Flying, Weight and Discrimination...

[plain 12]

Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe it really is that the benevolent airlines only care about protecting the normal-sized passengers from the evil obese ones.

[MacMadame 81]

The workers now decide arbitrarily who is too big, who is dressed too provacatively, who fits certain profiling guidelines...the list goes on.

Another of my pet peeves... arbitrary enforcement or lack of enforcement of arbitrary rules and policies.

I have been on MANY flights where people didn't fit in their seats but weren't made to buy an extra ticket. But every once in a while an airline employee decides to crack down just by some arbitrary eyeballing and we all turn a blind eye (when it isn't us) because we all have been impinged on at some time flying and secretly we think "yeah, someone's doing something about it!" But it's all for show and we still get stuffed into our tiny seats with inadequate leg room next to Mr. I Want Two Armrests.

While we find it intrusive and unfair, we keep wanting them to do what they do, cheaper, quicker, and safer.....something has to give and it is usually customer service----the only way to combat it---is letting them know why, and taking your $$$$ elsewhere.

I no longer fly any more, if I can at all help it. In fact, I drove from CA to Kansas City two summers ago because it was easier and cheaper than flying, given some of the stuff I had to bring with me.

See, there's the problem. Larger seats means fewer seats. Fewer seats means fewer passengers per plane. Fewer passengers per plane means that seat prices jump tremendously, making them even more outrageous.

That's what the airlines want you to believe. But have you looked at the salaries and bonus plans of their top executives? How come they don't cut those? No, it's always customer service that goes. Then they tell us that they *have* to do it that way, either for our own good or because we demand reasonable ticket prices.

Well, I'm not buying it...

If airlines want only thin people to fly, they are going about it exactly the right way. But if they want as many people to fly as possible, including the 60% of Americans who are overweight, then they need to rethink their policies.

Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe it really is that the benevolent airlines only care about protecting the normal-sized passengers from the evil obese ones.

:huh2:

[Fanny Adams 7]

Am I the only person who has read this thread and is totally uncomfortable with the acronym "POS"? To me, that abbreviation has always stood for "Piece of Shit", in the same way that "SOB" usually stands for "Son of a Bitch". I KNOW it isn't meant that way, but I have cringed every single time I've read it in this thread and 6 pages of using it to mean "Person of Size" has done nothing to alleviate that cringe factor! I HATE the way those terms are associated in my mind - is this just my own paranoia?

[ReadySteadyGo 8]

Laurend and Kat hit the nail right on the head. The airlines (and I am no fan, I assure you) are not discriminating based on a person's size. They have to go on how much weight the plane carries. The more weight, the more fuel that will be consumed per flight. The more fuel consumed, the lower the profit margin.

The weight issue (vs. size) can also be looked at from a safety point. It's an extreme example (and 1-2 POS would not make such a drastic difference), but would you rather be on a plane that was target weight, or a plane that was dangerously overweight? That's why the airlines aren't hit with discrimination suits. If a person's disability was that they farted flames, and were denied a job working in a fireworks factory, would that also be discrimination? (We'll have to wait for a DS'er to answer that rhetorical question, I suppose)

Okay I get it. But then they should do something besides eyestimate how big a person is. If I were a foot taller I might fit in those seats...but my weight would be the same.

Then again if they asked me how much I weighed...I would lie, and be angry that they dared to ask me. Hmm....I will have to think on this.

[ReadySteadyGo 8]

Am I the only person who has read this thread and is totally uncomfortable with the acronym "POS"? To me, that abbreviation has always stood for "Piece of Shit", in the same way that "SOB" usually stands for "Son of a Bitch". I KNOW it isn't meant that way, but I have cringed every single time I've read it in this thread and 6 pages of using it to mean "Person of Size" has done nothing to alleviate that cringe factor! I HATE the way those terms are associated in my mind - is this just my own paranoia?

Yeah. I just imagine a new guy looking at the some chart and it says "POS". If it were me I would think that they had made someone mad. I would like to be referred to as PP (pleaseantly plump) oh wait...THats not much better is it...

What about "Curvy Undertall Not Thin"? Oh wait...

[losingjusme 12]

They don't make very much profit at all. There have been several smaller airlines that have folded in the last few weeks, in fact. Between fuel prices, employee benefits/wages, etc., the airlines aren't doing so well.

no, we're not... not as well as the oil companies .. by far.

last time i checked, our jet fuel was 120ish a barrell. i deleted the email i received yesterday that quoted how much it was, but when it comes today, i'll post what it is.

and MacMadame, i agree... some of the very top execs do get the huge pay outs and it really does tick some of us off, but you know, they run the airline and do have a lot to deal with... im not making excuses, but just sayin ...

