Six Weeks Post Op & Not Doing Great

[Lucii24 5]

I had my gastric bypass surgery on 17 September; I am now six weeks post op & to be completely honest I'm doing rubbish.

I've got no energy at all & I've recently added an additional Iron supplement in with my Calcium & Vitamins A - Z, but it hasn't made any difference at all. Due to my lack of energy its putting a real strain on my relationship & I'm even struggling with work, as I've had so much time off this year with this & gallbladder removal & infections.

I feel that my Partner is being really selfish & doesn't understand what I'm going through & especially what my body is going through, but has been through as well.

I'm doing okay with my fluids & they are being increased however; I am doing awful with my Protein & my dietician doesn't want me on Protein shakes, she wants me on food.< /p>

I'm so flat on the floor with depression & all of this has started since I've had this surgery, but I genuinely feel like giving up on life itself & my anti depressants are no longer working.

I'm seeing my GP tomorrow so I'm praying he can help me get out of this black hole.

Since my op there was 3 weeks my weight didn't move; now I'm weighing 11 stone 11lbs, but due to servere depression there are days I won't eat at all & only drink.

Please can someone help me or advise me; does this pass & will my energy levels come back eventually, will I always feel this tired & worthless?

Sorry for the essay.

Kindest Regards

Lucii Xxxxx

UK Hampshire

[Jacqueline K 93]

I was very tired for about the first 3.5 months and then my energy kicked in! Just hang in there with that. At this point you need the Protein shakes since you can't eat enough yet! My doctor wanted me off the shakes too but not until I could get enough Protein from food. Please do use shakes/bars to get enough protein in! That could be a part of the problem with your tiredness. It could also be slowing your weight loss.

It will get better- I had a hard time working too when I was so tired but I made it through that time and so will you. We're all here for you.

Sent from my iPhone using RNYTalk

[Lucii24 5]

Thank you Jacqueline K I really really appreciate your feedback & support. What Protein shakes did you take & bars & did they taste nice as thats what I'm dreading tbh? I will try keep going & really do appreciate your comments & knowing that I'm not alone.

Best wishes Lucii Xxxxx

[DLCoggin 1,788]

When it comes to energy, carbs will always be king. On a normal diet, about 60% of your energy needs are met with carbs. But, when you're on a low carb diet, Protein is your body's best friend. In the absence of sufficient carbs, your body will use Protein as its primary source of energy. So, no carbs, no protein = no energy.

There is no doubt that "whole" foods are always the best source of protein (or any other nutrient). But that can be extremely difficult if not down right impossible for several months following surgery. I am not a doctor. Or a nutritionist. But if the choice comes down to protein supplements or no protein at all, I would go for the shakes/powders/bars/soups/puddings in a heartbeat. Without hesitation. And I believe the majority of doctors would agree.

Protein is not only important for energy. Every single one of the one trillion cells in your body contains protein. Protein helps to build and repair body tissues including skin, muscle and major organs. Without sufficient protein, healing can be slowed. Protein is used extensively by the body in defending against bacterial and viral infections. Rapid weight loss will always result in some loss of muscle mass. Protein will help minimize that lean muscle loss. It will also reduce hair loss. And these are just some of the benefits of protein.

Consider giving protein a very high priority in your journey. There are very good reasons why virtually all doctors recommend their patients get at least 60g of protein per day. Follow their recommendation. You'll be glad you did and your body will thank you.

Depression is quite common following RnY. You've had a major surgery. Hormones are going wild. But it does pass and before you know it, you'll be back on your game. Stay positive. Stay patient. Stay focused on following the protocol as closely to the letter as you possibly can. And last but not least, maintain a food log.

You're gonna love the new you!!

[Shannon Mcmanus 32]

^ what he said!!! get your protien any way you can, your body needs it!!!!!

[TurnThePage 220]

If you are honestly thinking of harming yourself, please get to an emergency room or call a suicide hotline NOW. There are lots of people who will help you if only you ask! Whatever is happening in your life WILL pass--time inevitably moves forward and circumstances change.

