Intimacy

[faithmd 14]

Yep, I gotta agree with the two ladies above me. It seems the environment is just getting more toxic for you. It is killing your psyche and eroding your sense of worth, I'm sure. It may be time to look into how best to deal with ending the situation and striking out on your own.

Whatever you decide, know that I, that we are all here for you and anything you feel you need to bounce off of us, we're ready. I'm still off work so I'm online a lot. I have my phone by me.

[Marimaru 7]

Brandy, I agree that you have to do something at least for yourself... For me, if my DH didn't talk to me for days other than "get my food" he'd be starving or wearing it on his head! Maybe one night when he is saying sweet things to you while he thinks you are asleep, you should respond. Sometimes you can get a person to talk if it's just the right moment.

I think sex really is an important part of a relationship. Not really the 'act' of it, but the feelings it can generate. And if your husband wont have sex with you and you bring it up and hear "oh not this again" I would say "Yes, this again, and again, and again until you can make me understand". It's aggressive, but you need to drag this out of them. I think especially if you are trying to decide whether to stay with them (or in Tracy's case, marry them as well).

Anyhow, I guess my only advice is to get aggressive in finding the answers you need. I'm not an aggressive person, and it wouldn't be easy for me. I am in fact in counseling as a "recovering doormat", learning how to stand up for myself and not be walked all over. But in my case, it was my DH who pointed out that the rest of my family was doing this to me.

Intimacy is important, and it's kind of the whole picture; touching, kissing, caressing, sex, saying I love you; I think honestly that if any of that is missing, just out of balance.

[gadgetlady 4]

Brandy, I agree that you have to do something at least for yourself... For me, if my DH didn't talk to me for days other than "get my food" he'd be starving or wearing it on his head! Maybe one night when he is saying sweet things to you while he thinks you are asleep, you should respond. Sometimes you can get a person to talk if it's just the right moment.

Intimacy is important, and it's kind of the whole picture; touching, kissing, caressing, sex, saying I love you; I think honestly that if any of that is missing, just out of balance.

I agree wholeheartedly. Especially about the part where he'd be wearing his food. My Italian temper, I guess. I do also agree about the part where he's talking to you in your "sleep" -- what the heck is that all about? I wonder if he realizes he's a jerk during the day so he's trying to subliminally affect you so you won't do something drastic. Anyway, in that situation I would roll over when he says that and say something like, "That's so sweet; I really appreciate your saying things like that" and start up a conversation. See where it leads. Best of luck to you. I am continuing to pray.

[TheGh0st 9]

Kitty - I know it is probably one of the scariest things to do considering the situation right now. But I also agree that the next time he says something nice while you are "sleeping". Let him know you are awake, maybe just say something like "I love you too dear" without trying to start a conversation. You never know maybe he is secretly hoping you really are awake, but at the same time afraid of the flood gates that his comment might open. By flood gates I guess I mean long serious conversations he may not be willing to have yet or renewed attempts at physical contact he is also not yet willing to accept.

[areellady 1]

Or you could roll over and say, I really would like to hear those kind of things during the day when you think I am awake.....

I can not even say how sad this makes me feel.....I am going to gush all over my DH tonight 1) because I can 2) because he will let me 3) because I need to really realize how very lucky I am to have him....

You girls who are going this these things are sooooooooooooooo strong and awesome!!!!! All of this hard work you are going through to transform your bodies and mind, you need someone to do something for you....someone to touch you, hold you, kiss you....I truly you all find what you are looking for and move in that direction.

[TheGh0st 9]

OFF TOPIC!

I have been lurking and occasionally posting on this thread from the start with my own intimacy issues with my husband.

But the more I read this thread the more I'm feeling convicted that I'm guilty of some of the same issues we are having with our DH's but in regards to my relationship with my mother. I thought I'd go ahead and share this with you as it is possible some of our DH's are also struggling with some of the same feelings as I am.

I know I worked myself into a corner with my mother years ago. In fact I'm embarrassed to admit it was over 20 years ago now back in early high school. I had finally "bloomed" into a very well endowed young lady and my new found chest was an alien object to me. And the thought of hugging ANY other female was just too much for me. The whole thought of the feeling of my new breasts against someone else's breasts wierded me out to no end.

