Should people barely over 200 lbs or below 200 get Lapband or any WLS...?

[krissyjean 0]

I never was mad at you hun or did I mean to sound like I was judging, I was just trying to figure out in my mind why you would have surgery. And now I know why. I never wanted to cause so much grief, I just wanted to know why the lower BMI's felt the need to have surgery. Sorry.

Thanks. That means a lot

[Nanook 2]

Indigo I never said people not my size shouldn't be able to have surgery.

I said and I don't know how many times I have to repeat this...I dont understand why they do...and people answered that of course.

I am not against it, my mother is. My mother gave me the idea for this thread/poll.

If someone feels they have to get surgery to help control weight...so be it. Like I said I just don't understand it.

I am over 400 lbs 406 to be exact and I started at 419...on this 6 month diet etc. I have had people tell me at 420 lbs that I should just diet and exercise and why are you getting surgery.

So I am not judging anyone about their decisions...all I simply have said the wholeeeeeeeee time is WHY. I never said they shouldn't.

So I really don't understand why I am being attacked(least seems like it).

I posted this for opinions as to WHY people do it.

When will people stop blaming their mothers!

[IndioGirl55 32]

Indigo I never said people not my size shouldn't be able to have surgery.

I said and I don't know how many times I have to repeat this...I dont understand why they do...and people answered that of course.

I am not against it, my mother is. My mother gave me the idea for this thread/poll.

If someone feels they have to get surgery to help control weight...so be it. Like I said I just don't understand it.

I am over 400 lbs 406 to be exact and I started at 419...on this 6 month diet etc. I have had people tell me at 420 lbs that I should just diet and exercise and why are you getting surgery.

So I am not judging anyone about their decisions...all I simply have said the wholeeeeeeeee time is WHY. I never said they shouldn't.

So I really don't understand why I am being attacked(least seems like it).

I posted this for opinions as to WHY people do it.

Froggie

I miss read the title of the thread - MY BAD - I edited my previous post..

go see it...

I think we have predujuci within in our own fat socitey - The person who weighs 175 thinks they aren't as bad as the person who weights 250 and the 300 lbs chick think shes better than the one who weighs 400

It's each person perspective - ...

[Nanook 2]

Indigogirl55,

That is very true there is prejudice within our own group of peeps on sizism! Not necessarily in the forum but in general. Many interesting books and articles and sites on the matter in fact! But I won't go "there" because it's way too controversial for Rants and Raves:unsure:

[Jachut 487]

I really think its OK not to "get it". I got that all the time from other people who are the same size I was. I've got friends who are the ame size I was who are perfectly happy with the way they look. I wasnt.

Now there's no way to say that without then implying if I thought I was gross at 5ft 10, 240, what on earth must I think of someone who's 400lb? I cant answer that. I was worried about what *I* looked like, not anybody else. I was every bit as out of control with my weight so I really dont judge that. I dont think someone is weaker than I was because they got heavier, but by the same token, that means that I dont necessarily find it any easier to control my weight just because I'm lighter.

Its really just a function of when you say "ENOUGH" and do something about it. I'm also lucky to live in Australia and have private health insurance, this was a lot more available to me than it is to a lot of other people.

[ilse72 0]

Calm down, I never said self pay was easy! Sometimes it's a struggle to pay the co-pays and I never would have paid out of pocket personally, I have enough worries with putting 2 girls through college! That's your choice! Nanook.

LOL...I'm calm...just explaining that self-pay does not mean stuffed wallets or lots of money. We are like the rest of you...desperate to lose weight and be healthy. And, we are willing to sacrifice and struggle financially to get the surgery that insurance denies us...often because it is an exclusion. Believe me, my life is just as tough financially as the next person...my oldest recently graduated college and now is getting married in a few months. It seems the money goes out so much faster than it comes in. :frown: Sure would be nice to have a money tree or a rich uncle. LOL.

Edited June 30, 2008 by ilse72

[Nanook 2]

Hey times are hard, I think money is on all our minds. I definitely wouldn't have even considered it if I was self-pay, that's just me.

I remember when I got married in 1982 my father gave me a $1,500 allowance for wedding costs. I didn't realize that he spent more on the brothers on their rehearsal dinners! So I went to Learners which back then was a "cheap" store and bought a dress on sale, it was even a size too small but I starved myself for 2 weeks and fit into it. I think it was a pretty white dress with a Victorian look to it on sale for $20. Had the wedding in the backyard of my BIL's house and my dad made a turkey and his mom a ham and one of my brothers bought a keg. Those days are gone!!! Oh and the rest of the money was spent on our honeymoon at the beach for a week.

