So how do you really know ?opinions please

[stacey3272 5]

So I was wondering. There is a thread that has been pretty hot around here.Through out the many post people start saying things about a surgery in the 4500 or so range just can't be done and the surgeon must cut corners and an use black market supplies. So what I just don't under stand is every surgeon in that range are all that way ?? What I mean is there are a good hand full that are in that range. So does that mean they all cut corners and use cheap or bad supplies. They do not seem to say any thing about other Doctors besides the one that is a hot ticket item right now. So unless you go to a MX surgeon that is 7 to 9 thousand range they are not good. ?? Just a thought. I mean many people say I talked to them( doctor or (coordinator) and asked what they use and so on. Well do you think they are going to tell you otherwise. HOW do you really know. I am not one to pick and think to deep but after reading a bit last night it just made you wonder.

On another note. When calling for a US surgeon that could take you on if something should come up. many say they just call around and ask. So are you talking to the Doctor or some one that handles request like that ?? I was wondering who do you ask for .

Thanks

[Kindle 8,667]

For me, I used certain criteria that was important to me to choose my surgeon. It just so happened that none of the $4500 range options met these criteria....

Experience (Over 12,000 bariatric surgeries);

Credentials (Fellow of the American College of Surgeons, full member of the American Society of Metabolic and Bariatric Surgery, SRC International Centers of Excellence surgeon)

Facility (Private surgical center, not a general hospital; limited number of surgeries/day, Staff experienced and dedicated to bariatric surgery, SRC International Centers of Excellence; fully equipped and staffed ICU)

Complaints/complications (None reported at the time of my researching, communicated directly with other patients)

Postop communication and followup care (weekly/ monthly email surveys, Dr. readily available via phone and email)

As for hands on followup care in the US, my PCP has taken care of everything. My Mexico doctor has been available to consult if needed and my PCP would have referred me to the appropriate specialist if I had needed to.

Edited August 14, 2014 by Kindle

[SherB 220]

Here is what is so funny. Everyone is saying how cheap surgery is in Mexico but my insurance only allowed my doctor to be paid around $1500 after adjustments. It is the hospital that screws you. The surgeons in Mexico may be making more than the US doctors unless you are US self pay.

[NothingUpMySleeve 244]

So, I work in a hospital but I had surgery in Mexico, and yeah, I can certainly see where corners are cut, but not always in the ways people bring up here.

Is it possible my surgeon lied about the brand of staples used? Possibly, but I really don't think so. It's more about how hospitals here in the US have tremendous costs that aren't necessarily tied to the procedure. For example, I had a complication. It was scary, but I'm fine now. Had this happened in the US, I would have had a visit from Risk, a nursing manager, some additional sort of patient advocate, so forth. There may have been an investigation involving numerous parties, legal, HR, administration, etc. These things are hugely expensive, and the documentation involved goes beyond what even a nurse or physician is aware of. I know because I see it. Does this regulation and liability due diligence add an extra layer of safety? Absolutely! Would it have been worth an extra $15,000 to me? Hard to say. Sometimes my decision to go to mexico still makes me uneasy, but other times I'm at peace with it. Regardless, I've been very pleased with my results (size 2!!!!) and anytime I've had questions, the practice has quickly gotten back to me via email. So no, I don't find it impossible for this surgery to be done for $4500, but there are differences, certainly.

I know this is a rambling response, but I see such polarized responses on this board: it's either, "Mexico has only corrupt evil doctors who use vet equipment and steal your kidneys and hit on you," or it's, "Mexican surgery is the best and even better than the US, so OMG," when in reality I think it's neither extreme. There are good and bad surgeons everywhere.

[VSGAnn2014 12,992]

Here are some questions I asked my surgeon (and investigated about him before finally settling on him):

1. How many WLS surgeries have you done? (In what time frame?)

2. How many VSGs have you performed? (I'll be having a VSG.)

3. How many WLSs have been performed at this facility? (I'm having my surgery at a hospital -- and am happy to be doing so, since complications of all kinds can be dealt with there readily.)

4. What's the MRSA infection rate at the facility for surgical patients over the last 6 months?

5. How many of your patients have died during WLS surgery? How long ago?

6. What kinds of complications have your WLS patients had during the last six months?

7. I realize that complications are to some extent unpredictable. But in what ways does my current physical / health condition suggest that I could have difficulties / complications with WLS during or after surgery?

