who supports right to choose

[BJean 16]

late, that's a nasty little comment you made to IndioGirl... although it is so in character for someone who believes she is the person who can make reproductive decisions for all of the other women on this earth. Well you can't. And no ugly thing you can come up with will change that. It will only go to prove how unkind you are. Seems to me that you may have some hard questions to answer one day.

[late 0]

My comment was not made to be "nasty" only truthful. And yes one day we will all bow at the feet of Jesus and be held accountable for our unforgiven sins including myself. And i'm sure God has a long list for me. And before anyone says that i'm saying God will not forgive an abortion that is not what i am saying. God forgives all sin when asked with a repentive heart.

[gadgetlady 4]

Gadget - If you look beyond the tip of your nose,

what a sweet way to start a post

you will see it's not about making abortions legal or illegal, it makes very little difference one way or the other.

I disagree. I know a lot of women who wouldn't have had abortions if they were illegal. Abortions have increased 1500% since abortion was decriminalized.

If you don't confront the main issue, we are just blowing in the wind. Abortions are a symptom of the disease, there are a lot of others as well, female abuse, child abuse, child neglect & abandment....... etc. How can you just look at one aspect and put so much time, money and energy on this one and neglect all the others.

How do you know I'm only looking at one aspect? That's awfully presumptuous of you.

Take a step and try and focus on the root of the disease. The root as I see it, as I have stated before is how men see the world and how they see woman, and how woman see them self's. If we change this, we can not only be done with abortion but a whole slew of other sympton's.

Very true. But the sooner we stop abortion, the sooner we stop the murder of innocent human beings. Yes, the rest is important, but I think the most important thing for the baby that's about to be slaughtered is stopping the slaughter.

[gadgetlady 4]

I'm posting a picture of a beautiful baby girl (being held by MY beautiful baby girl). Her name is Gaby. She was brought over to our house today by a dear, dear friend who is a foster parent for her. She is a crack baby. Yes, the dreaded crack baby that everyone talks about. She is a total sweetheart, an adorable, precious little girl. Better that she would have been killed?

[BJean 16]

There you go, posting ridiculous stats again. There is no possible way to calculate that there are 1500% more abortions now than when abortions were illegal. You came up with that figure how? There is no possible way to know how many illegal abortions have been performed. At best, that's a guestimate. Ok if you post it and state that it is a guess or an estimate, but to post it as if it were fact is incorrect.

late: If your comment wasn't made to be nasty, that's nice, but the fact is that it was nasty. Why don't you worry about how you're going to answer for your sins and not cast judgment on others? That's not your job. And I guess your last sentence tells us that you are not a Southern Baptist Born Again Christian because they believe that the only people getting into heaven, even if someone asks for forgivness with a repentant heart, are Southern Baptist Born Again Christians.

[BJean 16]

Who said that "crack" babies should be aborted? What are you thinking, and why would you assume that pro-choice people are desirous of aborting "crack" babies? The fact is, pro-choice people are not suggesting that anyone get an abortion.

[gadgetlady 4]

There you go, posting ridiculous stats again. There is no possible way to calculate that there are 1500% more abortions now than when abortions were illegal. You came up with that figure how? There is no possible way to know how many illegal abortions have been performed. At best, that's a guestimate. Ok if you post it and state that it is a guess or an estimate, but to post it as if it were fact is incorrect.

There certainly weren't more than 1,500,000 abortions per year in the US when abortion was illegal. Even if you accept the number of illegal abortions that the pro-abortion movement touts as gospel truth, you are still looking at a dramatically high percentage increase, well over 1000%. So it's only 1300% or even only 1000%? It's still a huge number.

[gadgetlady 4]

Who said that "crack" babies should be aborted? What are you thinking, and why would you assume that pro-choice people are desirous of aborting "crack" babies?

Because I hear it all the time. "What about the crack babies? Who's going to take care of the crack babies? Don't you think we should abort the crack babies?" Well, the answer is no. I don't think any babies should be aborted, regardless of circumstance.

[gadgetlady 4]

BTW, sorry I couldn't figure out how to post the picture. It's asking for an URL address but the photo is on my desktop and the path isn't working. If anyone knows how to do it please let me know.

