Anti-Semitism In France!

[Tired_Old_Man 1]

Umm.. so what would be the solution here? I have my children and give them to a family with an opposing belief system just so I don't taint them? Help me here, but I find it hard to discern how on earth I could bear children and not get just a teeny bit of my own belief system on them.

Again, little people are born a clean slate. Being a Christian is something that happens to you personally, internally; it's not something you wake up one day and decide really.

Both my children were raised with my belief in Jesus Christ, albeit not as fervent as it is today. Today, my daughter, who is an autonomous person on her own and is now 25 yrs old, is searching for answers between her Christian type upbringing and the idea of Buddhism. We discuss it on occasion, but ultimately this is her decision. Whatever consequences along the road or at the end of the road will also be of her own doing; good or not so good.

I have known many many young people who move away from what their parents believed and in most cases tested the waters in the world and came back on their own accord (and probably with a bit of conviction from God). I have also known those who ran straight to the other side out of spite and anger towards their parents. So, to say that parents may brainwash their kids to lean (to the other side) isn't completely true. And so what if it is? Of course I want my kids to be Christian. I love them.

Proverbs 22:6 Train up a child in the way he should go, And when he is old he will not depart from it.

You can raise your children by saying "I have faith that Jesus died on the cross for our sins."

"I believe that through Jesus is the only path to Heaven"

But saying, "It is a fact that Jesus is the son of God" is not the right way even though you or I or 2,000,000,000 other people believe that, because it is our belief and based on our faith. If it could be proved, then we would not need faith. In fact, if it could be proved, we could not have faith, because having faith has to do with things that can not be proved, not with things that can be proved.

[Ron Cusano 0]

osh Lisah25, I though every Christian was aware of that. Let's start here . . .

"Our laws and our institutions must necessarily be based upon and embody the teachings of the Redeemer of mankind. It is impossible that it should be otherwise; and in this sense and to this extent our civilization and our institutions are emphatically Christian." - United States Supreme Court, 1892.

James McHenry was a member of the Continental Congress, a state legislator, a soldier, and a signer of the Constitution...as well as the president of the first Bible Society in Baltimore. McHenry stated:

Neither...let it be overlooked, that public utility pleads most forcibly for the general distribution of the Holy Scriptures.

The doctrine they preach, the obligations they impose, the punishment they threaten, the rewards they promise, the stamp and image of divinity they bear, which produces a conviction of their truths, can alone secure to society, order and peace, and to our courts of justice and constitutions of government, purity, stability, and usefulness

.

Charles Cotesworth Pinckney also signed the Constitution, and served as a delegate to the national Constitutional Convention and an author of the Constitution of South Caroline. Pinckney was a statesman, soldier, planter, a brigadier general and a candidate for President and Vice-President. Like the rest of the signers of the Constitution, he too recognized the Sovereignty of God:

"Blasphemy against the Almighty is denying his being or providence, or uttering contumelious reproaches on our Saviour Christ. It is punished, at common law by fine and imprisonment,

for Christianity is part of the laws of the land

."

And, for those who fear this sort of Law breeds intolerance or disrespect for others, Patrick Henry boldly declared:

It cannot be emphasized too strongly that this great nation was founded, not by religionists, but by Christians; not on religions, but on the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

For this very reason peoples of other faiths have been afforded assylum, prosperity and freedom of worship here.

Likewise, the Constitution of the United States was drafted so as to be in accordance with the Scriptures

, to be the legal foundation of a republican form of government based on that model which God had ordained for the children of Israel. Indeed, Thomas Jefferson even suggested that the national seal be a portrayal of

"the children of Israel in the wilderness, led by a cloud by day and a pillar of fire by night."

Much of the Constitution and our American common law and organic law is also derived from the principles of the

Magna Carta

, which expressly forbade monarchial tyranny.

In accordance with the spirit of Liberty which motivated those Righteous men of Principle so many years ago,

We the members of the U.S. Taxpayers Party gratefully acknowledge the blessing of the Lord God as Creator, Preserver and Ruler of the Universe and of this Nation...

The U.S. Constitution established a republic under God, rather than a democracy.

In a republic governed by Constitutional law rooted in Biblical law,all life, liberty and property are safe because Law rules.

- Preamble,

I could fill hundreds of pages with quotes from our forefathers, but these will suffice to get the point across. It is Basic History 101 and am amazed how people, especially some professing Christians can even question it.

lisah25: I am with you. I read earlier where you defended the intention of the framers of the Constitution.

