Pissed Off and Rebelling

[CocoNina 210]

That would be a good theory except this is the way it works in universal healthcare too.
The logic is the same.
Let's take OP's example of people with breast cancer. That's sort of a medical emergency is it not? Being fat isn't. There are comorbidities that associate with being fat. And those clearly affect when/if/how the surgery is done. However, for the vast majority of people this is self-induced. They need time to reflect and learn more about what got them to where they are, and it needs to be seen if they can lose weight on their own first instead of just throwing them into surgery because they demand it. People tend to think they're the doctors or triage nurses and can diagnose themselves and decide what surgery they want and when. In the real world of course, it doesn't work that way.
An insurance or government will lose 100% of the money on a surgery if you just fly into WLS and do absolutely nothing to treat the underlying causes of it, which very well may be physiological or psychological or both. The idea in mind is to ensure healthy choices so taxpayers, insurers, etc. don't go broke trying to fix health problems, in most cases, someone brought upon themselves.
And I won't take issue with the OP getting mad, but it changes absolutely nothing. As someone who had to deal with the bureaucratic nature of universal healthcare, being in a Weight Management program since September 2015, everything I learned, about what I did wrong, where I'm going right, etc. would not have happened if I was simply tossed into surgery "cuz I said so". It would have appeased me to be thrown in ASAP but I'd not have learned anything.

Would you rather pay for the surgery outright since it seems you don't like universal health care? I feel blessed to not have to pay for my surgery or else I wouldn't afford it.


Height: 5'0"
Weight for WLS consultation: 216 lbs.
Surgery date: 2/13/17
Goal: -71 lbs for healthy BMI (about 145 lbs).
Current weight: 185.2
My profile picture is not me. It's my "FITspiration" body.

[CocoNina 210]

I didn't have to wait that long. It took me 4 1/2 months from the day I was approved to have surgery to surgery date. I think waiting is good because between those 4 months there were so many hoops I had to jump through. I also smoked cigarettes occasionally so they wanted to make sure I quit before surgery. I also took A LOT of tests to make sure I'm healthy enough to have surgery, the psychologist appointment, nutrition classes (I had 3), & being prepared mentally & physically to accept the fact I won't eat for 6 weeks in total. 2-weeks of pre-op liquids & 4 weeks post op liquids ONLY is not easy. But it was all or nothing at this point. Even though it took months to get the surgery, it's still a light at the end of the tunnel. Don't give up, if this is what you really want. Use this 6-month period for more mental preparation & slowly changing your habits to loose more weight before surgery. It's not easy to be sleeved. I underestimated the pain & have to adjust to a whole new life style. But it's worth it. I haven't updated my stats here but I lost 30 lbs in 1 month post-op. It's worth the waiting, pain, & a little suffering for me at least.


Height: 5'0"
Weight for WLS consultation: 216 lbs.
Surgery date: 2/13/17
Goal: -71 lbs for healthy BMI (about 145 lbs).
Current weight: 185.2
My profile picture is not me. It's my "FITspiration" body.

[PatientEleventyBillion 851]

17 minutes ago, CocoNina said:

Would you rather pay for the surgery outright since it seems you don't like universal health care? I feel blessed to not have to pay for my surgery or else I wouldn't afford it.


Height: 5'0"
Weight for WLS consultation: 216 lbs.
Surgery date: 2/13/17
Goal: -71 lbs for healthy BMI (about 145 lbs).
Current weight: 185.2
My profile picture is not me. It's my "FITspiration" body.

Because I said it's bureaucratic? That's a pretty terrible assumption, especially since I just pointed out that wait was a blessing in disguise.

Edited March 13, 2017 by PatientEleventyBillion

[CocoNina 210]

Because I said it's bureaucratic? That's a pretty terrible assumption, especially since I just pointed out that wait was a blessing in disguise.

I asked because here in the States bureaucratic is always used in a negative connotation. We don't have universal healthcare & the people that don't want us to have it always say we shouldn't have Government running our healthcare.


Height: 5'0"
Weight for WLS consultation: 216 lbs.
Surgery date: 2/13/17
Goal: -71 lbs for healthy BMI (about 145 lbs).
Current weight: 185.2
My profile picture is not me. It's my "FITspiration" body.

