Spanking

[gadgetlady 4]

Because there are numerous cruelty-free ways to curtail problem behavior, it is, IMO, WRONG to spank.

I disagree. I believe spanking in anger is cruel, spanking without first warning the child that that particular behavior will lead to a spanking is cruel, and spanking with gross force is cruel. But IMO there are ways to spank that don't fall into the "cruel" category by any stretch of the imagination. You are entitled to not spank your kids. But I am equally entitled to spank mine so long as I am not abusing them.

[steph_co 9]

LOL again! As parents, we force our wills on our children in innumerable ways -- not to control them, but to train them and make them better people. As a parent, it is your JOB to train your children to understand right from wrong, and that there are consequences for bad behavior.

You have acknowledged, by getting banded, that pain is a motivator for you. Why would it not be a motivator for your kids? I'm not advocating whacking your kids around daily if they don't behave like robots. I'm simply saying that for some parents and some kids, the fear of a painful swat is the only thing that will motivate that particular child to relearn bad behaviors.

*sigh* Even though we're having a full conversation, I guess I have to completely pull a thought from something I just said into my next post so you don't take it out of context. I am not enforcing my will on other people by using pain. Again - we choose to control when we fail to inspire. Getting the band is the only thing that I have found so far that works for me so far. I have no idea how it will be down the road. It's not so much a fear of PAIN that is keeping me in line - I'm a comfort person. Meaning that I will not wear the nicest pair of shoes that anybody would die to have if they are not COMFORTABLE to me. But that's just me. Everybody's different.

I don't believe in smacking somebody to teach them a consequence. L&L has shown me other ways to teach consequences that don't cause pain, but have a lasting effect. My mother used to spank me. Did I shape up and become her best behaved child? No. I was the worst out of all of them. I wasn't awful, but I did many behaviors repeatedly...ones that I had been punished for in that way already. It did not teach me that what I did caused the pain...it taught me to resent my mother for doing it, it taught me to do my best to not get caught. But I still continued to do whatever I wanted. :confused: In my study of L&L, I have run across similar scenarios as behavior I had done (no, I can't think of a specific example right now...it's late, I'm tired, and I'm at work) and when I heard their solution, it made me go, "Ooooo, good one!" I have never, ever thought that hitting was an effective way to get results from anybody. I wish my mom had known L&L when I was growing up - my life would have been a whole lot easier!

[gadgetlady 4]

Everybody's different.

Absolutely. Spanking didn't work for your mother when you were a child. Maybe if she had done something differently it might have. Maybe it never would have. I can tell you unequivocally that in my family, it works. I can't argue with your mother's results; you can't argue with mine. Everybody's different.

There is nothing wrong with your choosing not to spank. It's your decision. There is nothing wrong with my choosing to do so. There is, however, something very wrong with the government telling me I can't.

[Telecia 1]

It really saddens me that such a large percentage of you feel that it is perfectly okay to hit someone smaller and less powerful than you. Most parents teach their child not to hit another child, yet how can the child learn that lesson from a parent that hits?

I was a social worker for Children's Services for three years and it totally demoralized me. I believe that an adult hits a child in anger because it makes them feel better. Any other rationale is merely a delusion of the unimaginative.

It is the automatic assumption that punishment is done out of anger that one of the reasons the lawmakers need to stay out of normal people lives.

Punishment is not about making yourself feel better its about teaching the child its not ok to do something. And if its something you have punished the child before for and you've exhausted all other possibilities. Then its your final option.

I can't speak for anyone else but for myself if I am angry at something one of my kids has done they get to sit in their room till I'm calm enough to deal with it. And usually waited for my other half to get home and we both decide on punishment.

Not to even mention I don't get mad easily in the first place. It takes allot for me to get mad.

It shouldn't be a common punishment for every little thing. But there are generations of people raised this way and the biggest portion of them are well adjusted people.

As long as its not done in anger, does not leave marks, and not used callously I don't have a problem with it.

I didn't grow up with my parents and my aunt used switches, belts and her favorite item was her dr.scholls exercise sandals. (wood) and ALWAYS left marks.

Now thats what I call abuse.

[skmsu 0]

Spanking, or any hitting of a child, just teaches that the bigger person can dominate the smaller person. There are far more effective ways to discipline a child.

I agree, all it ever did for me was make me afraid of my dad when I was a kid. What a waste. I just don't see the logic in hitting as a method of solving a problem. Why set an example like that?

[candy8360 0]

I was spanked as a child and felt at times that my dad was too rough, and swore I would never spank my kids. Then I had Sean (my son who is 22 now) and he really put me through it. I don't feel like I ever abused him but he was hard to handle and other forms of discipline never worked. All I can say is I'm glad I won't be around all the unruly kids in Massachusettes!!!

