Anti-Semitism In France!

[Tired_Old_Man 1]

That is not what5 I am saying. From my (our) perspective, in order to accept Jesus you need to know Him from a biblical context. You obviously do not agree with the, so what is being asked is by context do you have an understanding of Jesus aside from the scriptures! It's a legitimate question!

No, it is not a legitimate question. It is a statement disguised as a question.

Have you stopped beating your wife?

How would you like if I asked you that question and didn't stop asking follow-up questions until you admitted beating your wife?

You will not stopped asking (me and others) questions until I (we) admit beating my (our) wife(s).

It is none of your business how I or anyone else worships.

[Ron Cusano 0]

With all due respect, I don't consider the Qu'ran to be a holy book, and from what I have gleamed from it, the message is not at all like you stated.

You talk about keeping the faith as what is required to gain entrance into heaven. I get the impression that you feel that all the righteous and good things done by these people earns them "heaven"!

Biblical Christianity states that it's now what we do, but rather what we believe and in whom we trust that get's us to heaven. Noah was justified to God the same way that Abraham was ("Abraham believed God and it was counted unto him for righteousness"), Moses was justified by virtue of the Law and his attempt to keep it in addition to believing God!

Unbder the New Covenent dispensation, we are justified to God and worthy of heaven only through the blood sacrifice of the Messiah, Jesus. There is no contridiction here. Christian beliefs in this area are right in line with the whole mof scripture.

I have had many discussions with Jewish friends (some that kept us up all night in college) and I also believe that your way and their way of worship is as valid as any Christian way.

Even the "Holy Qur'an" says that Jews, Christians and Muslims have equal rights to Heaven.

But even if the "Holy Qur'an" didn't say that, I doubt that the God would allow Moses or Noah, or any of their followers who keep the faith to be pushed out of Heaven by Christians or the ideas of Christians.

Maybe God has put out all these contradictory ideas to test us. That would be compatible with God's MO. Look at Babylon for example.

[Ron Cusano 0]

With all due respect, I don't consider the Qu'ran to be a holy book, and from what I have gleamed from it, the message is not at all like you stated.

You talk about keeping the faith as what is required to gain entrance into heaven. I get the impression that you feel that all the righteous and good things done by these people earns them "heaven"!

Biblical Christianity states that it's now what we do, but rather what we believe and in whom we trust that get's us to heaven. Noah was justified to God the same way that Abraham was ("Abraham believed God and it was counted unto him for righteousness"), Moses was justified by virtue of the Law and his attempt to keep it in addition to believing God!

Unbder the New Covenent dispensation, we are justified to God and worthy of heaven only through the blood sacrifice of the Messiah, Jesus. There is no contridiction here. Christian beliefs in this area are right in line with the whole mof scripture.

I have had many discussions with Jewish friends (some that kept us up all night in college) and I also believe that your way and their way of worship is as valid as any Christian way.

Even the "Holy Qur'an" says that Jews, Christians and Muslims have equal rights to Heaven.

But even if the "Holy Qur'an" didn't say that, I doubt that the God would allow Moses or Noah, or any of their followers who keep the faith to be pushed out of Heaven by Christians or the ideas of Christians.

Maybe God has put out all these contradictory ideas to test us. That would be compatible with God's MO. Look at Babylon for example.

[Ron Cusano 0]

With all due respect, I don't consider the Qu'ran to be a holy book, and from what I have gleamed from it, the message is not at all like you stated.

You talk about keeping the faith as what is required to gain entrance into heaven. I get the impression that you feel that all the righteous and good things done by these people earns them "heaven"!

Biblical Christianity states that it's now what we do, but rather what we believe and in whom we trust that get's us to heaven. Noah was justified to God the same way that Abraham was ("Abraham believed God and it was counted unto him for righteousness"), Moses was justified by virtue of the Law and his attempt to keep it in addition to believing God!

Under the New Covenent dispensation, we are justified to God and worthy of heaven only through accepting the blood sacrifice of the Messiah, Jesus. There is no contridiction here. Christian beliefs in this area are consistant with the whole of scripture.

I have had many discussions with Jewish friends (some that kept us up all night in college) and I also believe that your way and their way of worship is as valid as any Christian way.

Even the "Holy Qur'an" says that Jews, Christians and Muslims have equal rights to Heaven.

But even if the "Holy Qur'an" didn't say that, I doubt that the God would allow Moses or Noah, or any of their followers who keep the faith to be pushed out of Heaven by Christians or the ideas of Christians.

Maybe God has put out all these contradictory ideas to test us. That would be compatible with God's MO. Look at Babylon for example.

[TruBlueSue 0]

"Completed Jews" may be their terminology, but to Judaism they are still considered Christians. However, this still doesn't really answer my original question - why would Christian women use Jewish mens' ritual objects while worshipping Jesus? Just saying that real Christians learn about Judaism b/c Jesus was Jewish just doesn't answer it. I know lots of Christians who are very conversant with Judaism who would never DREAM of utilizing Jewish ritual objects for their own purposes.

[Ron Cusano 0]

I agree with you! Women have no place using a prayer shawl. You will get no argument from me!!

"Completed Jews" may be their terminology, but to Judaism they are still considered Christians. However, this still doesn't really answer my original question - why would Christian women use Jewish mens' ritual objects while worshipping Jesus? Just saying that real Christians learn about Judaism b/c Jesus was Jewish just doesn't answer it. I know lots of Christians who are very conversant with Judaism who would never DREAM of utilizing Jewish ritual objects for their own purposes.

[Tired_Old_Man 1]

With all due respect, I don't consider the Qu'ran to be a holy book, and from what I have gleamed from it, the message is not at all like you stated.

