who supports right to choose

[TommyO 5]

See there you go, I make a statement that I disagree with your methods and I am evil but you call people murderers and still you get to judge me. Your rhetoric is fine to you only because you believe it to be not because it's right.

You choose to intepret my words based upon your pallet and as such you tell the world more about you than you do about me. Your arrogance and hate creates a blemish on what is a beautiful world but you will never understand this because you think your beliefs make you right. You are no different to me that any other religious fanatic and as such you scare me. Spewing your hatred against those you disagree with, yes you can paint me as the bad guy but in truth I think I know where evil lurks.

[gadgetlady 4]

You go from "it's good to still see you fighting for what you believe in" and "I disagree with your beleifs [sic] but I commend your commitment to them" to "Your arrogance and hate creates a blemish on what is a beautiful world" and, then speaking directly of me, "in truth I think I know where evil lurks." I think people can draw their own conclusions.

[Carrie_C 9]

I think it is worse to have a child you neglect and abuse than to have an abortion.

[gadgetlady 4]

The children who are being neglected and abused currently weren't aborted. Abortion doesn't cure neglect and abuse! You can't predict when a mother is pregnant whether she will neglect and/or abuse her children.

[Carrie_C 9]

The children who are being neglected and abused currently weren't aborted. Abortion doesn't cure neglect and abuse! You can't predict when a mother is pregnant whether she will neglect and/or abuse her children.

That's not what I said at all. I think a lot of women have children they don't want because they are afraid of what people will think if they get an abortion. So they have it anyway. Then they abuse and neglect the child because it was unwanted. I was saying it is worse to do that than to just get the abortion in the first place.

[pattygreen 5]

Who says that an abortion that didn't take place is going to be an abuse and neglect case? Most mothers once they see their child at birth fall madly in love with them and regret ever even 'thinking' about abortion.

[BJean 16]

MissFFs: I am seriously wanting to take issue with your claim that there is some relationship between abusive parents and people of color.

I lived in Florida for 16 years (one of your "sources" of experience that provided your claim). My sister worked in state-run drug program. Most of the people she helped into the program (both live-in treatment and out-patient treatment) were black. If she were a single minded, biased person, she would have claimed that most drug abusers are people of color.

But whoa...she didn't believe that for one minute because she understood that she was working in an area of town that was accessible to black people more readily than to white people, and the people they treated had fewer options for treatment than more financially well-off white people.

So just because she saw more black people with drug problems in her treatment center, that had absolutely nothing to do with the statistic of which race has more drug problems.

By the same token, during the 16 years I lived in Florida, the number of cases across Florida of child abuse, child endangerment (people leaving their babies in hot cars) and the outright torture and murder of children was alarming! And the majority of those cases were not black people abusing their children - they were nearly all white people abusing and killing their children.

So I take exception to your claim that child abuse is probably more prevelant in black families and I would suggest that you cite serious references to back up your suggestion.

[BJean 16]

Those of you who justify your position on taking away women's right to choose, please tell me exactly what the Constitution of the United States does promise us, if it does not "mention" abortion as you have stated?

And for the person who asked why we're discussing this because we already legally have the right to choose, I am here to tell you why. It is not because it is a very volatile issue and one that is spoken of nearly every Sunday in many of our churches.

It is because Sarah Palin and John McCain and the right wing faction that has taken over the Republican party are pushing with all of their might to overturn Roe v. Wade - the very case that was upheld again not too long ago by the Supreme Court - which ruled that to take away a woman's right to choose is to take away a woman's Constitutional Rights.

As women, we should be very afraid of people who want to take away our rights. We have to fear them just as much as we would fear any communist; Hitler, Stalin, or Chairman Mao for instance, who has decided that it should be within their power to tell every woman what she must do in this extremely personal medical issue.

[gadgetlady 4]

Those of you who justify your position on taking away women's right to choose, please tell me exactly what the Constitution of the United States does promise us

Hilarious. The Constitution promises us a lot of things. Abortion is not one of them. I'm still waiting to hear where you've managed to locate it in the Constitution. I won't hold my breath.

[BJean 16]

Are you being intentionally obtuse? I asked if you know what it does say in the Constitution. I'm not the one who suggested that the word "abortion" is or is not addressed in the Constitution. Do you understand your Constitutional rights? Why do you want to take away every woman's Constitutional rights?

I have no quarrel with your abhorence of abortion. That's your right. Fortunately for you, I'm not trying to make a law that requires you to have one. There is nothing that requires you to have one.

You're picketing abortion clinics. The Constitution gives you that right. You can say whatever you want. You can even lie. In fact, your presidential and vice presidential candidates can lie - in public - and do on a regular basis, and do it on the record. Their people can actually call Obama a Marxist and not get carted off to jail.

Guess I can call anyone who wants to take my rights away, a communist.

Now you go girl. Rant on.

Right now I'm heading home (with visions of Colin Powell's statements that the right wing that has taken over the Republican party, dancing in my head.)

[Carrie_C 9]

MissFFs: I am seriously wanting to take issue with your claim that there is some relationship between abusive parents and people of color.

I lived in Florida for 16 years (one of your "sources" of experience that provided your claim). My sister worked in state-run drug program. Most of the people she helped into the program (both live-in treatment and out-patient treatment) were black. If she were a single minded, biased person, she would have claimed that most drug abusers are people of color.

But whoa...she didn't believe that for one minute because she understood that she was working in an area of town that was accessible to black people more readily than to white people, and the people they treated had fewer options for treatment than more financially well-off white people.

So just because she saw more black people with drug problems in her treatment center, that had absolutely nothing to do with the statistic of which race has more drug problems.

By the same token, during the 16 years I lived in Florida, the number of cases across Florida of child abuse, child endangerment (people leaving their babies in hot cars) and the outright torture and murder of children was alarming! And the majority of those cases were not black people abusing their children - they were nearly all white people abusing and killing their children.

So I take exception to your claim that child abuse is probably more prevelant in black families and I would suggest that you cite serious references to back up your suggestion.

I agree with you that child abuse is not just happeneing in black families. My mother and stepfather are foster parent, as I mentioned before, and the majority of the kids they have had have been abused in some way. And most of the kids they have had are white or biracial.

[Carrie_C 9]

As women, we should be very afraid of people who want to take away our rights. We have to fear them just as much as we would fear any communist; Hitler, Stalin, or Chairman Mao for instance, who has decided that it should be within their power to tell every woman what she must do in this extremely personal medical issue.

I agree with you 100%. We should be afraid of people who want to take away our rights. If they make abortion illegal, what's next, making birth control illegal as well? It's sounds absurd, but it is entirely possible.

[gadgetlady 4]

Are you being intentionally obtuse? I asked if you know what it does say in the Constitution. I'm not the one who suggested that the word "abortion" is or is not addressed in the Constitution. Do you understand your Constitutional rights? Why do you want to take away every woman's Constitutional rights?

How could I be more clear. WHY is abortion a Constitutional right? I can tell you why gun ownership is a right; I can point to the Second Amendment. I can tell you why free speech is a right; I can point to the First Amendment. Can you tell me WHERE In the Constitution on ON WHAT GROUNDS you base a supposed Constitutional "right" to abortion?

[pattygreen 5]

they can't. it's not in there.

[gadgetlady 4]

they can't. it's not in there.

Of course they can't. Neither will they find the supposed "right to privacy" in their either. Yet that doesn't stop them from lying and saying a mother has a "Constitutional right" to kill her children.