[Livingthe Dream 0]

Hitting out of anger is wrong and I think everyone can agree on that. I can only do the best I can as a parent and I don't allow my kids to "set the rules" in my house and I think they will someday respect that. I thank my dad every once in a while for setting me straight and giving me a spanking whenever he thought it was appropriate.

I set some weeds on fire next to a drainage ditch by our house because we needed light inside our fort. Me and the neighbor kid thought it sounded like a good idea. I was spanked with a belt and learned my lesson at the age of 10.

Have you ever seen a child laying on the floor kicking and screaming at Wal-Mart or turning the Church pew into a obstacle course during Sunday service? These are examples of what happens with their is zero fear in a relationship.

I am writing this based on me being a man and raising a boy. My little girl has never been spanked and frankly she never has deserved one. It is my little man that needs curbing every once in a while. My son goes to a Christian Pre-K so I have seen first hand how timeouts and sitting on your hands works and frankly it does nothing but builds up his energy to go off the wall.

[Kat817 19]

LOL love that idea. I normally use chores for when they get in trouble at school. my oldest used to constantly get detentions etc for mouthing off to his computer teacher. The computer teacher was about 10 years outta date and of course my teenage son was totally up to date with ALL things computer related. So anytime he would *correct* his teacher he got detention and I got household chores I hated doing done. My favorite one is floors and they can't use a mob. Nope good old fashioned scrubbrush and sponge and bucket!! lol

Now that he h as moved out its my daughters turn shes really bad sometimes about being late getting home by half and hour to an hour sometimes. Maybe I should add a new chore every 15 minutes late.

*Ponders*

My oldest DD pulled that trying to get and extra few minutes past curfew. We first pulled out an old alarm clock, and set it for her curfew----when she come in, she turned it off. If it went off, then I was awake and waiting---and she owed me---1 hour for every minute she was late. She could not go out again until the hours were completed. She raked leaves, did all kinds of household chores---and she learned to come in on time!!!

As for the spanking or no spanking---all I can say is that as a general rule our society is spanking less and less as the years go by. Time outs, and such were something that you did not hear about 30 years ago.

30 years ago, kids treated adults with respect. Not so much anymore. They know they are in control---they have no fear of what is going to happen when they get home.

I believe you would be hard pressed to find one of our grandparents or parents depending on our age, who were not spanked as a punishment. Yes some were extreme, and none of us here are promoting that, but they were raised knowing right from wrong, and how to both give and earn respect.

The direction the kids of today are going is scary. Some of it has to be contributed to parents being afraid of being parents, and wanting to be the childs best friend instead.

Before the battle begins---I AM NOT saying anyone here who chooses not to spank is doing that--but we all know people like that, I would bet.

Kat

[candy8360 0]

I totally agree with both comments above. Things have changed and even though the methods of our parents and grandparents may have not been the best, the motives had the best intentions and the result was one that made us into more respectful people. I guess the problem was that then, as now, there are always some adults who cross the line and take it too far. It's just a shame that the government has to stick their nose in and set limits for everyone. I feel that it is a personal choice and parenting should be left to the parents.

[Titslereaux 1]

I once smacked my puppy's nose and nearly died of feeling terrible. It didn't help, he just peed on himself and then ate more furniture the next day. Seems parents that spank do it often, a whack here, a slap there, a tree branch, a kitchen utensil, Dad's belt (buckle end.) Those of us who were physically punished can testify that it doesn't work. Humilation and pain aren't positive ways to teach little ones to be better. It contradicts itself. Don't smack the baby!

[mrsjiggles 4]

When I was a child I was spanked for not minding if I refused, after several attempts to get me to change my behavior. My mother spanked me more often for smaller infractions than my father did. My father only had to spank me once and I never wanted another spanking from him again so when he said something, that was the end of the story. I followed his direction without question. I don't consider myself to have been beaten or abused as a child. My father did what he thought he needed to in order to gain my respect wether it was out of fear or not. I believe that there is a fine line between spankings and abuse and that if over used it becomes inaffective. Are there other ways to make your kids mind you? Sure! I was raised with spankings and other forms of punishment and my kids will be raised the same. Sometimes, it takes more than a good talking to or removing a TV from a room. It would be my job as a parent to protect my child from a greater harm. If I have to spank my child to get him/her to fear playing in the traffic, you bet your butt I'm going to spank him/her. I would rather give them a sore bottom than see them in the hospital. I think the infraction should be considered when giving the punishment. With all that said, I understand that their are way tooo many people that abuse children in this world. I just don't think out-lawing a spanking is really going to do much good in stoping child abuse. Just my 2 cents on the topic.