I don't know if after the girls graduate, I'd be able to afford the kind of weddings they have today. OMG, I watch some of those shows like Bridezilla and Platinum Weddings and don't know how people do it. I say living together for the first 25 years is a good thing! I was one of those who got her MRS instead of her PhD like all my bros did! Although I love my husband dearly.

[TerriDoodle 6]

I was 215...an all time high for me and gaining steadily at 2# a month since menopause kicked in.

My older sister weighs 270 easy and I could see where this road was leading! I did it more as a preventative measure, I guess you could say. I was self-pay.

Whether any of you think I should have or shouldn't have is, frankly, irrelevant. My body, my life!

[MrsFlipFlops 2]

Glou- good question, one I might have to consider for a bit. I wish then I knew now how painful getting larger was. I wonder if that knowledge would have prevented me from doing so... although I suppose I'll never know.

Jachut- I don't necessarily agree with plastic surgery either. We as a society are so caught up in image. I'm a little hypocritical though because I said I didn't have lapband partically for looks, I'd be lying. 80 percent health, 20 percent looks. But to be fair, the way we look will hold us back in career, relationships, and even the discount we get on cars and houses.

[IndioGirl55 32]

Indigogirl55,

That is very true there is prejudice within our own group of peeps on sizism! Not necessarily in the forum but in general. Many interesting books and articles and sites on the matter in fact! But I won't go "there" because it's way too controversial for Rants and Raves:unsure:

Yep it's no diff that African Americans have prejudice in there race about lighter skinned vs darker skin - Mexicans the same way - or as something as simple as who has more $$ rich can think they are better than the poor

I really think its OK not to "get it". I got that all the time from other people who are the same size I was. I've got friends who are the ame size I was who are perfectly happy with the way they look. I wasnt.

Now there's no way to say that without then implying if I thought I was gross at 5ft 10, 240, what on earth must I think of someone who's 400lb? I cant answer that. I was worried about what *I* looked like, not anybody else. I was every bit as out of control with my weight so I really dont judge that. I dont think someone is weaker than I was because they got heavier, but by the same token, that means that I dont necessarily find it any easier to control my weight just because I'm lighter.

Its really just a function of when you say "ENOUGH" and do something about it. I'm also lucky to live in Australia and have private health insurance, this was a lot more available to me than it is to a lot of other people.

Jachut - Well said !!! it's up to the individual - some choose to say Enough and others don't - I had the pleasure to listen Dr Richard Dixon speak this weekend - it was motivational and inspiring - you Aussie have a better health care system that us American's - Maybe we can take a page from your book

LOL...I'm calm...just explaining that self-pay does not mean stuffed wallets or lots of money. We are like the rest of you...desperate to lose weight and be healthy. And, we are willing to sacrifice and struggle financially to get the surgery that insurance denies us...often because it is an exclusion. Believe me, my life is just as tough financially as the next person...my oldest recently graduated college and now is getting married in a few months. It seems the money goes out so much faster than it comes in. Sure would be nice to have a money tree or a rich uncle. LOL.

Ok this whole selfpay vs insurance issue - just sorta bugs me - no offense to you Nanook - I have read this many times over on other threads

"Well I am self pay so I am going to work harder" IMHO that's BS - we are all self pay when it came to WW - Jenny Craig or whatever program we went on etc - did we succeed NOPE. Ya selfpayers are going into debit for this but I don't think that's really going to make a diff - it's all about what you want the person- if like Jachut said about - if you are ready to just say Enough - just cuz I had insurance that covered it (but you also have to take into consideration even though you have insurance depending on your plan you can have considerable copays) do I take it for granted NOPE -

I just don't think the statement Self Payer are going to work harder does mean to say that if you did have insurance to cover it you wouldn't work it the same way.

Again no offense directed at you Nanook - just talking on the point of self pay vs insurance in general..

[MacMadame 81]

And also if you read my VERY first post in here I said people who are completely healthy

I'm sorry, but no one who is morbidly obese is completely healthy and I'd argue that (almost) no one who is obese is completely healthy either. You may not have outward signs, but your inside are feeling the extra weight and it's going to come out and bite ya eventually.

At 220 I felt like the fattest person around, but told myself I would never have surgery.

I understand your attitude because I used to have it but now that I've finally accepted that I can't do this on my own, I find my previous attitude towards surgery to be misguided.

I see some people who are at 200 and they get WLS and sure, I think they took the easy way out without trying anything.

Whether or not people have tried things is not a function of their weight. Some people who are 300 lb. have never tried anything, not really tried. Personally, I have been dieting since I was 13. I once lost 70 lb. and got down to a normal weight and kept it off for a few years. I've been on Jenny Craig, I've been on WW, I've been on Nutri/system. I did Atkins back in the 70s when only crackpots did it. I've even done it on my own.