[PatientEleventyBillion 851]

Just now, CocoNina said:

I asked because here in the States bureaucratic is always used in a negative connotation. We don't have universal healthcare & the people that don't want us to have it always say we shouldn't have Government running our healthcare.


Height: 5'0"
Weight for WLS consultation: 216 lbs.
Surgery date: 2/13/17
Goal: -71 lbs for healthy BMI (about 145 lbs).
Current weight: 185.2
My profile picture is not me. It's my "FITspiration" body.

Well, for one, the US healthcare system is already severely government run. You've got federal healthcare (VA, Medicare, etc.), state healthcare (i.e. Medi-Cal and exchanges), local healthcare (i.e. CMSP), that covers what, 50-100+ million people already? The insurance industry mandates and regulations also effectively make the rest of it government run. Insurance industry spikes prices because they have profit margins to maintain, people providing care that get those profits from spiked insurance force government insuring people to pay those exorbitant costs or lose coverage, nothing really ever addresses the price. The cost for care, in say, Canada, is dramatically lowered because the government has set what the costs are for certain care can be as high as, effectively creating a price ceiling. In Canada one can verify this by ordering payment history from their province showing an itemized list of types of care and how much it was billed for. For example, my ENT back in Ontario billed the province some $600'ish for my tonsillectomy and adenoidectomy. That's roughly 1/6th to 1/12th the price that it is in the US. As a fiscal conservative not only does that quantify the "real" costs of healthcare (something that can't be done in the US, only vaguely "estimated" since it encompasses so many various levels of uncooperative governments, but rest assured significantly higher), but makes it very easy to budget for. Generally, if one can't even truly quantify the costs of something, chances are there's a lot of ripping off being done.

Make no mistake, just because I criticize or identify the bureaucratic nature of Canadian healthcare doesn't make it bad or a negative connotation.

And as an American myself I certainly don't trust the US government either. Other countries have different relationships with their government, that's why I decided to move rather than, in futility, think I or anyone else can (or morally should) just push such a system on unwilling people.

[MBird 298]

It's taken me more than six months, a year, because I had to go through sleep study.

A lot of people do not have your knowledge, hence the classes. Even after taking the classes a lot of people are still clueless because they didn't listen or comprehend.

It's a good time to lose a few pounds prior to surgery or to start working out. Sure, you've done it before, probably yo-yo'd, I know I have but this time it's before surgery. So it's different.

Completely understandable about the frustration but it's about being selfless in a sense so others don't fail. Insurance companies can't weed out who knows nutrition from those who do.

[bekah7482 79]

I have mixed feelings on this. My program didn't require any classes but had mandatory weight loss and a 3+ months wait after you lose the weight before you got the surgery. For me, since I had to wait anyways I wish they would have had classes so I could learn and be part of a program. My program just kinda throws you out there. I have had no communication with them since December. I hit my goal weight at the beginning of February and I am projected to get surgery in early May. Granted I would rather not have the classes AND not have to wait forever after I met all their requirements. But since I have the wait and no communication, I wish there was something more they provided.

[bekah7482 79]

I also feel like sometimes I want to just say "F it." So far the easiest part of this process has been losing weight and I have lost double the weight that was required and feel like I'm no closer to getting the surgery. Dealing with the program and their ridiculous waiting for no reason is what has been challenging. Almost feel like it would be easier to do it on my own at this point but I need to think about the long run and in the long run, surgery is my best chance of life long success.

[Walter.Sobchak 978]

I also feel like sometimes I want to just say "F it." So far the easiest part of this process has been losing weight and I have lost double the weight that was required and feel like I'm no closer to getting the surgery. Dealing with the program and their ridiculous waiting for no reason is what has been challenging. Almost feel like it would be easier to do it on my own at this point but I need to think about the long run and in the long run, surgery is my best chance of life long success.

You said it yourself, you have to think about long term success.
Can you lose the weight naturally and then keep it off?

[goshesgaunt 15]

Actually, I consider the six month diet requirement to be the best thing that ever happened to me. I decided to make the most of that time, and I started making changes right away. During that time, I redefined my relationship with food, got a handle on my mental demons, and lost half of my excess weight (99 pounds -- from 397 to 298 on the day of surgery). This hard work set me up for my post-op success, and made everything about the surgery and life afterward much easier.
The sleeve is just a tool, and it is only as good as the hard work that accompanies it. The point of the six months is to start that hard work. Most people don't change anything and let the time go by, but if it is done right, it can be life changing.
Good luck!

