Enabling addictions

[gamergirl 4,610]

You know what I don’t understand? We all get that you can’t urge an alcoholic to have just one drink. We wouldn’t dream of doing that.

But we routinely urge self-confessed bingers, sugar-carb addicts, grazers, and cheaters to “go ahead!” because “I do that and it doesn’t hurt me”.

Well maybe YOU can, but whoever posted in a panic about it clearly thinks they can’t control it and are panicked about falling off the wagon. That’s WHY they’re posting, right??

So why do we do that? Why do we tell bingers it’s okay to overeat once in a while? And that cheating on a pre-op is okay? Or that everyone should be eating everything in moderation including junk when the person is clearly saying “I’m trying not to eat junk?”

I’m not trying to be confrontational, I’m really intrigued as to why we don't see this an enabling behavior.

Thoughts?

[JessicaAnn 564]

You know what I don’t understand? We all get that you can’t urge an alcoholic to have just one drink. We wouldn’t dream of doing that. But we routinely urge self-confessed bingers' date=' sugar-carb addicts, grazers, and cheaters to “go ahead!” because “I do that and it doesn’t hurt me”. Well maybe YOU can, but whoever posted in a panic about it clearly thinks they can’t control it and are panicked about falling off the wagon. That’s WHY they’re posting, right?? So why do we do that? Why do we tell bingers it’s okay to overeat once in a while? And that cheating on a pre-op is okay? Or that everyone should be eating everything in moderation including junk when the person is clearly saying “I’m trying not to eat junk?” I’m not trying to be confrontational, I’m really intrigued as to why we don't see this an enabling behavior. Thoughts?[/quote']i think that everyone is different. I personally can have 1 bite of something and that's it. Some people take one bite, and it triggers more and more cravings. While I don't necessarily think it's ok to "binge" or "cheat", I think that if it does happen the only thing to do is brush yourself off and move on. dwelling on "cheats" won't change them. But as far as purposely binging or cheating, it depends on the individual. For my birthday, I ate one bite of cheesecake and was completely satisfied without wanting more.. others can't do that so they shouldn't put themselves in the situation to begin with.

Edit- at no time do I think binging or over eating is a good idea. But "cheating" depends on the person. Unless it's on pre op diet, or post op diet during the healing process. Then, that could be dangerous.

[No game 14,437]

Some people plain and simple don't believe in food addiction... And some feel that they do not have an addiction to food.

And some feel comfort in pushing food (or moderation) on others because it makes them feel better about eating it too.

Whatcha think?

[gamergirl 4,610]

Some people plain and simple don't believe in food addiction... And some feel that they do not have an addiction to food.< /p>

And some feel comfort in pushing food (or moderation) on others because it makes them feel better about eating it too.

Whatcha think?

I think we may all believe that SOME people can be addicted to food, but maybe we don't believe WE are addicted to food And really the addiction to food comes in various forms too. It's not all one flavor, pardon the pun. So it's easy to think we don't have it because "she says she binges. I never binged! I am not like her". Too easy to justify.

I do believe some of that the "it's okay to cheat" posts are rationalizing their own behavior. I just worry because there are newbies on here, who are struggling to do what's right. People like me, who want to be thoughtful about how we approach this and want to maximize our success.

It worries me when someone says I feel horrible about what I did..and we say, oh that's okay! We don't know that it's okay for that person. We just know it would be okay for US.

[gamergirl 4,610]

i think that everyone is different. I personally can have 1 bite of something and that's it. Some people take one bite, and it triggers more and more cravings. While I don't necessarily think it's ok to "binge" or "cheat", I think that if it does happen the only thing to do is brush yourself off and move on. dwelling on "cheats" won't change them. But as far as purposely binging or cheating, it depends on the individual. For my birthday, I ate one bite of cheesecake and was completely satisfied without wanting more.. others can't do that so they shouldn't put themselves in the situation to begin with.

Edit- at no time do I think binging or over eating is a good idea. But "cheating" depends on the person. Unless it's on pre op diet, or post op diet during the healing process. Then, that could be dangerous.

