Some people, I swear...

[neveragain 9]

It has been most interesting to observe this “back room” discussion of my postings.

I have been on the Internet for many years, long before it was called the “Internet”. I have participated in many, many forums, and I have owned, operated, and moderated many as well.

Thus, I am very familiar with the concept of a “troll”. I have (many times) been party to the “outing” of a troll on various forums. There have been times, in fact, when the troll was not actually a troll, but a real person espousing a real point of view and opinion, and I was proven wrong.

This is the first time that I have been referred to as a troll, and it is not all that pleasant.

There is another type of forum miscreant that we sometimes call an “rtroll”, which stands for REVERSE Troll. This is the person that THINKS they smell a troll, and becomes obsessed with “outing” the Troll to the point where the original message/posting is nearly forgotten. They become obsessed with findings flaws in the argumentation, missing details, etc. I see some of that happening here.

This is a REAL situation. Perhaps I erred by bringing up the Talk Show appearance. At the time, it seemed like a good idea, that it may lend credibility to my story, but the reality is that it appears to have detracted from my credibility.

I used the expression “more later” or “I’ll have more to say on that later” a couple of times, but that seems to have been burned into your collective psyche as the sign of an impending sales pitch. It didn’t, perhaps, occur to any of you that maybe I have a job or business to run and maybe cannot give all the juicy details in one sitting? Next time I will be sure to state that up front, in language that you will all understand.

The expression “target audience” seems to have been engraved in your minds as well. And I would pose the question (again): what part of that don’t you people get? That’s an expression that we use in the business world, and in our private lives EVERYDAY. But you CHOSE to interpret it as an overt confession that I will be somehow soliciting you all. So…howz about “intended listeners” for a replacement phrase. Does that send up any red flags for ya?

Neveragain, I was completely unaware that you “tore” me a new “a-hole”. I must have missed that post. All I saw was some inane ramblings about how you don’t “buy” what I’m saying. It’s not important to me AT ALL that you buy ANYTHING I have to say. But it sure seems to piss you off. That’s not my intention.

Oh, oh my god, I'm sorry. I really should get down on my knees and beg for your forgiveness. I had no idea that you knew the amazing amount of knowledge that most 10 year olds do, oh, and that you may be a prestigious and successful entrepreneur. God forbid I would ever question your extensive knowledge on any given subject.

No one is confused about what "target audience" is. It is about as self-explanatory as possible. Did it ever occur to you that the way things are written and the undertones they are given is very directive in the way something is taken or meant? Well, now you do.

You bring a sob story about something that happens to more people than just yourself and you make yourself look like the entire world owes you a deep and sincere apology that would fill the crevices of your heart. Seriously, if you want some credibility, don't make yourself look like a poor victim of some vicious, hanus crime when you are no different than just a poor statistic of the weight loss surgery category.

Everything else aside, providing that this really did happen, I wish you nothing but the best. You took a risk and it backfired as they do on occasion. It really is a sad thing when something that can be so beneficial and helpful in someone's life doesn't work out, especially in this case. I really just wish you had come out and explained everything differently instead of giving everyone the idea that you were just trying to get complications of the Lapband out and provoke some emotion.

I don't like giving people crap, I really don't, but I'm not going to sit here and tell you that you didn't deserve all of the crap you got.

I do wish your mother-in-law all the best, though.

[Headhunter 6]

Ok., Never, that's fair enough. I don't wish to escalate this any more. I appreciate the good wishes, and send you the same.

We'll just leave it at that.

[Headhunter 6]

"

"Never....im totally with you..I received a private email from this guy slamming me big time. There is something wrong with him, there truly is. I did contact the site and reported him as well as put him on my ignore list. He was verbally abusive, ignorant and hateful. This guy has some serious issues and I felt it was best not to even answer his private email to me....anyway, glad we are in the same ballpark. Thanks for the post."

I am responding to this post for ONE reason: in it, she gives the impression that I INITIATED a contact with her that was unprovoked.

this is NOT the case.

She PM'd me first, with a rather nasty little diatribe. I responded in kind.

I do not wish it to be thought that I am attempting to provoke people individually, off-list. That is NOT the case, but she is attempting to make it appear so. I simply responded to her. End of Story.

