Stop having so many damn kids; population control, anyone?

[Carlene 12]

But wherever it fits in, my sister STILL says, "Susie wouldn't cross me." LOL

I love those little spontaneous utterances that turn into family-speak! Sometimes they last for generations. They are part of what defines the familial relationship.

In my family, there are several. One of the best came from my daughter, the youngest of four and the only girl (can you say "prima dona"?). Her nearest brother in age was Kelly. When she was about 3, something went amiss and she was looking like the prime suspect. Protesting her innocence, she declared, "Kelly did it." Kelly, however, was at my mom's, and had been for several days prior. Busted!

To this day, when there is a "who did this" question, the response from ALL my children and grandchildren is "Kelly did it". No one gets it but us, and it probably isn't even all that funny, but it never fails to lighten the moment for us.

[missy4gordon 0]

My main concern is the environment and our dwindling natural resources around the world, not just here in the US.

I don't think the government should be able to legislate how many children people are allowed to have, but I do wish that people would be responsible on their own and realize the burden each child places on the earth, because each child really does place a burden on the earth and the ozone layer.

I disagree, "in my opinion" children are not burdens, they are precious little miracles! The "burden" is our lifestyles.

Ideally people would "replace" themselves and that's it.

Personally, I don't have children, but if I did, I would never have more than two, because I am educated with regard to the environmental problems we are facing now.

Have a kid to "replace" myself??? Ok, that's a good reason to have a child.....wow. If my folks only wanted enough to replace themselves, I would not be here filling their lives with joy!!

But wishing that people would do a little reading and research is futile, because people always just want to do what the hell they want and they don't seem to care about anything else.

And when God comes into the picture with regard to this issue, well then forget it, because all logic and intellect goes right out the window.

Also just had to note I am in Memphis for vacation right now and I find it truly horrifying that we came across a giant replica of the Statue of Liberty (about 20 stories high), holding an enormous cross in her hand instead of a torch and the ten commandments in her other hand. On the base of it, it says "America return to Christ".

If that's not illogical and ignorant, then I don't know what is.

What you find illogical and ignorant, some find reasonable and respectful. It's all in the eye of the beholder, so what makes your feelings of this statue more important than those that feel the opposite?

[GeezerSue 7]

I love those little spontaneous utterances that turn into family-speak! Sometimes they last for generations. They are part of what defines the familial relationship.

You're right...our daughter uses it now. It could be spoken by future generations if she ever "gifts" me with grandkids, like she SHOULD....oh...wait...that's her choice, huh? It's times like this that I really disagree with myself. I think I should be able to ORDER her to have grandbabies for me!!

[~Jules~ 0]

To this day, when there is a "who did this" question, the response from ALL my children and grandchildren is "Kelly did it". No one gets it but us, and it probably isn't even all that funny, but it never fails to lighten the moment for us.

Carlene,

We have quite a few of these in my family too. We keep passing them on from generation to generation. lol

[mousecrazy 2]

As I have said before, and again, the juice is probably not worth the squeeze (but I just can't help myself), the sanctimonious attitude of some posters is disgusting. Asking for tolerance for their minority beliefs, while being completely intolerant of all other beliefs is pitiful. If I could devise a way to pull the blinders back, so that the holders of these attitudes could see they have one point of view, and other people have a different point of view, and that is not necessarily a problem, I would do so. I have learned it isn't possible. So, if you are reading this, and you understand what I'm referring to, please know you are not alone. There are many people on LBT who understand and hold a more conservative point of view; they just do not bother very often to post to Rants and Raves due to the pushy, intolerant people who post here, regardless of how they describe themselves and their attitudes.

I do, however, respect an atheistic, secular point of view, though I do not agree with it. I do not respect the attitude expressed here and in other threads that this point of view is right and educated and differing points of view are wrong and ignorant...thus, I have used the terms "disgusting" and "pitiful" to describe this. I just wanted to clear that up, because I am sure I will be attacked for being hypocritical.

