The date is set.. Now where are my dancing shoes???

[Toolow 0]

First let me say hello to all of you on this VSG forum and thank you for all of the wonderful insight you have given me!

My name is Bob and my VSG surgery date is set for April 25th at the Emmanuel medical center, Tijuana Mexico. Dr Mario Almanza

I havent started the pre diet yet but am looking forward to getting this done and get on the road to a new me.

My BMI is at 34.26 and recently I have started suffering the indignities of pre-diabetes. Minor Neuropothy and cold feet. I wanted to nip this in the bud before it escalates to something worse. My primary doctor basically said if he were a betting man he would take a life insurance policy on me. (blunt but effective)

If any of you are familiar with Dr. Almanza or the Emmanuel medical center your input would be greatly appreciated.

They are running a spring special of $6500.00 for the VSG and that fits my budget well. This is not my only consideration but the price does help.

You all have paved the way for me to make this decision and I thank you for that.

Will keep you posted,

Bob

[Elisabethsew 50]

Hi Bob,

Since you asked for opinions, mine is that you reconsider where you're going for surgery. On the practical side, the Mexican police and drug lord/gangs are fighting on the Mexican border as you can see in the news. Tijuana is NOT safe and Americans are being advised to steer clear.

Since you are pre-diabetic, 47, and obese, you should select a facilty that is a hospital rather than a clinic. Should you need ICU care, Betancourt/Emmanuel clinic would have to get you to a hospital. I can't speak to the surgeon you're considering because I don't know him. I do know he's not one of the experienced, top, surgeons in Mexico.

There is a thread in this section of the board that has to do with VSG recovery. Two people posted that they went to Emmanuel Clinic and came out with a Sleeve when, in another thread, they posted that they went for a band!!! Another patient, a registered nurse, got an awful MRSA staph infection (see the recovery thread) from Emmanuel clinic and has been on intravenous and oral antibiotics since she had the surgery in Jan!!!

There are MANY good surgeons in Mexico who boast low infection rates and excellent patient outcomes. Low price should never be the deciding factor and I'm glad you realize that. My advice is to quickly reconsider and look into another surgeon.

[Elisabethsew 50]

http://www.lapbandtalk.com/f281/describe-your-post-op-recovery-please-85507/

Here is the link.

[Toolow 0]

Thanks for the info. I considered the drug war in Mexico and honestly I live in the hood and deal with unpleasant people all the time. Scary but we all cant be middle class and live in the burbs..

I will however speak to the people who are making the arrangements to get me to the center about these concerns.

I looked at Dr. Almanza when I first considered this and he has done more than 200 sleeves and I think more than 200 bypasses. I've heard the stapling process is more delicate in a bypass so that made me feel better with him as a surgeon.

As to him being new at this.. well we all have to be new at something once in our lives. Yes I know its surgery and I know its dangerous but as a victim of the new economy (unemployed) and having a limited amount in savings I have to go where I can afford to.

The thought that someone might be posting false information on these forums is very disturbing. Much of my decision to have this surgery was based on posts from forum members...

Now I'm having serious second thoughts.

damn..damn..damn..

Edited March 28, 2009 by Toolow
additional thoughts

[MacMadame 81]

The other thing about that clinic is that they do too many surgeries in one day to save money. That's how Almanza got to do 200 sleeves in such a short time. By doing 10 surgeries in a day, which is not safe.

If you end up with a complications due to his being fatigued when he does your surgery, then it's going to cost you more money than if you paid a few thousand extra to go to an excellent surgeon with a great reputation.

There are quite a number of surgeon in MX with great facilities and reps who are in the 9000-10000 range. When it comes to our bodies and our lives, it's not worth it to price shop.

[MacMadame 81]

The other thing about that clinic is that they do too many surgeries in one day to save money. That's how Almanza got to do 200 sleeves in such a short time. By doing 10 surgeries in a day, which is not safe.

If you end up with a complications due to his being fatigued when he does your surgery, then it's going to cost you more money than if you paid a few thousand extra to go to an excellent surgeon with a great reputation.

