No Child Left Behind? How about adults?

[Tired_Old_Man 1]

Today I went to a credit union and took out $1500 in cash. I was given 15 $100 bills. While pointing to the picture on the bills, I playfully said to the teller, "some people think he was one of our greatest presidents".

She looked up and said, "Don't you"?

I said, "Of course not".

"Why?"

"He was never president!!"

"He wasn't?"

"No, Benjamin Franklin was never a president of the United States."

Then I went to a bank to deposit my $1500 and said to the teller, "I was just at my credit union getting this money and I said to the teller, 'some people think he was one of our greatest presidents'.

She asked me, 'Don't you'? and I said, 'Of course not'."

"How come?" asked the bank teller.

"Because he was never president!!"

"OH!"

[SGDodge06 0]

Omg Omg Omg Omg!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[tracew 2]

I suppose that is one advantage to being Canadian....no presidents! But we have a few sketchy Prime Ministers!! hehehehe

Tracey

[Wheetsin 714]

I would wonder if it's more an issue of not knowing he was never president, or of not knowing who the man is, and by the time you find out, you're so confused you really don't know any better.

I'm like that when it comes to geography, which is probably my "weakest" of school type subjects. I'm pretty good with non-US geography, but don't ask me what states border what because unless I've lived there, there's a chance I couldn't tell you. But I'd know where to go to find the answer.

[Tired_Old_Man 1]

I would wonder if it's more an issue of not knowing he was never president, or of not knowing who the man is, and by the time you find out, you're so confused you really don't know any better.

I'm like that when it comes to geography, which is probably my "weakest" of school type subjects. I'm pretty good with non-US geography, but don't ask me what states border what because unless I've lived there, there's a chance I couldn't tell you. But I'd know where to go to find the answer.

Both tellers knew that Benjamin Franklin was the person on the $100 bill. I even said to one of them, I guess that the movie "Dead Presidents" has had a lot of influence.

Note: For those unaware of the term, the movie was called "Dead Presidents", because that was how the thieves referred to the money they were going to steal; "Pictures of 'Dead Presidents'."

[Sunta 5]

Unfortunately, the majority of Americans would probably think the same thing. My belief is that we are the most uneducated and/or ignorant nation on the planet. Sometimes it's not people's fault, but the fault of a totally unbalanced school system that favors the rich and penalizes the poor. A great book on this topic is "Savage Inequalities" by Kozol. Written over almost 20 years ago, not much has changed since it came out. In fact many teachers and students alike say the situation has deteriorated even further since the book's publication. It exposes the division, especially among racial lines, in America's schools. Issues raised include the inability of school districts to afford textbooks for every student, overcrowding, violence, poor teacher quality due to low pay, etc.

Of course, people who went to the best schools can also be ignorant of many things. I think it's a general lack of interest in education and reading that permeates our culture. Many people just don't care about learning these days, it seems, and have no intellectual curiosity at all.

[Ariel 1]

How do you know that they knew who the person on the bill was? Myself I don't pay attention to the pictures i just care about the number printed on them.

[maudeispam 2]

As with anything I think the rich get the full advantage of the educational system. I also think the students who participate in sports, clubs, band, etc., have a better advantage as well. I felt all through my school career, I was pushed through the system, not really taught much, just pushed. To this day I believe I would have had a better education if my parents were rich, on the school board, or I participated in extracurcular activities. JMO.

[Wheetsin 714]

We lived in an affluent neighborhood and I went to a school in an equally affluent area. And I mean - kids driving BMWs and Mercedes they got for their 16th birthday affluent. And then we moved and there really weren't particularly affluent areas, there were a few affluent people, mostly doctors at the local hospital, and a few nicer neighborhoods, and a few not so nice neighborhoods, but it was this great sea of middle class, for the most part. At least when I was in high school.

