Is God real?

[WASaBubbleButt 41]

Isn't that really the definition of a prophet? I think it was more of a coincidence. I'm sure many of us women have been mistaken for being pregnant when we are actually just overweight.

That is exactly what I'm saying. Not that god hates people, but I believe you are misrepresenting god by saying people will be damned for doing something that they believe is in the best interest of themselves, their families, or their communities.

I thank god that the medicine and technology was available to allow me an abortion when having my tubes tied didn't do the trick.

Excellent post.

[pattygreen 5]

Isn't that really the definition of a prophet? I think it was more of a coincidence. I'm sure many of us women have been mistaken for being pregnant when we are actually just overweight.

Mistaken for pregnant because I'm overweight? By a 2 year old? No. I don't think so. I believe it was God being God in my life. Showing me that he is present and using my son to do it. After all, he just moments before put a new soul that he created in my womb.

That is exactly what I'm saying. Not that god hates people, but I believe you are misrepresenting god by saying people will be damned for doing something that they believe is in the best interest of themselves, their families, or their communities.

I wasn't the one who said people will be damned for their sins (whether they believe it's in their own best interest or not). I'm saying ,"God says that unbelievers, in his son Jesus, who sin will be damned to everlasting life without God in it. A place he named Hell. He also says that those who believe in his son, will live eternally with him in a place he named Heaven. (They will have sinned also in this life, for no man is without sin, but believers will be forgiven.)

I thank god that the medicine and technology was available to allow me an abortion when having my tubes tied didn't do the trick.

Not all medicine and technology benefits the people. Some is used for good and some is used for evil. He gives man the free will to choose what they do. But he also allows consequences. That's why we live in a screwed up world. Consequences. Sin doesn't just affect those who do the wrong, it affects everyone.

God allows a way out for those who have sinned and done things they shouldn't have. And he is merciful and loving. If you ask him for forgiveness, you shall have it. But not only forgiveness from him, but he promises to cast your sin into the sea of forgetfulness and remember it no more. In other words, when you come face to face with him someday, he won't even remember that you sinned.(whatever the sin is)

.......................see replys above...........

[TerriDoodle 6]

I think Jesus was an ancient astronaut.....and that cosmic consciousness rules our destiny.

So there.

[pattygreen 5]

So there what?

[volcano lady 0]

...

Secondly, ...There is a difference in the believers sin and the unbelievers sin, though. The difference is in how God views the sin of each. When a believer in Christ sins, God doesn't see it, he sees his son Jesus in the believer and he is justified. When an unbeliever in Christ sins, God sees his sin and he is unjustified and condemned. So, to God, ALL sin is wrong, but the difference is HOW he views the sin of the believer and the unbeliever.

...

Are you saying sin (murder, robbery, rape, being abusive, adultry, liars, etc.) is only forgivable in the eyes of God if one happens to be a believer of Jesus? So...all you have to do is believe and live your life in the most wretched way but it's OK because you'll get to heaven anyway????

patty, the more you share about your god, the more I'd really like nothing to do him. I could never put my faith in a god that was that vain. Sounds more like the devil. Think about it!

[pattygreen 5]

Are you saying sin (murder, robbery, rape, being abusive, adultry, liars, etc.) is only forgivable in the eyes of God if one happens to be a believer of Jesus? So...all you have to do is believe and live your life in the most wretched way but it's OK because you'll get to heaven anyway????

patty, the more you share about your god, the more I'd really like nothing to do him. I could never put my faith in a god that was that vain. Sounds more like the devil. Think about it!

Sin is only forgivable by God. And He says that putting your faith in his son, Jesus, is the only way for forgiveness of sins. (ANY sins, from murder, to lying, to thinking impure thoughts, whatever)

The apostle John wrote...."I write these words (refering to the bible) to you so that you wont sin. But if anyone does sin, we have one who speaks to the father in our defense, Jesus Christ, the righteous one."

