Anti-Semitism In France!

[BJean 16]

You are more than welcome. I'm sure glad you're one of our moderators. I wish we really were sitting across the table from each other with our cups of mocha java!

[Ron Cusano 0]

Although I completely disagree with how you feel, I can accept and respect that you do. There is little more that I can add. We can argue intelliectually untill the cows come home but it is up to you to either accept or reject the claims of Christ, and at this point in time, you seem to have your mind made up. I thi8nk that any further persuasion on my part will be falling on deaf ears, so I won't belabor the point. I won't try to twist your arm. That's not my job! I wish you the best and will pray that someday you will look at these things differently. If I can ever be of any help with understand anything about the Word of God, I hope that you would feel comfortable to contact me. God bless!

There are lots of things that may or may not be true that I can't spend my entire life investigating. There are only so many hours in a day, after all, and my days are pretty busy. My priority is the here and now, not the hereafter. Your sense that eternal life is in the balance is what motivates YOU, it doesn't motivate me. And "factually proven true" seems to be in the eye of the beholder--clearly we all have different standards of proof. I go with what the scientific community holds to be provable, explicable, grounded in the scientific method.

Recorded history is notoriously subjective--being written by the winners and all. All of it (before modern recording methods were invented) is inflected with huge amounts of personal and cultural bias, almost to the point of being fiction. Useful, enlightening, fascinating, indeed, but not something to use as a roadmap for my life. We should learn from our history, think critically about it, not live our lives as though we're still in it. The existence of a popular and influential teacher 2000 years ago speaks not at all to my life in the 21st century.

It seems to me that going into Bible study with an intent to prove or disprove is a pretty all-encompassing endeavor. And it can only ever be done to the seeker's satisfaction; any arguments based on such study will prove persuasive only to those who are seeking as well. I did my investigating early in life, and reached my conclusion based on information, time, experience, and personal instinct.

I'd like nothing more than for everyone to be able to say the same.

[Alexandra 55]

Although I completely disagree with how you feel, I can accept and respect that you do. There is little more that I can add. We can argue intelliectually untill the cows come home but it is up to you to either accept or reject the claims of Christ, and at this point in time, you seem to have your mind made up. I thi8nk that any further persuasion on my part will be falling on deaf ears, so I won't belabor the point. I won't try to twist your arm. That's not my job! I wish you the best and will pray that someday you will look at these things differently. If I can ever be of any help with understand anything about the Word of God, I hope that you would feel comfortable to contact me. God bless!

Ron, I'm just curious. How would you feel if I were to say that I wish you the best, yet hope with all my heart that you will someday look at these things differently? Can you not see the negativity in that?

Your respecting and accepting that I believe differently than you should be the end of it. There is no reason whatsoever for you to pray that I have a change of heart and come to accept YOUR credo. My beliefs cause no one harm and satisfy me fully. Can we leave it at that, and part friends?

[Ron Cusano 0]

I said what I meant using a common expression and I know all who responded were not athiests, so I don't understand what you are trying to convey here. Please explain!

When you say I made personal beliefs the issue, if you mean by me asking a moderator about labeling herself as the "token athiest", then yes, giulty as charged.

Words mean things. We chose to type what we do because, I hope at least, it best fits what we mean.

You made personal beliefs the issue, people responded. Not all who responded were athiests.

[Ron Cusano 0]

Yes, I believe that we can part as friends. Since what I believe, if true, would mean sever ramifacations for those that don't believe, my remarks to you were out of concern from a sincere heart. Can you accept that?

Ron, I'm just curious. How would you feel if I were to say that I wish you the best, yet hope with all my heart that you will someday look at these things differently? Can you not see the negativity in that?

Your respecting and accepting that I believe differently than you should be the end of it. There is no reason whatsoever for you to pray that I have a change of heart and come to accept YOUR credo. My beliefs cause no one harm and satisfy me fully. Can we leave it at that, and part friends?

[Ron Cusano 0]

I never said that was not how I felt, and I do accept full responsibility for everything I say. I felt like people were coming at me from all directions on the attack, and that expression was right on the money. It was not directed at any particular person, and I make no apoligy for it.

And? No, really. So it's a common expression, so what? Does that change it's meaning?

I believe that I alone am responsible for my behavior. That what other people do doesn't justify anything I might choose to do.

[Alexandra 55]

Yes, I believe that we can part as friends. Since what I believe, if true, would mean sever ramifacations for those that don't believe, my remarks to you were out of concern from a sincere heart. Can you accept that?

I accept that you believe you are acting kindly and sending nothing but good thoughts. What it comes across as is condescending and patronizing, since my beliefs are not damaging to myself or anyone else. There is nothing loving about wishing someone would change in a way that pleases you.