There are quite a number of surgeon in MX with great facilities and reps who are in the 9000-10000 range. When it comes to our bodies and our lives, it's not worth it to price shop IMO.

[Guest zsflower]

Thanks for the info. I considered the drug war in Mexico and honestly I live in the hood and deal with unpleasant people all the time. Scary but we all cant be middle class and live in the burbs..

I will however speak to the people who are making the arrangements to get me to the center about these concerns.

I looked at Dr. Almanza when I first considered this and he has done more than 200 sleeves and I think more than 200 bypasses. I've heard the stapling process is more delicate in a bypass so that made me feel better with him as a surgeon.

As to him being new at this.. well we all have to be new at something once in our lives. Yes I know its surgery and I know its dangerous but as a victim of the new economy (unemployed) and having a limited amount in savings I have to go where I can afford to.

The thought that someone might be posting false information on these forums is very disturbing. Much of my decision to have this surgery was based on posts from forum members...

Now I'm having serious second thoughts.

damn..damn..damn..

Hi Bob!

Most of the information you are reading here is completely untrue. Please contact Shirley at Emmanuel Medical (Shirleyrohr50@comcast.net Emmanuel - Cosmetic Plastic and Reconstructive Surgery Center -)

and she will put you in touch with the people that posted here and had surgery with Dr. Almanza.

The 2 ladies that one of the posters accused of stating they had a lap band then stated they had a sleeve, had CONSIDERED the lap band, but then decided to have a sleeve instead. They are a mother and daughter, the mother is an RN. Furthermore, neither of these people contracted MRSA nor were they on antibiotics long term. Just read the posts and you will see that they were completed miss quoted.

Dr. Almanza does NOT do 10 surgeries a day. He does only up to 3 sleeves a day.

It is unknown just why some people are posting untrue information, however it is possible that they may have an agenda. Remember, you are reading internet posts, where everyone, including you and me, has anonymity.

You can get to the bottom of it by calling Dr. Almanza's office and ask to be put in contact with these people and talk to them over the phone yourself.

Good luck to you!

OK...now I'm holding on for the BIG FIRE STORM!

Edited March 28, 2009 by zsflower
spelling

[WASaBubbleButt 41]

I don't know, to go that low for a sleeve is of concern. The costs to do a sleeve are quite a bit more than most would realize. They have to be seriously hurting for business to be willing to go that low and it does make one wonder where they are cutting corners. The staples alone are amazingly expensive.

Surgery in a clinic, recovery in a hotel in Tijuana, dirt cheap surgery... be careful. At least make sure you are getting three leak tests and have access to a hospital and that YOU know how to get there.

Since you won't be getting 24/7 medical supervision after major surgery at least don't go by yourself. At least have someone there in case you can't get to a hospital by yourself.

[Elisabethsew 50]

The problem with people who are paid to post is that they quite often cannot keep track of the stories they tell. Two threads have been closed so far. If YOU read closely, you will see that it was NOT posted that this mother and daughter tag team got MRSA. They both went in for a band and came home with a sleeve as per you.

Another patient who had surgery at Betancourt/Emmanual, an RN, stated that MRSA infections are common there, that she contracted it there, that she had to get IV antibiotics, and that she has not been off antibiotics since having the surgery in Jan!

Madame posted that the surgeon does up to 10 surgeries a day. You counter that he only does 3 sleeves a day. How many other procedures a day does he do in addition to the 3 sleeves?

I am a health care professional and would NEVER advise anyone to have bariatric surgery in a clinic where recovery takes place in a hotel and no ICU care is available. When you're own patient, an RN, posted that MRSA is a common infection and that she has been on antibiotics since her surgery 3 months ago, why would anyone in their right mind book surgery at your clinic?

[Guest zsflower]

Thank you for your questions Elizabeth.

The problem with people who are paid to post is that they quite often cannot keep track of the stories they tell. Two threads have been closed so far. If YOU read closely, you will see that it was NOT posted that this mother and daughter tag team got MRSA. They both went in for a band and came home with a sleeve as per you.

I am not paid to post. I am an independent patient coordinator. Yes, I make money when one of my clients books a surgery. However, the person posting above is NOT one of my clients, so whether or not he has surgery with Dr. Almanza I won't make a dime.