God doesn't allow sin into heaven, but if you recognize that it's not possible to live this life without sinning and that you are in need of someone to take your punishment for you so you can get into heaven when you die, then Jesus is the one. So, if you believe in him, he will defend you on that day. If you ask God to forgive you, he will. Once you understand what Jesus did for you, and you accept his gift of salvation, you will no longer desire to commit the wrongs you have done in the past. You will always sin. every day. The Holy Spirit will convict you of it. But what Jesus did in dying on the cross for you will always cover your sin,(the sins you did in the past, the present and even your future sins) and God will not see it. Believers have peace and joy about death and dying because we understand that we can't ever be good enough to enter into heaven, yet it's ok, God will allow us in because Jesus paid the penalty for us already. Sorry to say, but unbelievers don't have that peace about dying, because they are not sure of their destiny. And to be frank, it would scare me to not know for sure if I was going to heaven or not.

Volcano lady, I hope you will change your mind about not wanting anything to do with God. Because he loves you. Don't take my word for anything here, read God's word for yourself.

[pattygreen 5]

I never said that I believe he existed, but it seems due to references in other historical literature besides the bible that he did exist. That era was full of prophets and theologians, so it is of no surprise to me that one young Jewish man questioned his own religious upbringing and grew up to be Jesus. This is where I veer off from believers though.

My assumption is that he was real, he was a prophet, and he developed a loyal following. I seriously doubt there is any credible evidence outside of the bible that he preformed any miracles, was ever reborn, or was the son of a virgin. The virgin birth is fascinating though. There seems to be some historical evidence that Mary was a virgin, but the term virgin had a very different meaning than it does today. This theory dispels the whole concept of the Immaculate Conception.

The immaculate conception of Mary is a catholic doctrine that was made up by someone in that denomination that states that Mary was born without a sinful nature like the rest of us humans. The problem with this teaching is that it is nowhere taught in the bible. Thus, the importance of reading the scriptures before choosing a christian denomination to attend. Actually, it is taught in the bible that only Jesus was born without sin. In Mary's song or prayer as recorded in Luke chapter 1 she says, "I rejoice in God my savior." Anyone who needs a savior, has sinned. Therefore, Mary herself admits she was a sinner.

What do you mean when you say there is no evidence outside of the bible that Jesus was reborn? I ask because I've never read in the bible about him being reborn. born, yes. reborn, no.

Edited April 8, 2009 by pattygreen

[Laptastic 0]

My god is considering forgiving you, Patty, for your sins against your fellow man and against him. I'm praying that he does forgive you. But he's not so sure right now.

[TerriDoodle 6]

Believers have peace and joy about death and dying because we understand that we can't ever be good enough to enter into heaven, yet it's ok, God will allow us in because Jesus paid the penalty for us already. Sorry to say, but unbelievers don't have that peace about dying, because they are not sure of their destiny. And to be frank, it would scare me to not know for sure if I was going to heaven or not.

Volcano lady, I hope you will change your mind about not wanting anything to do with God. Because he loves you. Don't take my word for anything here, read God's word for yourself.

Patty, your argument is seriously flawed in this one regard: you are operating from the position that your faith is the ONE TRUE faith -- and that is simply hogwash. All paths lead to God. NOT ONE PERSON on this planet can know, without any doubt, that theirs is the ONE TRUE path. If you don't have questions or doubts then you are super-human. Even Mother Theresa had doubts....many, many doubts. Even Jesus Christ had questions.

Sorry to say, but unbelievers don't have that peace about dying, because they are not sure of their destiny. And to be frank, it would scare me to not know for sure if I was going to heaven or not.

This is so flawed I don't even know where to begin. First of all, I suppose technically you could call me an 'unbeliever' by your definition. I don't believe that the only path to heaven is 'through Jesus'. So yeah, I guess that makes me an "unbeliever". BUT I have absolutely no qualms at all about my death and the afterlife. Hey, get this: I don't even believe in "HELL" as you define it! I am just as ready to die tomorrow as you are and am every bit as "sure about my destiny". You could argue with me until we are both purple but I know what I know, just as you do.

