Are revisions REALLY necessary?

[woo woo 872]

That was my problem - I couldn't eat anything healthy/good for me, it would get stuck and come back up. I didn't gain though (until my unfill), probably because I was still going to the gym and riding my bicycle everywhere...

Awesome conversation! Thanks guys!

I also want to add some other insight and even empathy to banders. It has also been my observation that Protein rich foods ironically can sometimes be difficult for banders to eat. That causes them to choose foods like crackers and other crunchy carby stuff that break down faster and go down much easier, thus causing gain. Once again, that falls into the special circumstance category. If I were in the same situation and frustrated by not being able to eat without food getting stuck or making me sick, I would probably do the same thing.

So only healthy foods caused problems? Interesting.

This is actually a very common complaint with the band.

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[Aggiemae 739]

Interesting. So the issue is not the quality of the food, it's not being able to tolerate the density and texture of the "allowed" foods. I couldn't tolerate that for long either. Thanks Babbs.

[KeepCalm 223]

for the most part - healthy I could eat was salads, that went down fine... oh and tuna, but if I tried eating solid foods like chicken, meat, and some veggies (which by the way I love except carrots I'm kinda eh on them)... On a good day, everything was fine, but most days I'd eat one or two bites of something and have to run to the bathroom.

what I mean is only healthy foods made me sick - if I wanted to I could eat all the junk and it would slip right through. I didn't though I'd eat grits, oatmeal, Soups, salads or soft boiled eggs. I could eat the soft stuff, just nothing harder and when I tried, I'd get sick...

I'd get so frustrated being with my family at dinner and stuck in a corner - they knew the first excuse me was cue for get outta the way.

most of my days were 'soup' days... which is what I called any day that I couldn't eat regular food.

Edited November 22, 2016 by Raenh

[BayougirlMrsS 3,934]

Awesome conversation! Thanks guys!

I also want to add some other insight and even empathy to banders. It has also been my observation that Protein rich foods ironically can sometimes be difficult for banders to eat. That causes them to choose foods like crackers and other crunchy carby stuff that break down faster and go down much easier, thus causing gain. Once again, that falls into the special circumstance category. If I were in the same situation and frustrated by not being able to eat without food getting stuck or making me sick, I would probably do the same thing.

You are correct in your insight. Protein rich food are harder to swallow/digest. Learned through trial and error that i can't eat over cooked meats of any kind.. so i stay away from Pork chops because i can't cook them med/med rare.... but i get my steak cooked MR and my burger (no bun) med... chicken tends to be only dark meat as the white is too dry. I also learned to cut up my meat in bite before i put one piece in my mouth the size no bigger than my pinky fingernail. Each person is different and their journey is also. Success is hard work for everyone... it's all a learning process.

And yes the crunchy stuff goes down wayyyy easy (chips, crackers, Cookies...etc) but if i don't buy it, i can't eat it.

[Julie norton 2,850]

What a nice civil discussion by mostly vets... this is why I like this board.

Good info on banders... not many of us left....

I'm celebrating 10 ! Years[emoji322] dec 11.... woo hoo

Not perfect, but way better than almost 100 lbs ago

I'm thankful

[BayougirlMrsS 3,934]

@@Julie norton we have to stick together...

[Jen Mac 28]

@@Hammer_Down As you said, public board where everyone can post opinions... even if it is outrage. Perhaps this topic interested some because they had a revision. We're here to share thoughts, and they shared theirs. We are all so different and that's what makes reading these threads so interesting.

Edited November 24, 2016 by Jen Mac

[GBLady41 393]

So to piggy back on the question.

What are your thoughts on WLS on folks who swear they were not addicted to food, rarely over ate, only consumed 1500 calories or less daily. etc?

How does reducing their stomach size really help? I get that malabsorbtion might, but the sleeve or band? Again, no judgement, just confused.

Obesity is a disease in of itself, and a lot of us don't have a food addiction. I didn't. I was diagnosed with PCOS two years ago, but I have probably had it for years. In 2014, before my diagnosis, I gained 50 lbs from May to August with no negative changes in my diet. Matter of fact, I changed my diet to no avail. The weight gain was due to the PCOS, not my diet.

I'm having gastric bypass surgery after doing a lot of research. I still need my brain and hormones reset in order to lose weight and keep it off. I also did not have a weight problem when I was a child. I only started to have weight issues after I had my daughter. I couldn't lose the weight and keep it off. My point is there are many reasons why people need wls.

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[GBLady41 393]

My whole purpose for having bypass was based solely upon anecdotal evidence showing that people with autoimmune disease specifically rheumatoid arthritis were going into remission after bypass. There was no evidence shown for patients who had the sleeve. My feeling was it was worth a shot. Worst case scenario oh would be that I would be able to drop some of the massive weight I had gained from all the medications there by alleviating the pressure and extra weight put on my already damaged and painful joints.