[plain 12]

Headhunter, a lot of people post unmitigated bullsh*t on here, trashing the band. That's probably why your story raised red flags. Surely you can at least see that your story, though it may be true, certainly sounds fantastic in the telling. If you really want to share, I have a lot of questions. Feel free to PM me if you don't want things out in the open. Nobody here would wish a bad outcome on you.

I guess my point is, some people troll almost daily ranting against the band in an attempt to dissuade potential users. So when a story like yours pops up, we are naturally skeptical. I'll be honest....I'm still skeptical. Most of our doctors explained the risks and went out of the way to make sure we knew exactly what we were getting into. If your story is true, it is a gigantic anamoly in the lapband community.

[MacMadame 81]

Oh McMadame, I'm glad I'm not the only one who loathes Dr. Phil!

Oh there are more of us. Unfortunately not enough to stop him from appearing in enough places that I can't avoid him no matter how much I try.

Most of our doctors explained the risks and went out of the way to make sure we knew exactly what we were getting into. If your story is true, it is a gigantic anamoly in the Lap Band community.

I think it's more that people don't listen than that they weren't told. There was some study about how much info people retain from their doctors visits and it's something really low like 30%.

It's interesting that HH went for lap band. Lots of people post here that over a certain weight their surgeons try to steer them towards RnY and maybe that would have been a better option for him.

[Catalystmb 2]

Hey there Headhunterr.....

Care to 'splain your posts on a board for marketing about your ebooks you're hocking?

Or is it two books now?

Last year (per date on post) someone had a similar situation with WLS which resulted in his intestines being...blah blah blah.....

Do you think this is amusing?

If this was a hobby board I would just think you were an imbicile. There are people here seeking answers to something they are battling. They don't need you and your ebooks.

How about coming out about your stinkin' ebooks in the introductory line of your first post. You would have earned some credibility. People would have sighed and moved on...or maybe one or two would have thrown you a few pennies for your ebook......

[Headhunter 6]

Mac, he really didn't try and steer me either way. he did ask me why I had chosen the Lap Band. I told him it seemed like viable option: it was reversible, it was adjustable. and it sounded great on paper.

I will state emphatically that he did NOT give me any detailed information on the potential risks. I did think i was aware of the apparent risks, as i had done a fair amount of homework on the process. I sensed that when I answered his question about why I had chosen the band, he was satisified that I knew what I needed to know. And keep in mind that this was several years ago, there was not as much history on the band, as there is now. I'm not sure that they were entirley aware of the all the risks.

But I DO NOT recall any moment when they sat me down and said "These are the risks". I think they should have, but that's just my opinion.

[Headhunter 6]

Hey there Headhunterr.....

Care to 'splain your posts on a board for marketing about your ebooks you're hocking?

Or is it two books now?

Last year (per date on post) someone had a similar situation with WLS which resulted in his intestines being...blah blah blah.....

Do you think this is amusing?

If this was a hobby board I would just think you were an imbicile. There are people here seeking answers to something they are battling. They don't need you and your ebooks.

How about coming out about your stinkin' ebooks in the introductory line of your first post. You would have earned some credibility. People would have sighed and moved on...or maybe one or two would have thrown you a few pennies for your ebook......

Sorry, i already "'splained" that on the other thread. Nothing to explain, except what you are TRYING to make of it. There is NO NEW information there except intestine was swtiched with colon...as I "'splained".

So, you are suggesting that I should have introduced myself by saying

"hey, I have a great story to tell you, but I need you to know upfront that a few months ago I considered writing an ebook about my expereicne and was looking for suggestions from marketing pros on how to get it out there, but I never really did anything thing about it other than outlines and interviews, and I need to tell you this rightnowrightawaysoIcanGetstreetcred........."

You think THAT would have given me credibility? hardly.

And, in reality, it might have been the CORRECT thing to do to simply WRITE the books and let people judge for themselves. That way I wouldn't have to deal with folks like you, now would I?

You need to find something else to do. you really do.

[taz 2]

Hi Headhunter. I was wondering when you were banded and where and by whom? I was also wondering how long you were banded before you started having trouble.

[Headhunter 6]

Hi, Taz;

I was banded at a medical facility here in los Angeles,....I am reluctant to divulge much about the where/who for reaons I have stated several times here (there's a thread on it over in the Complications section).

I'll PM you....

