Leaving dieting behind

[Newme17 3,444]

I read the principles of intuitive eating. I don't see anything wrong with any of them actually. Unless y'all can pinpoint something in these principles that should be a no-no for the vast majority of people here, then ok, I don't mind accepting it for them for what it needs to be. Otherwise, I might use some of the principles.

http://www.intuitiveeating.org/10-principles-of-intuitive-eating/

[Newme17 3,444]

5 minutes ago, Apple1 said:

I am so open to learning!! Obviously what I have been doing for the past 8 -9 years hasn't been working and led me down this path. The debates and discussions on nutrition on this forum have led me to seek out publish papers on the subject so I can educate myself.

I am learning so much from everyone especially the veterans that are still here posting and helping us new to this whole process. My degree is entomology not nutrition, so I still have a long way to go, but I will get there, my health depends on it.

You and me both hon. I don't mind being wrong, I actually embrace it after I get over being what little hurt I may have been (lol), it just makes me grow stronger. Obviously all my studying of nutrition in college didn't do much for me before I gained this weight, cause I didn't apply it to myself either. Lol.

[Apple1 2,572]

26 minutes ago, Newme17 said:

I read the principles of intuitive eating. I don't see anything wrong with any of them actually. Unless y'all can pinpoint something in these principles that should be a no-no for the vast majority of people here, then ok, I don't mind accepting it for them for what it needs to be. Otherwise, I might use some of the principles.

http://www.intuitiveeating.org/10-principles-of-intuitive-eating/

I think the problem is many of us need to change our attitudes about eating. We need to eat to live and not live to eat.

I think many of those principles are great, but not all of us or even many of us, would be able to just intuitively eat correctly to the point of not regaining weight or losing some aspect of our health, such as controlled diabetes without medication. I absolutely think we need to correct any bad habits or mental aspects related to our eating. I have already changed my mindset in that I no longer view how I am eating as a diet. It is a lifestyle and it is still evolving, but it will be how I eat for life. This is just my opinion and I am always learning, and will adjust if I feel compelled that I need to.

In some ways my type 2 diabetes is helping me now believe it or not. By checking my bs daily I have a concrete way of gauging how what I am eating, is effecting my body, and by tracking my foods, I can make adjustments as needed. I got in the habit of keeping a food journal when I was diagnosed so it has become second nature to me and is not a bother at all.

[nomorefattypatty 329]

You and me both hon. I don't mind being wrong, I actually embrace it after I get over being what little hurt I may have been (lol), it just makes me grow stronger. Obviously all my studying of nutrition in college didn't do much for me before I gained this weight, cause I didn't apply it to myself either. Lol.

Its hard to know what works for some won't work for others I have learned through all of my nut classes and trying to incorporate all my new eating habits that I have bed, and I have to be careful with everything I eat or drink. My medicines don't help either. I have up a drug addiction 7 years ago and realized I substituted food instead, neither is good for me. I'm now using my AA tools for my food addiction as well. If I use the things I learned through my meetings and apply it to my food addiction I feel like I'm winning this insane battle I've been trying to fight for the past 7 years. Either way everyone needs to use whatever works for them. There is no right or wrong way to lose weight just as long as we do what works for each of us.

Sent from my N9519 using BariatricPal mobile app

[BigUtahMan 207]

2 hours ago, OutsideMatchInside said:

If anything she wrote is true, which is unlikely. It is probably a tactic they taught her when she went in-patient for her anorexia (if that was true).

Intuitive eating is why almost everyone is over weight.

An anorexic suggesting intuitive eating to people that are probably compulsive over eaters as a solution to their problems is so misguided it borders on unethical and immoral.

Why she is allowed to continue to troll these forums with her fantastical lies is a mystery.

Wow- Surprised someone with 8000 posts who is a "bariatric legend" would be so forthcoming with personal attacking and questioning one's integrity? Is that ok if they don't match your own philosophy or personal plan?

For your information, many therapists use intuitive eating for all types of eating disorders including compulsive eating and food addictions. While it may be easy for you to make ignorant claims of "unethical," it only represents your own limited knowledge about the subject than actual truth. (Are you a therapist? Have you read the book?) I don't mind people countering with facts, but personal insults and actual mistruths don't benefit anyone.

