43% Pay NO Federal Income Tax - ARE YOU KIDDING ME??

[BJean 16]

Come on Beth. You're the queen of tossing out your own personal opinions. And you do it loud and with an exclamation mark.

Don't hold your breath Terri, waiting for me to run off and find links to "back up" my statements. If I run across anything that is relevant to this discussion, I will do as you have asked and I will bring them to you. But the information highway is constantly changing and new and different information is constantly being made available to us. Looking back is a waste of time if you are going to keep up with what is going on everyday.

And I will tell you again, what I have said many times before: I do not care one whit if I have credibility or a strong "stand" on the issues with you all. You do not care one whit if I share your beliefs either. You say what you want and I may argue with you, just as you may argue with me. But you have every right to say what you believe and think what you will and I know that you have come by your beliefs in lots of different ways. I don't expect you to treat this as if you are writing a thesis.

Some people, like Jack, enjoy pulling out stuff that he believes provokes discussion and even argument. That is his right and his style here at LBT. It has never been my style and I just don't have time for it. Life moves too fast. I post and then I move on.

Please do not think that you must be moved by anything that I have to say. If you disagree with me, tell me, I can take it. I will probably argue with you though. This forum is therapy for me. I have a lot going on in my life and jumping on here and spouting off from time to time is just plain fun. So if this causes people like Beth to say bad things about me and make lame accusations about my motives, it just comes with the territory. With certain people, it is easy to consider the source and dismiss it (and them.) You're perfectly free to dismiss me and what I say without a second thought.

On the other hand, if you find something I say that peaks your interest and you want to know more, try watching Rachel Maddow or listening to your president, or visiting his website, or watching some of the other news broadcasts besides the Rupert Murdock channel. Trust me, the information is readily available without any assist from me.

[BJean 16]

Btw Beth, not that you deserve a reponse from me, but for the record, when I post things here they are my opinion. They are what I believe to be factual, although I do not print a disclaimer at the bottom of each post saying that if something I've said is not factual, you can shoot me. Um kay? :crying:

[BethFromVA 5]

Come on Beth. You're the queen of tossing out your own personal opinions. And you do it loud and with an exclamation mark.

And you're the queen of tossing out "fact" and not backing it up. At least when I pass an opinion, I say it's my opinion and don't portray it as fact that whole groups of "scientists" or "economists" claim is true.

And when I toss out fact with info to back it up, you come on with another of your sad little quips.

Seriously, BJean, if you HAVE info to back up your claims/facts, please share them. You ARE trying to get your point across after all, no? Or is this just your opinion that all these economists think this theft of Peter to pay Paul is really working?

[BethFromVA 5]

Btw Beth, not that you deserve a reponse from me, but for the record, when I post things here they are my opinion. They are what I believe to be factual, although I do not print a disclaimer at the bottom of each post saying that if something I've said is not factual, you can shoot me. Um kay? :crying:

Shoot you? Why would I do that? I find you rather entertaining.

So... this is an opinion and not a fact?

"However, most credible economists all agree that the steps that the Obama administration has taken are vital to a recovery."

Interesting, as it's presented as a fact. But, mkay.

[Jesusislove 26]

I have not read all of the comments, but I like Obama, but I do question some of the methods.

[DownInSocal 12]

re: "we'll pay it off the same way we will pay off the astronomical debt of the Iraq war and the Bush administration debacle:

I'm all for getting this out in front of us: to date the Iraqi War has not cost as much as AIG all by itself was recently GIVEN just last month.

Now, let's all get credible.

Whoa. Do you have a source for your assertion that the Iraq war costs less than AIG was given in one month because you are just plain wrong.

"""Of those $700 billion, Iraq will have received $526 billion by mid-2008, or 75% of total war appropriations. In late 2007, the Bush administration requested an additional $105 billion for 2008 war costs. On Feb. 4, 2008, the administration added yet another “placeholder” request for $70 billion. Congress has yet to act on the two requests, which would bring total war funding to $875 billion, with the Iraq war accounting for about $657 billion of that"""

MY source: What Are the Costs of War in Iraq - Iraq War Costs

[DownInSocal 12]

I believe it is better to spend all our money on protecting us from future terrorists than to spend it on unnecessary crap!