I definitely agree with you on the fact that if it does happen, brush yourself off and move forward. I really appreciate when people provide that feedback. That seems supportive without telling the person it was no big deal. We don't know what's a big deal for a person.

All we know is that we ALL have some form of bad relationship with food, and if someone says it's a problem, we should trust that they know it's a problem.

I also like that you distinguish between you, who can have a bite of cheesecake, but at the same time, you realize that not every one can. And that's the heart of what I am saying.

Our journeys are different. What's no big deal to you may be a big deal to me so if I say it's a big deal, then maybe just trust me that it is a big deal for me.

I may be rambling now

[ReDbEaN 654]

You know what I don’t understand? We all get that you can’t urge an alcoholic to have just one drink. We wouldn’t dream of doing that.

But we routinely urge self-confessed bingers, sugar-carb addicts, grazers, and cheaters to “go ahead!” because “I do that and it doesn’t hurt me”.

Well maybe YOU can, but whoever posted in a panic about it clearly thinks they can’t control it and are panicked about falling off the wagon. That’s WHY they’re posting, right??

So why do we do that? Why do we tell bingers it’s okay to overeat once in a while? And that cheating on a pre-op is okay? Or that everyone should be eating everything in moderation including junk when the person is clearly saying “I’m trying not to eat junk?”

I’m not trying to be confrontational, I’m really intrigued as to why we don't see this an enabling behavior.

Thoughts?

I never thought of it like you said...I hope I would never "enable" anyone:(

[gamergirl 4,610]

I never thought of it like you said...I hope I would never "enable" anyone:(

I think we all try to walk that thin line between being supportive but not enabling. It's not crystal clear, especially in a format like this internet forum where we don't really know everyone's histories, right? it's confusing. But I'm sure you would never do it deliberately

[No game 14,437]

I started a thread about food addiction back in the day... It was called "big fat people"

Catchy title huh?

I really wanted to get this whole food addiction thing and why some fat people had it and others did not...

I think yes some of it is what people believe an addiction is. I really think that we all have some disordered eating, it's how we all got extra large.

But others truly believe its just hunger...

We are all so similar in so many ways, but at the same time we are oceans apart sometimes on our thoughts, theories, philosophies ???

[RJ'S/beginning 5,358]

I do believe I am a food addict...I was and will be for the rest of my life....I do not agree in binging or grazing or out of control eating....

I do however do not look at this tool and program as a diet...I failed all those diets before and had the sleeve to help me deal with the reasons why I got to this point.

These are real people looking for real answers..Answers that are not always that simple to give....I eat everything!! I hardly ever eat refined sugar..No chips, candy or fries...But I look at food now as a way to live...not the way to deal with my issues...

This is a life long adventure or journey whichever you want to call it....And we need to be real..At first we all have extreme zeal and it shows by some of the way we answer that questions on here.....Then we start to see the giant picture that this is our life now and we live in the real world...That all diets did not work for us and so we need to modify how we handle our addiction.

Personally I believe that there is a place for most foods in my life....I do try to stay balanced and watch my intake and listen to my sleeve...

I thought when I was done that I would get through this with no issues at all...Life is not like that it is full of twists and turns and we have to be ready for them....So I do believe in balance....

[gamergirl 4,610]

I do believe I am a food addict...I was and will be for the rest of my life....I do not agree in binging or grazing or out of control eating....

I do however do not look at this tool and program as a diet...I failed all those diets before and had the sleeve to help me deal with the reasons why I got to this point.

These are real people looking for real answers..Answers that are not always that simple to give....I eat everything!! I hardly ever eat refined sugar..No chips, candy or fries...But I look at food now as a way to live...not the way to deal with my issues...

This is a life long adventure or journey whichever you want to call it....And we need to be real..At first we all have extreme zeal and it shows by some of the way we answer that questions on here.....Then we start to see the giant picture that this is our life now and we live in the real world...That all diets did not work for us and so we need to modify how we handle our addiction.

Personally I believe that there is a place for most foods in my life....I do try to stay balanced and watch my intake and listen to my sleeve...