Getting surgery is not about lack of effort on my part. It's about finally realizing that doing the same thing over and over hoping for a different result is madness. It's about finally being willing to do something extreme because it works and my fears of the extremeness of it being outweighed by the fears of what would happen if I didn't do anything about it.

But let's say I hadn't... should it really matter? We know that diet and exercise doesn't work once you have a significant amount of weight to lose. We even know why. Why should we force people to try something that we know won't work for them and also make them be in an unhealthy state for years (2 to 5 depending on the insurance company) before we're willing to give them a medical treatment that actually works? I think it's madness.

Can you imagine if we made cancer patients have to prove their worthiness for chemo? Or if we wouldn't give them treatment that works until they'd spent two years trying herbs and hypnosis? Just imagine the uproar!

None of this is about health or doing what makes sense medically IMO. It's about making people prove they are worthy. Frankly, I don't approve.

Edited July 1, 2008 by MacMadame

[Sades 4]

It's all relevant to the person. For example, when I was much younger, around 170-180 lbs I had some really skinny friends who would constantly pat their stomach and say I feel fat blah blah blah. I used to get peeved at them but now I realise that no matter what size you are, if you don't feel good about yourself then you will always want to be slimmer, fatter (hard to believe), taller, shorter, prettier, etc. Now I just say to them, yes you'll probably feel better if you lose a few lbs or get some exercise in.

Also, I have tried every diet from the grapefruit diet in the 60-70s to the detox diet in the 2000s, Gloria ?? (can't remember the name), WW, Lite n Easy, various gyms, urine injections, and the list goes on. I have managed to lose 30-50 lbs and of course back it comes. And some of this I'd tried over and over during the last 40 years. I'd say that I've worked harder at losing weight than people I know who weigh heaps more than me, so really it's not the size but the need that matters here and I need this just as much as someone 200 lbs bigger than me.

[MrsFlipFlops 2]

I was thinking about this last night... my perspective is kind of old school. When the surgery first hit the US back in 2001, you had to be at least 100 lbs overweight to get it. Slowly that requirement lowered. I guess I've always felt that requirement helped people keep it as a last resort. I mean, if someone who has just 20 lbs to lose, 10 lbs to lose can get it by being self pay or treating it like plastic surgery, what's keeping us from banding children who have family history of obesity? It's preventative, right? Going back to a previous post, are we going to treat people with chemo as a preventative tool?

I know I sound anti, I really am on the fence about this. On one hand I know the pains of being not overweight, not obese, not even morbidly obese, I know the NEW category SUPER Mordibly obese... And I believe that people should do what they can to control their weight, and if that includes surgery, terrific. (there appears to be plenty of people in camp) On the other hand, I worry what being a surgery happy society will do to us. Not just superficially, but emotionally.

[VegasGrace 1]

I say this....even if they are 175 lbs they should get it if they want.

The FDA has not stopped people from getting surgery if it's not needed. Case in point, cosmetic surgery. And don't say it's not as dangerous or there are less risks...that's so not true!

The lapband is so not evasive and so not permanent that anyone should get it if they want.

And just wait and see...one day that will come to pass.

If I could have gotten it going upwards to my 256...I would have not ever gotten there, had the comorbids, etc.

My daughter is having it rough, she's 18 and is gaining weight like crazy. My entire family lost weight when I did. But she's on her own and I don't cook for her.

So the damage I have done all these years has stuck with her. She's now 165 going up....I wish she could have the lapband.

[MacMadame 81]

I guess I've always felt that requirement helped people keep it as a last resort.

But it's arbitrary. It assumes that "last resort" is the same for everyone.

I mean, if someone who has just 20 lbs to lose, 10 lbs to lose can get it by being self pay or treating it like plastic surgery, what's keeping us from banding children who have family history of obesity? It's preventative, right? Going back to a previous post, are we going to treat people with chemo as a preventative tool?

Chemo isn't preventative though. People do get their breast cut off when they have a family history of breast cancer--the virulent kind that kills you.

Surgeons are often in the forefront of treating new diseases. Their work often helps us understand the disease well enough to come up with non surgical treatments. I see a lot of breakthroughs coming out in the next 5 to 10 years, at least some of them non-surgical now that we understand about ghrelin -- which was only discovered in 1999.

When there are other viable choices, less and less people will get surgery. Not I think surgery is always the last choice. Sometimes it's less risky than non-surgical alternatives. I got my gallbladder out when it had stones instead of having the stones smashed by a laser and taking medicine for 2 years to dissolve them, for example, and I'd do it again if I had the same choice to make over again.

Edited July 1, 2008 by MacMadame