Lap band erosion

[Oregondaisy 2,021]

I really would like to come across someone who has had their band for over 10 years and find out if they are experiencing any problems. Everyone I know who has been banded more than 3years has all sorts of problems. The band can damage the stomach and the esophagus.

[amella 0]

you are so kind to give of your time to let us know this. It is so very scary when someone says they had erosion with no symptoms. Im scared because I have been naughty and drinking a starbucks frappacino almost everyday because they have them in sugar free light - but i also have been using a straw - can this cause erosion? i had my surgery on 11/14/08 - but have no problems but again im scared now because that girl said all she had was a little bit of bloating when she got erosion?

[amella 0]

I just want to toss in my two cents here in a little defense of Dr. Watkins. I know it's easy to toss in things like, (the guy who charges over $1,000 for a lap band fill), without really knowing the guy. I was banded by Dr. Watkins on February 13th, 2009. Let me tell you something, he's an amazing doctor. I say this for many reasons. First, his clinic has performed almost 5000 lap band surgeries with only one reported case of 'slippage' and that one case happened after the patient had undergone chemo...not saying that it was the cause but it is an interesting coincidence. Also, when I went in to meet with Dr. Watkins on my initial consult he spent over an hour not only answering every question I had but also filling me in on many aspects of the lap band that I had no idea about. He also took the time to chit chat with me about himself, his upbringing, etc. and made me feel more comfortable than any doctor i've ever met before. Also, i'm about 12 days post-op and my surgery day started at 9:30am and I was in the car heading back home to recover by 1pm the same day. My recovery has been awesome. Since the procedure was laparoscopic my incisions are healing very well and i am exercising and feeling great now. In fact, I've already lost 30lbs. in the last 3 weeks.

I would also like to point out that Dr. Watkins didn't say that the band was more powerful than the sleeve. He said that the band is a powerful tool. He then went on seperately to say that the sleeve is newer...i'm sure he means as far as approval by the FDA for weight loss uses...not as far as invention goes.

Also, his point about the adjustability is for reaching an ideal weight and maintaining it. I have a friend that has the sleeve and honestly he's lost TOO MUCH WEIGHT...he looks like a skeleton now and it's really sad. The nice thing about my band is if I begin loosing too much weight I can always have my band adjusted to whatever ideal weight I desire.

Finally, I would like to address the comment about going to a surgeon that performs all the surgeries for a balanced opinion. I don't know about you but I don't take my Lexus to Wal-Mart to get my servicing. I take it to a specialist that works on my type of car exclusively and has a proven track record working with high performance machines. To me that is what Dr. Watkins has done. He has chosen the procedure that he deems most successful while balancing risks and benefits and has chosen to make a stand and to specialize in that one particular procedure. To me that's a good thing to know that i'm getting specialized care catered specifically for the exact procedure that I chose to receive.

I'm not going to knock the sleeve or bypass just because I have the band. I will however defend my doctor for being nice enough to write a message about why he performs and recommends the lap band over the sleeve. He was taking the time to give his opinion in a polite manner and i don't think that he deserves to be discredited in a public forum by someone that doesn't even know him.

Again, just my two cents.

Amen!!!!! Thank you for putting this in here!!! What a good kind caring man this doctor is to come on here and give of his time like he has been just to have some bubblebut come on here and take over the whole forum and try to discredit such a kind and caring professional man!! How many doctors you know are going to answer questions and talk to you for free to the extent he has! and now that woman is trying to ruin it for the rest of us who would like to ask him some questions!!

[WASaBubbleButt 41]

I just want to toss in my two cents here in a little defense of Dr. Watkins. I know it's easy to toss in things like, (the guy who charges over $1,000 for a lap band fill), without really knowing the guy. I was banded by Dr. Watkins on February 13th, 2009. Let me tell you something, he's an amazing doctor. I say this for many reasons. First, his clinic has performed almost 5000 lap band surgeries with only one reported case of 'slippage' and that one case happened after the patient had undergone chemo...not saying that it was the cause but it is an interesting coincidence. Also, when I went in to meet with Dr. Watkins on my initial consult he spent over an hour not only answering every question I had but also filling me in on many aspects of the lap band that I had no idea about. He also took the time to chit chat with me about himself, his upbringing, etc. and made me feel more comfortable than any doctor i've ever met before. Also, i'm about 12 days post-op and my surgery day started at 9:30am and I was in the car heading back home to recover by 1pm the same day. My recovery has been awesome. Since the procedure was laparoscopic my incisions are healing very well and i am exercising and feeling great now. In fact, I've already lost 30lbs. in the last 3 weeks.

