Intermittent Fasting

[GreenTealael 25,336]

1 hour ago, 2shea said:

If you are having Protein Shakes in the morning would that not break the fast, as the Protein shakes have calories?

They are in my fluids (tea or coffee) traditional Keto styled fasting some people can have MCT oil in coffee and it won't break the fast for them, since I add so much Water oz in the morning it does not appear to break it for me, but I limit the tea/coffee with protein to one serving then all the water happens, the other servings of tea/coffee with protein happens during my non fasting hours.

[GreenTealael 25,336]

1 hour ago, 2shea said:

@IveGotThePower

I think for non WLS individuals that is a hard and fast rule but our already reduce cals allow us to go into kenogenesis quicker, so i think that's why I can eek by modified.

Edited August 19, 2018 by GreenTealael

[GreenTealael 25,336]

3 hours ago, superthin said:

Green Tealeal, what did you mean by erasing the amount of ghrelin that has returned? Is that really something we can do? I’m about 2 months post op and when I had my period a few weeks ago, it brought on the cravings like I used to get and since then my hunger is way stronger and I crave junk food again. I don’t know how to stop it and I dread my next period. Do you have any pointers??

No unfortunately the more I look into it the less I think its possible I was reading conflicting scientific studies about the effects of intermittent fasting in leptin and ghrelin levels and the findings are contradictory or leaning towards ghrelin being unaffected overall. But these were mostly studies conducted in rats, so...

But it has once again retrained me to become more hydration focused again, once food was introduced heavily it was such a chore , I subconsciously became chained to a feeding schedule I never relaxed on although I could have several months later after I was fully healed. So that has been the biggest benefit. I eat when I eat. But I'm always drinking.

I also have an increased appetite when my period rolls around. Its crazy. But i eat more of whats on my plan (dark chocolate has made it's way on my plan for this reason) You can ride the wave by making sure you have substitutions available instead of eating the "junk".

Almost anything you want from pre surgery can be made healthier and better to fit your new life style. What cant be made can be bought. I'm not sure what you crave but Protein Cookies, chips, ice creams are a thing now (single servings) make sure they fit into your plan (ask your NUT), STAY ACCOUNTABLE, eat dense Proteins (the denser the better, within reason and capability of course) and stay hydrated AF lol

Edited August 19, 2018 by GreenTealael

[Orchids&Dragons 9,047]

On 8/1/2018 at 3:32 PM, GreenTealael said:

Has anyone given Intermittent Fasting a try for long periods after surgery. I'm really interested. Not so much for the weight loss, that would be nice too but I'm still early out, but more to place focus on hydration , erasing whatever amount of ghrelin that has returned and feed schedule/pattern forming.

Interesting video explaining what I am specifically talking about, please watch before responding

https://youtu.be/tIuj-oMN-Fk

Thanks for the post. He's really interesting.

[GreenTealael 25,336]

39 minutes ago, Orchids&Dragons said:

Thanks for the post. He's really interesting.

So far, it appears to has accelerated my weight loss

[Orchids&Dragons 9,047]

2 hours ago, GreenTealael said:

So far, it appears to has accelerated my weight loss

And that's tough when you're close to goal. Congrats!

[superthin 37]

Thanks for the info GreenTealael!!

[GreenTealael 25,336]

8 hours ago, Orchids&Dragons said:

And that's tough when you're close to goal. Congrats!

I was losing a pound every few weeks if that prior to trying, I'd recommend it for anyone struggling that has done everything else they can

[GreenTealael 25,336]

1 hour ago, superthin said:

Thanks for the info GreenTealael!!

Any time

[GreenTealael 25,336]

11 hours ago, Orchids&Dragons said:

Thanks for the post. He's really interesting.

Right! And explained the science well. I should have been more strategic with recording my findings to help with the questions being asked but I honestly didn't think it would work (or so well) so I kind of just started randomly.

[Deemar007 244]

I love Jason Fung! I also do IF, usually 16 hours. About two times a week I do OMAD. IF has really helped my weight loss stall.