Are you claiming she didn't lose the weight? Are you claiming, she isn't enjoying a new relationship with food and that others can't enjoy it either? Why is this approach to food such a threat to you or your psyche? I appreciate we all fear failure and returning to our unhealthy selves that needed surgery to become healthy, but I hope we can support each other in their processes rather than insult and make even more difficult to accomplish our collective goals in our individual journeys.

I don't know you, and I assume you are a great person, but I hope we can all share our experiences, successes, and failures without being personally attacked for sharing.

[blizair09 3,250]

56 minutes ago, Newme17 said:

I read the principles of intuitive eating. I don't see anything wrong with any of them actually. Unless y'all can pinpoint something in these principles that should be a no-no for the vast majority of people here, then ok, I don't mind accepting it for them for what it needs to be. Otherwise, I might use some of the principles.

http://www.intuitiveeating.org/10-principles-of-intuitive-eating/

I don't see anything wrong with any of them, either. If this was an audience of healthy teenagers in a wellness course, I'd definitely see it included in the curriculum. If this was an audience of adults at a healthy weight and who had a healthy relationship with food, I'd say it is awesome. But for an audience of morbidly obese people, formerly morbidly obese people, people with unhealthy relationships with food, food addicts, people struggling with their weight, etc., etc., etc., it leaves too much room to open up a Pandora's box of issues.

Think about Miss I Ate A Whole pizza (how did I do that), Miss chicken Fingers and Fries During the Pre-Op Diet, Mr. Peeps and Filet Mignon, Miss Ice Cream During the First Week Post-Op, Mr. Swedish Fish, Miss Milkshake and Mashed Potatoes. This isn't going to be a good thing for them. It's like offering a mimosa to an alcoholic. It looks harmless enough, but 2 hours later, there will be lampshades on the head, screaming and yelling, and almost a guarantee of a blackout.

[Newme17 3,444]

4 minutes ago, BigUtahMan said:

For your information, many therapists use intuitive eating for all types of eating disorders including compulsive eating and food addictions. While it may be easy for you to make ignorant claims of "unethical," it only represents your own limited knowledge about the subject than actual truth. (Are you a therapist? Have you read the book?) I don't mind people countering with facts, but personal insults and actual mistruths don't benefit anyone.

I posted the link to it above. I actually didn't find anything wrong with it myself. But you're right, facts need to presented, not opinions.

[Newme17 3,444]

2 minutes ago, blizair09 said:

I don't see anything wrong with any of them, either. If this was an audience of healthy teenagers in a wellness course, I'd definitely see it included in the curriculum. If this was an audience of adults at a healthy weight and who had a healthy relationship with food, I'd say it is awesome. But for an audience of morbidly obese people, formerly morbidly obese people, people with unhealthy relationships with food, food addicts, people struggling with their weight, etc., etc., etc., it leaves too much room to open up a Pandora's box of issues.

Think about Miss I Ate A Whole pizza (how did I do that), Miss chicken Fingers and Fries During the Pre-Op Diet, Mr. Peeps and Filet Mignon, Miss Ice Cream During the First Week Post-Op, Mr. Swedish Fish, Miss Milkshake and Mashed Potatoes. This isn't going to be a good thing for them. It's like offering a mimosa to an alcoholic. It looks harmless enough, but 2 hours later, there will be lampshades on the head, screaming and yelling, and almost a guarantee of a blackout.

Would you be able to point out a specific principle that wouldn't work with the gang who slipped up (I remember the whole pizza one)? I'm a little fuzzy and confused which ones would give them the ""permission" so to speak to engage in this kind of behavior? I'm curious because I am not reading anything that would be so.

[BigUtahMan 207]

The point isn't to ignorantly assume everyone is ready for intuitive eating, or the transformation is an easy one to make for anyone with food issues. But to me, it provides hope that people with my same issues have found a path to get to a more complete and healthy relationship with food beyond what surgery provides. No one is asking anyone to stop what they are doing if it is working, but many people cannot sustain the "eternal diet" mentality for several years post op, and still enjoy life or success. (I also recognize. others can and do find freedom in it.) So I Celebrate any approach that success and happiness can be reached for those who seek it.

[blizair09 3,250]

Just now, Newme17 said:

Would you be able to point out a specific principle that wouldn't work with the gang who slipped up (I remember the whole pizza one)? I'm a little fuzzy and confused which ones would give them the ""permission" so to speak to engage in this kind of behavior? I'm curious because I am not reading anything that would be so.