I was one of the fortunate who went into complete remission after my bypass surgery. I know coming off all the steroids had a huge impact on the significant amount of weight that I was able to lose so quickly. But let's face it there was still plenty that has had to come off with Hard work determination and a commitment to the tool and for lack of better terminology life altering life saving gift I was given.

Two things-

Forgive my lack of proper sentence structure I'm dictating this into the phone as I'm driving to pick up a child from school, and lipstick lady is right we are super groovy and big girls and don't take anything each other says with anything other than the intent in which it was stated.

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This is very interesting to me, since I also have RA/PsA. When we started discussing biologics, I asked my rheumy's opinion of WLS. She was enthusiastically behind it, citing WLS as many times reducing the inflammatory factors. However, she and my surgeon (and my research) all said that the bypass was NOT a good option for someone with auto-immune because of the complete contraindication for NSAIDs and steroids, where the sleeve only has a relative contraindication for those meds.

Not criticising you or your docs, just find it interesting how there are so many differing opinions in the medical community.

BTW, biologics are now off the table for me for the forseeable future. My inflammatory factors are down, and we still have dosing room on sulfasalazine and we haven't tried plaquenil yet. Mtx failed and I developed an allergic reaction to it, so at least I don't have to give myself chemo anymore! LOL. So the sleeve has worked amazingly well for me. Not remission, but meds are working better and we're able to avoid the real heavy hitters indefinitely.

It is interesting how doctors differ in their opinions. I have autoimmune diseases as well. Medications really truly were the reason i packed on so much weight so quickly. I have Psoriatic Arthritis and hypothyroidism.

At the same time, I had a very severe case of GERD causing me to cough every day all day for over a year with no solution.

We had to heavily weigh the right choice of surgery for me. GERD is 100% resolved, issues with pain control for my joints are an everyday battle and I can not and will not risk taking any nsaids even with treatment.

Because I have Psoriatic arthritis oral steroids are out as well as it kicks up the psoriasis so bad that it has caused serious infections that have caused me to be hospitalized over the years.

I also never over ate. However, I ate crap all the time so i was actually malnourished while being morbidly obese. In fact my family and friends could not understand how i was so heavy because they saw how much i ate, they just did not realize that all the carbs were killing me.

Anyway, since bypass I am still on biologics (Stelara) and Cyclosporine to keep my Psoriatic arthritis under control. It has been well controlled for the last 2 years so we have slowly be reducing the quantity of those medications. We tried lowering the dose of Stelara over a year ago and I went into a full on several month episode so we increased it back to where it was. We are discussing trying a reduction again in the spring as everything looks like it is going into remission. That being said, anytime i have surgery it seems to kick back up again so we are going to wait until after my plastics in January to try again.

The biggest thing about having WLS is the head game. You have to change the way you live and learn to make better choices. I think for the most part i have done this well. Of course there are times when i indulge but 90% of the time, I do have to fight with my head.

In the beginning, it was easier for me because even if i did indulge, the weight still came off.

Now that I am two years post op, those decisions matter. I will gain or lose based solely on my behaviors. I believe this MUST be true of anyone going through or that has gone through WLS.

Yes, some people will lose slower than others - I was one of them. It took me 18 months to lose my excess weight and alot of hard painful work to actually get there. Others have lost their weight of similar proportions within the first 12.

I am sort of glad it took me longer, and took me understanding that I am now in the drivers seat, not my pouch. What i choose to put in my body and how often will dictate whether i lose, gain or maintain. If i choose to get no exercise at this point, it will and does have an impact on whether i lose, gain or maintain.

I am in the drivers seat......not my surgery. The sooner some people realize this there will be less need for revisions in my opinion. Of course, I am NOT referring to those that have a equipment failure.

I personally feel that a surgeon that is considering a revision for those persons who failed to lose the weight (not by malfunctioning equipment/surgery) really do need to see someone to assist with why they have not lost the weight.

There is a nurse in my doctors office who had bypass surgery at the same time i did. I know this because she told me and seemed almost upset that I lost all of my weight and she has lost very little. She immediately blamed the surgery for not working. Then proceeded to tell me that her schedule simply did not allow for her to focus on herself so she is unable to get the right Protein and even fluids in her body. She skips meals and then eats whatever is handy in a few minutes in between patients.

Ok, that is not the surgery failing, clearly she is still following the same behaviors she was before surgery. Dont get me wrong, I get it....she is taking care of patients. But, there comes a time when we have to be selfish and focus on ourselves if we want to be successful in the end.

I literally started taking care of everyone else but me from the time I was 16 years old. I was a working married mother of 2 by the time i was 19 going through a horrible marriage. By 22 I was divorced and a single mother working 3 jobs just to make ends meet. By 25 i was remarried to my wonderful hubby of 29 years and working a high paying very stressful job. I did so well in my career and became the primary breadwinner. Well, then there was the stress of that so again, not taking care of me just working like a crazy person.

By the time i was 51 i was in big trouble health wise and was literally told, i would end up in kidney failure soon if i did not lose weight.

So, it was time for me to be very selfish and start taking care of myself.