I would also like to point out that Dr. Watkins didn't say that the band was more powerful than the sleeve. He said that the band is a powerful tool. He then went on seperately to say that the sleeve is newer...i'm sure he means as far as approval by the FDA for weight loss uses...not as far as invention goes.

Also, his point about the adjustability is for reaching an ideal weight and maintaining it. I have a friend that has the sleeve and honestly he's lost TOO MUCH WEIGHT...he looks like a skeleton now and it's really sad. The nice thing about my band is if I begin loosing too much weight I can always have my band adjusted to whatever ideal weight I desire.

Finally, I would like to address the comment about going to a surgeon that performs all the surgeries for a balanced opinion. I don't know about you but I don't take my Lexus to Wal-Mart to get my servicing. I take it to a specialist that works on my type of car exclusively and has a proven track record working with high performance machines. To me that is what Dr. Watkins has done. He has chosen the procedure that he deems most successful while balancing risks and benefits and has chosen to make a stand and to specialize in that one particular procedure. To me that's a good thing to know that i'm getting specialized care catered specifically for the exact procedure that I chose to receive.

I'm not going to knock the sleeve or bypass just because I have the band. I will however defend my doctor for being nice enough to write a message about why he performs and recommends the lap band over the sleeve. He was taking the time to give his opinion in a polite manner and i don't think that he deserves to be discredited in a public forum by someone that doesn't even know him.

Again, just my two cents.

I don't know, you see... I just think a surgeon that charges $1K a fill is nothing short of greedy. Call me silly, but that's how I see it.

A single slip in all those bands... you know, patients are the single cause of slips. Vomiting, overeating, stomach flu, food poisoning... please tell me how a doc can control these issues? Does the doc pick people that will NEVER eat a food that causes food poisoning? I gotta tell you, I'm totally impressed with your doc. No... seriously, in a whole new way I'm impressed with your doc! He has skills beyond human skills! Really! Kinda like superman!

Now, don't misunderstand, I'm not suggesting that food poisoning is a patient's fault! I'm not. I've had food poisoning and I sure didn't blame myself. It's just that ... stuff happens yet it does not happen to YOUR doc's patients.

I'm totally impressed! Really, I am!

As for going to a surgeon that does all procedures. Maybe you see value in the surgeon that sells only one car type. Me... I don't. I see value in those that sell ALL car types. They are able to perform everything from the easy band to the difficult bypass. But again.. that's just me.

I'm sure that at 12 days post op you are the expert of banding. I'm 24 months post op from banding and 9 months post op from a sleeve. I'll defer to you for expert advice on bands and surgeons.

[WASaBubbleButt 41]

you are so kind to give of your time to let us know this. It is so very scary when someone says they had erosion with no symptoms. Im scared because I have been naughty and drinking a starbucks frappacino almost everyday because they have them in sugar free light - but i also have been using a straw - can this cause erosion? i had my surgery on 11/14/08 - but have no problems but again im scared now because that girl said all she had was a little bit of bloating when she got erosion?

No, consuming sugar and drinking through a straw cannot cause erosion. A total loss of restriction and a weight gain are cause for concern.

I thought this forum made you giggle and you wouldn't return??

I must have misunderstood.

[WASaBubbleButt 41]

Amen!!!!! Thank you for putting this in here!!! What a good kind caring man this doctor is to come on here and give of his time like he has been just to have some bubblebut come on here and take over the whole forum and try to discredit such a kind and caring professional man!! How many doctors you know are going to answer questions and talk to you for free to the extent he has! and now that woman is trying to ruin it for the rest of us who would like to ask him some questions!!

Yessssssssssssss, a good and caring man charges $1K+ for a simple fill. You have no agenda, right? Do tell, how many fills would you pay $1K for? 3? 5? Let me guess, you are rich, right?

I thought you wrote something about this forum being below your awareness, no? I can provide a link to the other thread if you wish. Do you wish?'

Wait.... let me remember, you were pitching fits one way and another in the OTHER thread because FillCentersUSA was charging too much for a fill at $150 per each, yet in THIS thread $1,000+ is okay!

Yeah, I got your number!

Cheers.

[simplelife2000 0]

Diane, I believe errosion is when the stomach grows around the band and into the stomach. The band can actually errode into the stomach. I believe that is what it is. It does require surgery to fix and typically they can't put in a new band until it heals. Hope this helps.