At this point, it is incumbent upon Ron to show us where it is documented anywhere that the earliest Americans sat down with a Bible and included verbage in the Constitution based on It's teachings.

And our laws have the exact intention (or should have) of preventing people from harming each other and from infringing on others' freedom.

[Ron Cusano 0]

If you did your homework you would know that it is indeed common knowledge. I just posted to your request that I offer some proof of the Biblical foundation of our country and government. I would welcome your response!

Yep. Just claiming things like "it's common knowedge" aren't really good debate tactics.

[BJean 16]

Thanks Ron. Now I understand why you believe that the framers of the Constitution used the Bible when writing the Constitution. Did you read what Patrick Henry said?

[Tired_Old_Man 1]

To say that same sex marriage affects you is wrong. To say that it offends your Christian beliefs and your sense of morality may be true, but it has nothing absolutely to do with infringing on your rights or taking away your freedom. Banning same sex marriage is taking away (some) Americans' freedoms. It is wrong.

My wife and I are getting a divorce only 5 months short of our 40th wedding anniversary A gay couple moved in on our block just three houses away from our door and as George W. BuSh said it would, it destroyed the sanctity of our marriage.:faint:

[BJean 16]

Well, I have one question for you TOM. Were the gay couple legally married?

[BJean 16]

I mean the ruination of the sanctity of your marriage might not have been because the couple was gay. Perhaps it was simply because they were not married, and were thereby living in sin. That can just completely ruin a neighborhood.

[Tired_Old_Man 1]

osh Lisah25, I though every Christian was aware of that. Let's start here . . .

"Our laws and our institutions must necessarily be based upon and embody the teachings of the Redeemer of mankind. It is impossible that it should be otherwise; and in this sense and to this extent our civilization and our institutions are emphatically Christian." - United States Supreme Court, 1892.

Claim: Alleged quote from U.S. Supreme court decision Church of Holy Trinity v. United States (1892): "Our laws and our institutions must necessarily be based upon and embody the teachings of the Redeemer of Mankind, it is impossible that it should be otherwise.... Our civilization and institutions are emphatically Christian..."

Rebuttal: This is yet another inaccurate statement from David Barton, and he has admitted that this quote appears nowhere in the Trinity v. United States case.

This case was not a church-state separation case but rather on whether an alien labor law passed by Congress in 1887 referred to only manual labor and not professional or skilled labor. In the non-legally binding *obiter dictum*, or "footnote" section, Justice Brewer went off on a tangent and wrote a completely unrelated discourse on religion and this nation:

"These, and many other matters which might be noticed, add a volume of unofficial declarations to the mass of organic utterances that this is a Christian nation."

This case is frequently cited as by organizations seeking to amend the Constitution to include an endorsement of Christianity. To correct this misinterpretation, Justice Brewer himself wrote a book in 1905 to correct the record, titled "The United States: A Christian Nation". He explains:

"But in what sense can [the United States] be called a Christian nation? Not in the sense that Christianity is the established religion or the people are compelled in any manner to support it. On the contrary, the Constitution specifically provides that 'congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion or prohibiting the free exercise thereof.' Neither is it Christian in the sense that all its citizens are either in fact or in name Christians. On the contrary, all religions have free scope within its borders. Numbers of our people profess other religions, and many reject all."

"...Nor is it Christian in the sense that a profession of Christianity is a condition of holding office or otherwise engaging in public service, or essential to recognition either politically or socially. In fact, the government as a legal organization is independent of all religions."

Whatever his ideas about the United States as a Christian nation may have been, that did not include any official endorsement or special status for religion by government, and this position is reflected in other legal decisions he made

[Tired_Old_Man 1]

And, for those who fear this sort of Law breeds intolerance or disrespect for others, Patrick Henry boldly declared:

It cannot be emphasized too strongly that this great nation was founded, not by religionists, but by Christians; not on religions, but on the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

For this very reason peoples of other faiths have been afforded assylum, prosperity and freedom of worship here.

Claim: Alleged quote from Patrick Henry: "It cannot be emphasized too strongly or too often that this great nation was founded, not by religionists but by Christians, not on religion but on the Gospel of Jesus Christ."

• Rebuttal: This quote has not been traced back to an original source, and is a questionable quote used by David Barton. Based on other quotes made by Patrick Henry, it is not inconsistent with his general opinions. His claim to fame rests in the founding of the nation of Virginia, his battle with Jefferson and Madison in trying to keep Christianity as the legally established religion of the Nation of Virginia, and his efforts in trying to keep the Constitution from being ratified. He lost both of those battles with Madison.
  If his claim is true, then it is odd that the primary legal document which defines the government of this nation has no references whatsoever to Jesus Christ or any deity whatsoever, basing its authority instead on "We the people."
  