The mother and daughter that had the sleeve had originally decided to have the lap band. After further reseach they decided to go with the sleeve. They made that decision BEFORE they arrived for surgery.

Another patient who had surgery at Betancourt/Emmanual, an RN, stated that MRSA infections are common there, that she contracted it there, that she had to get IV antibiotics, and that she has not been off antibiotics since having the surgery in Jan!

She did NOT contract MRSA. She was posting that she is an RN and has SEEN patients contract MRSA in hospitals in the U.S. Again, she did NOT contract MRSA after her surgery!

Madame posted that the surgeon does up to 10 surgeries a day. You counter that he only does 3 sleeves a day. How many other procedures a day does he do in addition to the 3 sleeves?

Depending on which surgeries he performs that day, he performs anywhere between 3 to 5 per day. The lower number for sleeves and/or bypasses, the higher number for bands. If they are all bands, he may do slightly more

I am a health care professional and would NEVER advise anyone to have bariatric surgery in a clinic where recovery takes place in a hotel and no ICU care is available. When you're own patient, an RN, posted that MRSA is a common infection and that she has been on antibiotics since her surgery 3 months ago, why would anyone in their right mind book surgery at your clinic?

Lap Band surgery is done on a short stay basis, just as it is often done in the U.S. Patients stay from 10 to 12 hours in the hospital, then go to the hotel where they are monitored by an RN. Yes, she is licensed.

Sleeve and Bypass patients stay in the hospital for 3 days before going to the hotel.

Again, this person did NOT contract MRSA, she was speaking about her experiences as an RN with other patients in the context of her work.

ICU's and transportation is available if needed, just as with ANY other hospital in Mexico.

I appreciate this opportunity to clear things up and I welcome your questions.

__________________

[WASaBubbleButt 41]

Thank you for your questions Elizabeth.

The problem with people who are paid to post is that they quite often cannot keep track of the stories they tell. Two threads have been closed so far. If YOU read closely, you will see that it was NOT posted that this mother and daughter tag team got MRSA. They both went in for a band and came home with a sleeve as per you.

I am not paid to post. I am an independent patient coordinator. Yes, I make money when one of my clients books a surgery. However, the person posting above is NOT one of my clients, so whether or not he has surgery with Dr. Almanza I won't make a dime.

The mother and daughter that had the sleeve had originally decided to have the lap band. After further reseach they decided to go with the sleeve. They made that decision BEFORE they arrived for surgery.

Another patient who had surgery at Betancourt/Emmanual, an RN, stated that MRSA infections are common there, that she contracted it there, that she had to get IV antibiotics, and that she has not been off antibiotics since having the surgery in Jan!

She did NOT contract MRSA. She was posting that she is an RN and has SEEN patients contract MRSA in hospitals in the U.S. Again, she did NOT contract MRSA after her surgery!

Madame posted that the surgeon does up to 10 surgeries a day. You counter that he only does 3 sleeves a day. How many other procedures a day does he do in addition to the 3 sleeves?

Depending on which surgeries he performs that day, he performs anywhere between 3 to 5 per day. The lower number for sleeves and/or bypasses, the higher number for bands. If they are all bands, he may do slightly more

I am a health care professional and would NEVER advise anyone to have bariatric surgery in a clinic where recovery takes place in a hotel and no ICU care is available. When you're own patient, an RN, posted that MRSA is a common infection and that she has been on antibiotics since her surgery 3 months ago, why would anyone in their right mind book surgery at your clinic?

Lap Band surgery is done on a short stay basis, just as it is often done in the U.S. Patients stay from 10 to 12 hours in the hospital, then go to the hotel where they are monitored by an RN. Yes, she is licensed.

Sleeve and Bypass patients stay in the hospital for 3 days before going to the hotel.

Again, this person did NOT contract MRSA, she was speaking about her experiences as an RN with other patients in the context of her work.

ICU's and transportation is available if needed, just as with ANY other hospital in Mexico.

I appreciate this opportunity to clear things up and I welcome your questions.

