Help needed: overhead weakness

[Fiddleman 4,376]

Friends of the fitness forum.

I need your help to diagnose an issue and perhaps offer some approaches to fix it. I know there are several lifters who have been lifting Iron much longer than I as well as physical therapy and perhaps fitness professionals among you. With your collective knowledge and practical experience, I think you can help me.

Quite frankly, I have a profound weakness in lifting overhead. Even though I have been doing all sorts of progressional lifts of different styles over the last year, I have made no progress, or worse, negative progress. For example, I can not even do a 65# shoulder press without discomfort and very little strength.

Here is a representative list of overhead lifts I struggle with:

Push press

Push jerk

Split jerk

Sn@tch

Power Sn@tch

Overhead squat

Thruster

My execution at all of these are leaving me wanting to give up on overhead lifts. However, these are so core to cross fit that I look silly not even being able to push press 65# without pain and struggle. If I cannot do these, it is going to hinder any real progress for me. I have zero power overhead. Zero. it is sad.

The primary issues when lifting overhead:

1. Inability to lock out arms

2. Inability to rotate shoulder even to vertical. Needs to rotate beyond vertical behind my head.

3. Pain in left shoulder

4. Pain in left bicep (side of upper arm)

5. Left bicep an delts are much underdeveloped compared to right bicep.

I am not weak in terms of other lifts:

1. Front squat max: 205#

2: back squat max: 275#

3: deadlift max: 315#

4: bench press max: 250#

I can make use of my shoulders in other functional ways:

1. Push ups

2. Pull ups

3 rowing

4. Wall ball tosses

5. Kettle bell swings

6. And more

I do these well in terms of athletic skill, endurance, stamina and focus. These use my shoulders and arms in a way that there is power.

I do spend a lot of time daily on mobility stretching using bands and PVC pipes. I also have fixed my general standing and sitting posture in the last 2 months ( it was severely messed up). I fixed my posture through the course of wearing a posture correcting shirt. It has worked wonders to align my shoulders and thoracic regions so I can do the squats and deadlifts correctly. All the other functional movements got a lot easier after fixing my posture to be one of stability and strength.

I know my frontal muscles and ligaments are tight and short. That is why my arms cannot lock out overhead nor can they rotate back or even be held straight up and down naturally against the head. I went through months of PT at the end of last year, but I am still stuck with this issue.

I so desperately want to get past these mobility and pain issues so I can start making real progress with the overhead lifts above. I do not think this is a nutritional or supplement issue. Both are handled well by me. I think it is a mobility issue. I have read the supple leopard book in addition to a lot of other flexibility books. I put a lot of it into practice like yoga stretches and things like stretching in a door jam or using bands to stretch out upper body.

Help? All thoughts, ideas and suggestions are welcome. I really want this issue to go away.

Edited February 6, 2014 by Fiddleman

[Fiddleman 4,376]

I was just Looking at this page :

http://nemsi.uchc.edu/clinical_services/orthopaedic/shoulder/rotatorcuff_tendinitis.html

I have all the symptoms described in my left shoulder:

Aching pain

Trouble sleeping

Pain worsened by overhead activity

Weakness (secondary to pain)

Clicking or popping

[catfish87 3,471]

I don't lift Fiddle...but I did have rotator cuff surgery...

Could that be a possibility?

Edited February 6, 2014 by catfish87

[Fiddleman 4,376]

I am thinking it is either a rotator cuff issue, or a bursitis tendinitis issue. Planning on going in to xray it very soon so I can get the ball rolling so to speak. Hope it is something that can be fixed with out surgery. It has been going on for what seems like forever and it is kind of embarrassing to be this strong guy and fumbling around with such low weights on the overhead lifts when all these smaller girls are lifting so much more. Well maybe it is not so much about that. It is more about the insanity of making zero progress in this area of lifting after months and months and months.