The thing I find so sad about some fundamentalists is that they are so .... EXCLUSIVE. It's a huge turn-off. I understand where it comes from and that you feel it is justified....but nevertheless....it's not an attractive quality.

Edited April 8, 2009 by TerriDoodle

[Daisalana 33]

I agree, I am a Christian, but I also think it's better to believe in something, even if it's not what I believe in. I believe there is only one "true" God for me-- but I don't think that's true for everyone.

I know it's outside the norm, but frankly I don't care.

I think there's other life somewhere out there. The universe is too big for us to be alone on this planet. So with that in mind, they don't have our Bible & our Jesus, etc.. there has to be some sort of religion out there for them. I also can't say Buddha is wrong, just because it's not what I believe in.. I don't think it's anyone's place to judge someone's faith. I think that should be the ultimate sin, if I was editing the Bible I may throw that in there.. Swap some wording around and put "There's only one true judge." as the 11th commandment.

Teehee.

And yes, even Jesus had doubts.. depending on the translation while on the cross; "Why have you abandoned me, why have you deserted me, why have you forsaken me?"

Edited April 8, 2009 by FairyFacade

[pattygreen 5]

My god is considering forgiving you, Patty, for your sins against your fellow man and against him. I'm praying that he does forgive you. But he's not so sure right now.

Unless your god is Jesus, then I don't care if he forgives me for my sins or not.

[pattygreen 5]

Patty, your argument is seriously flawed in this one regard: you are operating from the position that your faith is the ONE TRUE faith -- and that is simply hogwash. All paths lead to God. NOT ONE PERSON on this planet can know, without any doubt, that theirs is the ONE TRUE path. If you don't have questions or doubts then you are super-human. Even Mother Theresa had doubts....many, many doubts. Even Jesus Christ had questions.

Jesus said ,"I am the way and the truth and the life. No man comes to the Father but through me."

He is either telling the truth and no one can see God the Father in Heaven unless they go through him to get there, or he is a liar and a lunatic that has duped millions and millions of people through many, many centuries of time. I choose to believe he tells the truth. All paths do not lead to God. I don't have any doubts. I believe the bible to be God's words to mankind for the salvation of their souls.

There is one true faith. I know there are many religions out there, but only 1 can be right, for there is only 1 creator of it all. The difference between christianity and ALL other religions is this...In all religions man is working to get to God (good deeds, sacrifices, penance, prayers,etc.) Christianity is God coming down to give man a free gift that doesn't need to be worked for at all (salvation). It's not a religion at all, it's a relationship with the one who created you.

This is so flawed I don't even know where to begin. First of all, I suppose technically you could call me an 'unbeliever' by your definition. I don't believe that the only path to heaven is 'through Jesus'. So yeah, I guess that makes me an "unbeliever". BUT I have absolutely no qualms at all about my death and the afterlife.

So sorry, I should have said that most unbelievers fear death. I am a CNA and have witnessed the death bed of at least 25 people. Those who had no faith in God feared dying in that moment. There was quite a difference at the death bed of believers in Jesus. They were calm and without fear.

Hey, get this: I don't even believe in "HELL" as you define it! I am just as ready to die tomorrow as you are and am every bit as "sure about my destiny". You could argue with me until we are both purple but I know what I know, just as you do.

If you are confident and fearless about dying and your destination, then that is a good thing. I hope that your faith in whatever it is you have faith in works out for you. I have given you some information that I have learned from God's word, and what you do with it is your decision. I would never want to argue with you or anyone else about it.

The thing I find so sad about some fundamentalists is that they are so .... EXCLUSIVE. It's a huge turn-off. I understand where it comes from and that you feel it is justified....but nevertheless....it's not an attractive quality.