Again, for emphasis, I am tolerant of the point of view, but not of the sanctimonious, "I am right and educated, and you are wrong and ignorant" attitude. It is elitist and insulting, which may not bother the ones holding such attitudes, but is that really the effect that is desired? Perhaps it is.

Possibly, the Rants and Raves section should be renamed, because it is apparently the Liberals Only Rant Section/Others Enter at Your Own Risk.

That's why very few of "us" ever come here, but ya'll are interesting every now and then.

[sweethot143 2]

I have a different point of view here, and I know to many of you it wouldn't change how you look at things at all but here it is.

We are LDS, and we believe that we were spirit children of Heavenly Father before we came here to Earth. We chose to come here, we are here to get a body and be tested and idealy return to live with Heavenly Father. We believe that families can be eternal that we can be together again when we die. We believe our time on Earth is temporary and is a small flicker in eternity. WE are to be our best while here, bring other spirits into this world to gain a body. Some of us were meant to have many children and some of us none, we all have different tests in life, and we have what we call "free agency" the right to choose. some choose to obey heavenly fathers command to have children and others choose not to.

"We don’t create life—God does. While we may participate as a mother or a father in bringing a child into the world, that child is a gift from our Creator.

Human life is sacred and should be treated with reverence from its beginning to its end" www.lds.org

What I am saying is, that yes there are people who are irresponsible in having children, ex. teen mothers, unwed people, ect. Those that are not in the atmosphere that was meant to have children, but we cannot judge them, it's not our place. One of those children could grow up to change the world. It only takes one person, what if that person's parents decided to never have children or get an abortion, the world would have missed out on what that person provided us. Examples, Martin Luther King, George Washington, Henry Ford, to name a few.

I agree with some others, that you don't know love until you have your own child, it's like no other. I have always loved my husband, but I love my children differently, we made them, they are part of us. We have 2 beautiful little girls and hope to bring more children into this world, as many as Heavenly Father would want us to have. However, I do use birthcontrol and we pray together to know when the time is right for us to bring more into the world.

I think the lack of Religion in this day and time is the downfall of our nation. People seem to have forgotten that there are consequenses to their actions here on Earth. Whether they be now or in the Eternities. People lack love, integrity, honor, charity. The world would be better off with more of those qualities and less of the worldly ones. But I'm not one to judge, it's between you and God on what you do. None of my business, I will lead by example and raise my children to live thier lives with love and honor and integrity. That's the best I can do.

[the best me 6]

This is ridiculous. It's a little quiz for the people with room temperature IQ's? If you don't mention names, you can attack others? So, how many atheists have disagreed with something you've written here? Big mystery, eh? You wouldn't like how that nameless attacking works in reverse, so maybe it's not a good idea to go there.

Sorry, I was replying to a post where I was quoted, in reply to a post where I quoted Sunta...eh, if that made sense. Go back a few posts...it's there. No name games going on, no need to belittle.

Personal religious (and political) beliefs--once posted in this forum--are not exempt from being examined and challenged. If you cannot tell the difference between your being ridiculed and your beliefs being challenged, perhaps posting about them in a somewhat public place isn't a great idea.

I don't mind my beliefs being challenged. I mind my beliefs being ridiculed. The very first post of this thread was demeaning and scorned the religious beliefs of those who subscribe to the "quiverfull" mindset of raising children, letting God decide how many little blessings He will give a couple. I took it a bit personally. I said so.

"Feeling the love?" On the Rants and Raves Board? Well, it's possible, but less likely than anywhere else here.

Sincerely,

(One of the Potential) Self-Proclaimed Educated Person(s)

nope, it was Sunta I was talking about (see above) but you come in a close second, Sue, for being demeaning, if you werent so damn smart-alecky.

This is the Rants and Raves section. I can Rant and Rave, too, right?

[GeezerSue 7]

I have a lot of VERY religious friends of VARIOUS religious persuasions.