That is what I thought erosion was when it was explained to me in the beginning; however, after being told that's what's wrong with me and looking at the pics, it's actually more like "here mone minute, gone the next"....it actually goes through the stomach. Mine is only partially inside and also has to be removed. Itactually works it's way inside the stomach. I was told that is very rare...I am only the 6th one my doctor has seen and he's a pioneer in the procedure. I knew something was wrong but the normal tests were saying I was okay. I took a requested endoscopy to find it and even after than when a barium swallow with air contract was done, they could see it on that test. I even had a CT scan a year ago that showed it fine.

My doctor said that I should not get the band again but if I wanted to I could do one of the other surgeries, which I'm opting out of.

If you have insurance, it wouldn't hurt to have your doctor send in a precert just to see if he codes it in a manner that would get it approved. I'm doing that...and if that fails...well...it's cash OUCH! I will know Friday what the cost is.

I'm scared because of the 3-5 day in the hospital having to be fed by tube. That makes it all sound that more serious and scary!

Even after all this, I don't regret getting the band. It helped by loose 100 lbs and even though I have more to go, I feel it much more manageable now. Good Luck!

[lapbandbarb 0]

Yessssssssssssss, a good and caring man charges $1K+ for a simple fill. You have no agenda, right?

OMG! Please! There is so much info in this thread! Can't we just appreciate it and Know how great Dr Watkins is for getting on here(or having someone get on here in his behalf) and explain things to us. I hope he will continue to help us!

Thank you, Dr Watkins. You have explained things beautifully and made me all the more happy that I was banded by an Australian Dr who knows his stuff! I hope we have the privilege of your knowledge more often.

[WASaBubbleButt 41]

Yessssssssssssss, a good and caring man charges $1K+ for a simple fill. You have no agenda, right?

OMG! Please! There is so much info in this thread! Can't we just appreciate it and Know how great Dr Watkins is for getting on here(or having someone get on here in his behalf) and explain things to us. I hope he will continue to help us!

Thank you, Dr Watkins. You have explained things beautifully and made me all the more happy that I was banded by an Australian Dr who knows his stuff! I hope we have the privilege of your knowledge more often.

The great Dr. Watkins?

He's explained sleeves incorrectly, he charges $1+K for fills, "great" is subjective.

[DrWatkins 5]

An erosion is basically where the band works itself inside the stomach.

This happened more in the early days of banding in Europe and fortunately, the European surgeons figured out how to dramatically reduce the chance for this.

They started stitching the stomach over the band to help reduce the incidence of band slippage. In the beginning they stitched the stomach over the band too tightly and they stitched stomach over the buckle and the taper (section from buckle to tubing). Whenever you have living tissue stretched too tightly over plastic, the plastic will end up eroding through the tissue over time. This pressure cuts off the blood supply to the small capillaries delivering blood and over time you get tissue necrosis and plastic inside the stomach.

Interestingly, the European patients didn't get sick, they simply stopped losing weight. They treated this by removing the band and replacing one later. Their knowledge and experience has brought the erosion rate from 10% to well less than 1%.

The easiest way to diagnose erosion is to perform an EGD (stomach scope) and you see white plastic inside the stomach. Sometimes you can see this on a barium esophogram as well when the barium passes outside the ring.

There was quite a lot of discussion at last year's ASMBS meeting that erosions were possibly the result of stomach injury during the procedure which is a newer theory behind erosions.

The good news is that erosions are now rare and are treated by simply removing the band. For a time some European surgeons replaced a new band at the same time as removing an eroded band and these nearly always re-eroded so the current strategy is to remove an eroded band, let the stomach heal and then consider later replacement.

Hope that helps

[WASaBubbleButt 41]

Unfortunately, Dr. Watkins hasn't been around lately. I would like to see his answer to your post.

He's back now.

Edited March 5, 2009 by WASaBubbleButt

[Oregondaisy 2,021]

I see that. I wonder if somebody told him we have been talking about him. He certainly didn't address anything that you brought up.

[GuyMontag 1,264]

I don't know, you see... I just think a surgeon that charges $1K a fill is nothing short of greedy. Call me silly, but that's how I see it.

A single slip in all those bands... you know, patients are the single cause of slips. Vomiting, overeating, stomach flu, food poisoning... please tell me how a doc can control these issues? Does the doc pick people that will NEVER eat a food that causes food poisoning? I gotta tell you, I'm totally impressed with your doc. No... seriously, in a whole new way I'm impressed with your doc! He has skills beyond human skills! Really! Kinda like superman!