8. In your experience, what patient behaviors are most highly associated with losing all the excess weight they wanted to lose and thereafter maintaining that weight loss FOREVER?

[stacey3272 5]

So, I work in a hospital but I had surgery in Mexico, and yeah, I can certainly see where corners are cut, but not always in the ways people bring up here.

Is it possible my surgeon lied about the brand of staples used? Possibly, but I really don't think so. It's more about how hospitals here in the US have tremendous costs that aren't necessarily tied to the procedure. For example, I had a complication. It was scary, but I'm fine now. Had this happened in the US, I would have had a visit from Risk, a nursing manager, some additional sort of patient advocate, so forth. There may have been an investigation involving numerous parties, legal, HR, administration, etc. These things are hugely expensive, and the documentation involved goes beyond what even a nurse or physician is aware of. I know because I see it. Does this regulation and liability due diligence add an extra layer of safety? Absolutely! Would it have been worth an extra $15,000 to me? Hard to say. Sometimes my decision to go to mexico still makes me uneasy, but other times I'm at peace with it. Regardless, I've been very pleased with my results (size 2!!!!) and anytime I've had questions, the practice has quickly gotten back to me via email. So no, I don't find it impossible for this surgery to be done for $4500, but there are differences, certainly.

I know this is a rambling response, but I see such polarized responses on this board: it's either, "Mexico has only corrupt evil doctors who use vet equipment and steal your kidneys and hit on you," or it's, "Mexican surgery is the best and even better than the US, so OMG," when in reality I think it's neither extreme. There are good and bad surgeons everywhere.

Very well said. This is how I have been feeling since I have started to research this. It was one of these questions I has to ask out loud Thanks for your story and opinion.

[stacey3272 5]

No need to brae down more. I do understand and have read a post by you about this same thing. It was just one of those things that I had to pt out there Thanks for taking the time to answering my post .

Yes, having the surgery in the $4500 dollar price range is very doable, using the same FDA approved surgical equipment used here in the states. There are a number of factors that go into the pricing in Mexico, I did extensive research on every element of this surgery abroad before booking my surgery.

There are a number of ways to verify the equipment used by whichever surgeon you choose, I asked for pictures, researched the info that I obtained from the pictures, and tracked down tons of information that way. I also saw the equipment on the day of my surgery, and if you are really concerned about it just ask to see the Endopathic staple cartridges before going into your surgery, and ask if you can keep the packaging, which provides you will all the detailed specs, such as the lot number, reference number, expiration dates etc. Plus you have the surgical video, which you can clearly see in a lot of them the Ethicon name on the side of the Endopathic stapler, and each gun I believe has their own serial numbers as well. Research is key.

You also have to factor in that you are comparing two countries with very different economic structures...and American nurse on average will make around 30 dollars an hour, while a Mexican nurse will average around 60 dollars a day. From there we could go into supply lines, distribution centers, bulk medical supply ordering, currency exchange rates, operational cost, advertising cost comparisons...literally the list goes on and on, it just depends on how far you want to break the process down to figure out if surgery abroad is right for you.

To answer your question, on how you know that surgeons and coordinators are providing you with good information...well, I personally put in the leg work to verify anything I was told...so again research is a crucial part of this process. Not to mention that Medical Tourism brings in millions of dollars into the Mexican economy every year, sure there are good and bad doctors everywhere, but people who hold the assumption that Mexico doesn't regulate Medical Tourism health care, I believe are misinformed a bit. They highly regulate controlled substances, operating centers, they have an arbitration committee that investigates medical negligence etc. From an economic standpoint, if a country has developed an industry which injects millions into their economy every year, I highly doubt they will allow a bunch of botch doctors to set up shop and deter people from seeking medical care abroad.

The negative effects on the loss of injected capital alone is enough to keep the country on its toes to insuring the care that is provided is quality. That is not to say that a bad doctor cannot open up shop, but it wouldn't take long for them to be shut down either...when it comes to economics and finance, especially outsider revenue streams, those are important, and are closely guarded...there is not a business/government in the universe that is going to let a hack jeopardize revenue sources, taxable income, and capital injection of that magnitude. If you want a more detailed breakdown of what all these means, let me know and I will write up a detail outline of how it all breaks down.