Regardless of which school I was at, except for a very small handful (maybe 3) of classes I can think of, I always felt that learning was my responsibility and would occur outside of the class or teacher. The teachers told us what to learn, and that's all they did, but it was our job to go forth and learn it. In either school, except for the mentioned exceptions, I really can't remember learning occuring because of the teacher of because of the setting. I remember plenty of instances where I learned because I took the book home with me and read it and read it and asked my parents and kept at it until I understood what it was saying. Teachers just never held value, outside of "babysitter" for whatever hour I happened to be with them. They couldn't answer questions outside of what was printed in the text, they could not help me make connections or form new schema, or see some deeper insight in a superficial topic.

We need to help our teachers learn to teach, not just to follow a curriculum or talk or instruct. I'm not a teacher so I don't have the first hand experience, but I have worked as a contractor hired to help schools fox this problem. And I know there's a huge deficit out there (can only speak for sure about schools in my state and two surrounding states) between what teachers are learning, how they're allowed to do their job, and the knowledge/skills someone really needs to teach effectively.

[Tired_Old_Man 1]

How do you know that they knew who the person on the bill was? Myself I don't pay attention to the pictures i just care about the number printed on them.

Because they mentioned Benjamin Franklin by name.

Even if they had not, they are supposed to be trained at "how to tell counterfeit money from real money" and would therefor be expected to have more knowledge than average people about money.

Plus, it says Benjamin Franklin on the bill right under the picture.:faint:

[Tired_Old_Man 1]

We lived in an affluent neighborhood and I went to a school in an equally affluent area. And I mean - kids driving BMWs and Mercedes they got for their 16th birthday affluent. And then we moved and there really weren't particularly affluent areas, there were a few affluent people, mostly doctors at the local hospital, and a few nicer neighborhoods, and a few not so nice neighborhoods, but it was this great sea of middle class, for the most part. At least when I was in high school.

Regardless of which school I was at, except for a very small handful (maybe 3) of classes I can think of, I always felt that learning was my responsibility and would occur outside of the class or teacher. The teachers told us what to learn, and that's all they did, but it was our job to go forth and learn it. In either school, except for the mentioned exceptions, I really can't remember learning occuring because of the teacher of because of the setting. I remember plenty of instances where I learned because I took the book home with me and read it and read it and asked my parents and kept at it until I understood what it was saying. Teachers just never held value, outside of "babysitter" for whatever hour I happened to be with them. They couldn't answer questions outside of what was printed in the text, they could not help me make connections or form new schema, or see some deeper insight in a superficial topic.

We need to help our teachers learn to teach, not just to follow a curriculum or talk or instruct. I'm not a teacher so I don't have the first hand experience, but I have worked as a contractor hired to help schools fox this problem. And I know there's a huge deficit out there (can only speak for sure about schools in my state and two surrounding states) between what teachers are learning, how they're allowed to do their job, and the knowledge/skills someone really needs to teach effectively.

I agree with the vast majority of what you wrote.

Today, with the Internet and TV Channels like the Science Channel, History Channel, National Geographic Channel, etc. available, it is a shame that MTV and similar junk are what children are watching.

In the break room where I used to work, we had a TV. I wanted to watch the ABC World News and this other mechanic wanted to watch "Lifestyles of the Rich and Famous". This happened almost every night, because that was when we normally got lunch. Sometimes I would get there first, so we would watch the news, sometimes, we watched the "glitz".

One night when we were watching the news, this other mechanic was bitching and moaning, "same news every night" until the news anchor said, "after we come back from these commercials, star from the 40's remembered" (translation: Old Movie Star died), and then he couldn't wait to see who it was and to hear all the gossip.

We have a nation of dummies because they are only interested in glitz. More people can name all 12 American Idol contestants than came name their 3 Federal Congressmen. Talking about FOX TV shows; has anyone seen "Are You Smarter Than A 5th Grader?"

People who are stupid are competing for a $1,000,000 by answering questions on math and geography from the first through fifth grades. I wonder where they got their pool of applicants from and how did they keep away the Jeopardy and "Do you want to be a Millionaire" applicants out of the show's contestant pool?