That is the problem. You say "with all due respect", but you give none.

Just because I don't use the Qur'an as my Holy Book, doesn't make it any less of a Holy Book. You have no respect for the religion of anyone else, but demand total respect for yours, and don't tell me that it is God's way. It is your way and your style. You are not the first “man of God” that I have met.

Allah is the same God as you worship. You make this into a debate over God, but it is a debate over the men who wrote, translated, transcribed and canonized the books purported to be divinely inspired.

Do not accuse me of bashing your God, because I am not bashing "OUR GOD". I am discussing the short sightedness of the people who bring about never-ending war because they can not discuss their Holy Books without killing each other.

[Ron Cusano 0]

There in lies the problem! I don't believe that the God of the Qur'an is the God of the Bible, I don't believe it's author to be a prophet of God, so therefore I consider the Qur'an to be a false book, and Islam to be a false religion. I can't respect a religion that I understand to be false and misleading.

I won't go into all the many reasons why, because I know that you don't care. You want me to respect your views, and yet you don't offer that same respect for my views. You keep trying to make this personal but telling me how wrong my "style" and "beliefs" are, and yet, if I do the same, you get all upset. There is a very big double standard with the things you are saying.

That is the problem. You say "with all due respect", but you give none.

Just because I don't use the Qur'an as my Holy Book, doesn't make it any less of a Holy Book. You have no respect for the religion of anyone else, but demand total respect for yours, and don't tell me that it is God's way. It is your way and your style. You are not the first “man of God” that I have met.

Allah is the same God as you worship. You make this into a debate over God, but it is a debate over the men who wrote, translated, transcribed and canonized the books purported to be divinely inspired.

Do not accuse me of bashing your God, because I am not bashing "OUR GOD". I am discussing the short sightedness of the people who bring about never-ending war because they can not discuss their Holy Books without killing each other.

[lisah25 3]

There in lies the problem! I don't believe that the God of the Qur'an is the God of the Bible, I don't believe it's author to be a prophet of God, so therefore I consider the Qur'an to be a false book, and Islam to be a false religion. I can't respect a religion that I understand to be false and misleading.

Then don't be surprised when other people don't respect your beliefs, esp. when they don't share them.

[Ron Cusano 0]

Believe me, I am not!! You may not share my beliefs or respect them, you you need to respect my right to have them! That is waht you want from me, and it is a 2-way street!

Then don't be surprised when other people don't respect your beliefs, esp. when they don't share them.

[Ron Cusano 0]

Believe me, I am not!! You may not share my beliefs or respect them, you you need to respect my right to have them! That is waht you want from me, and it is a 2-way street!

Then don't be surprised when other people don't respect your beliefs, esp. when they don't share them.

[Tired_Old_Man 1]

There in lies the problem! I don't believe that the God of the Qur'an is the God of the Bible, I don't believe it's author to be a prophet of God, so therefore I consider the Qur'an to be a false book, and Islam to be a false religion. I can't respect a religion that I understand to be false and misleading.

I won't go into all the many reasons why, because I know that you don't care. You want me to respect your views, and yet you don't offer that same respect for my views. You keep trying to make this personal but telling me how wrong my "style" and "beliefs" are, and yet, if I do the same, you get all upset. There is a very big double standard with the things you are saying.

I respect your beliefs about the Bible except when they put down other people's religions. Your interpretation of the Bible doesn't allow for anyone else's interpretation or other people's “Books of God”, yet many ministers and theologians can accept other people's beliefs and Holy Books.

I do not question your love for Jesus. I do not question you relationship with Jesus. I do question your intolerance for other people's method of worship, and I question your right to blame it on God.

"Who are we to question God's way" is the answer I have heard whenever a Christian is stumped.

Who are you to question God's ways as expressed by other Holy Books than your Bible?

You have no more right to call another Holy Book false than the readers of that Holy Book have to call the Bible False.

You have no more right to call another person's interpretation of the Bible false than that person has to call your interpretation of Bible False.

Yes, I am intolerant of intolerance.

[lisah25 3]

Believe me, I am not!! You may not share my beliefs or respect them, you you need to respect my right to have them! That is waht you want from me, and it is a 2-way street!

I completely respect your right to believe as you want to. I even agree with much of what you believe.

[Ron Cusano 0]

I believe that the Bible is the ONLY authority in spiritual matters, and I make no apoligies for that. The "other theologians and ministers" you refer to are extremly liberial in the outlook, and I believe them to be very wrong. I don't have these beliefs and opinions for nbo reason. I believe they can all be substanciated by scripture. There can be no compromise with the Bible and the things of God, and you won't find any with me. The Bible is absolute and infallible. I blame nothing on God! I echo what the Word of God says. Goid is the author so your disagreement is with Him.

I respect your beliefs about the Bible except when they put down other people's religions. Your interpretation of the Bible doesn't allow for anyone else's interpretation or other people's “Books of God”, yet many ministers and theologians can accept other people's beliefs and Holy Books.

I do not question your love for Jesus. I do not question you relationship with Jesus. I do question your intolerance for other people's method of worship, and I question your right to blame it on God.

"Who are we to question God's way" is the answer I have heard whenever a Christian is stumped.

Who are you to question God's ways as expressed by other Holy Books than your Bible?

You have no more right to call another Holy Book false than the readers of that Holy Book have to call the Bible False.

You have no more right to call another person's interpretation of the Bible false than that person has to call your interpretation of Bible False.

Yes, I am intolerant of intolerance.

[Ron Cusano 0]

Thank-You!

I completely respect your right to believe as you want to. I even agree with much of what you believe.