[catfish87 3,471]

I hope you find some answers. My symptoms were similar to what you describe above. For my issue, I was treated for A/C joint arthritis with injections for appx two years. They helped for a while.... It got to the point where I couldn't pick up a gallon of milk. Then the MRI showed the tear in the rotator cuff. I ended up having surgery in the fall of 2010. I have NO pain in that shoulder now.

Edited February 6, 2014 by catfish87

[B-52 7,113]

Rotator Cuff....Bursitis or Arthritis...or in my case..both. Just the left shoulder...

But I am over 60 years old....

[wcn1970 239]

Do you do any workouts outside of CF? Are you doing any muscle isolation lifting?

[Fiddleman 4,376]

No, no isolation lifts. All my lifts are cf and compound.

[CBT 450]

Left side symptoms may also be calcific tendinitis. I had both in left shoulder: Calcium and medium full thickness tear. Calcium shows on xray. Tears do not but some surgeons have sharp clinical skills that will clue them into MRI earlier than a PCP (IMHO)

I agree to see an Orthopedic shoulder surgeon. S/he will evaluate your weaknesses and give you good feedback as well as diagnosis and/or tx options.

My surgeon is also an ironman athlete. He was highly motivated to get me right back to were I want to be.

So don't despair

[Fiddleman 4,376]

I got the X-ray results back yesterday. No issues.

I have been thinking more and more about what these pain and weakness issues are originating from and it think it is clear. My shoulders are misaligned from years of bad posturing due to a combination of obesity and ergonomics. It is so simple yet profound. To test this theory I have been wearing a posture shirt by Intelliskin and conscientiously practicing an internal backwards rotation of the shoulders in addition to a squeezing of the shoulder blades.

These changes in posture line up the bones in the shoulder and thoracic regions and relax the pectoral (major and minor) and lat muscles. The first thing that happens is my mid back pain goes away. The second thing that happens is my thoracic spine pain goes away at the base of the neck. The third thing that happens is the rotator cuff pain goes away. It takes practice, but the shirt helps remind me to stay in this position of alignment.

We shall see what this does for lifting overhead, but I think it will move me in the right direction since my shoulders will no longer be under such constant torque due to the tight short ligaments and muscles. I hope I am right, but am a little disappointed to have suffered such pain, endured so much physical therapy, performed so much mobility training over the last 6 months just because of a bad alignment of shoulders and back. If I am right, this will be the start of a pain free set of days and improvement in my lifting abilities.

Hope this self realization helps someone. It certainly helps me.

[Wags 549]

Fiddle,

Yes! You have helped me!!! I do not exercise like you do, but I have chronic mid back pain that I believe is from decades of poor posture due to obesity and ergonomics. I just bought the posture correction shirt from Intelliskin! I am so excited to try it!! I am hoping that it helps me to correct my posture and relieve this chronic pain. Thank you for telling me about a product that I didn't even know existed :-)

[CBT 450]

Fiddle you can have your wife take a photo of you at the corner of a wall to check your posture. Shoulders rolling/hunched forward is a problem for many ppl. We do so much in front of us (typing).

I had a PT who had me do similar exercises to your shirt. Basically you stand up straight, roll your shoulders back and down to set them, arms at your sides, palms facing forward (rotated) and pump you arms back. You'll feel it. 30 reps three times a day.

This is where Pilates/yoga/acupuncture/massage can be helpful in the mind body connection. In Pilates and yoga there is a constant reminder to set your shoulders into the sockets before you use them. In body work you get instant feedback on muscles you're holding and what is weak. Your therapists will tell you if you ask. They can feel it.

I used to pop out rib heads on the right side from lifting without setting my shoulders that caused muscle tension/pain/weakness.

If there isn't a tear, weakness often comes from the small muscles doing the job of the big muscles because the form is compromised.

[Fiddleman 4,376]

CBT - you are very helpful.

[wcn1970 239]

If you get that posture in check why don't you work in some shoulder isolation exercises to build some muscle there and gain some strength. No chance you wouldn't see an advantage.