[SGDodge06 0]

You guys need to look in the TV guide and see when "Homeless to Harvard" is going to be on life time again. This is a true story. It proves that no matter what you have if you want to learn and be somthing your will work you tushie off. Librarys are free...

Doesnt mean that I did well in school by any means. I am not saying that! Just please watch the movie! Plus it was really good too!

[babygrl1234 6]

. Talking about FOX TV shows; has anyone seen "Are You Smarter Than A 5th Grader?"

People who are stupid are competing for a $1,000,000 by answering questions on math and geography from the first through fifth grades. I wonder where they got their pool of applicants from and how did they keep away the Jeopardy and "Do you want to be a Millionaire" applicants out of the show's contestant pool?

I have never seen this show but I have heard about it from co-workers. Sadly the jeopardy people are probably the rare few seeing as when while I am hearing about it at work, I am hearing about how hard the questions are and how there is no way a fifth grader would really know the answers.

Or I might just work with a bunch of morons.

[wavydaby 1]

I still think the standardized testing is to blame. All kids learn is how to fill in the dot on the stupid tests. The teachers gear the lessons plans to teach what little, and I do mean little will be on those tests. It is the results from those tests that say if they get a raise or get to keep their jobs.

As a side note, while working in a Burger King for extra coin in college, I over heard this conversation:

Co-worker: I'm sorry sir, we dont take checks

Customer: But its a traveller's cheque

Co-worker: Right and we dont take checks

Customer: But the sign says you honor American Express

Co-worker: Yes, but thats a credit card.

At that point, I walked over to see what was going on.

I looked at what the customer had and it was a $50 dollar AE travellers cheque.

I took my co-worker, its a travellers cheque, it works like a real $50 bill.

Of course, co-worker wouldnt believe me and went off in search of the manager. He came out and verified that we DO take those.

Co-worker finishes ringing up order and getting food for customer, then I hear this question;

"Hey, I dont have any Travellers Cheque $1 bills, do you?"

I wanted to scream.

[Tired_Old_Man 1]

I still think the standardized testing is to blame. All kids learn is how to fill in the dot on the stupid tests.

Both before BuSh put his controversial "No Child Left Behind" Policy into effect while governor of Texas and after the policy had been in effect for years, they tested the incoming freshmen at the University of Texas with simple tests.

Questions were of the nature of which side was the US on in the Vietnam war(?) and the Korean war(?), who was president during the civil war(?). The questions were either multiple choice ( with 2 possible choices) or true/false. The average score was 50%. Flipping a coin would have done just as well.

The standardized testing IMHO has made the problem worse while giving it the appearance of making things better. Teachers and principals know that their jobs are on the line if the children do poorly on the standardized tests, so they teach how to pass the test, not who was president during the civil war(?) or which is the closest planet to the Sun(?). The program runs counter to all other programs in that it gives the schools who need the least financial aid (because they are doing well) more money, and takes money away from the schools who need financial aid the most because they are doing poorly. The rational for this approach is, “Why should we reward poor performance?” Sounds like a smart question at first glance, but think of the ramifications. If a school is located in a well to do town with high property values, the school tax and school budget will be high. The children there do well on the standardized testing so they get more money. In the next town which has a poor population, lower property values, lower school tax and therefor a lower school budget, when they do poorly, they get a cut in financial aid for their school system. So the rich kids who are getting a better education get even more help, while the poor lose money for the extra tutoring and remedial programs that they need. And then we wonder why the poor are locked into a cycle of poverty and we hear preaching about personal responsibility (of the poor performing students) when it is the earning power of the parents which are actually being tested.

I used the University of Texas test story for two purposes. One; to show how badly high school graduates are doing and two; to show that the standardized testing of the "No Child Left Behind" Program is not working. Most colleges, I believe would have a similar record.