I'd be much more convinced of your sincere heart if you were to say you'll pray that I'll find happiness, health, and peace. But your praying that I'll find your God? That says to me that you don't care about me at all.

[BJean 16]

Woo-hoo. Score another one for Alexandra!

[Ron Cusano 0]

I do pray that you will find happiness, health and peace, but with what I believe, that can only truly come from a relationship with God. This is not condescending and patronizing, or at least not intended to be, but a true reflection of who I am and what I believe. Please don't take it as a negative. If you saw someone doing somthing that YOU regarded as being destructive, even if they did not see it that way, wouldn't it be a good thing for you to wish that they would act in a different manner? Would you really be demonstrating a caring heart if you did less? Believing what I do, I would be a hypocrite not to want to see you believe differently. I can accept you and wish you the best as a person, but it's the belief system I can't accept. Does that make any sense??

I accept that you believe you are acting kindly and sending nothing but good thoughts. What it comes across as is condescending and patronizing, since my beliefs are not damaging to myself or anyone else. There is nothing loving about wishing someone would change in a way that pleases you.

I'd be much more convinced of your sincere heart if you were to say you'll pray that I'll find happiness, health, and peace. But your praying that I'll find your God? That says to me that you don't care about me at all.

[Ron Cusano 0]

BJean,

Alexandra and I are having an intelligent and caring exchange without any dispursions of any kind. We have agreed to disagree. We are talking about how we feel without casting stones. So what is your problem!

You make a big deal about how you think I am condesending and looking for arguments, but you just don't stop. If you want to have a simular exchange of ideas on an intelligent level, let's do it. If you want to get into a pissing match, you will find that you have more then met your match. How about we keep this civil and stop with the barbs.

[BJean 16]

Alexandra: I'm glad you are carrying the torch for many of us who prefer not to communicate with this clown, but who are having trouble turning away from this thread. His is way too reminicent of the voices of propaganda I've been exposed to all of my life. You have my respect for not backing down or giving in. In fact, this is finally getting pretty humorous. Thanks!

[Ron Cusano 0]

This was not addressed to me so I won't respond directly. All I can say is if it walks like an idiot, and talks like an idiot, . . .

[Alexandra 55]

I do pray that you will find happiness, health and peace, but with what I believe, that can only truly come from a relationship with God. This is not condescending and patronizing, or at least not intended to be, but a true reflection of who I am and what I believe. Please don't take it as a negative. If you saw someone doing somthing that YOU regarded as being destructive, even if they did not see it that way, wouldn't it be a good thing for you to wish that they would act in a different manner? Would you really be demonstrating a caring heart if you did less? Believing what I do, I would be a hypocrite not to want to see you believe differently. I can accept you and wish you the best as a person, but it's the belief system I can't accept. Does that make any sense??

Honestly, no, it doesn't make any sense. There are loads of belief systems out there that I can't accept for me (yours, for example), but I fully accept that it works for the people who embrace it. Have you ever heard the phrase "more power to you"? That's what I say when I see people doing things that I think would be destructive for me, but that they feel is acceptable to them. I leave them to it, and let them enjoy. That doesn't mean I don't care about them--rather, it means I DO care about them and what makes THEM happy.

So you believe that happiness, health, and peace can only come from a relationship with God. I am glad you've found what gives you those things. Can't you say the same to me?

[Ron Cusano 0]

I can and do! If that is your thing, as you say, more power to you.

That aside, I would like to say something to you, since you are a moderator. On this board I have met several avowed athiests, and a few, like yourself and Green have managed to have an intelligent exchange, even though we disagree on so much. If we met in person, we might even like each other.

I have been critized by many as being argumenative and condecending, and yet, it is perfectly OK for others to act like bottom feeders and cast disparaging remarks about me. For instance, this BJean character. I am trying real hard to be civil in the face of continuing hostility from a few idiots. So, in your opinion, what would be an approiate way to deal with idiots who keep throwing barbs.

Honestly, no, it doesn't make any sense. There are loads of belief systems out there that I can't accept for me (yours, for example), but I fully accept that it works for the people who embrace it. Have you ever heard the phrase "more power to you"? That's what I say when I see people doing things that I think would be desctructive for me, but that they feel is acceptable to them. I leave them to it, and let them enjoy. That doesn't mean I don't care about them--rather, it means I DO care about them and what makes THEM happy.

So you believe that happiness, health, and peace can only come from a relationship with God. I am glad you've found what gives you those things. Can't you say the same to me?

[Alexandra 55]

I can and do! If that is your thing, as you say, more power to you.

Thank you.

I am trying real hard to be civil in the face of continuing hostility from a few idiots. So, in your opinion, what would be an approiate way to deal with idiots who keep throwing barbs.

Ignore what makes you bristle. That's generally the best approach. Message board arguments take two, but it only takes one to say "I'm done."