I want to say Dr. Fung also had a video on fasting and reducing excess skin. That is really why I started fasting.

I am just leaving for work, but I will try to see if it was Dr Fung that talked about fasting and it's benefits with excess skin, or another Dr.

TBC........

Di

[FluffyChix 17,415]

14 hours ago, GreenTealael said:

They are in my fluids (tea or coffee) traditional Keto styled fasting some people can have MCT oil in coffee and it won't break the fast for them, since I add so much Water oz in the morning it does not appear to break it for me, but I limit the tea/coffee with Protein to one serving then all the Water happens, the other servings of tea/coffee with protein happens during my non fasting hours.

This is because MCT oil although it has calories, is considered by many to be blood sugar/insulin neutral. So it's possible to intake it for energy (something most fat peeps don't need anyway) without hormonally altering/affecting their fat burning system. I don't believe that those of use with ample fat on us need additional exogenous sources of fats that go straight to our liver like MCT nor do I think exogenous ketones help us burn weight faster (nor do we need that extra fuel). If you're trying to amp burning up, we have the fat stored and ready. But that's just my lay opinion. I've been studying and doing IF for many many years; both 16:8 and also alternate day fasting with caloric restriction. Both work. Both are muscle sparing, and both have the ability to reduce fasting insulin and make cells less IR, lowering bgs.

Women have to be a bit more careful, cuz it seems their fasting window is better (less endocrine stress) with 14:10 rather than 16:8. But I think it may also be a YMMV thing too. If you find you develop sleep issues at around the 3-6 week mark, that is a tell that your endocrine system is being adversely affected by the IF. Women are more sensitive to this than men. Men have incredible success with IF and caloric restriction. They quickly normalize blood sugar, IR, and upreg HGH and androgen conversion to testosterone. If you/they also add in HIIT and/or movement conditioning, they will restore lost muscle. It's not quite as simple for women though.

My opinion is that technically, the Protein Drink breaks the fast, but it's incremental. And it sounds like it's working for you. A system created by an Israeli doctor who made the "Warrior Diet" does allow his men to drink Protein Drinks from grassfed "pure" cows. It's a diet for dudes that is very effective...so there ya have it.

Edited August 20, 2018 by FluffyChix

[GreenTealael 25,336]

43 minutes ago, FluffyChix said:

This is because MCT oil although it has calories, is considered by many to be blood sugar/insulin neutral. So it's possible to intake it for energy (something most fat peeps don't need anyway) without hormonally altering/affecting their fat burning system. I don't believe that those of use with ample fat on us need additional exogenous sources of fats that go straight to our liver like MCT nor do I think exogenous ketones help us burn weight faster (nor do we need that extra fuel). If you're trying to amp burning up, we have the fat stored and ready. But that's just my lay opinion. I've been studying and doing IF for many many years; both 16:8 and also alternate day fasting with caloric restriction. Both work. Both are muscle sparing, and both have the ability to reduce fasting insulin and make cells less IR, lowering bgs.

Women have to be a bit more careful, cuz it seems their fasting window is better (less endocrine stress) with 14:10 rather than 16:8. But I think it may also be a YMMV thing too. If you find you develop sleep issues at around the 3-6 week mark, that is a tell that your endocrine system is being adversely affected by the IF. Women are more sensitive to this than men. Men have incredible success with IF and caloric restriction. They quickly normalize blood sugar, IR, and upreg HGH and androgen conversion to testosterone. If you/they also add in HIIT and/or movement conditioning, they will restore lost muscle. It's not quite as simple for women though.

My opinion is that technically, the Protein Drink breaks the fast, but it's incremental. And it sounds like it's working for you. A system created by an Israeli doctor who made the "Warrior Diet" does allow his men to drink Protein Drinks from grassfed "pure" cows. It's a diet for dudes that is very effective...so there ya have it.

Great info, i may try 14/10 but im so committed to 16/8 lol im a creature of habit

I am going to eliminate the Protein added to tea and see if this kicks things up

TBC...