__________________

The person posting about the infection does explain quite clearly that they are on antibiotics and have been for 2.5 months because of having had surgery with Almanza. You can talk this away all you want, it's in black and white. Maybe it wasn't MRSA, but it was an infection from the surgery.

Is Almanza doing the sleeves and bypass at Angeles hospital?

I do not believe for one minute that corners are not being cut with the prices as they are. Impossible. Unless you guys are donating your time, these costs have to be absorbed for dirt cheap surgery.

Considering the overall rep of Betancourt/Emmanual and their very long history on this board and every other I would just hope people really watch what they are doing.

Then we have the issue of paid posters. You can't talk your way out of that one either. One of them emailed Elisabeth apologizing for being paid to push your facilities and slam dunk anyone who dared to tell of negative experiences. She couldn't do it anymore and apologized to a mod for this. She's never even BEEN to Emmanual! The paid posters aren't even bright enough to hide what they are doing. They are spamming every WLS board with this nonsense, not just here on LBT. Don't you realize it makes you guys look worse?

Seriously, if you guys are going to lower yourself to paid posters at least get some bright ones. Those you have now... well, there are surely brighter crayons in the box, aren't there? If everything is as great as you say it is then why is there a need for paid posters? Other doctors... their patients are posting.

Then we have the issue of the email I received from your facility suggesting that if I don't stop posting what I know then they will attack my doctor on the boards. They will come up with fake information and slam dunk him on every WLS board they can find.

For God's sakes, where are the professional ethics at Betancourt/Emmanual/Almanza? My doctor has nothing to do with my posting. Why not attack my dentist while you guys are at it?

You know, for a short time I really started thinking Andres was trying to clean things up, improve his rep, do things the right way. When one of the paid posters explained that P. L. is no longer associated with you I honestly thought to myself that maybe things are changing. I was clearly wrong.

Ethics, they are a GOOD thing.

Edited March 28, 2009 by WASaBubbleButt

[Elisabethsew 50]

Toolow asked a question when he started this thread and I answered based on two facts, the United States is advising citizens of the dangers at the Mexican border and Tijuana is one of the two most dangerous cities warned against. Second, the experiences of past patients at Betancourt/Emmanuel. Far too many have not had good outcomes.

Toolow can make the decision to have surgery wherever he wants but should do so only after careful research. Mexican surgeons are dependent on American customers and the American economy is bad. Having surgery based on who's doing it the cheapest should not even be one of the top considerations. Obviously, as a paid employee, you have a vested interest in drumming up business for Betancourt/Emmanual. I do not.

Thank you

[Toolow 0]

I did some searching on the internet for Dr. Almanza/Betancourt and the Emmanuel center. In all of the posts the only negative information I could find was from the same three people and more often than not they were taking a positive post and picking at it for negative information.

The mother/daughter group that went to Mexico.. Looks to me like they decided to get sleeved instead of bands.. They changed their minds? Nothing sinister about that.

I looked at the post from the RN who spoke about the MRSA.

" I had a gastric sleeve on January 8, 2009 in TJ Mexico. The first couple of days were really rough but I followed the doctor's recommendations exactley and soon began feeling much better. "

A positive post from a satisfied person.

"The only complication I had were my lungs! I have asthma and was having problems with chest pain and lung capacity. Wonderful Dr. Betancourt and Dr. Almanza were both at my bedside within minutes of experiencing the chest pain and got me up out of bed walking around, using the incentive spirometer and soon, I was breathing and feeling better.'' I never had any nausea but did experience a lot of gas. Walking, lots of Water (when you are cleared to drink it) and Mylanta worked wonders. "

Again she is being positive about the doctors reaction time and her treatment for a known medical problem.

"Just remember that surgery is surgery! There is no such thing as risk free anything. Anyone who tells you that there are no complications or risks aren't telling you the truth. Even the best hospitals and doctors can't guarantee you a risk free, complication free surgery!"

A fair and reasonable warning about the risks of ANY surgery.

"MRSA, and other infections are very common no matter where you get your surgery (I am a nurse and work in geratric long term, skilled care and rehab and see it all the time!)."