Start by getting help for your depression from a psychiatrist who can prescribe an appropriate medication, preferably a doctor specializing in weight loss and chronic health problems. There are many different anti-depressants and a good psychiatrist has much more extensive knowledge of the various drugs than your GP, and can help you find the right med at the right dose more quickly. There are other therapies beyond meds as well, but you need to see a specialist quickly. Talk therapy will also speed your recovery from depression, so you need to get on that, ideally with a therapist specializing in your issues. Cognitive therapy--turning around negative thoughts and ideas--is an especially good approach, producing better results in a shorter time than traditional therapies.

The fact that some days you are not eating anything is contributing to your lack of energy and to your depression. You have to eat, whether you want to or not. It's just not optional. Just make up your mind and EAT. Even though your dietician would prefer you to start solid foods, the hell with that. Right now you need to get your daily Protein through Protein drinks and any healthy way you can. The Protein is KEY to your body healing and rebuilding your strength.

Yes, the depression will pass. Much of it is due to the hormonal changes many of us feel post op. But you need to get the psychological assistance you need now to get the turnaround underway without delay. I'm sorry your partner is not being helpful, but at this point you need to stop worrying what he/she is doing or not doing and just focus on yourself. Put the relationship issues aside and do what you need to do to take care of yourself in the present moment. First, take good care of yourself. Then when you are feeling stronger and well again, you will be in a much better position to determine whether the relationship works for you, and if so, how to fix it.

Take care and be kind to yourself!

[oldoneyoungagain 200]

When it comes to energy, carbs will always be king. On a normal diet, about 60% of your energy needs are met with carbs. But, when you're on a low carb diet, Protein is your body's best friend. In the absence of sufficient carbs, your body will use Protein as its primary source of energy. So, no carbs, no protein = no energy.

There is no doubt that "whole" foods are always the best source of protein (or any other nutrient). But that can be extremely difficult if not down right impossible for several months following surgery. I am not a doctor. Or a nutritionist. But if the choice comes down to protein supplements or no protein at all, I would go for the shakes/powders/bars/soups/puddings in a heartbeat. Without hesitation. And I believe the majority of doctors would agree.

Protein is not only important for energy. Every single one of the one trillion cells in your body contains protein. Protein helps to build and repair body tissues including skin, muscle and major organs. Without sufficient protein, healing can be slowed. Protein is used extensively by the body in defending against bacterial and viral infections. Rapid weight loss will always result in some loss of muscle mass. Protein will help minimize that lean muscle loss. It will also reduce hair loss. And these are just some of the benefits of protein.

Consider giving protein a very high priority in your journey. There are very good reasons why virtually all doctors recommend their patients get at least 60g of protein per day. Follow their recommendation. You'll be glad you did and your body will thank you.

Depression is quite common following RnY. You've had a major surgery. Hormones are going wild. But it does pass and before you know it, you'll be back on your game. Stay positive. Stay patient. Stay focused on following the protocol as closely to the letter as you possibly can. And last but not least, maintain a food log.

You're gonna love the new you!!

So well said DL and that food log is totally great on myfitnesspal.com since it calculates everthing. I love it and it doesn't leave me guessing, a tool that tells me what more I have to do. Thanks for the imput.

[Mid West 99]

Hi Lucii. I'm in the UK too. I buy Boosh shakes www.boosh.com who are also in the UK. Their shakes are really nice and have 14g of Protein and 150 cals. Best I've found. If you use milk instead of Water they are 250 cals plus whatever protein is in the milk. My team would now prefer me to get my protein from food but I have one of these for Breakfast and another at night if I need some more protein. My faves are the vanilla and the chocolate but they do lots of flavours. Hope you're ok honey. Lx

[Tizzielish 21]

Maybe you should consider finding another nutritionist. I have prepared to bariatric surgery three times, including this time -- I am definitely doing it this time, just have a couple insurance hoops and I jump thru the last hoop on Nov 7 and then I'll get a surgery date.

But I have been to lots of nutrition classes -- required by the different surgery centers -- and met many nutritionists -- and this is the first time I heard a nutritionist tell a newly post op not to use Protein shakes. I suspesct that it a bias of your nutritionist and not a science-based piece of advice. Like DLCoggin said: you need Protein and this post op period doesn't last forever.