[Fanny Adams 7]

So Headhunter, are you in a Witness Protection Program yet? Is there somewhere we can send money to aid you in your valiant efforts to avoid the evil Bariatric Surgery Industry assassins? I sure would hate to see you fall victim to those heinous criminals and if there's anything I can do to help save you from their clutches, please let me know!

[Gone4Now 4]

So Headhunter, are you in a Witness Protection Program yet? Is there somewhere we can send money to aid you in your valiant efforts to avoid the evil Bariatric Surgery Industry assassins? I sure would hate to see you fall victim to those heinous criminals and if there's anything I can do to help save you from their clutches, please let me know!

HA HA HA HA. No, seriously, though...there was a horse head in my bed this morning....

Signed,

Anonymous

[brandyII 9]

Man, my computer is out for a few days and I miss all the good stuff, but I'm still on the fence on this one, but that's just the kind of gal I am, brandyII.

[WASaBubbleButt 41]

...If he is, then he was given zero post-op or aftercare instructions. Again, that might be possible if he had his surgery in Mexico, or elsewhere overseas (I'm not knocking those that got banded in Mexico, BTW).

I have to jump in here. You know, the above is just plain insulting. It is a bit like saying, "Wow, you are REALLY ugly (but if you are ugly I'm not knocking it, btw)".

Mexico has some mega fine hospitals and doctors, some are better than your average doc in the US. There are a couple of docs that have referred very complicated cases to my doc in Mexico because he COULD handle them. Let's not forget, it was mostly the Mexican surgeons that not only perfected the band, they perfected the surgical technique to what YOU have now, and they trained the first US surgeons in banding.

I'm sick to death of any bad thing that happens with any WLS, some idiot jumps in and says, "Oh, did they have surgery in Mexico?" So far each and every bloody time I have read that the person had surgery in the US. Amazingly, it's totally freak'en possible to have surgery in Mexico and unbelievably, it's damned safe. Safer than many US surgeons. It is sheer bigotry to assume that if something bad happens a Mexican must have done the surgery.

On OH right now there are two threads about how a doctor placed a band around a wad of fat instead of the stomach. Two patients! Of course, the first question that was asked was, "Did you have surgery in Mexico?" WTF? What does surgery in Mexico have to do with it? Both were operated on by doctors in the good 'ol USA.

I'm sick of it, it's nothing but ignorance and bigotry when people are so uneducated and unenlightened about places outside the US.

Do some research people! I did, you can do it too! There are many very good doctors in Mexico. One can be Mexican and skilled at the same time. Honest.

But if he had his operation in a hospital, then either 1) - this is this worst hospital known to man (but he wrote that the hospital was one of the "finest") or 2) he's full of shit. Because even if he had the most incompetant doctor in the world, the hospital (with potential lawsuits always in the back of their mind) would provide, in writing, postop instructions of what he needed to do, and what he should do if he feels there is a problem. He probably had to initial that he recieved those instructions before he even had the surgery.

I have worked in the US medical system for 25 years. You are just plain wrong. I have worked at a hospital here in Phoenix, AZ (County hospital in Phoenix) where medical records were not transferred with an NICU baby that was dying due to lack of care and crappy medical care while in the hospital and the records were not released until the damage control team (lawyers) went over the records and changed them so the care didn't look as shitty as it was.

Was that the care you refer to when you write of how careful hospitals are? I'm here to tell you, that is not rare, it happens all the time. I always tell people with problems to try and get copies of the records from the nurse before discharge. They have a way of changing after the hospital lawyers take a look. The care is not always better here because it is the US. The LACK of care or crappy care is just covered up better.

Onto the physiology: Unless his doctor totally botched (which is possible) port placement, it would take some length of time for a loose port to erode through the adipose tissue and then through all the dermal layers. Like somebody mentioned before, you'd think he would notice a lot of pain / bruising (from the bleeding that had to occur).

The doctor may have blown it, I don't know. I suspect he did not remove the excess tubing at the time of surgery. Bands come with extra long tubing and it should be trimmed before closing the patient. What happened with this guy wouldn't be much different from erosion. There is no pain with erosion, no bruising, nothing. Most people figure out something is wrong when they start gaining weight or when a ton of fills doesn't touch their restriction. Nope, no pain... nada. Just like what this guy is claiming with his colon. Erosion does not have to take a long time to happen, it can happen in months. Same with tubing embedding in a colon.