Now, don't misunderstand, I'm not suggesting that food poisoning is a patient's fault! I'm not. I've had food poisoning and I sure didn't blame myself. It's just that ... stuff happens yet it does not happen to YOUR doc's patients.

I'm totally impressed! Really, I am!

As for going to a surgeon that does all procedures. Maybe you see value in the surgeon that sells only one car type. Me... I don't. I see value in those that sell ALL car types. They are able to perform everything from the easy band to the difficult bypass. But again.. that's just me.

I'm sure that at 12 days post op you are the expert of banding. I'm 24 months post op from banding and 9 months post op from a sleeve. I'll defer to you for expert advice on bands and surgeons.

First of all, disbelief, sarcasm, and condescension are never effective debate tools...unless your 7. I mean this in all seriousness, take a class in critical thinking...you'd learn a lot.

Secondly, I just called Dr. Watkins office and you are WAY off on the fill pricing. It's actually $250 for fill for someone that was banded in the US and $400 for someone that was banded in Mexico. There is a onetime transfer fee of $400 if banded in the US and of $1000 if banded in Mexico. As for me, since I was banded by Dr. Watkins, my fills are free for two years and then $50 thereafter.

Really, that's about all I have to say to someone that has a hard time being civil and discussing something like this on an adult level.

As for you having all the experience with weight loss surgeries and surgeons...I was simply providing first hand knowledge on someone that you were providing false and offensive information about. If you take offense at that then I apologize for stepping on your toes with the truth and first hand testimony.

PS - I applaud Dr. Watkins for sticking to the real issues about weight loss surgery and staying on task in this thread. This topic is about erosion and that's what he addressed. Kudos.

[amella 0]

Thank you for coming on here with some sense - that person makes the forums a miserable experience for everyone - she is mean and rude and she does not even have a lap band anymore she has a sleeve now so I dont know why she does not go on some sleeze oops sorry i mean sleeve site instead of trying to stir up so much trouble on here when she is not even a bandster anymore! and your doctor is a wonderful person for coming on this site and giving us free information - what doctor does that??? I may not ever agree with the pricing of fills but I have nothing but praise for such a kind man who is willing to give of his time and knowledge for free the way this doctor has.

[WASaBubbleButt 41]

First of all, disbelief, sarcasm, and condescension are never effective debate tools...unless your 7. I mean this in all seriousness, take a class in critical thinking...you'd learn a lot.

Secondly, I just called Dr. Watkins office and you are WAY off on the fill pricing. It's actually $250 for fill for someone that was banded in the US and $400 for someone that was banded in Mexico. There is a onetime transfer fee of $400 if banded in the US and of $1000 if banded in Mexico. As for me, since I was banded by Dr. Watkins, my fills are free for two years and then $50 thereafter.

Really, that's about all I have to say to someone that has a hard time being civil and discussing something like this on an adult level.

As for you having all the experience with weight loss surgeries and surgeons...I was simply providing first hand knowledge on someone that you were providing false and offensive information about. If you take offense at that then I apologize for stepping on your toes with the truth and first hand testimony.

PS - I applaud Dr. Watkins for sticking to the real issues about weight loss surgery and staying on task in this thread. This topic is about erosion and that's what he addressed. Kudos.

Actually Dr. Watkins and I had an email discussion about fills for MX banded patients several months ago. Lucky for me I save all PMs on my hard drive.

He explained that fills for MX banded patients are $1K or more and his reasoning was that someone needed to punish them for leaving the country for surgery. WTH?

Now seriously, could you have respect for someone that says that?

He was talking on the boards about how he would fill anyone regardless of where they were banded. Another poster PMed me asking if I was aware of his fees. I had no clue. She explained that she called the office and they told her it would be $1+K. That IS the $1,000 that you write of above.

I PMed Dr. Watkins and at first he claimed he did not know what he charges, he'd have to ask him office manager. (Riiiiiiight) He did get back to me and explained the above.

As for his not getting in the mix... no, I don't blame him but that's not what the post is about that you refer to. The post you refer to is where he claims that after care comes WITH surgery if done in the US. I specifically asked if that means he does fills, unfills, etc. for free for his patients after surgery as he claims.

From your post, that claim wasn't true either.

With all your feetie stomping you did a fine job of proving my point.

Amazingly, being civil does not mean agreeing with your every word. Just because you don't like the reality does not make this less than an adult conversation.