Anti-Semitism In France!

[Carlene 12]

No! Same wrong conclusion!! To go to Heaven you don't have to do anything but accept God's free gift of salvation through Jesus who died for your sins. He did it all!! PERIOD! Your good works have nothing to do with you going to Heaven!

I don't understand, then. You said earlier that if a person is truly saved, he/she will perform good works. You used my own example (my father) as a person NOT saved because he did not "follow thru" after accepting Christ. Now you're saying that's totally unnecessary?

[wavydaby 1]

But, Ron, they do, its a matter of getting up and doing your faith or just sitting on your tush.

Because I am saved, I want to do good works. But want is not enough, I still must do them.

We still must hold up our bargan to the Lord.

What the good work is that I do, is defined by the Lord and I.

Spell out for me the other side where you would not be doing good works, but still be saved. Is the fact that I am mearly breathing doing God's good works?

[Ron Cusano 0]

I have never seen where it was written that creation by God was done in one day.

If we believe that the Bible is inspired by God, then we also have to believe that God handed it down to us accurately, since God is perfect and does not make mistakes. Yes it was written doen by men, but these men were under control of the Holy Spirit of God.

Jesus said to "search the scriptures" and that the scriptures were "good for doctrine and reproof"! Do you think Jesus would instruct us to use an imperfect testimony as the basis and foundation of our faith?

If you can't trust the accuracy of the Bible, then you cannot know who Jesus was and what He did!! It is his testimony!!

In the Bible God say's what He means and means what He says. If you can't accept the literal meaning of the Word of God, there is nothing on which to base the Christian faith except tradation, opinion and feelings, all of which mean nothing.

Opps, I forgot a Point 6 in my rambles

Since translation is an art and not an exact science, I can not take the bible literally.

I can take the bible literally for the point is trying to make however.

And again, in Genesis, it says God created the heavens and earth and all in it in 6 days... later in there it says 1 day.

Do I care howmany days that God took to create us? Nope, not one bit, cause I don't think God has a 24 hr day anyway. Time has no meaning to Him. Do I care that he did create us, you betcha!

Do I think its a sin that I dont care howmany days he took, no.

Are there more examples where I dont take it literally, but only the jist of the text? Yes.

I still say that one can not take the WHOLE bible literally, parts, yes.

Inspired by God, written by Man.

[Ron Cusano 0]

All true! But it is not the good works that brings salvation. That what was Jesus was here for.,

But, Ron, they do, its a matter of getting up and doing your faith or just sitting on your tush.

Because I am saved, I want to do good works. But want is not enough, I still must do them.

We still must hold up our bargan to the Lord.

What the good work is that I do, is defined by the Lord and I.

Spell out for me the other side where you would not be doing good works, but still be saved. Is the fact that I am mearly breathing doing God's good works?

[wavydaby 1]

Bjean, I know why GB's name keeps popping up, i just wish it didnt.

[Carlene 12]

In the Bible God say's what He means and means what He says. If you can't accept the literal meaning of the Word of God, there is nothing on which to base the Christian faith except tradation, opinion and feelings, all of which mean nothing.

Hey, I quoted literal passages from the Word of God and YOU said they didn't count because I had taken them "out of context". No, no, no.....Ronnie. You can't have it both ways.

[Ron Cusano 0]

You are twisting things and I hope not purposely. It is not that he was not saved because he did not change and do good works, he did not change and do goos works probally because he was not really saved! There is a big, big difference that you are not seeing here.

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I don't understand, then. You said earlier that if a person is truly saved, he/she will perform good works. You used my own example (my father) as a person NOT saved because he did not "follow thru" after accepting Christ. Now you're saying that's totally unnecessary?

[lisah25 3]

You are twisting things and I hope not purposely. It is not that he was not saved because he did not change and do good works, he did not change and do goos works probally because he was not really saved! There is a big, big difference that you are not seeing here.

So, you are saying, if I'm understanding, that while good works aren't going to save or not save anyone, anyone who is saved will do them. That it's an outward sign of having been saved, a "side-effect" of sorts?

[Ron Cusano 0]

You took offence whan I called you Charlene, but now you call me "Ronnie" and the other day "be a good boy"! That's a little condesending isn't it.

Everything in the Word of God is literal in the proper context, unless that context clearly indicates otherwise. Because you apparently don't have a grasp on the consistancy of all of scripture you insist on picking and choosing passages completely out of context and/or without understand their place in God's plan, and trying to make a case for it.