What exactly is "crap"? If you are speaking about healthcare for human beings then I don't see that as "crap". If you are talking about education I don't see our children as "crap". What exact "crap" that the President has put forward are you objecting too?

[luluc 6]

bjean - just thought i'd say you crack me up...

i don't read long posts myself, i will click on links - but feel i live a balanced life, w/the spousal unit and i not sharing the same political views.

personally, i think the community organizer is doing better job than the former owner of a rotten major league baseball team.....oh yeah and he was also the gov...,:crying:

[BJean 16]

LOL yeah, and a lousy governor at that luluc. No one in his right mind ever predicted that George W. would be able to win an election of this kind. Not even his mother, or so they say. Of course there has always been a lot of questions about whether he really won the election or if it was stolen.

[BJean 16]

Beth, do you really think this is about "robbing Peter to pay Paul"? If that is your assessment, I doubt that you and I have anything to talk about regarding the economy.

I must say though that I not so secretly enjoy the fact that I'm entertaining for you. I certainly try. Although I realize that most of the time when I am trying to be humorous, people just think I'm being mean.

I obviously don't have your gift.

There have been many talk shows and discussion groups televised where prominent economists have backed up the president's plan of action. They have said over and over that the steps he has taken have been necessary. And they have also said, on many shows, that the leading economists all agree on the necessity of taking the action that the president has.

If you haven't heard it, it sure isn't my fault that you haven't been listening to the same broadcasts. I have also seen shows where the occasional economist has said that there may have been better ways to bring us out of the recession. None of them has ever come up with a viable plan. Or any alternative, for that matter.

Now I know we were talking about taxes in the beginning, but the president's approach and his plans all involve taxes and the recession is a big part of that.

I was speaking to the recession when I said what you consider to be wrong about economists having backed the president's plan to get the country back on sound footing. But as far as I am concerned, from everything I have gleaned from news sources, including a couple of newspapers, what I stated is fact.

If you have factual data that suggests otherwise, then I think it is incumbent on you to prove me wrong. Wouldn't that be a lot more productive than you whining about what I do?

[TerriDoodle 6]

Come on Beth. You're the queen of tossing out your own personal opinions. And you do it loud and with an exclamation mark.

Don't hold your breath Terri, waiting for me to run off and find links to "back up" my statements. If I run across anything that is relevant to this discussion, I will do as you have asked and I will bring them to you. But the information highway is constantly changing and new and different information is constantly being made available to us. Looking back is a waste of time if you are going to keep up with what is going on everyday.

And I will tell you again, what I have said many times before: I do not care one whit if I have credibility or a strong "stand" on the issues with you all. You do not care one whit if I share your beliefs either. You say what you want and I may argue with you, just as you may argue with me. But you have every right to say what you believe and think what you will and I know that you have come by your beliefs in lots of different ways. I don't expect you to treat this as if you are writing a thesis.

Some people, like Jack, enjoy pulling out stuff that he believes provokes discussion and even argument. That is his right and his style here at LBT. It has never been my style and I just don't have time for it. Life moves too fast. I post and then I move on.

Please do not think that you must be moved by anything that I have to say. If you disagree with me, tell me, I can take it. I will probably argue with you though. This forum is therapy for me. I have a lot going on in my life and jumping on here and spouting off from time to time is just plain fun. So if this causes people like Beth to say bad things about me and make lame accusations about my motives, it just comes with the territory. With certain people, it is easy to consider the source and dismiss it (and them.) You're perfectly free to dismiss me and what I say without a second thought.

On the other hand, if you find something I say that peaks your interest and you want to know more, try watching Rachel Maddow or listening to your president, or visiting his website, or watching some of the other news broadcasts besides the Rupert Murdock channel. Trust me, the information is readily available without any assist from me.

All I asked for was some info about the economists you referred to. Nevermind then.