See above for replys

Exclusive has 2 meanings. One , that we don't allow any others in. Which isn't true at all. God hopes that all will turn to him. OR Two, Jesus is the only way.(which is what I think you mean) Well, God says so. Not me. If you are putting your faith in Buddah or Allah or Mother Earth or anyone else except God (Jesus)to bring you into Heaven after you die, you will not make it there.(according to the Holy Scriptures) Just think.... If your child refused to acknowledge you all his life and chose someone else to be his father (Allah or Buddah, etc.) and never wanted anything to do with you, how could you not give him what he wanted after he died, which is to be without you. God will give all unbelievers exactly what they have chosen. He gives us a free will to make that choice in this life.

[pattygreen 5]

I agree, I am a Christian, but I also think it's better to believe in something, even if it's not what I believe in. I believe there is only one "true" God for me-- but I don't think that's true for everyone.

I know it's outside the norm, but frankly I don't care.

I think there's other life somewhere out there. The universe is too big for us to be alone on this planet. So with that in mind, they don't have our Bible & our Jesus, etc.. there has to be some sort of religion out there for them. I also can't say Buddha is wrong, just because it's not what I believe in.. I don't think it's anyone's place to judge someone's faith. I think that should be the ultimate sin, if I was editing the Bible I may throw that in there.. Swap some wording around and put "There's only one true judge." as the 11th commandment.

Teehee.

There is only one true judge. God the Father. That's already in there.

I believe you are mistaking judgement for telling. God has already told us who will go to heaven and who won't, so his judgement is already settled. He said believers in Jesus will enter in and unbelievers won't. It's that simple. So for me to say that those who believe in any other God will not enter Heaven is not a judgement. It's simply repeating what God has already said to be true. So it is not an ultimate sin to 'judge' someone elses faith. (if that's what you want to call it) The ultimate sin according to God is 'unbelief'. (rejecting him).

The apostles in the book of Acts had no problem telling the people they met that their statues of many different Gods that they prayed to were not really gods at all, but that the statue they entitled "The Unknown God" was the true God and they should destroy all the other ones.

And yes, even Jesus had doubts.. depending on the translation while on the cross; "Why have you abandoned me, why have you deserted me, why have you forsaken me?"

Jesus didn't doubt who he was on the cross. Jesus was sinless up to that point, and once he was on the cross and the sins of the entire human race was placed upon him, God the Father left him, because he can not be in the presence of sin, for he is holy. Jesus had never been separated from the Father and the Holy spirit, for all three beings make up one being, God. When this happened, he was no longer God, but human, and questioned, as we would, 'Why has his father forsaken him?"

[TerriDoodle 6]

Patty - The thing is that you express your opinions as if they are bona fide, scientificly proven facts. And no matter how you slice it or dice it, they simply are not facts. All of your arguments are based on faith, not facts. Your faith resonates true for you and that is a wonderful thing. My faith resonates true for me, and that is a wonderful thing. Why isn't that good enough for fundamentalists? Why must they be "right"? I just think their (your) assumptions are immature, ignorant and ridiculously condescending.

If I tell you that I think your interpretation of the Bible is virtually meaningless to me, and you argue with me by quoting the Bible -- I hope you understand that you've lost the debate by using such circular logic.

Edited April 8, 2009 by TerriDoodle

[LilMissDiva Irene 3,282]

I hoped to get away from all of those who didn't want to talk about God on other threads, by starting a thread that was specifically about God. This way, those who didn't want to talk about God didn't have to participate. To my surprise, he's a hot topic. Even to some of the Atheists who don't even believe he exists. That's like starting a thread to talk about the tooth fairy. Why are you atheists here? You don't believe in him. So, I don't understand your interest.

pattygreen, with all due respect the title of this thread is "Is God real?". Of course you know this since you made it.

How do you expect to keep those who don't think God is real out of this discussion? If you only wanted to talk to those who DO believe in God already, and to no one else, perhaps you should have specified that.

Maybe: "If you believe in God and want to discuss it, lets talk" would have been a better option.

I'm not going to humor you however. I think you knew full on well these "people" you speak of would come here.