They are mostly Catholics, Mormons and Jews...although I know a Wiccan or two, as well. My daughter has a small group of close friends from her high school days. One is the daughter of Presbyterian minister one is the daughter of a Foursquare minister. Another is (was?) the daughter of a gay and now-dead-from-AIDS church activist. The guys in the group include a very Mormon Mormon, Evangelical Christian twins and a now-out-of-the-closet flaming hairdresser/make-up artist.

I used to go to Homemaking Meetings (I forget the name) at my local LDS church to teach a craft or two and to learn a few. I just bought our daughter a cute little Channukah bear and dreidel at Helen Grace.

We get along well, and occasionally discuss our differences. Usually, each of the ministers teases me about the fact that if my kid ever gets married it will be in their church...and that's a pretty extreme way to rope in "new customers," but they'll do what they have to do.

But, I know that THEY have read the entire bible--a few times at that--and that they tend not to have a lot of patience for people who pick a random passage and go off on a tangent. And I know that they know that for every passage in the bible telling you not to kill, for example, there's another one giving the go-ahead...in the right circumstances. And, that in the bible, women are chattel...which doesn't fly in THEIR homes beause they have daughters who would not stand for that.

There are, I believe, an awful lot of people who consider themselves to be devout Christians and who haven't read the owners' manual. Those people tend to quote the bits and pieces of what they've read, as though they had a clue. But they have neglected to read the next book, the next chapter, the next verse. If THEY can find it in the bible, they buy into the passage they have found without even considering that there may be other views in other places.

Education doesn't have to be formal...but before people quote SOME lines from a text...they should educate themselves as to what the NEXT lines have to say...or they themselves are subjecting their own line of reasoning to ridicule.

[GeezerSue 7]

This is the Rants and Raves section. I can Rant and Rave, too, right?

Oopsie

you can rant and rave, but when you go here...

...demeaning, if you werent so damn smart-alecky

...you are speaking of me and not my beliefs and inviting me to express MY opinion of YOU. If I were to do that, I'd then have to endure a ditribe about modern-day persecution of the poor oppressed Christians in our country...and how those of us who HAPPENED to read the books in question are elitists, when all we are is possessors of curiosity.

[Carlene 12]

Possibly, the Rants and Raves section should be renamed, because it is apparently the Liberals Only Rant Section/Others Enter at Your Own Risk.

That's why very few of "us" ever come here, but ya'll are interesting every now and then.

You think the pro-quiver people are Liberals?

[Wheetsin 714]

It only takes one person, what if that person's parents decided to never have children or get an abortion, the world would have missed out on what that person provided us. Examples, Martin Luther King, George Washington, Henry Ford, to name a few.

Another argument I've never understood. Children should be born, or exist, or whatever you want to call it because you never know, one of them might change the world? Yeah, sure, that's true for everyone born. This includes people like MLK, and Einstein, and Watson & Crick. And it also includes people like Hitler, Stalin, Pol Pot, Mao Tse-tung and Idi Amin.

[StrawartS 2]

Because of certain familial and political circumstances, both my grandmother and mother had several abortions. People always say to me, "what if YOU had been one of those aborted babies?" Who cares!? How would I know if I had been aborted?

Wheetsin, I'm with you. I'm not about to start having babies willy-nilly on the off-chance that one of them might end up changing the world. Mine are probably more likely to infect this country with godless corruption.

[the best me 6]

...demeaning, if you werent so damn smart-alecky

...you are speaking of me and not my beliefs and inviting me to express MY opinion of YOU. If I were to do that, I'd then have to endure a ditribe about modern-day persecution of the poor oppressed Christians in our country...and how those of us who HAPPENED to read the books in question are elitists, when all we are is possessors of curiosity.

Nah, and "damn smark-alecky" was spoken in love, hence, the smilie. I like the feely-good love stuff, you know.

[GeezerSue 7]

Nah, and "damn smark-alecky" was spoken in love, hence, the smilie. I like the feely-good love stuff, you know.

If you get a chance to check out the ersatz Statue of Liberty with the list in her hand, you might want to check out Commandment Number Nine.

[StrawartS 2]

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/07/05/us/05liberty.html?ex=1309752000&en=633335bb68bac96a&ei=5088