[plain 12]

LOL yeah, and a lousy governor at that luluc. No one in his right mind ever predicted that George W. would be able to win an election of this kind. Not even his mother, or so they say. Of course there has always been a lot of questions about whether he really won the election or if it was stolen.

Yeah...I hear Dubya was a cannibal, that he is an excessive masturbator, and that he secretly worships Satan. I heard that somewhere and if you disagree, quit watching FOX news exclusively.

I was speaking to the recession when I said what you consider to be wrong about economists having backed the president's plan to get the country back on sound footing. But as far as I am concerned, from everything I have gleaned from news sources, including a couple of newspapers, what I stated is fact.

If you have factual data that suggests otherwise, then I think it is incumbent on you to prove me wrong. Wouldn't that be a lot more productive than you whining about what I do?

Well, I'm not Beth, but here's the latest report from AP, as found on MSNBC.com (I purposely was looking on non-conservative sites, BJean.)

Stocks drop on economy worries - Stocks & economy- msnbc.com

read and discuss. Or don't, if it doesn't support your view.

[BethFromVA 5]

LOL yeah, and a lousy governor at that luluc. No one in his right mind ever predicted that George W. would be able to win an election of this kind. Not even his mother, or so they say. Of course there has always been a lot of questions about whether he really won the election or if it was stolen.

You mean like how a certain someone still has not proven he was born in this country? :crying:

[luluc 6]

Yeah...I hear Dubya was a cannibal, that he is an excessive masturbator, and that he secretly worships Satan. I heard that somewhere and if you disagree, quit watching FOX news exclusively..

well i hear that W gave up the tug when he gave up the jug...

[BethFromVA 5]

Beth, do you really think this is about "robbing Peter to pay Paul"?

Absolutely I do. What benefit am I receiving when my tax dollars are being used to keep them afloat or pay bonuses to people who ran these businesses into the ground? What benefit am I receiving when my tax dollars are being used to bail out the auto industry rather than allowing them to do the RIGHT thing and file bankruptcy so that these insane contracts can be renegotiated or, better yet, done away with? What benefit am I receiving when my tax dollars are being used to pay other people's mortgages??

I do everything right, don't overextend myself, work hard, pay my bills on time, etc., yet many who made $100,000 but spent $125,000 every year are getting the benefit of MY hard-earned money to essentially reward them for bad decisions they chose to make. I will say now before the howling begins that I am not speaking of those who legitimately fell on hard times. I am talking those who bought houses they couldn't afford or had no intention of paying for.

So do I feel that I'm being stolen from to pay off the bullcrap choices others made, whether personal or commercial? Hell yeah!

If that is your assessment, I doubt that you and I have anything to talk about regarding the economy.

Then I guess we don't. I don't believe the economy was created to be "my brother's keeper." I choose to keep as much of my money as possible and for the government to be good stewards of our money. Neither of these things happen. Instead, "economy" now means redistribution of wealth, and that is stealing no matter what you want to call it.

I obviously don't have your gift.

That's okay. I mean, could this board really handle two of me? :crying:

There have been many talk shows and discussion groups televised where prominent economists have backed up the president's plan of action. They have said over and over that the steps he has taken have been necessary. And they have also said, on many shows, that the leading economists all agree on the necessity of taking the action that the president has.

If you haven't heard it, it sure isn't my fault that you haven't been listening to the same broadcasts.

<snip>

If you have factual data that suggests otherwise, then I think it is incumbent on you to prove me wrong. Wouldn't that be a lot more productive than you whining about what I do?

The thing is, BJean, I don't hear what you hear because I don't listen to left-leaning media, which pretty much encompasses the entire industry (with very few exceptions). And what I would hear or read would be more right-leaning compared to what you listen to or read, I'm sure. So we could both back up our stances with quotes. What I want to SEE is data that back up the quotes/opinions of others, whether they be yours or some economist who may simply be an Obama lackey for all I know.

The thing about economics is you typically don't know much about whether something's going to work until you try it and it does or it doesn't. It's not an exact science due to all the variables that are at stake here -- one of which is simple human nature.