Many surgeons in Mexico hold operating privileges at a number of hospitals and operating facilities and must go through the process of obtaining those privileges for each and every place they operate at, so the surgeon, their credentials, and surgical capabilities can have gone through a number of different review processes.

I know this is a very vague and short answer to your questions, and I would be happy to break it down further for you when I have the tim

As far as your question about follow up care in the states, most of the time, at least in my experience you are going to want to talk to the bariatric doctor...sometimes the staff might know if they take on patients from other surgeons, but it is always better to gather your information directly from the source. Explain what you are asking for to whomever answers the calls, they can either transfer you to someone who can tell you for sure, or request that they have the surgeon call you back.

[stacey3272 5]

No need to brae down more. I do understand and have read a post by you about this same thing. It was just one of those things that I had to pt out there Thanks for taking the time to answering my post .

Yes, having the surgery in the $4500 dollar price range is very doable, using the same FDA approved surgical equipment used here in the states. There are a number of factors that go into the pricing in Mexico, I did extensive research on every element of this surgery abroad before booking my surgery.

There are a number of ways to verify the equipment used by whichever surgeon you choose, I asked for pictures, researched the info that I obtained from the pictures, and tracked down tons of information that way. I also saw the equipment on the day of my surgery, and if you are really concerned about it just ask to see the Endopathic staple cartridges before going into your surgery, and ask if you can keep the packaging, which provides you will all the detailed specs, such as the lot number, reference number, expiration dates etc. Plus you have the surgical video, which you can clearly see in a lot of them the Ethicon name on the side of the Endopathic stapler, and each gun I believe has their own serial numbers as well. Research is key.

You also have to factor in that you are comparing two countries with very different economic structures...and American nurse on average will make around 30 dollars an hour, while a Mexican nurse will average around 60 dollars a day. From there we could go into supply lines, distribution centers, bulk medical supply ordering, currency exchange rates, operational cost, advertising cost comparisons...literally the list goes on and on, it just depends on how far you want to break the process down to figure out if surgery abroad is right for you.

To answer your question, on how you know that surgeons and coordinators are providing you with good information...well, I personally put in the leg work to verify anything I was told...so again research is a crucial part of this process. Not to mention that medical tourism brings in millions of dollars into the Mexican economy every year, sure there are good and bad doctors everywhere, but people who hold the assumption that Mexico doesn't regulate medical tourism health care, I believe are misinformed a bit. They highly regulate controlled substances, operating centers, they have an arbitration committee that investigates medical negligence etc. From an economic standpoint, if a country has developed an industry which injects millions into their economy every year, I highly doubt they will allow a bunch of botch doctors to set up shop and deter people from seeking medical care abroad.

The negative effects on the loss of injected capital alone is enough to keep the country on its toes to insuring the care that is provided is quality. That is not to say that a bad doctor cannot open up shop, but it wouldn't take long for them to be shut down either...when it comes to economics and finance, especially outsider revenue streams, those are important, and are closely guarded...there is not a business/government in the universe that is going to let a hack jeopardize revenue sources, taxable income, and capital injection of that magnitude. If you want a more detailed breakdown of what all these means, let me know and I will write up a detail outline of how it all breaks down.

Many surgeons in Mexico hold operating privileges at a number of hospitals and operating facilities and must go through the process of obtaining those privileges for each and every place they operate at, so the surgeon, their credentials, and surgical capabilities can have gone through a number of different review processes.

I know this is a very vague and short answer to your questions, and I would be happy to break it down further for you when I have the tim

As far as your question about follow up care in the states, most of the time, at least in my experience you are going to want to talk to the bariatric doctor...sometimes the staff might know if they take on patients from other surgeons, but it is always better to gather your information directly from the source. Explain what you are asking for to whomever answers the calls, they can either transfer you to someone who can tell you for sure, or request that they have the surgeon call you back.

No need to brae down more. I do understand and have read a post by you about this same thing. It was just one of those things that I had to pt out there Thanks for taking the time to answering my post .

[woo woo 872]

it's either, "Mexico has only corrupt evil doctors who use vet equipment and steal your kidneys and hit on you," or it's, "Mexican surgery is the best and even better than the US, so OMG,"

LMAO love it!