Also when you did IF pre surgery what were your losses like , how long of a period did you sustain it for? It feels almost too easy for me, like I could do this all the time a leave it situationally...

Edited August 20, 2018 by GreenTealael

[Frustr8 7,886]

What is MCT oil?

[FluffyChix 17,415]

37 minutes ago, GreenTealael said:

Great info, i may try 14/10 but im so committed to 16/8 lol im a creature of habit

I am going to eliminate the Protein added to tea and see if this kicks things up

TBC...

Also when you did IF pre surgery what were your losses like , how long of a period id you sustain it for? It feels almost too easy for me, like I could do this all the time a leave it situationally...

So I found a plan: Dr. Johnson's Alternate Day Diet (based on a lot of the research from Walter Longo, Krista Varady, et al and it was one of the original alternate day fasting diets with caloric restriction that came to the public. He's a doc out of LSU. And they found it helped their asthma patients, and helped with wl too. So I added it to my low carb principle. I'd lost from 325 to 160lb doing Atkins '72. But I'd been stuck for years at 260lbs. Nothing I did could budge it. I'd go up or down within a few pounds. My bloodwork was amazing, but I was stuck. I added it into the mix and started losing. (I had a hysterectomy and so was very hormone deficient and imbalanced hormonally.)

I'd lost 30lbs when they discovered my breast cancer. Well I immediately said, "Fu*k It All!" And I went on my "Make-a-wish Diet" where I ate ALL. THE. CRAP. and I waited for all of my test results and to get into an amazing oncologist. It took a little over 2mons. In that time, I had a 25lb regain eating my MAW diet. And the oncologist was horrified. Cuz that can make cancer grow quickly (gaining after dx). So he said to get back on it.

And I fasted all through chemo and radiation. I essentially went from 260lbs down through chemo, 1st surgery, radiation and lost to 218lbs. Incidentally, the chemo + fasting did something my onc had never witnessed. I had a high grade aggressive tumor that is historically a "lazy eater" of neo-adjuvant chemotherapy. Meaning chemo will shrink the tumors a little bit, and stop/alter the cells...but you don't usually see complete remission or regression. They saw that my tumors shrank 60% with neoadjuvant chemo. And the path report showed that although there were some remaining living cells within my 12 lymph nodes (1 had pierced the node)--all the cancer cells showed genetic modification by the chemo which is unusual. So the research shows this to be true...fasting during chemo can be protective of healthy cells and helps boost the effectiveness of chemo and radiation.

When I got down to 218lbs they worried about my radiation levels and I was getting huge burns/open wounds. So they told me to stop losing. I went back to a "more normal" Zone style diet 30-30-40. And maintained for a few months. Then after all my reconstructions and healings slowly began to regain up to my most recent 287lbs. The onc was freaking out and tried for 2 years to talk me into WLS. I resisted and pretended I didn't notice the weight gain, even though by that time, I was essentially bed-ridden. (I'm still on a cancer drug and will be on it for 10 years total. It puts me in "super-menopause" and shuts down my hormones as much as possible. So I'm extremely hormone deficient/imbalanced.)

I haven't been doing alternate day fasting anymore. But yeah, you might be able to say I've been doing IF, cuz you know, at 650-850, I'm already in de facto Keto from calorie reduction--a form of fasting, and I'm living in a full-time calorie restricted state. So I find no reason to add even more alternate day IF into the mix at this point, until I'm at a more normal maintenance level caloric load. Although, I do naturally fast for 12-14 hours (with breaking the fast with 3oz of Premier Protein in my coffee each day). So you could theoretically claim using your definition, that I've been IF since May 2017 when I weighed 287lbs. LOL. I get up, have Protein in my coffee as Creamer. Then I eat Breakfast between 10-11am. I stop eating around 8-9pm. Today I weigh 164.6lbs.

Sorry for the book!!

Edited August 20, 2018 by FluffyChix