There is a wide range in quality of Protein powder and shakes.< /p>

My goodness, I don't think I could get enough protein in my egg-size stomach post-op if I had to eat only eggs, meat, fish.

Some proteinpowders are loaded with bad chemicals, poor sugars or sugar substitutes and many are against all Protein Powder. I use 100% organic usda certified whole whey protein and you can add to the natural flavor to anything and get in a lot of protein with every swallow. 100% whole whey protein organic is good for everyone.

And the post op phase doesn't last.

In Seattle and now in East Bay of San Francisco Bay area, every bariatric medical person I have talked to says only liquids for first couple weeks -- how the heck can you get any protein in if you are on all liquid? I expect I will want to stay on Liquid Protein longer than they advise because I will be anxious about how my stomach will handle real food.

Your nutritionist has good intentions but it seems to me she has a bias about protein supplements. At least ask her for her philosophy or ask your doc.

And if you are suicidal, as others have said, get some help.

And hang in. It gets better. I know it because everything always does.

[Mid West 99]

Tizzilish, what powder do you use? I've been looking for one to add to food rather than drinking as a shake. We probably won't have it over here but I can try and get it imported. Thanks.

[Mid West 99]

Lucii, I don't know anyone else in the UK who's had a bypass. We're at other ends of the country so meeting up would be difficult. But if you want to be RNY buddies long distance, message me :-)

[Tizzielish 21]

I use raw 100% whole organic whey, natural flavor. It's expensive. I swear here in USA someone has cornerd the market. About a year ago, I could buy it bulk for $17 a pound and now it is hard to find at $36 a pound and the businesses who sell it online (no local stores can get it in bulk -- I even talked to the wholesaler who supplies the whole western half of USA and was told no one can find it anywhere -- I am sure someone saw it was getting popular and bought it up. Here in the states, and perhaps everywhere but all I know is herre, people can sell future crops and food products and I have a hunch someone has been buying whey as a commodity and cornering the market. IT happened very quickly, being widely available to being hard to find.

It is very easy to buy whey isolate but almost always loaded with chemicals, including soy lecithin. They say the soy lecithin makes the powder easier to mix but that's baloney, at least if you use a mini single serving blender like I do. I bought a $25 single serving blender that uses an actual bottle on the blender, blending with bottle upside down and then you put on the lid and can take your bottle and sip sip sip away all morning. Look at the list of chemicals. And one thing many don't know: most 'added vitamins' are made with lots of harsh chemicals and aren't nearly as good for you as the marketing words on the package claim.

A guy on this forum, who works here, says whey isolate is just fine. To make whey isolate, they denude the whey of much of its nutrition. AS the guy pointed out, Gibbons, I think is his name, the denuding process strips out fats but it is a mistake to think one can be healthy with no fat. There are good fats and our bodies need them. The Proteins in whole whey are good fats and good for you and you don't eat mass quantities of the stuff.

Besides, here in USA, I have yet to find an organic whey isolate and I insist on organic. I am not actually an organic fanatic. But when I see unrecognizable words in the ingredients list, which you always see on whey isoalte packaging, I dn't buy it -- those are chemicals and we don't know enough about how they affect our bodies. The food processors put them in cause they are cheap but they still get to charge top dollar as if you were getting the pure whey.

You said UK Sleever that you are in UK. I bet you can find 100% certified organic whole whey, natural flavor. With natural flavor whey, you can make anything: add a few frozen strawberries, or chocolate --I use raw as much as possible, esp. with whey and chocolate - processing food denudes nutrients virtually always in all foods and I no longer eat any processed food -- I got fat eating government subsidized cheap processed foods as an ordinary American diet and I am not eating processed food again.