I thought when I was done that I would get through this with no issues at all...Life is not like that it is full of twists and turns and we have to be ready for them....So I do believe in balance....

I've read your posts on this a lot and always appreciated them. I do think that while you believe in balance, you seem to also believe in making smart choices for the most part. As you said above and as you've said before, it's not like you're out there not eating your Protein or eating refined sugar, fries, chips and cake. But you have some once in a while and it's not the end of the world for you.

I think there are some of us who may never be able to have "just a little" of certain things. I am very afraid that I will always be a sugar addict. I don't know what my new tummy will like, but I don't plan to test the sugar addiction anytime soon because I honestly was addicted to sugar before. I ate very healthy meals, lots of veggies, great Portion Control, but oh the sugar after meals! That's what made both my husband and me fat.

So I think if you said, hey I had some cake yesterday and I'm eating chicken today, we'd all say Yay! cake! But if I say I had some cake and now I'm wanting a pie and a reese's Peanut Butter cup, maybe we shouldn't say Yay! cake!

[gamergirl 4,610]

I started a thread about food addiction back in the day... It was called "big fat people"

Catchy title huh?

I really wanted to get this whole food addiction thing and why some fat people had it and others did not...

I think yes some of it is what people believe an addiction is. I really think that we all have some disordered eating, it's how we all got extra large.

But others truly believe its just hunger...

We are all so similar in so many ways, but at the same time we are oceans apart sometimes on our thoughts, theories, philosophies ???

There are people who go to AA but don't believe they are addicts. This may be the same thing. Accepting you had/have an addiction is not an easy thing. I think the vets are faster to acknowledge that than newbies.

I know I will happily confess to being addicted to sugar, but I myself am not to the point where I feel like I was addicted to food in many ways. just sugar!

Ask me again in 3 months.

[RJ'S/beginning 5,358]

I've read your posts on this a lot and always appreciated them. I do think that while you believe in balance, you seem to also believe in making smart choices for the most part. As you said above and as you've said before, it's not like you're out there not eating your Protein or eating refined sugar, fries, chips and cake. But you have some once in a while and it's not the end of the world for you.

I think there are some of us who may never be able to have "just a little" of certain things. I am very afraid that I will always be a sugar addict. I don't know what my new tummy will like, but I don't plan to test the sugar addiction anytime soon because I honestly was addicted to sugar before. I ate very healthy meals, lots of veggies, great Portion Control, but oh the sugar after meals! That's what made both my husband and me fat.

So I think if you said, hey I had some cake yesterday and I'm eating chicken today, we'd all say Yay! cake! But if I say I had some cake and now I'm wanting a pie and a reese's Peanut Butter cup, maybe we shouldn't say Yay! cake!

As I work to rebuild myself I push the limits to see how I will react to the food that took up all my thoughts and time before I had this surgery.....

The other day my friend ate a huge ice cream cone in from of me while I ate a half of an apple....the whole time I thought you think I am the one suffering but it is your hips that ice cream is going to be on...I was excited to eat the freshly picked apple.....

Still there are times that I would love to have a small ice cream and I don't because I have not tried to see if it is a trigger food for me...I know that Pasta is, and so is squares....I have searched long and hard to find tiny Pasta so that in my mind it looks like I am having some pasta...Squares...have not even gone there at all yet..Still don't feel strong enough to try that..But I will..

I want to be able to go out to dinner at someones home and eat what they eat without making a big deal about how much I eat......So a little bit of what ever has worked for me so far....I am 11 months out and most of the time I can take it or leave it when it comes to the trigger foods for me.....

That does not mean that I think it is okay for someone, anyone to binge and lose control...The whole point is to gain control of this life long addiction and work on it...Probably for the rest of my life....

I would never say that what you are doing is wrong. But there will come a time when you will have to face the demons like everyone else and put the addiction in its place.....