Keep your body biologically fed with adequate energy and carbohydrates. (Carbs. Yes. Let's see, first I'll have some peeps, maybe later, some potatoes, and if I walk, I can eat that entire container of Halo Top Ice Cream since it has Protein, too.)

If you tell yourself that you can’t or shouldn’t have a particular food, it can lead to intense feelings of deprivation that build into uncontrollable cravings and, often, bingeing When you finally “give-in” to your forbidden food, eating will be experienced with such intensity, it usually results in Last Supper overeating, and overwhelming guilt. (I can't cut myself off from anything. pizza time! Uh oh, I ate the whole thing -- how did I do that? I thought I had restriction.)

Scream a loud “NO” to thoughts in your head that declare you’re “good” for eating minimal calories or “bad” because you ate a piece of chocolate cake. (I have been eating chocolate cake every night this week. That has pushed me to more calories than my body needs considering that I am not exercising at all. Oh well; I'll do better tomorrow, but I never do.)

Listen for the body signals that tell you that you are no longer hungry. (Being morbidly obese, I have had a lot of success in this area...)

When you eat what you really want, in an environment that is inviting and conducive, the pleasure you derive will be a powerful force in helping you feel satisfied and content. (See Roseanne comment from earlier...)

Find ways to comfort , nurture, distract, and resolve your issues without using food. (Again, great for people who have re-defined their relationship with food. But none of the people mentioned have done that, or are even close to doing that.)

Accept your genetic blueprint. Just as a person with a shoe size of eight would not expect to realistically squeeze into a size six, it is equally as futile (and uncomfortable) to have the same expectation with body size. But mostly, respect your body, so you can feel better about who you are. It’s hard to reject the diet mentality if you are unrealistic and overly critical about your body shape. (How many posts a day on here from people freaked out because they have "only" lost 60 pounds in 6 months. Again, consider the audience.)

Forget militant exercise. Just get active and feel the difference. Shift your focus to how it feels to move your body, rather than the calorie burning effect of exercise. If you focus on how you feel from working out, such as energized, it can make the difference between rolling out of bed for a brisk morning walk or hitting the snooze alarm. If when you wake up, your only goal is to lose weight, it’s usually not a motivating factor in that moment of time. (Great for those that are exercising. How many posts say -- I know I need to exercise, but...)

Again, these are great for people who are at a certain place in their journey. But that isn't the majority of people that post on here. They will read and hear what they want to read and hear.

[Joann454 1,329]

Keep your body biologically fed with adequate energy and carbohydrates. (Carbs. Yes. Let's see, first I'll have some peeps, maybe later, some potatoes, and if I walk, I can eat that entire container of Halo Top Ice Cream since it has Protein, too.)
If you tell yourself that you can’t or shouldn’t have a particular food, it can lead to intense feelings of deprivation that build into uncontrollable cravings and, often, bingeing When you finally “give-in” to your forbidden food, eating will be experienced with such intensity, it usually results in Last Supper overeating, and overwhelming guilt. (I can't cut myself off from anything. pizza time! Uh oh, I ate the whole thing -- how did I do that? I thought I had restriction.)
Scream a loud “NO” to thoughts in your head that declare you’re “good” for eating minimal calories or “bad” because you ate a piece of chocolate cake. (I have been eating chocolate cake every night this week. That has pushed me to more calories than my body needs considering that I am not exercising at all. Oh well; I'll do better tomorrow, but I never do.)
Listen for the body signals that tell you that you are no longer hungry. (Being morbidly obese, I have had a lot of success in this area...)
When you eat what you really want, in an environment that is inviting and conducive, the pleasure you derive will be a powerful force in helping you feel satisfied and content. (See Roseanne comment from earlier...)
Find ways to comfort , nurture, distract, and resolve your issues without using food. (Again, great for people who have re-defined their relationship with food. But none of the people mentioned have done that, or are even close to doing that.)
Accept your genetic blueprint. Just as a person with a shoe size of eight would not expect to realistically squeeze into a size six, it is equally as futile (and uncomfortable) to have the same expectation with body size. But mostly, respect your body, so you can feel better about who you are. It’s hard to reject the diet mentality if you are unrealistic and overly critical about your body shape. (How many posts a day on here from people freaked out because they have "only" lost 60 pounds in 6 months. Again, consider the audience.)
Forget militant exercise. Just get active and feel the difference. Shift your focus to how it feels to move your body, rather than the calorie burning effect of exercise. If you focus on how you feel from working out, such as energized, it can make the difference between rolling out of bed for a brisk morning walk or hitting the snooze alarm. If when you wake up, your only goal is to lose weight, it’s usually not a motivating factor in that moment of time. (Great for those that are exercising. How many posts say -- I know I need to exercise, but...)