Chocolate, cinnamon, ginger, tumeric (not so tasty in a shake but the #1 medicine in ayurvedic medicine for diabetics, which is one of my comorbidities) -- you can add frozen blueberries, or raspberries or a scoop of Peanut Butter. Blend it a few seconds. The frozen fruit gives the shake an almost ice cream texture. I often add one half frozen banana - and now, to me, it is like a milkshake. Mostly I do chocolate shakes, not always frozen bananas, not always Peanut Butter. I'll go on a jag of berries. My freezer always has frozen berries.

A frozen berry tip: let the frozen berries sit out for 20 minutes before you blend them with the whey. Frozen, you don't always taste their great flavor but if you half thaw them you get the frothy effect of the frozen and you taste the great berry.< /p>

I add organic stevia to my shakes: no calories, no carbohdrates. I don't think it will be a problem post op cause it is nothing like sugar but I'll find out, won't I?

You must have some websites similar to Amazon that sell everything these days. I buy most of my supplements and Protein on amazon which usually has best prices but I always check.

Since the organic whole whey market has been in such flux, I change companies as needed. A company I have bought from before might become unable to get new product -- someone has cornered the market, I am sure of it.

I am sure someone sells 100% certified organic whole whey.

Health food stores all sell lots of Protein powders. If you don't insist on organic and natural flavor (if you buy chocolate flavored, you are paying the same for that chocolate as you pay for the whey --- think about it, a one pound container of 'whey' loaded with artificial sweeteners -- none of them are good for you but stevia, imho -- and with flavors -- you are paying $35 a pound for the chocolate and the sweetener. But if you buy only whey powder and add your own stuff it is way cheaper.

I started my Protein Powder journey about six years ago, drinking one before my daily one hour lap swim. I cringe now to think of the chemical laden stuff I used to bithely devour. My boyfriend got into protein powder and he figured out natural whole whey was best and that I could add any flavor I want and make whatever I want.

Plus with natural flavor, you can add protein powder to things like oatmeal, muffins (there are lots of recipes for high protein Snacks that actually use protein powder, and gluten-free, almost-carb-free flour like almond flour or coconut flour.

And my guy gave me the idea to use unsweetened coconut milk for my Protein Shakes -- the cocomilk has health fats, low calories, almost no carbs. Coconut is almost a miracle health food. The coconut milk took my Protein Shakes to a whole new level.

NOw I make cream of mushroom Soup -- with coconut milk! Or butternut squash Soup with coconut milk. I drink my own blend of chai with coconut milk as a special treat -- with stevia. I use maybe 1/4 cup cocomilk so it is very low calorie. It took me about two days to adjsut. For years, I resisted alternatives to cow milk even as my best friend lived off almond.

Here's a great low calories healthy treat: coconut milk, chocolate powder and stevia to sweeten: hot chocolate. I don't know when I will be able to drink that post op but I will and it is super healthy. Many don't realize that chocolate is very very good for us -- it's the sugar that is usually added to it that isn't.

Long answer.

Short answer: google, or whatever search engine you use, for 100% raw organic whey, not whey isoalte. I am sure someone sells it where you live. I have only been trying to use raw for about a year and I don't do pure raw and I am not going to -- it is a ton of work to eat all raw. But why raw? Because processing food denudes it of some nutrition and I want every calories I put into my body to count.

Last year, eating protein shakes, protein and low carb vegies, I went from 267 to 216 -- no surgery. Then my endocrinologist tested me and decided I was Type I -- without changing my diet, suddenly I was using a lot more insulin and in 6 weeks regained 30 pounds. When I was at 216, I decided I wouldn't do the surgery, that's I'd just keep eating the post surgery way. If I had done it for a year already, I reasoned, why not. But that was before the insulin changed my life.

When I complained to my endocrinologist, he shrugged and said 'everyone knows insulin makes a person gain" as if my morbid obesity was irrelevant, that all he cared about was my diabetes.

I tend to run on, as you can see.

If you can't afford 100% raw whey, buy what you can. I used highly processed protein powder loaded with chemicals for over a year -- I lost a lot of weight, so if that is your goal, weight loss, any protein powder will do. I am interested in maximizing the nutritional value of what I eat -- not just as weight loss but to be healthy as I keep aging. I am 60. I want to remain healthy. Aging will take its toll but I don't have to enable poor health by eating chemicalized and highly processed food.

