Let the Joyous news be spread: New Jersey votes yes on Gay civil union!

[carol134 0]

You know you can believe in whatever you like. Put your morals in and take the Bible out (if you don't believe in it) and where do you end up? Do you think marriage to several partners is the answer, do you like the thought of sending your children to school and the teacher having their way with them, do you think taking prayer out and putting drugs in was a wise choice? The list goes on and on and the thing I am saying is if you put your belief in something good (like the word of God) and there is nothing evil about God or His suggestions to you, then the world could be a much better place to live. Rest assured it is not me judging you, that's insane to even think that, but it will be God today and in the end. I was only wanting one person to take a good look at this world and ask yourself how can I make it better? And you have to have a guide line like the Bible to give yourself. For those of you who think the old testament is to much and way to crazy it is no longer valid anyway not one person can get to heaven that way, but the old testament is good for the history part of it. I believe alot of you are caught up on the old because it is easier to make fun of. Read the New Testament and find something to make fun of with that.

One thing for sure you can count on I would never try to steal your husband, or abuse or molest your children, kill you, or someone you love dearly, beat you, rape you, rob you, only try to love you just like that book you people all question tells me to do. Now if that's bad then so be it.

[carol134 0]

There is not one single instance in the Bible where Christ mentions homosexuality - not one.

Would it make a difference to you if it were:confused:

Have you got a Bible? 1Corinthians 6: 9-10 Homosexuality activity condemned

Romans 1:24-27

[BJean 16]

Carol: I'm not sure I understand why you think that just because people are discussing the Bible and they question why one directive in the Bible is more important than another in today's society, that anyone believes the Bible is a bad thing to hold dear to your heart. Don't you think it is healthy to question certain passages in the Bible that are troubling?

You are busily defending the Bible as a tool to live by and defending your belief of who actually wrote the Bible. Those are questions of belief like you mentioned earlier in one of your posts. I don't honestly think anyone here is questioning your personal beliefs. It is when someone says that everyone should believe what they believe that it gets dicey. Can you understand why someone would have differing beliefs about who "wrote" the Bible, and which verses are relevant today, and why some parts of the Bible may have been included and others dropped from a printing?

I am wondering what led you to believe the way you do? Don't you think it has something to do with your participation in an organized religion at some point in time? Or did you take up the Bible on your own one day and all your beliefs are based on your personal interpretation of the Bible? Your comments have made me very curious.

[Carlene 12]

Would it make a difference to you if it were:confused:

Have you got a Bible? 1Corinthians 6: 9-10 Homosexuality activity condemned

Romans 1:24-27

Of course I have a Bible. I am a Lector at church. That means I read from the Bible, to the congregation. But I don't own one of the Bibles on your list, so I guess mine isn't "instructed by God", right?

Christ, the ultimate authority, is not quoted in either Corinthians or Romans. My post said that Christ does not say a word about homosexuality in the Bible....and He doesn't. Nevertheless...

"Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate (malakoi), nor abusers of themselves (arsenokoitai) with mankind, Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God."

1 Corinthians 6: 9-10

If the word "homosexual" appears in your Bible in this passage then you're holding a version that was written after 1946, since the word "homosexual" didn't even reach common usage until the late 1800's. Prior to the 1946 Edition of the Revised Standard Version, the words that "homosexual" has replaced in many modern versions have included "boy prostitutes, effeminate, those who make women of themselves, sissies, catamites, the self-indulgent, sodomites, lewd persons, male prostitutes, and the unchaste."

It seems both helpful and honest to recognize that what often finds it's way into current biblical interpretation is not a more informed understanding of the biblical text based on years of accumulative knowledge but on imposing our own culture, complete with its prejudices into the Bible. What else would explain the shift in meaning and the narrowing of focus in the interpretation of this and other passages over the last fifty years?

[Tired_Old_Man 1]

You know you can believe in whatever you like. Put your morals in and take the Bible out (if you don't believe in it) and where do you end up?

Where would we end up if we followed my morals instead of that Christian president and his Christian Congress?

*We would not have almost 3,000 dead US military personal in Iraq.

*We would not have over 20,000 US military personal with injuries received in Iraq.

*We would not have over 10,000 US military personal with life changing crippling injuries received in Iraq.

*We would have more money available for food Stamps to feed starving babies.