The only way I can think of as to how his tubing would end up in the colon is this scenario: Band erodes a hole in the stomach, tubing somehow detaches and finds way into hole, and works way into colon from there. Again, it's possible, but I'd think it would be the equivalent of winning the lottery and getting struck by lightning at the same time.

See above. The tubing comes in excess. They use part of it during surgery for other uses but most of the excess is merly cut off and removed. So no, it would not be as likely as winning the lottery and getting struck by lightening at the same time. If so, every eroded patient could say the same. What's erosion now, 1.3%? Actually, those are outdated stats, who knows what they are now. Since the US has started banding slip stats have doubled according to Inamed.

Bottom line, there are a whole lot of possibles, but they add up to improbables. I'd like to hear from some nurses / doctors on here what their theory is (uh, off the record, of course).

No, bottom line is that many who do not have medical knowledge are making assumptions based on... nothing. What if this guy is for real? We have treated a fellow banded person like complete shit and why? Are we afraid he might be telling the truth and this could happen to us?

Finally, OP makes a big point of "why would I come on here with my story?I have nothing to gain". Except....people get on here all the time to just be negative. And y'all can boo me all you want, but I don't know if a person that is 300 lbs overweight is an excellent candidate for the band in the first place. That much overweight may need a malabsorbive procedure.

The higher BMIs do not necessarily need malabsorptive. If a band and sleeve have very similar 5 year weight loss stats, why is malabsorptive superior to restrictive? The surgical risk alone makes bypass dangerous for the super-obese. It's MORE dangerous, that does not prove your theory to be true that the higher BMIers need malabsorptive.

You know, many of us (and I used to be one) sit there smug feeling like we picked the most safe procedure out there. That might or might not be true. Initial surgical risk for banding is indeed the safer option. BUT... 30 days after surgery a sleeve person has drastically fewer risks and complications than a banded person.

Not as safe as we might like to believe.

I may not agree with the guy's technique or maybe even motives. I don't know all the facts so I can't say. I can say what he is saying is totally possible and we have treated him worse than we would dog crap. Not very nice of fellow bandsters. It is human natures to not want bad things to happen to ourselves, fair enough. But if this guy is for real, what have we done?

You know, I'm having band problems too. I'm at a point where I can't quit losing weight. That's just one of the many problems that have happened over the last two months. I was posting on another board (private board) about this issue while explaining that I am eating chocolate and ice cream just to stop losing weight. I am considering a revision to another procedure so I can maintain instead of losing weight. An oh-so-bright idiot decided that I shouldn't post anymore because I am not supportive of the band, I dared to tell of problem issues. Mind you... not to newbies, but to band vets only. Newbies can't even read this board. She then told me that I am obviously anorexic with body image issues because I don't want to just remove my band and get fat again. I should wait until I'm fat before revising to another procedure for maintenance. If I was anorexic, shouldn't I be keeping things the way they are so I can continue losing? Common sense isn't her forte in life.

How do you think that made me feel? I will tell you, I now only go into detail about my situation with friends because they are safe, unlike posting on a board such as this.

What you guys are doing to this guy is NO different from what the other person on another board did to me. I just hope you are never in the position I am in, your fellow posters will be heartless. And for what reason? Only thing I can come up with is fear that it might be true and it might happen to them.

[WASaBubbleButt 41]

Listen Ladies (and gents) coming from my lowly EMT experiance .. he is full of crap ... a perfed colon is ER/OR in lightening speed.. sepsis can kill in a very VERY Short time

Pix... how much OR experience do you have? How many surgeries have you performed? How many "perfs" have you repaired? How many have you seen repaired? I've been an OR Trauma nurse and a Trauma ICU nurse. I've seen many. You? How many erosions have you personally seen that causes sepsis in lightening speed?

Again, he never claimed he had a "perfed" colon. A perforation is much different from what he is explaining.

I have a real problem with the extremes everyone is going to here. People with no or minimal medical knowledge are just certain this guy can't be telling the truth and they are going into medical detail to explain why. And you know what? You guys are dead wrong. Your EMT experience is not going to touch this one, this one requires more knowledge than an EMT has.

This guy might or might not be telling the truth. But when it comes to major issues like this I prefer to stay on the side of... he might f'ing well be telling the truth so perhaps the abuse is not justified.