[BJean 16]

HA! You and I agree on one thing, gadget... nobody should be compelled to abort a baby, ever.

But we'll never agree that someone can accurately have a clue how many abortions were performed when they were illegal. It does make a difference whether it is a 1500%, a 1000% or a 1300% increase if you are posting something as fact. The real fact is, you have no idea how much of an increase there has been in abortions since they were legalized. You can say that it only makes sense that there has been a huge increase, but you cannot say it with any real proof. If you want to be taken seriously, you shouldn't cite statistics that cannot be proven. It makes it seem that you are willing to exaggerate the numbers to make your case.

It is great that your friend is a foster parent. Does she have any idea if and when the baby is going to be adopted? How old is the baby? I'm sure everyone here will be happy to hear that she's being properly cared for.

[gadgetlady 4]

The friend is a he. Actually, it's a married couple but I know the husband better. The baby is 4 months old and they'll have her at least until November, until the state can re-evaluate the mom.

This couple is one of the friends I've talked about in the past. They had an abortion before they were married and very much regret it. They have 3 daughters but feel a hole in their hearts from the baby they aborted. He feels like they aborted their son. They are now, of course, pro-life.

These "rabid pro-lifers" are giving something back, caring for those who society tells us don't deserve to be alive. But of course, pro-lifers never do that. They're just pro-life because they are fetus-lovers, and after the babies are born they're not around to help take care of them.

[gadgetlady 4]

But we'll never agree that someone can accurately have a clue how many abortions were performed when they were illegal. It does make a difference whether it is a 1500%, a 1000% or a 1300% increase if you are posting something as fact. The real fact is, you have no idea how much of an increase there has been in abortions since they were legalized. You can say that it only makes sense that there has been a huge increase, but you cannot say it with any real proof. If you want to be taken seriously, you shouldn't cite statistics that cannot be proven. It makes it seem that you are willing to exaggerate the numbers to make your case.

How about this? How about if we look up the number of LEGAL abortions the year after Roe? Then compare that to today? Would you hold that the number of ILLEGAL abortions before abortion was decriminilized was higher than the number of abortions the year after? Would that be fair to you, or would that be a huge exaggeration as well?

[joe7777 1]

My 2 cents...i will probably not look at this thread again so write whatever you want. Also i might be repeating something someone has said because i just skipped to the last page to add this.

If you don't want one (abortion)...don't get one. If you want one it's you choice.

Also...Pro-choice doesnt mean pro abortion...it means pro-CHOICE.

[green 6]

Green I do admire much about my Canadian cousins and their beautiful country. But I have to tell you, sometimes I wonder if your pride in your country isn't keeping you fitted with rose colored glasses. When we moved to Montreal, we were told that there were no "street people" and no beggars and practically no crime. That wasn't true. There were lots of street people there. One guy who was begging on the street one day actually landed a punch in my DH's face. We witnessed men urinating on the streets quite often. There was always a puddle of pee in many of the downtown Metro stops. There was a murder just around the corner from us in a jewelry store during a robbery.

Did I read about it in any of the newspapers or see it on the news? Not very often. The newscasters did not stupidly sensationalize shocking stories like they do in the states, and I do not doubt that more crazy things go on down here than in your parts, but your country isn't Nirvana either. (Although I do admit that it's closer to it than the U.S.A.)

For all the negative stuff you hear about what's happening down here, just please remember that we have a crazy media that loves to exaggerate for effect. Most of our neighborhoods are quite safe and beautiful places to live.

We do spend a lot of time debating and criticizing our own, that's one of the really neat things about us. But it also wreaks havoc on our self-esteem, both as a country and as individuals.

Hah! You know what, BJean? I think that you might be right! Although there is not much public pissing going on in Toronto. We are still informed by the Anglo-Saxon sensibility on that score. Green sez thank you for your observations.

(This is a little off topic but the French are quite casual about pissing in public. This was part of my culture shock when I first started living there and all foreigners who came from over here or from the northern European countries were affected in much the same way. )

[TommyO 5]

Figures can lie and Liers can figure!! An old quote my dear old dad would use