Hey, I quoted literal passages from the Word of God and YOU said they didn't count because I had taken them "out of context". No, no, no.....Ronnie. You can't have it both ways.

[Carlene 12]

You are twisting things and I hope not purposely. It is not that he was not saved because he did not change and do good works, he did not change and do goos works probally because he was not really saved! There is a big, big difference that you are not seeing here.

You're right about that. First you said "once saved, always saved". Then you said it's a gradual process....first you have a "salvation experience", and that leads you to do good works. My dad, according to his sister, had a "salvation experience". So you're saying what now....that it wasn't a valid save? Would that be from the get-go, or did it slowly ebb away, like air leaking out of a tire? If we are really saved, we keep performing good works, and if we stop performing good works, it means we were never really saved in the first place. Is that it?

[Carlene 12]

You took offence whan I called you Charlene, but now you call me "Ronnie" and the other day "be a good boy"! That's a little condesending isn't it.

Everything in the Word of God is literal in the proper context, unless that context clearly indicates otherwise. Because you apparently don't have a grasp on the consistancy of all of scripture you insist on picking and choosing passages completely out of context and/or without understand their place in God's plan, and trying to make a case for it.

I asked you not to call me "Charlene" because it's not my name, or a diminutive of my name. There is no "h" in Carlene. Had you addressed me as "Carly" I would not have taken offense. Ronnie was good enough for President Reagan, so I thought you might even be flattered. Sorry for the implied intimacy, Mr. Cusano.

Perhaps you would be so kind as to explain to us the "proper context" of the scriptures I quoted regarding slavery, a woman's "place", divorce, etc.

[wavydaby 1]

All true! But it is not the good works that brings salvation. That what was Jesus was here for.,

Yes, salvation brings the good works, but what good is it for the rest of mankind if salvation did not bring out the good works in mankind?

I believe at 12, (I think thats what Carlene said) her father did take God in to his heart, and he was saved. But it was proved that he stopped doing Godly works. Was he or was he not stripped of his salvation?

How is it then that you can say that you dont have to do good works and be accepted by God? Is it that you dont do good works OR bad works? You mearly are lawful neutral and are saved alone??

That I do not buy

[Ron Cusano 0]

Carlene,

I never said salvation was a gradual process. I said a changed life was a gradual process. You keep twisting everything I say and putting words in my mouth to make points that are not accurate.

The only one who know who had a real salvation experience is God who knows out hearts. Certainly not your sister or me. You keep playing these childish word games instead of considering weather they are valid or not.

Again, for the upteenth time, good works are a sign of a changed life through the salvation experience. Good works do not bring about a salvation experience. I can't make it any plainer than that.

You're right about that. First you said "once saved, always saved". Then you said it's a gradual process....first you have a "salvation experience", and that leads you to do good works. My dad, according to his sister, had a "salvation experience". So you're saying what now....that it wasn't a valid save? Would that be from the get-go, or did it slowly ebb away, like air leaking out of a tire? If we are really saved, we keep performing good works, and if we stop performing good works, it means we were never really saved in the first place. Is that it?

[Carlene 12]

This probably belongs on a separate thread, but I'd hate to open up yet another can of theological worms.

My granddaughter lives with me. Last Saturday we had a dust storm like I've never seen (except in Arizona and West Texas). They closed D/FW airport and cancelled 564 flights. Two of my granddaughter's school chums were walking down a busy thoroughfare during the peak of the storm and were struck by a car. One girl will recover; the other will not. She is on life support only until her organs are harvested for transplant.

Here's the question, for all you theologians. "Kate" is 14 and has never been "churched". Will she go to heaven? That was the question Cheyenne asked me this morning, on the ride to school.

Let me add that Kate was known for her gentle spirit and her kind ways.

[Ron Cusano 0]

I don't know for a fact weather her father did or did not get saved. All I know is, based upon what she said, her father did not display a changed life, which makes his salvation questionable.

We are expected to have changed lives and do good works when we are saved, but it is Jesus and Him alone that brings salvation. Once you are saved and have the Holy Spirit of God indwelling you, you cannot lose it.

Yes, salvation brings the good works, but what good is it for the rest of mankind if salvation did not bring out the good works in mankind?

I believe at 12, (I think thats what Carlene said) her father did take God in to his heart, and he was saved. But it was proved that he stopped doing Godly works. Was he or was he not stripped of his salvation?

How is it then that you can say that you dont have to do good works and be accepted by God? Is it that you dont do good works OR bad works? You mearly are lawful neutral and are saved alone??

That I do not buy