in the best interests of the country and our fellow citizens. As you read this bill and make your choice of how to vote, take into consideration that as servants to the citizens of this country, all members of government should be required to carry the government healthcare plan that they enact as their own healthcare plan for themselves and their families. If you would not desire this plan for yourself or your family DO NOT VOTE FOR IT!!!

Page 30 Sec 123 of HC bill - THERE WILL BE A GOVT COMMITTEE that decides what treatments/benefits you get. The Health Choices Commissioner will choose your HC Benefits for you.

Page 58 HC Bill: Govt will have real-time access to individuals’ finances & a National ID Health card will be issued!

Page 59 HC Bill lines 21-24: Govt will have direct access to you banks accounts for elective funds transfer.

Page 65 Sec 164: is a payoff subsidized plan for retirees and their families in Unions & community organizations

Page 84 Sec 203 HC bill: Govt mandates ALL benefit packages for private HC plans in the Exchange.

Page 85 Line 7 HC Bill: Specifications for of Benefit Levels for Plans

Page 95 HC Bill Lines 8-18: The Govt will use groups to sign up individuals for Govt HC plan.

Who regulates these companies? And why the heck is Acorn being discussed as a possibility to do this? If there are groups to be used then they should be highly regulated as to their methods unlike Acorn in the last voter registration drive.

Page 102 Lines 12-18 HC Bill: Medicaid Eligible Individuals will be automatically enrolled in Medicaid. No choice.

What happens if the individual is not interested in Government based Healthcare?

Page 124 lines 24-25 HC: No company can sue GOVT on price fixing. No “judicial review” against Govt Monopoly.

How is this American? Our country has always utilized its ability to grow and adapt by questioning itself through “judicial review” of practices and ideologies that are outdated. Does this mean that the government wants the medical and science communities to stop learning new and improved methods of treating and curing illnesses? We can’t afford to allow one government body to dictate our medical and scientific growth and development!! I realize that this bill has “the Center” for research, but a lot of valid research occurs in the physician’s office with individual patients.

Page 127 Lines 1-16 HC Bill: Doctors/ American Medical Association - The Govt will tell YOU what you can make.

I understand the desired outcome of this provision. However, by allowing this line to stay in the bill, the government is stifling physicians ability to specialize and develop better treatment options for patients. It may allow all patients to be able to afford the same care, but sometimes the “best care” from more expensive, more specialized physicians allows for this growth, which then becomes common practice by all physicians after it has been proven to be effective. History has proven that the ‘wealthy’ are willing to pay more for their healthcare and this willingness has required physicians to “think outside the box” and develop these new treatments to accommodate this particular population. These physicians take on more risks and as a result deserve to be compensated at a higher rate for that risk.

Page 145 Line 15-17: An Employer MUST auto enroll employees into public

option plan.

Page 146 Lines 22-25: Employers MUST pay for HC for part time employees

AND their families.

Page 149 Lines 16-24: ANY Employer with payroll 401k & above who

does not provide public option pays 8% tax on all payrolls.

Page 150 Lines 9-13: Business’s with payroll btw 251k & 401k who

doesn’t provide public option pays 2-6% tax on all payroll.

Page 167 Lines 18-23: ANY individual who doesn’t have acceptable HC

according to Govt will be taxed 2.5% of income.

Where does the money come from for these employers to pay for this insurance? This could bankrupt many small companies leaving even more people unemployed and uninsured! The government is already spending my unborn grandchildren’s money, so they can’t provide these funds to the employers without continuing to spend money that doesn’t exist. Government spending must be halted not increased.

Page 170 Lines 1-3 HC Bill: Any NONRESIDENT Alien is exempt from individual taxes. (Americans will pay)

Page 195 HC Bill: Officers & employees of HC Admin (GOVT) will have access to ALL Americans finances /personal records.

Page 203 Line 14-15 HC: “The tax imposed under this section shall not be treated as tax”

Page 239 Line 14-24 HC Bill: Govt will reduce physician services for Medicaid Seniors, low income and poor are affected.

Page 253 Line 10-18: Govt sets value of Doctor’s time, profession, judgment etc.

Page 265 Sec 1131: Govt mandates & controls productivity for private HC industries.

Page 268 Sec 1141: Federal Govt regulates rental & purchase of power driven wheelchairs.

Page 272 SEC. 1145: TREATMENT OF CERTAIN CANCER HOSPITALS Cancer patients - welcome to rationing!

Page 280 Sec 1151: The Govt will penalize hospitals for whatever Govt deems preventable re-admissions.

Page 298 Lines 9-11: Doctors, treat a patient during initial admission that results in a re-admission -Govt will penalize you.

This provision makes absolutely no sense to me! Some conditions and diseases have recurring sub-conditions that require hospital treatment and monitoring as a normal part of their disease process. So with this provision the government will be forcing hospitals to refuse to treat these sub-conditions of their patients to avoid fines. This is NOT improved healthcare for United States Citizens!!! If individual hospitals are abusing the system by discharging and readmitting patients on the same day or the next day in order to continue to receive government funds then and only then should the hospital be fined. This is not an area where across the board rules will be beneficial to patients or the hospitals that treat them.