*We would have more money available for poor people's health care under the Medicaid program.

*We would have more money available for the elderly people's health care under the Medicare program.

*We would have more Rx drugs available at much lower prices for the elderly people through the Medicare program.

*We would have a higher minimum wage.

*We would not be torturing people suspected of illegal actions.

*We would trying to protect the planet God created for us from pollution and Global Warming.

*We would pass more laws to help the poor than the rich.

*We would not be spending our grand-children's money by borrowing trillions of dollars.

I could go on and on, but I guess you are right, if I substituted my morals for those espoused by those of a man who gets his marching orders from Jesus, then we would be in a terrible mess. :faint:

Do you think marriage to several partners is the answer

But the Mormons base polygamy on the Bible.

do you like the thought of sending your children to school and the teacher having their way with them

That is not a law we passed. That is the free will given by God to his children. Or do you believe that we do not have will and that God knows everything we will ever do and planned our life for us?

do you think taking prayer out and putting drugs in was a wise choice?

If the population of your town or neighborhood had a sudden influx of Buddhists and they became the majority, would you like it for them to pick out the prayers to be said in school each day?

you have to have a guide line like the Bible to give yourself. For those of you who think the old testament is to much and way to crazy it is no longer valid anyway not one person can get to heaven that way, but the old testament is good for the history part of it.

There you go again trying to confuse me. You say that you believe in the 10 commandments and you say that the 10 commandments are in Exodus and Deuteronomy, but then you say that the Old Testament is "no longer valid".

Exodus and Deuteronomy are in the "no longer valid" Old testament.

I believe alot of you are caught up on the old because it is easier to make fun of. Read the New Testament and find something to make fun of with that.

The new Testament condones slavery also.

One thing for sure you can count on I would never try to steal your husband

You can steal my husband anytime you want him.

or abuse or molest your children, kill you, or someone you love dearly, beat you, rape you, rob you

Most Athiests, jews and Muslims that I know also would not rape, rob or murder. Most of the people in US prisons are Christians. Most of the people who commit adulty in the USA are Christians.

I have one question for you and all others who think that we must have a Bible or a God:

If something happened tomorrow to prove that there never was a God; Would you steal my husband, rape me, murder me, rob me, molest my grand-children or beat me?

I didn't think so.

[Tired_Old_Man 1]

"Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate (malakoi), nor abusers of themselves (arsenokoitai) with mankind, Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God."

1 Corinthians 6: 9-10

I used to go to college fraternity parties. Lots of booze and sex.

Well I guess all college kids are going to Hell.

I don't want to embarrass anyone, but I heard that there are only two kinds of people in the world, those that admit masterbating and those that don't admit it.

Oh, and those parts about thieves and extortioners; I guess all of congress is going to Hell also.

I guess the effeminate people will have a lot of company in Hell.

[Tired_Old_Man 1]

Im with you Carlene! When it comes to my hubby he's mine all mine!

Same here!!! :help:

[sheilamj1fan 2]

We as believers in the word of God and his son Jesus are suppose teach and if others choose not to listening and turn from away from sin they will have to face the consequence(hell). In other words our work has been done...bible also say people perish from lack of knowledge. I am a Christian, I believe God's word and I know it will not return void and I know Jesus is coming back for the righteous! Hell is for somebody....

[Alexandra 55]

I have one question for you and all others who think that we must have a Bible or a God:

If something happened tomorrow to prove that there never was a God; Would you steal my husband, rape me, murder me, rob me, molest my grand-children or beat me?

I didn't think so.

Brilliant.

[green 6]

I don't see what the big deal is. Up here in Canada same sex couples have the right to a civil/state marriage. No church can be forced to marry a same sex couple. There are some rogue churches that will, however. The Prime Minister who spearheaded the movement to enshrine this right to marriage in law is a practising Roman Catholic, by the way. He simply felt that this was the right thing to do given that our Constitution is set up in order to protect the rights of minorities.

Of course this will prove awkward if the polygamists set up their own challenge....

As for the legal rights of unmarried heterosexual couples, the government, and businesses, too, have recognized these for decades now. They are on a par with those of married couples. Though my own relationship is long term we have never troubled to get married and likely never will. I guess we're afraid to jinx it.