My mom couldn't understand why I was all of a sudden so unwilling to hug her. I tried explaining it to her but she didn't seem to believe me and thought something else might be wrong like an abusive boyfriend or sexual abuse. She would go so far as to try to walk in on me changing my clothes at home or in clothing stores to see if she could find any bruising. That behaviour didn't help any as if I was uncomfortable feeling my chest against another women's I was even more upset at anyone seeing them. It all came to a head one day when she thought she could "cure" me with some tough love and literally chased me all around the house trying to force a hug out of me. She thought if she could just hold me long enough I'd get over my phobia. In the end I was standing in the bathtub arms outstreched crying, yelling, begging her to leave me alone.

Since then I was even more unwilling to hug, if that was possible. She continued to try to force them on me after I went to college especially in public places where she thought she might coerce me into giving into a hug rather than causing a scene. It only pissed me off more at the thought of what I saw as her disrespect for my feelings. It actually took me nearly 10 years to finally get used to hugging another female, but those females are my inlaws and other female friends. Not my mother or by extension my sister who I also don't hug out of some warped respect for the fact that it would hurt my mother to see me hug my sister but not her. To this day it takes everything in me not to physically cringe when she initiates a hug. And though I do grudgingly allow it I know she can tell I'm uncomfortable touching her. And I never initiate one myself.

Which is very sad because I love her dearly. I live 300 miles away but we talk nearly every other day. And other than this one issue which in all fairness really shouldn't have been a big issue she has never abused me physically or emotionally. I would really like to be able to hug my mother openly, I know I'm unfairly hurting her. But it's become such a big "elephant" hiding in the room. That I'm still actually afraid to show much of a response when she tries to hug me or worse initiate the hug myself for fear that she would break down with tears of joy and not let go for so long it might take another 20 years before I tried to hug her again.

But even though she is not old in my eyes. She is not getting any younger and I would hate myself even more if I wasn't able to get over this foolishness before it was too late. I tried once to tell her if she would stop trying to hug me I would make the effort to hug her. I feel if she would only allow me to come to her on my terms I could slowly get back to where we once were so many years ago but I'm still scared she won't be willing to make the baby steps that I need.

I am going to be seeing her this weekend. And am going to try to remain convicted enough to give her a genuine hug initiated by me. And pray that my fears are unfounded and that she doesn't start crying and refuse to let go until I pry her off me.

Wish me luck.

[green 6]

Ghost, maybe you could write your mum a letter, one similar to the one which you have just posted, explaining everything to her in much the same way that you have explained everything to us. Just a thought....

[nume130 0]

Ghost: I know that must be hard with your mother. Maybe if you give your mom the hug this weekend and she gushes and cries and clings etc etc She just might get it out of her system once and for all and then the nice hugs can happen again. I have a real hugger child and I can cuddle and squeeze her and she loves it, a medium hugger and I can get a nice big bear hug from him- not too prolonged but a decent hug none the less. My oldest is a no hugger child, I get an itty bitty hug from her. I don't believe we should treat our children the same because they are not the same. The hugs I give to my kids are not just to meet my needs but their need for affection. If I tried to force my oldest to cuddle etc. then the only need I'm meeting is mine, not hers.

As I write this I know that this also applies to my husband, over the years I have tried to force him to be affectionate, I would reach out to him to hug me etc and when it was too long he'd push me away, now he really dislikes it. Maybe I forced my need on him to much?

Anyway Ghost, have a great weekend and try not to feel to guilty. As women we feel guilty about everything!

[Marimaru 7]

Ghost,

Maybe see how this weekend goes, and if you are unable to do it, then I agree with Green, and you should write her a letter. If she didn't believe you when you were younger about what the issue was, maybe you can try to explain it again, with some of the struggles over the next 10 years in trying to get over it.

I did not have that thought, but I was a C cup by 6th grade, and that really does something to a person. We'll just say I didn't get them from my mom, and she used to tease me all the time, as did my younger sisters. Also, just before that age, my parents got divorced and I was living with my dad then, and was also living with him when I got my period for the first time. HE had no clue how to deal with it. I had issues about my breasts for years, but other issues in my general upbringing kept me from saying anything, I just stuffed all the feelings away. I have joked with my mom about the idea, like I said above, that having big breasts so young 'does something to someone', her answer to that was "you think?!" but, I don't think she has ANY CLUE what-so-ever, just like my weight issues in general, but that's another story.