For the last two years, I have been focused on my health and well being and when you are morbidly obese, that is a necessary part of getting your health back.

So, i say again......your head really has to change in order to be successful. It is why they send you for physch evals before this surgery. I honestly think they could do a better job of assessing patients and setting them up with the right people to help them through the mental part of WLS. Most of us need some sort of help.

@@Djmohr, thank you for your comments. I was on the October 2015 forum and your posts have been encouraging. I am finally going to have gastric bypass surgery on December 12th and I have learned a lot from you and others in that and other forums. I just wanted to let you know that you are appreciated.

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[BayougirlMrsS 3,934]

@@GBLady41 the attached pic is of my friends beautiful daughter.... She was about your height and in or around 2007ish she started putting on weight... She was always a thinner girl.. stayed active and in shape. But it seemed no matter what she did the weight just would stop. Fast forward.. she got married and started trying to have a baby... No luck. So she went to the dr and he confirmed PCOS. He also suggested WLS. She called me immediately (she knew i had LB) with a 1000 questions (well maybe not that many, but close). She wanted the LB, but her insurance paid for the GB or Sleeve. I Not really know a lot about either at the time, came here and asked. the overwhelming response was GB. So, she had the GB a year ago in June.... before her year was up she had lost over 100lbs and a few months after that found out she was expecting.... Baby girl is coming in Feb.

Im wishing you all the luck with your GB. I'm sure you will be a success.

[1Day1Life4Now 882]

I feel like this particular board is being a bit judgmental. I had revision surgery two weeks ago from the Sleeve to RNY, For the record, I did not want to have revision surgery (who would????) but due to severe GERD and Rheumatoid Arthritis i had no choice. For my health it was necessary. I loved my sleeve and never wanted anything different, now dealing with the RNY is different and will be for the rest of my life. Being obese, we were always being judged by others and this forum is supposed to be our "safe place" but it doesn't seem very safe for some people.. Different surgeries work for different people and some don't work as well or at all. Our pouches are tools and those tools can fail regardless of how well someone is informed or how well they are sticking to their diets. Yes there are some people with food addictions or other issues that prevent them from following the plan. But to suggest because they have not been fully compliant they shouldn't be allowed an additional surgery in hopes that the new surgery could help them, is a bit cruel and selfish. Once you are a few years out from surgery your perspectives may change. I wish everyone good health and weight loss and know that any issues you have are just as valid as anyone else's.

[Aggiemae 739]

If you read the posts you will see that no one has issues with medically necessary revisions but at least a few times a week some one starts a thread basically saying that they successfully lost weight but regained it and are angry that their insurance wouldn't pay for another surgery.

A few of them have had lap band revised to sleeve, not because of a mechanical problem, but because they regained the weight and call it a surgery "failure" (the i r words not mine) and are now seeking an RNY. The sleeve doesn't "break" and the stomach capacity can be evaluated. If the sleeve works why risk another major surgery?

My concern is that for these people the underlying food issues have clearly not been resolved. To my way of thinking performing another surgery is unethical.

I myself was sleeved on 10/25 and though I have never had GERD or any digest problems before but I now have severe GERD I sometimes vomit up even with the Protein shakes. It might improve. I'm hoping it does. Of course, one would want to live with this for the rest of their lives. No one should have to.

I hope this clarifies the reason the thread was started. God luck with

[1Day1Life4Now 882]

I read each and every posts. I realize they were giving a pass to the medically necessary revision. My point was that some people were still coming across as very judgmental. Just not an attractive thing for this type of board.

[LipstickLady 25,682]

I read each and every posts. I realize they were giving a pass to the medically necessary revision. My point was that some people were still coming across as very judgmental. Just not an attractive thing for this type of board.

That said, you can't read tone on the internet. There's a good possibility that what you are reading as judgment is not intended in that way at all. Instead of accusing, ask questions. It works for me.

[Jen Mac 28]

I guess I view revisions for whatever reason to be at the discretion of the surgeon and patient. Everyone's story is different, but even if it is not "medically necessary", who am I to say another isn't worthy of a second chance?

I am a nurse and have taken care of addicts of all nature and see the rate of recidivism/relapse. I know that it takes more than one round of treatment some times... yes, surgery is a major intervention and there are risks associated with it, but to say a surgeon is "unethical" for performing them as revisions is a bit judgemental, regardless of whether or not there is perceptible tone.

Pray you never find yourself in a position where you have "eaten your way through" your surgery. We are all human and not infallible. I lost 115 lbs the "natural" way and kept it off for over 10 years. I NEVER thought I would gain that weight back. I thought my food issues were resolved. But here I am, typing this post on the bariatric pal thread. I gained all the weight back and then some. Went from 165 lbs to 362. I needed surgery to help with this. We all did, right? That's why we're here.

I'm here to find support and offer it to others... if I had a revision and came here looking for support and was reading this, I think I'd cry. There are those that judge us because we had to have the surgery the first time... let's not do the same to someone who found themselves here twice.