But if you can only afford processed whey, go for it. Whey is spposed to be the easier to digest. I jsut got some raw vegan protein and I'll use it up -- and, ugh, I bought 2.2 pounds -- but I feel bloated all day after drinking it. It tastes about the same as the whey in a natural flavor -- natural flavor is no flavor so no flavor vegan or no flavor whey is about the same. But I don't like the way I feel. The whey, for me, definitely digests better.

Keep in mind: all my talk is before surgery.

There are women in my support groups offered through my surgery center who eat food I have never eaten, highly processed junk, even after surgery. By highly processed hunk, I mean they consider Carnation's Instant Breakfast to be a Protein Drink. I guess it is but it is full of chemicals, not a lot of protein and not for me. And lots of folks buy canned Soups but canned Soups are almost always high sodium and also have chemicals. It is so easy to make soups. I stew a chicken, debone it, put the chicken back and dump in a pound or more of kale or spinach. With lots of seasonings, it is super yummy, densely nutritious, very low calories. During the puree post op phase, I'll make the same soup and puree it in my Vitamix blender. And when I go into surgery, my fridge is going to be stocked with my homemade chicken broth. Again, look at the ingredient list of packaged chicken broth.< /p>

Nobody really knows why so many humans are obese these days but I am convinced it is the poor quality of processed foods. Just by gradually improving what I eat I have already gone down from all time high of 330 to, today, 240 (alas, I was down to 216 a year ago and the insulin nightmare began).

I do run on.

[maria pepe 29]

My surgery was 4/2012. The ONLY thing I count is grams of Protein. I still use the shakes...ungery...for Breakfast. It is the only way I get breakfast. It also give me 8 oz of Fluid and 1/2 my protien requirement for the day. Tada! The biggest thing that helps me feel energetic and less depressed is increased Vitamin D. My GP runs a full blood panel...focusing on iron...D...Bs. Remember the days are getting shorter. Stay hydrated! So important for everything. Get with your gp to run your blood work and work with your nutritionist. Journal your food. One of the biggest helps has been support group. If your surgeon/program offers it take advantage of it. Ups and downs are normal. some of the changes are scary. Some fun. Some exciting. Having to try on pants with no w after the size freaked me out!! That was 3 sizes ago. Seek help if you need it.

[DLCoggin 1,788]

"A guy on this forum, who works here, says whey isolate is just fine. To make whey isolate, they denude the whey of much of its nutrition. AS the guy pointed out, Gibbons, I think is his name, the denuding process strips out fats but it is a mistake to think one can be healthy with no fat. There are good fats and our bodies need them. The Proteins in whole whey are good fats and good for you and you don't eat mass quantities of the stuff."

I'm pretty sure that guy did not say or imply that "one can be healthy with no fat". I seem to recall that he indicated that fats, along with Protein and carbs, are all "macronutrients" meaning that they are all three required in relatively large quantities. Whey isolate is not a source of healthy fats. But I don't recall him suggesting that anyone should limit their diet exclusively to whey isolate. There are many sources for healthy fats. I believe that he indicated that whey isolate is an excellent source of highly digestible and exceptionally high Protein content.

Not familiar with the term "denuded" but protein can be "denatured" using either heat or acid. Whey isolate is produced by a filtering process (as the guy mentioned) and is not denatured. Denaturing actually changes the molecular structure of Proteins effectively making them smaller in size. The result is that they pass very, very quickly through the walls of the intestine and into the bloodstream. Denatured proteins are sometimes the protein of choice for body builders but they are very expensive and seldom used or recommended for bariatric patients.

As I recall, the guy that made that post indicated that he is not vegan or vegetarian but has friends and family that are and he has great respect for those who make that choice. I also think he favors organic, but does not exclude other options.

And just for the record, that guy's name is DLCoggin but some folks just call him Dave.

You're gonna love the new you!!

[DLCoggin 1,788]

Some folks have expressed curiosity and/or interest in the original post. You can find it at http://www.rnytalk.com/topic/14547-garden-of-life/ .

You guys have a great day!