Are you serious?

[blizair09 3,250]

39 minutes ago, goshesgaunt said:

Are you serious?

I am very serious.

[CocoNina 210]

@PatientEleventlyBillion I watched the Bernie Sanders & Ted Cruz debate about healthcare & all Ted said was government should run our health care since he totally opposes it. I don't get why we're the only civilized country without it. I rather our tax money go to that than war. Thanks for this good convo. I admire how Canada & other countries handle Universal Health Care.


Height: 5'0"
Weight for WLS consultation: 216 lbs.
Surgery date: 2/13/17
Goal: -71 lbs for healthy BMI (about 145 lbs).
Current weight: 185.2
My profile picture is not me. It's my "FITspiration" body.

[PatientEleventyBillion 851]

3 hours ago, CocoNina said:

@PatientEleventlyBillion I watched the Bernie Sanders & Ted Cruz debate about healthcare & all Ted said was government should run our health care since he totally opposes it. I don't get why we're the only civilized country without it. I rather our tax money go to that than war. Thanks for this good convo. I admire how Canada & other countries handle Universal Health Care.


Height: 5'0"
Weight for WLS consultation: 216 lbs.
Surgery date: 2/13/17
Goal: -71 lbs for healthy BMI (about 145 lbs).
Current weight: 185.2
My profile picture is not me. It's my "FITspiration" body.

What I was trying to point out is that your tax money (and mine, I still have to answer to the tax man even though I moved to Canada) already pay for the Healthcare of upwards of 100m+ on various levels of government. This and all the insurance industry mandates and regulations effectively make it government run already.

This current system is already un-American and stands to be a welfare-for-the-rich system. The only way to lower costs of Healthcare in the American sense (because universal isn't gonna happen) is to gut the insurance industry and have people directly negotiate with those providing them care. But that would make a lot of rich people overly dependent on government angry and they have too much clout. So rather than in futility try to change a system that obviously won't change any time soon I chose to live elsewhere. That's what I'd advise too for anyone else.

The Canadian system has drawbacks, first and foremost, would clearly piss off the OP because to get to surgery you need to appease gatekeepers the same way as the US insurance industry. I've been in Alberta's Weight Management program since Sept 2015 and only now getting the surgery done. However, with all the common questions people ask regarding diet and such its clear the overall level of lifestyle support is greater in Canada. Going through all the nutritional classes, meetings and follow-ups with psychologists, RDs (Dietitians with min 4-6 year degrees), and case managers to steer things in the right direction, its invaluable at assisting with making those changes. And it requires time. After being through this with so many other people I'm very skeptical those who just want instant surgery are in the right mindset to make far more important underlying changes. We do see a few who can but I also see on forums like this so many others who completely mess things up because they believe the surgery absolves them from the much more important lifestyle changes. Would be no different in universal if people were just tossed into surgery so that's why I vehemently disagree with the OP.

[pdallariva 57]

Did you call your insurance company directly? I called and they confirmed that I did not have to wait the 6 months. I was able to bypass the waiting period. Also, just an FYI if you see your shrink and express this anger they may not give approval to have surgery. It is a huge life changing event. Hang in there!

[Michelle920 66]

I didn't have much of a waiting period. My first consultation was April 15, 2015 and RNY surgery was June 8. In many ways I wish I had one. I didn't make any changes in those seven weeks, although I had good intentions and I tried for the first month, but then it started to dawn on me that I would *never* have things like ice cream or pizza, or drink beer or wine again, and so I indulged in everything I thought I would miss. I didn't binge but I ate whatever I wanted. And gained ten pounds. I did nothing to mentally prepare myself, or to get to the root of the reasons I was fat. I'd been in therapy with an eating disorders specialist for almost twenty years so I guess I thought all that work was done. Um, no. I'm dealing with a slight regain now, and am finally working on why I always end up going back to food. Oh and I've eaten ice cream and pizza, and had wine and beer since surgery. I'm not condoning it, but it happens.