[*susan* 1,709]

My parents were firm believers in spanking, I, however am not. I have never spanked my children. I couldn't imagine how I would feel if my boss was unhappy with something I did, so to punish me and make sure I didn't do it again, he hit me. Or, if because someone is bigger than me, they figured they could "spank" me to make me behave in the manner they feel is appropriate. To me, spanking is humiliating. It is teaching that if you are bigger than someone, you can control their behavior through pain.

I believe I am a very good parent. I have a son who will be 17 on Friday. He is in the gifted program, has never made anything but straight A's and never had any problems in school. My daughter will be 15 on Christmas. Again, she is in all honors classes, makes straight A's and never been in trouble. Other adults and their teachers frequently compliment me on how well my children behave, how respectful they are and how caring they are of others. I did all this without ever physically harming my children (aka, "spanking"). Talking with a reasonable explanation almost always worked for my kids. If not, I would remove them from the situation, put them in time-out or take away something that meant a lot to them for a period of time. This method worked great for me and I have great kids.

[Livingthe Dream 0]

Everyone has made great points but I keep seeing anti spanking arguments being made and you are using "abuse cases" to make your point. Lets define what spanking is for the argument going forward. Spanking is when you swat your child on the butt with your hand and the child knows what he/she is getting spanked for. So if you are chasing your kid with a clothes hanger, slapping the childs face, beating them in front of neighbors, kicking, elbowing or screaming at them to the point they cry then you are a shitty parent that needs parental training.

Last Year we were on vacation and my wife had my sons hand in the parking lot walking towards our car. My son loves to ride the shopping carts and he saw one sitting in the parking lot unattended so he dropped moms hand and bolted. My wife instantly screamed in terror to stop and he of course ignored her. He knew that time out was well worth it to get to that cart. At this point I was scared to death because a car was coming and the car didn't see him or the cart already in the parking spot. I yelled so loud the entire parking lot stopped including my son. He knew that the price was not worth it and he stopped out of fear of punishment. If you cant make your child stop dead in his tracks (at a young age) then you should have concerns. Screaming time out and counting to three was not going to work. I think those that say there is no place for spanking are probably very loving parents that have been blessed with low maintenance kids or all girls.

[Wheetsin 714]

It doesn't have to be a matter of abuse. For me, personally, it's still a matter of - what are you really teaching your kids? Hitting them, regardless of where or with what device, is physical punishment. Physical punishment doesn't teach someone why something is wrong, or what they might have done differently. It teaches them to fear the person giving the punishment. I would much rather my kids learn what is right and what is wrong, than learn to be afraid of me. My father spanked me, and it never really did much to keep me from doing it again unless he was there. And even then, I didn't refrain because I had some kind of cognitive acknowledgement that it was wrong, I refrained because I was afraid of him hitting me.

For example, one time at a grocery store my father smacked me because he said I had rolled my eyes at him. I didn't even understand what "roll your eyes" meant. And I certainly hadn't done it intentionally. Going forward, I didn't have an understanding of what rolling my eyes meant, or why it was a bad thing, I pretty much was just afraid to look at him.

On the flip side, I was once curious about how fire extinguishers work (after age 12, I was home alone for an hour or two before my parents got home from work) so I got the one from our kitchen and sprayed it in the living room, thinking it might just blow out air. Nope, I got a shitload of white powder all over everything. When my dad got home I told him what had happened, and he explained that I shouldn't have done what I did, and reinforced that if I was curious about something to ask, and then went on to explain how extinguishers work. No smacking. So I learned that I could ask him questions, and do "bad" things without necessarily having to automatically be afraid of getting hit -- that maybe I could do "bad" things, and something other than a hit might happen.

I hope to raise my kids without having to punish them via physical force. I don't have kids yet so I can't say "I don't," just that "I don't plan to." But I can say that parents across the board could probably do well to think about what exactly it is that their actions are teaching their kids.

[Livingthe Dream 0]

Wheetsin,

That was a nice post and you made good points. To use your story what happens when you come home and your child has messed with the fire extinguisher for a second time? I completely agree with your email so I am just debating here but I think one misconception made on this post is that parents that spank use this as the first option of discipline and I can say for me it is the last option. I have two kids, one boy and one girl and every post that is anti spanking sounds like a word for word description of me and my daughters relationship. The spanking group sounds like my relationship with my son on occasion and is usually triggered by him putting himself in harms way or hurting his sister.