She is giving a warning here about the dangers of MRSA not that she or anyone else was affected by it.

"The main thing to know is whether or not your doctor gives you IV and oral antibiotic (I got both after surgery and am still taking the oral antibiotics). Don't pass on the oral antibiotics because you think you feel great. Take them anyway and be ever watchful for any kind of infection. The sooner you get it treated... the less likely you are to have a life threatening complication."

And here she is simply stating that we shouldnt pass on the oral antibiotics and that she is still taking the oral dose. Not complaining because she has to still take it.

zsflower I respect your opinion and appreciate your input and can accept that you are defending the reputation of the Emmanuel center but thats as far as I can allow myself to be swayed by your arguments.

Elisabethew, WASaBubbleButt, MacMadame when you create a link to a post and use it to support your opinion it pays to find a post that is actually negative and to not to try to pick a positive post apart for negative bits. If there are negative posts I cant find them and would be happy if you could link to one.

I can see where someone might try to induce a poster to add positive information to a forum the only problem with your arguments is the lack of proof and even worse misquoting a post entirely.

As to Mexico being dangerous.. I agree it looks ugly there right now. I have however seen positive posts from folks who were there as little as a week ago and none seemed concerned or complained of being harrassed in any way.

In the end Elisabethsew got it right by saying the choice is ultimately mine and though I dont entirely understand this hateful grudge that the three of you have towards the Emmanuel center I simply wont be swayed by false/incorrect information.

If you have a real post from someone who is unhappy with Betancourt/Armanza or the Emmanuel center please link it to me.

My request remains the same if anyone who has had real experience with these doctors has some input I would be thrilled to hear it.

For now my surgery date is still set for the 25th of April with Dr. Armanza and I am looking forward to getting control of my weight issue and becoming the new better me.

Please everyone responding to my post remain respectful of others opinions and try to not flame others for theirs.

Remember winning an argument on an internet forum is like winning at the special olympics.. In the end you are both still retarded!

(apologies to anyone with challenged children and the special olympics)

Bob

[MacMadame 81]

If there are negative posts I cant find them and would be happy if you could link to one.

If you had typed in "Betancourt" into the search engine here, you would have found TONS of negative posts from many people.

Here are just a few of them:

http://www.lapbandtalk.com/f26/dr-betancourt-molding-clinic-tj-mexico-26987/

http://www.lapbandtalk.com/f11/experience-dr-huacuz-molding-clinic-tijuana-4106/

http://www.lapbandtalk.com/f11/any-one-use-dr-daniel-huacuz-tijuana-8481/

http://www.lapbandtalk.com/f131/pregnant-w-raging-infection-dont-go-mexico-33029/

http://www.lapbandtalk.com/f11/betancourt-medical-group-anybody-25209/

http://www.lapbandtalk.com/f78/mexican-mess-24007/

http://www.lapbandtalk.com/f78/do-not-go-betencourt-medical-33409/

http://www.lapbandtalk.com/f78/complications-18965/

http://www.lapbandtalk.com/f18/banding-betencourt-34406/

http://www.lapbandtalk.com/f11/betancourt-good-bad-37925/

http://www.lapbandtalk.com/f31/still-looking-local-dr-accept-mx-surg-63908/

http://www.lapbandtalk.com/f11/anyone-heard-dr-liza-maria-pompa-gonzalez-out-mexico-76948/

http://www.lapbandtalk.com/f17/anyone-know-where-andres-betancourt-went-65420/

http://www.lapbandtalk.com/f17/thought-everybody-would-need-see-78497/

http://www.lapbandtalk.com/f11/doctor-mexico-dr-francisco-contreras-47495/

http://www.lapbandtalk.com/f11/dr-pompa-betancourt-dr-ortiz-54986/

http://www.lapbandtalk.com/f11/liza-pompa-gonzales-52458/

And that was just from typing Betancourt. If you had also typed in Molding (the name of his first clinic) and Emmanuel, you would have gotten even more.

Note: these are in the order I found them, not in a nice chronological order.

[Elisabethsew 50]

It appears his mind was set on this before he even posted so, it's his life and he can elect this surgeon. I stand by my postings.