Again, these are great for people who are at a certain place in their journey. But that isn't the majority of people that post on here. They will read and hear what they want to read and hear.

I think we all "wish" we could do this. If some can then great for them. I read it and immediately thought this isn't me or for me. I wish. Again, perhaps down the road but I'm 53 and haven't ever managed this way of eating. I don't want to fight the rest of my life but I'm accepting I will most likely have to. Each day since surgery I've had to figure out what does and doesn't work. I WANT Halo Top ice cream but I saw what it meant for ME, but what about someone who doesn't or can't see it? So, I completely agree with you. This isn't the appropriate audience.

[blizair09 3,250]

5 minutes ago, Joann454 said:

I think we all "wish" we could do this. If some can then great for them. I read it and immediately thought this isn't me or for me. I wish. Again, perhaps down the road but I'm 53 and haven't ever managed this way of eating. I don't want to fight the rest of my life but I'm accepting I will most likely have to. Each day since surgery I've had to figure out what does and doesn't work. I WANT Halo Top ice cream but I saw what it meant for ME, but what about someone who doesn't or can't see it? So, I completely agree with you. This isn't the appropriate audience.

Exactly. Thank you.

These things are certainly premises healthy adults should aspire to. I am pretty far along in my journey, have lost over 200 pounds, and successfully re-defined my relationship with food, but I wouldn't even trust myself with some of these. And lord help these poor people who are slaves to food that pour in here by the dozens every day.

Everyone is free to follow whatever path they wish to follow in this journey. I'll just be interested to hear how things are going 6 months or a year down the road for the intuitive eating clan...

Edited June 7, 2017 by blizair09

[Apple1 2,572]

5 minutes ago, blizair09 said:

Exactly. Thank you.

These things are certainly premises healthy adults should aspire to. I am pretty far along in my journey, have lost over 200 pounds, and successfully re-defined my relationship with food, but I wouldn't even trust myself with some of these. And lord help these poor people who are slaves to food that pour in here by the dozens every day.

Everyone is free to follow whatever path they wish to follow in this journey. I'll just be interested to hear how things are going 6 months or a year down the road for the intuitive eating clan...

My thinking is along these same lines. I would love to have a comparison 2-3 years down the line and see how well it works out for anyone that decides to do this.

[Apple1 2,572]

30 minutes ago, BigUtahMan said:

many people cannot sustain the "eternal diet" mentality for several years post op, and still enjoy life or success. (I also recognize. others can and do find freedom in it.) So I Celebrate any approach that success and happiness can be reached for those who seek it.

Does the approach of food tracking or journaling and Portion Control have to be thought of as an eternal diet mentality? I don't think so. It is a tool just as WLS is. I am not thinking of any of this as a diet. They are the tools that I use to ensure I am eating healthy and within my personal guidelines I set for myself.

For me a diet means it has an end and these tools I am using now are for life. Maybe down the road i wont have to use them everyday because I will have more confidence in myself, but I am not looking at any of this With a diet mentality.

[blizair09 3,250]

Just now, Apple1 said:

Does the approach of food tracking or journaling and Portion Control have to be thought of as an eternal diet mentality? I don't think so. It is a tool just as WLS is. I am not thinking of any of this as a diet. They are the tools that I use to ensure I am eating healthy and within my personal guidelines I set for myself.

For me a diet means it has an end and these tools I am using now are for life. Maybe down the road i wont have to use them everyday because I will have more confidence in myself, but I am not looking at any of this With a diet mentality.

Agreed. I have journaled everything that has gone in my body since March 21, 2016. My journal is up to 218 pages now. I can't imagine not journaling, not weighing my food, and not being completely aware at all times of what I have consumed in a day. It gives me the power and control. It is no different from my friends who are super devoted to the gym are about their own fitness and nutrition. In fact, I took my cue from them.

But this is my new normal. And it has been my normal for a while now. A lot of folks hope that they will return to some form of their old normal, it seems. For me, that would be a recipe for disaster. Being at a healthy weight is so much more important to me than any food or drink.