Page 317 L 13-20: PROHIBITION on ownership/investment. Govt tells Doctors what/how much they can own!

Since when did the government of the United States have the right to dictate what it’s citizens owned? The Equal Rights (for women) and Civil Rights (for those of ‘minority’ status) allow for every United States citizen the right to own property and pursue financial independence through equal employment opportunities and other legal financial opportunities. Good Healthcare providers do not practice medicine based on how much money they can make, instead they make money by being tireless in their pursuits to give their patients the best care, medicine and treatments available.

Page 317-318 lines 21-25, 1-3: PROHIBITION on expansion- Govt is mandating hospitals cannot expand.

Page 321 2-13: Hospitals have opportunity to apply for exception BUT community input is required.

This means that if a community experiences a population growth, its ability to meet the healthcare needs of its citizens is jeopardized as a result of the government deciding that it can or can’t expand. Healthcare representatives should be allowed to be proactive in caring for the community. Delays by having to apply for an exception and going to the community for input delays the care the community expects from their local healthcare representatives. This could result in people going untreated due to an ineffective healthcare system and could also result in a loss of revenue for that community as citizens are forced to look outside of their community for healthcare.

Page 335 L 16-25 Pg 336-339: Govt mandates establishment of outcome-based measures. HC the way they want.

Page 341 Lines 3-9: Govt has authority to disqualify Medicare Advance Plans, HMOs, etc. Forcing people into Govt plan.

Page 354 Sec 1177: Govt will RESTRICT enrollment of Special needs people!

Page 379 Sec 1191: Govt creates more bureaucracy - Tele-health Advisory Committee.

Page 425 Lines 4-12: Govt mandates Advance Care Planning Consult. Think Senior Citizens end of life patients.

Page 425 Lines 17-19: Govt will instruct & consult regarding living wills, durable powers of attorney. Mandatory!

Page 425 Lines 22-25, 426 Lines 1-3: Govt provides approved list of end of life resources, guiding you in death.

Page 427 Lines 15-24: Govt mandates program for orders for end of life. The Govt has a say in how your life ends?

Page 429 Lines 1-9: An “advanced care planning consultant” will be used frequently as patients’ health deteriorates.

Page 429 Lines 10-12: “advanced care consultation” may include an ORDER for end of life plans. AN ORDER from GOVT!

Page 429 Lines 13-25: The govt will specify which Doctors can write an end of life order.

Page 430 Lines 11-15: The Govt will decide what level of treatment you will have at end of life!

Physicians, nurses and social workers in healthcare are already addressing end of Life care. This is an area of healthcare that is very personal to the patients and family members involved and should not be interfered with by the government! We are all going to die, that is a fact of life, but how we die (if not by a sudden illness or accident) is as individual as the lives we live. The government has no right to indicate how a patient should address that part of their life: family and religious beliefs, as well as the patients’ condition are the only things that should be considered. A politician in Washington will have no personal investment in those areas of the patients care and would not want someone interfering if the patient were themselves or a loved one and as such should leave that part of healthcare to the patient and the physician and healthcare workers involved with that individual patient.

Page 494-498: Govt will cover Mental Health Services including defining, creating, rationing those services.

This bill appears to me to be another way for government to control the lives of its citizens. The United States that I have been led to believe in is Represented by its government officials and not controlled by them. I believe in the United States where we have the freedom to lead our lives the way we choose and where those ideals are protected by the government, this is what I believe our founding fathers and the writers of our constitution wanted for the United States at the birth of our country.

This bill comes from a true need to fix our current healthcare system, please use your vote to reflect the voices of those you represent and protect us from decisions made too quickly with little or no thought given to what the American People truly want. Please be aware as you vote that we need healthcare reform for the people of this country and their individual healthcare needs, and NOT for the government to dictate across the board treatments for illnesses. Illnesses are as individual as the patients that they effect and the treatment of those patients should be allowed to reflect that individuality.

Thank you for your thought and consideration,

May God bless and guide you as you continue to represent the state of Indiana.

Julie B.

[pattygreen 5]

http://waysandmeans.house.gov/media/pdf/111/AAHCA09001xml.pdf

Edited August 7, 2009 by pattygreen

[BJean 16]

See there plain, all you have to do is go after it if you want to read the bill. I've worked as a legislative aide and what you suggest as transparency, a place where everybody can read it as it goes along, is a great idea. Write your congressman.

But if you allow other people, complete strangers, affect your thinking just because you like the sound of what they're saying, then that's really too bad. The only way to fully understand what's going on is if you do your own research and make sure that you not only understand the bill, but you also understand all the implications. Not an easy task for congresspeople, much less us commoners.

Besides, most of us are willing to take someone else's word because it is so much easier. And many of us just like to give the opposition hell, whether they deserve it or not. You know, the ole' drinking the kool-aide thing that Republicans like to accuse everybody else of doing.