[Tired_Old_Man 1]

Well, I have one question for you TOM. Were the gay couple legally married?

Florida would not allow that, so they must live in sin, something that Tina and I could not abide by. Alas, she is gone and I am looking for a new abode.

[Tired_Old_Man 1]

osh Lisah25, I though every Christian was aware of that. Let's start here . . .

"Our laws and our institutions must necessarily be based upon and embody the teachings of the Redeemer of mankind. It is impossible that it should be otherwise; and in this sense and to this extent our civilization and our institutions are emphatically Christian." - United States Supreme Court, 1892.

James McHenry was a member of the Continental Congress, a state legislator, a soldier, and a signer of the Constitution...as well as the president of the first Bible Society in Baltimore. McHenry stated:

Neither...let it be overlooked, that public utility pleads most forcibly for the general distribution of the Holy Scriptures.

The doctrine they preach, the obligations they impose, the punishment they threaten, the rewards they promise, the stamp and image of divinity they bear, which produces a conviction of their truths, can alone secure to society, order and peace, and to our courts of justice and constitutions of government, purity, stability, and usefulness

.

Charles Cotesworth Pinckney also signed the Constitution, and served as a delegate to the national Constitutional Convention and an author of the Constitution of South Caroline. Pinckney was a statesman, soldier, planter, a brigadier general and a candidate for President and Vice-President. Like the rest of the signers of the Constitution, he too recognized the Sovereignty of God:

"Blasphemy against the Almighty is denying his being or providence, or uttering contumelious reproaches on our Saviour Christ. It is punished, at common law by fine and imprisonment,

for Christianity is part of the laws of the land

."

And, for those who fear this sort of Law breeds intolerance or disrespect for others, Patrick Henry boldly declared:

It cannot be emphasized too strongly that this great nation was founded, not by religionists, but by Christians; not on religions, but on the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

For this very reason peoples of other faiths have been afforded assylum, prosperity and freedom of worship here.

Likewise, the Constitution of the United States was drafted so as to be in accordance with the Scriptures

, to be the legal foundation of a republican form of government based on that model which God had ordained for the children of Israel. Indeed, Thomas Jefferson even suggested that the national seal be a portrayal of

"the children of Israel in the wilderness, led by a cloud by day and a pillar of fire by night."

Much of the Constitution and our American common law and organic law is also derived from the principles of the

Magna Carta

, which expressly forbade monarchial tyranny.

In accordance with the spirit of Liberty which motivated those Righteous men of Principle so many years ago,

We the members of the U.S. Taxpayers Party gratefully acknowledge the blessing of the Lord God as Creator, Preserver and Ruler of the Universe and of this Nation...

The U.S. Constitution established a republic under God, rather than a democracy.

In a republic governed by Constitutional law rooted in Biblical law,all life, liberty and property are safe because Law rules.

- Preamble,

I could fill hundreds of pages with quotes from our forefathers, but these will suffice to get the point across. It is Basic History 101 and am amazed how people, especially some professing Christians can even question it.

I found a site with all these statements and I found another site that rebuts all of them.

[BJean 16]

TOM: I wish I weren't so lazy. I had a sense that it was a case of a contemporary person doing just what you have confirmed.

These religious fanatics! They'll do just about anything, stretch the truth not being the least of which, to keep that "under God" phrase in our Pledge and to justify laws that are based on their religious beliefs.

I'm just sorry that Ron was taken in by that guy.

[BJean 16]

P.S. Tom. If you are serious about the current state of affairs in your household, I am very sorry to hear it. I hope you were just using it to make a point, as did I.

[Tired_Old_Man 1]

P.S. Tom. If you are serious about the current state of affairs in your household, I am very sorry to hear it. I hope you were just using it to make a point, as did I.

Of course I was kidding.

Tina and I; until death do us part, or one of us becomes Gay.:faint:

[lisah25 3]

James McHenry was a member of the Continental Congress, a state legislator, a soldier, and a signer of the Constitution...as well as the president of the first Bible Society in Baltimore. McHenry stated:

Neither...let it be overlooked, that public utility pleads most forcibly for the general distribution of the Holy Scriptures.

The doctrine they preach, the obligations they impose, the punishment they threaten, the rewards they promise, the stamp and image of divinity they bear, which produces a conviction of their truths, can alone secure to society, order and peace, and to our courts of justice and constitutions of government, purity, stability, and usefulness

.

So why don't our laws in fact do so?