[Lucy 0]

BooBooKitty, like the others here, your post is so hard to read. I hope you can find a way to connect with your husband or find a way out. If my husband didn't speak to me for 3 days except to tell me to get his food, I would take the day off work and have the locks changed. The fact that he says lovely things to you while he thinks you are asleep shows that he has feelings for you, but he obviously doesn't know how to express them. I don't have answers, but I hope that you and he can find a way to get through this and communicate with one another.

[KariK 0]

BooBoo do you and your hubby email? Could you possibly email each other? Maybe he would be able to write you how he feels? Or you could start writing to him in handwritten letters. Personally I take the more direct approach and regularily tell my husband exactly what is on my mind. He thoroughly does not enjoy hearing it and tells me so. My reply to that is to ask him if he'd rather I acted all nice to his face and did things behind his back. He replies no, and means it, in the end he's glad that I force him to communicate. He says that growing up his parents did not discuss things like we do. I ask him if he wishes we were that way and he says no. I stay totally calm and don't yell or call names or anything, I just keep talking until I feel like I've said what needs saying. I mean once in a while it might get a bit heated but thats maybe twice a year tops. I probably force him to talk about the 'issues' every 2 months or so. It makes me feel better and I think it really does make him try harder to be better. Sometimes he even tells me things that are bugging him. And that helps me to be better for him usually too. Ok im done rambling lol.

[TracyinKS 7]

First.. BooBoo Kity: I think you husband knows your awake but is insecure enough to take the chicken way out by the "OUT" of you pretending to be asleep... (does that make sense?) He figures that you'll answer when your ready to end the silence.... Silent treatment drive me INSANE, as I am a venter... Dbf is a runner and that pisses me off... it all boils down to some crap ass sense of insecurity on all parts....

In my old life I would of dumped the spaghetti on his head, but if I did it to dbf he would leave and never come back and I would be stuck with the bills and broken hearts (both mine and my sons)

The mother issue.................... I started my period at age 9 but didn't tell my mom til I was 11, because I felt she would embarass me by telling EVERYONE... I am heavy like her.. and a classic yo yo dieter going up and down the scale just like she has always done.. and she is one of the hardest people on me about it..... I love her dearly, and we talk daily via phone and email, but I can relate... I do hold her at more of a distance in some respects and that I know is hurtful. I just pray that I don't alienate my own child so that he hold me at a distance in his adult years...............

Oh yeah......... Dbf would never agree to counseling about our lack of sex... most likely he would turn it around that it was my fault... (again a sign of insecurity)

going to bed now.........

[Marimaru 7]

Brandy, I second the idea of email, or even a chat client. My husband and I work together, and honestly, if we are having a problem, we can work out the really hard parts on chat (like yahoo, or aim), that way we can get what we want across without having to *say* it. I am a TOTAL crybaby. I'll cry when we are chatting even, so chatting makes it much easier for me sometimes, but he and I make a point to talk about EVERYTHING under the sun. He tells me if he's not satisfied with how often I do (or don't) initiate sex, or if he feels I'm being distant, etc... even over chat. Chat or email can seem impersonal, but it kind of feels anonymous, even though it totally isn't, if that makes any sense...

[gadgetlady 4]

. . . or "here's what I wrote in my journal today; I'd like you to read it" . . .

[lizrbit 0]

ghost, i nearly cried when i read about your aversion to physical affection with your mom.

Im going through bigtime mom issues right now. I have a very strong aversion to my mother. i love part of her on one hand, but on the other hand, if i never spoke to her or saw her again i would be very okay with that. my mom is an alcoholic and there are big dramatic horrible secrets going all the way back to thirteen for me that NO ONE in my family will address. I have tried and its useless. Now she needs me. The one time in her life where she genuinely needs me, and she wants to pretend we are close and that shes always been this close loving mother...and i just cant do it.

part of me wants to. if she was TRYING to quit drinking, i think i really could trust it and give it another shot..and yeah, ive told her this directly at various times...where she promises the changes..and anymore not even fifteen minutes passes before shes forgot everything she laid out there and goes right back to how she lives.

My heart goes out to you. I hope that one way or another you get some peace with that issue, even if its reassurance that you would never have to feighn (spellin?) physical affection if you dont genuinely want to show it, or to just have the ability to enjoy the mutual affection. I hope it works out in any case.

i dont know where my relationship with mine is going to go. Im willing to just let it go at this point. I just dont have it in me to give.