More that 25g protein at one sitting?

[AirKuhl 1]

Jacqui, I read what you posted and I think it's pretty clear we're in agreement, so I don't understand why you seem angry about it. You said people get alarmed when they read stuff on forums, which is exactly what I'm trying to help with. The first post in this thread expressed concern about Protein damaging kidneys and another that no person can process more than 25g at one sitting. Those are the 2 myths I was addressing. I don't know where you got the stuff about only Protein matters and that everyone should gorge on protein to the exclusion of anything else or even that I am American for that matter, as I wrote none of those things. You also stated you disagree with me about quantity of protein yet the only thing I wrote is that everyone is different, which I think you agree with.

If you are referring to other posts from other people, please do me the courtesy of not lumping me in with them. My goal is simply to squash clearly false internet rumors about the few topics I happen to be knowledgeable about. Sounds like we're on the same team, so can we play nice together? :wink2:

[Jachut 487]

Yes, I'm sorry I snapped, it gets rather tiresome that a huge number of posters on this board tend to forget there's an entire world out there outside their own country that approaches things differently.

so.... a bit of friendly debate?

Re the second article, its actually a good illustration of what I'm trying to say:

Dangers

of excessive Protein, defined as when Protein constitutes > 35% of total energy intake, include hyperaminoacidemia, hyperammonemia, hyperinsulinemia nausea, diarrhea, and even death (the “rabbit starvation syndrome”). The three different measures of defining protein intake, which should be viewed together are: absolute

intake (g/d), intake related to body weight (g ∙ kg-1 ∙ d-1) and intake as a fraction of total energy (percent energy). A suggested maximum protein intake based on

bodily needs, weight control evidence, and avoiding protein toxicity would be

approximately of 25% of energy requirements at approximately 2 to 2.5 g ∙ kg-1 ∙

d-1, corresponding to 176 g protein per day for an 80 kg individual on a 12,000kJ/d

diet. This is well below the theoretical maximum safe intake range for an 80 kg

person (285 to 365 g/d).

176 grams a day for an 80kg individual on a 12000 kilojoule (almost 4000 calories) diet. Ok.....ay. So WHO eats that much? I'd have been 400kgs if I'd consumed anything like that. And your 176 grams of protein is spread amongst a vast number of kilojoules from other nutrient sources - the PERCENTAGE of protein in the diet should not exceed 35% and should in fact be around 25% as the article says.

So there's many people here who eat more than 25% of their diet as protein and even IF the liver can handle that 176 grams, if you eat say 100 to 120 grams of protein a day on a 1000 calorie diet instead of a 4000 calorie diet, you've completely mucked up the balance, and you're almost certainly going short of many other nutrients. Its just not as simple as the liver can handle this much so I can eat it.

But people read that and think Oh, YES! Irrefutable proof that lots of protein is not bad for you.

Interestingly, Shane Bilsborough has books still in current publication in Australia anyway, that advocate the high carb, low fat way of eating and exercising before Breakfast on an empty stomach to burn more fat! He's not above publishing for the masses.

This bit is intriguing too, it kind of backs up my feeling that going to the gym five times a week does not make you a world class athlete with special nutritional needs.

"High protein diets and popular “fad-diets” that claim to be “high

protein, low carbohydrate,” recommend intakes between 71 to 162 grams of protein per day also fuel interest in increased consumption of protein. This is despite the fact that no studies have evaluated the upper limit of amino acid intake , and no formal risk assessment paradigm for intakes of amino acids that are in significant excess of physiological requirements have been established . This should be a concern for any health professional advocating a high protein diet."

It also alarms me that the article states outright that soy protein isolates are a good form of nourishment for humans. Yes...... but a shake every single day? There's loads and loads of evidence out there that overconsumption of soy might be dangerous, and what about the artificial sweeteners and all the rest of the muck those shakes can come packaged with?

I just think, yes, there's credible evidence that a high-er protein diet might have weight loss benefits, particularly for some people over others. It does seem to dampen appatite too. But that doesnt translate into this crazy obsession, for example, that all you need is Protein Shakes during your liquid diet phase, as long as you get your protein you'll be fine. Ah, no, you wont. You need lots of other things too.

And the biggie - supplementing fibre. If you need to do that, its a sure fire sign that you're not eating enough fruit and veg, even if you choose to avoid the grains. If you cant fit them in, then perhaps a little LESS protein and little MORE fruit and veg might be beneficial to you OVERALL?

I guess I believe in moderation and I tend to observe the protein push as a bit obsessive, and not moderate.

But yeah, sorry I got cross.