I always feel so good when I walk away and don't eat something that I know is a bad choice like junk food...But it does not happen all the time...I am human and so are you......This gives us the chance to test our limits and learn what makes these things our trigger points...How it makes you feel, why you reach for them. Why you get such gratification out of this item of food....You have to break down into pieces the why's hows and whens and it will never effect you the same way again...You will have the power, you will have won over that small part of the food addiction....

[southernsoul 773]

I have caught a lot of flack several times for saying that I do not believe I have a food addiction. As a soon-to-be-licensed therapist, I define addiction according to the DSM psychiatric criteria. I definitely believe that food addictions exist, but I also know I don't meet the criteria that define a disorder. Lack of discipline was more my problem, and that's different from an actual addiction. With the sleeve, I have the assistance I need with Portion Control. I basically eat what I want, I get my Protein every day, and I don't have cravings for carbs. If I do enjoy the occasional something sweet or carby, it's just a very small amount & I've been satisfied with that so far. When I have wanted something sweet, I've made an effort to make it a "smart sweet", like fruit, or a low carb/high Protein ice cream substitute or cookie. I believe in moderation and balance, but I don't eat a lot of junk. I also acknowledge that I only really know my own experience, and that my approach would not work for everybody. As with everything in life, we each have to find our own path.

But to answer the original question, maybe it's just that anybody with issues in a certain area (be they true addictions or not), are likely to enable other "users". Smokers minimize the slips of those trying to quit, drinkers can minimize the slips of alcoholics, and people with food issues are very likely to minimize the slips of others with food issues. In all areas of substance abuse, most enablers don't generally see their behavior as enabling...they think they're trying to be nice, or supportive, or understanding, or just patient. And if the enabler also partakes in the substance or behavior, then it's even harder to get them to stop enabling the addict.

[gamergirl 4,610]

I would never say that what you are doing is wrong. But there will come a time when you will have to face the demons like everyone else and put the addiction in its place..... I always feel so good when I walk away and don't eat something that I know is a bad choice like junk food...But it does not happen all the time...I am human and so are you......This gives us the chance to test our limits and learn what makes these things our trigger points...How it makes you feel' date=' why you reach for them. Why you get such gratification out of this item of food....You have to break down into pieces the why's hows and whens and it will never effect you the same way again...You will have the power, you will have won over that small part of the food addiction.... [/quote']

I want to get to the point where I feel more in control before I fight the demons. In my head, somehow I think if I can just go 6 months without, then I'll be ready to brave them. Why 6 months? Who knows, it sounds good.

My old eating habits were only 13 weeks ago. It's still raw, and fresh and recent and scary. But you make an excellent point and one that I agree with. That some day, I have to control the addiction, not the other way around. I will have to face it and trust that if it turns out to be a trigger, that I can fight and win. Right now, I am not there yet. Working on it though

[gamergirl 4,610]

I have caught a lot of flack several times for saying that I do not believe I have a food addiction. As a soon-to-be-licensed therapist' date=' I define addiction according to the DSM psychiatric criteria. I definitely believe that food addictions exist, but I also know I don't meet the criteria that define a disorder. Lack of discipline was more my problem, and that's different from an actual addiction. With the sleeve, I have the assistance I need with Portion Control. I basically eat what I want, I get my Protein every day, and I don't have cravings for carbs. If I do enjoy the occasional something sweet or carby, it's just a very small amount & I've been satisfied with that so far. When I have wanted something sweet, I've made an effort to make it a "smart sweet", like fruit, or a low carb/high Protein ice cream substitute or cookie. I believe in moderation and balance, but I don't eat a lot of junk. I also acknowledge that I only really know my own experience, and that my approach would not work for everybody. As with everything in life, we each have to find our own path. [/quote']

So if I remember my DSM, we're talking tolerance, withdrawal, losing control over quantities, trying to cut down but failing, continuing to use despite physical or psychological harm, and withdrawing from normal activities. Yes? Close? I don't remember now many yeses to qualify.

Tolerance and withdrawal don't work for food so let's reject those. I lost control over quantities of sugar. I tried to cut down on my own and failed. I continued to eat it despite physical harm. Curious if you think we would not all answer yes to these questions?