[Carlene 12]

Carol....most of us here are Christians, too. We may not be the same "brand" of Christian as you, but that doesn't make us less Christian.

I think taking prayer out of the schools was a great idea, and you should too. I'm assuming that you would not like it if your child was taught to pray the Rosary in school, right? But it's only fair....if my child has to listen to prayers from your faith, your children should be exposed to prayers from mine. Doesn't sound like such a good idea when you look at it from that perspective, does it?

Where my DH grew up (W VA) they have snake handlers. That's how they pray....holding up poisonous snakes. That is a very fundamental part of their belief, and that's okay....but I don't think I'd want my kids to learn that, either.

Some churches pray in "tongues". Mine doesn't, so I'd rather my kids didn't.

We make the sign of the cross at the end of most prayers (in the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit). A lot of people find that objectionable, although I don't understand why.

My point is that no one church has all the answers. There is no such thing as a God-approved list of Bibles, no "right" way to pray. We all have a shot at heaven - not just people from one denomination.

Christ preached tolerance and love and peace. He would NEVER create someone a certain way (homosexual, for example) and then condemn them for it.

[anonemouse 1]

It really pisses me off when people say or imply that only Christians are moral people. If the only thing keeping you from raping, killing, and stealing is the fear of going to hell, then you are not a good person, even if you are a Christian. People have morals because they are good people, not because of religion. Personally, I don't lie, steal, rape, or murder because I don't want to be that kind of person. Am I a Christian? No, I am an atheist. In fact, I am a little more moral than many Christians; I don't want to keep two people who love each other apart.

[carol134 0]

If you do not want to keep people that love one another apart then why are you atheist? God loves you too.

[carol134 0]

Where would we end up if we followed my morals instead of that Christian president and his Christian Congress?

*We would not have almost 3,000 dead US military personal in Iraq.

*We would not have over 20,000 US military personal with injuries received in Iraq.

*We would not have over 10,000 US military personal with life changing crippling injuries received in Iraq.

*We would have more money available for food Stamps to feed starving babies.

*We would have more money available for poor people's health care under the Medicaid program.

*We would have more money available for the elderly people's health care under the Medicare program.

*We would have more Rx drugs available at much lower prices for the elderly people through the Medicare program.

*We would have a higher minimum wage.

*We would not be torturing people suspected of illegal actions.

*We would trying to protect the planet God created for us from pollution and Global Warming.

*We would pass more laws to help the poor than the rich.

*We would not be spending our grand-children's money by borrowing trillions of dollars.

I could go on and on, but I guess you are right, if I substituted my morals for those espoused by those of a man who gets his marching orders from Jesus, then we would be in a terrible mess. :faint:

But the Mormons base polygamy on the Bible.

That is not a law we passed. That is the free will given by God to his children. Or do you believe that we do not have will and that God knows everything we will ever do and planned our life for us? If the population of your town or neighborhood had a sudden influx of Buddhists and they became the majority, would you like it for them to pick out the prayers to be said in school each day? There you go again trying to confuse me. You say that you believe in the 10 commandments and you say that the 10 commandments are in Exodus and Deuteronomy, but then you say that the Old Testament is "no longer valid".

Exodus and Deuteronomy are in the "no longer valid" Old testament. The new Testament condones slavery also. You can steal my husband anytime you want him. Most Athiests, jews and Muslims that I know also would not rape, rob or murder. Most of the people in US prisons are Christians. Most of the people who commit adulty in the USA are Christians.

I have one question for you and all others who think that we must have a Bible or a God:

If something happened tomorrow to prove that there never was a God; Would you steal my husband, rape me, murder me, rob me, molest my grand-children or beat me?

I didn't think so.

Most of these things would not even exist to begin with!!!!

[anonemouse 1]

If you do not want to keep people that love one another apart then why are you atheist? God loves you too.

Okay, people saying THAT pisses me off more than anything. I do not believe in God, yours or any other. I am not going to riducule or patronize you for being a Christian, and I expect the same respect in return. THIS is why I usually keep my mouth shut about religion. People make comments that they think are fine, but they aren't. They are being patronizing and insulting. This is an extreme example, but if I was a Satanist, I wouldn't ask you why you were keeping two people that love each other apart (you and Satan) because you believed in God.

So yeah, if you REALLY want to see steam come out of my ears, comments like that do it.