[brandyII 9]

MacMadame,

Another one who hit the nail on the head!!!!!!, They don't make a profit, OMG!!!!!!!! I'm surprised I let that one go earlier. That's all I'm going to say on the matter, brandyII, not I and not III, but II.

Oh and I've never heard of Benevolent Airlines, are they any good? jk

[losingjusme 12]

Jet fuel price was $142.29 a barrel.

[snuffy65 1]

Another of my pet peeves... arbitrary enforcement or lack of enforcement of arbitrary rules and policies.

I have been on MANY flights where people didn't fit in their seats but weren't made to buy an extra ticket. But every once in a while an airline employee decides to crack down just by some arbitrary eyeballing and we all turn a blind eye (when it isn't us) because we all have been impinged on at some time flying and secretly we think "yeah, someone's doing something about it!" But it's all for show and we still get stuffed into our tiny seats with inadequate leg room next to Mr. I Want Two Armrests.

Which is why the SW policy of arm rests is fair. Then you don't have to guess and attendants don't ahve to argue with the 400lb man who doen't understand why people can't sit by him.

I no longer fly any more, if I can at all help it. In fact, I drove from CA to Kansas City two summers ago because it was easier and cheaper than flying, given some of the stuff I had to bring with me.

This is good. Wish more people would do this so MY ticket prices won;t go up.

That's what the airlines want you to believe. But have you looked at the salaries and bonus plans of their top executives? How come they don't cut those? No, it's always customer service that goes. Then they tell us that they *have* to do it that way, either for our own good or because we demand reasonable ticket prices.

Yes top execs get alot of money. What company's execs don't? What you need to do is look at margin of profits. Or maybe take a economics class.If you took one or two seats out of a certain type a plane it would cost alot. $100's of dollars x per 100's of flight X 100's of planes. Try doing the math!

If airlines want only thin people to fly, they are going about it exactly the right way. But if they want as many people to fly as possible, including the 60% of Americans who are overweight, then they need to rethink their policies.

60% of americans are over weight not morbidly obese. Last time I checked I can fit in the seats fine with a 43 BMI.

Again, people DOOOOOOOOOO have choices. upgrade your seat! pay for seat insurance! Fly on airlines that have bigger seats.

Private airlines don't have to conform to you. As a customer you can do what you want but so can they.

Edited April 15, 2008 by snuffy65

[ReadySteadyGo 8]

Which is why the SW policy of arm rests is fair. Then you don't have to guess and attendants don't ahve to argue with the 400lb man who doen't understand why people can't sit by him.

This is good. Wish more people would do this so MY ticket prices won;t go up.

Yes top execs get alot of money. What company's execs don't? What you need to do is look at margin of profits. Or maybe take a economics class.If you took one or two seats out of a certain type a plane it would cost alot. $100's of dollars x per 100's of flight X 100's of planes. Try doing the math!

60% of americans are over weight not morbidly obese. Last time I checked I can fit in the seats fine with a 43 BMI.

Again, people DOOOOOOOOOO have choices. upgrade your seat! pay for seat insurance! Fly on airlines that have bigger seats.

Private airlines don't have to conform to you. As a customer you can do what you want but so can they.

Why do you feel the need to put most of your points with exclamation marks and it seems that you talk down to people. I would listen to you a lot more if you made your points with less bulliness. Maybe I am wrong. I can't hear your tone of voice, so excuse me if I am speaking out of turn.

LosingJustMe- That is crazy expensive for fuel. You work for an airline?

[snuffy65 1]

Why do you feel the need to put most of your points with exclamation marks and it seems that you talk down to people. I would listen to you a lot more if you made your points with less bulliness. Maybe I am wrong. I can't hear your tone of voice, so excuse me if I am speaking out of turn.

LosingJustMe- That is crazy expensive for fuel. You work for an airline?

Because i am emphasing some points and if it did seem like I was talking down to someone I probably was, sorry. I only had three in there and two of them were kinda the same sentence .

I think LosingJustMe does work for the airlines.

[snuffy65 1]

Jet fuel price was $142.29 a barrel.

I found this article researching fuel prices. Found it pretty interesting.

Algae Farm to Produce 4.4 Million Gallons of Experimental Jet Fuel | Autopia from Wired.com

[ReadySteadyGo 8]

Should overweight people pay extra? Canada says no. - Gadling

I found this. Just another article.

I came into this debate with my mind made up. I shouldn't have to pay for another seat...but I am not so sure now. I guess I'm on the fence.

[ReadySteadyGo 8]

Because i am emphasing some points and if it did seem like I was talking down to someone I probably was, sorry. I only had three in there and two of them were kinda the same sentence :biggrin:.

I think LosingJustMe does work for the airlines.

thanks snuffy.

[brandyII 9]

ReadySteadyGo,

That's a pretty informative article you found there. Maybe I'll start driving to Canada to fly next time, it's only a couple hours away! Thanks, brandyII.