My Suggestion-Stop The Obsessing. Rules Are Meant To Be Broken

[NJSleeveboy 212]

U guys are hysterical. I added one quote from someone in this thread and added a two sentence preface/disclaimer for those like u who don't get it. Backtracked? Lol. No words? That's funny

[lessofmeismore 1,405]

Wow' date=' is that how you have interpreted my post? Or my posts on other threads?

My intent on this board is two-fold. To learn other people's experiences and to share mine. Nothing more.

I don't want anyone to turn into a health nut or go out and run a 5K, if they don't want to. I don't want you to be like me. I want everyone, whether pre or post sleeve, to have the best information they can to fulfill their goals. Some people are looking to only cut back on the quantity of food they eat, as is evidenced by the post asking, "I'm three days post-op, what can I order at Dairy Queen?" While that did make me go, "WOW", it is their choice and their own personal goals. That is fine. Other people are looking to change their lives completely. That is also their choice. I try to share my experience and answer whatever questions are posted honestly as I can. Have I avoided judging people on here? I'd like to say, "No", but alas, I know I, too, have been guilty. I'm human. I am trying to improve myself.

But, look at the threads. Not just the ones posted in the past day or week. The OP says they have read ALL the threads (tongue in cheek, I know) in pre- and post-, which would encompass thousands of threads. If even 10% were read, you would see the common topic of people sliming, throwing up, in terrible pain.

What would you suggest to them?

"Come on! You're 3 weeks post op. I could eat meatballs by then ... what's your problem?"

Real people are having real problems on here. Real people are researching the sleeve and using this site as a reference. I don't think it is responsible forum membership to give the impression that you don't have to follow your Drs guidelines. No matter what your goals are.

That is the jist of I interpret from this thread. Now, just know, the OP has edited his posts and the content has changed, but I am not able to follow each of those edits.

BTW, I define a troll as someone who come on a forum and kicks the hornets nest for no other reason that to create a buzz. That may easily apply to me as I do seem to attract controversy at times. But it is funny, I really don't think I am THAT controversial by suggesting you actually follow your Drs guidelines and call out someone who tells people not to worry about them ...

Curious ...[/quote']

Very well said!

[suzjag 107]

Ok. Rules are SOMETIMES meant to be broken. So' date=' Here's the deal. I am 2 weeks post op today. I am one of those who had zero issues and had a smooth ride from recovery room to date!! This post is not intended to mean I am sure I will have a long term good go at this! It also doesn't address the future, but really ONLY the many threads that I have read regarding the preo op and post op liquid diets and the Pre and post few weeks Do's and Dont's!

I have read almost every post on here before and after surgery, lol. Here is the point that I will explain. Your/Our obsession over following diet rules is what got us here in the first place.. isn't it?? I mean, it's great to have black and white rules.. Do's and Don's. can and cant's.. That's why we were ALL great on Atkins (remember the carb counting obsession), and South Beach (remember how carefully we chose the meals), weight watchers, low cal, grapefruit, slimfast , yada yada yada......RIGHT?

Sure, it worked. THEN WE WENT OFF THE WAGON and got sick of the rules and restrictions and put weight back on (and then some).... That's because it was a DIET.. Why do so many of you do that on here? I'm not judging, but trying to help! Yes, it's easier for me, since I have had no issues. I come from a strong medical family (i had bio as a minor,4 docs and 2 nurses in immed family) and I always love to understand WHY the rules are in place. If something doesn't make sense, I want to know why and not just follow a rule because it was put out there.

My surgeon told me that "rules" are on here for the lower end of reaction spectrum. meaning, many need not follow them, but since 30%, for ex, will have issues with some things, they want to make a general rule......

As EVERYONE says on here, as well as EVERY doc, ALL OF US ARE DIFFERENT! We heal differently, We tolerate pain differently, foods differently, weight loss differently, etc..... EVERY SINGLE ONE So, the rules need not be applied to the T!

Now, as a caveat and from feedback so far on this post, this is not an excuse to eat junk NOR stay on bad habits. I don't mean to enable anyone. here is what BUTTERTHEBEAN wrote:

"The only reason I say "enabling" is because I think there are some people waiting in the wings to hear someone tell them it's okay to eat whatever they want. They haven't tackled their food addictions and they are hoping for "permission" to go back to their old ways. I know there are some that can learn to eat "all things in moderation." I have no problem with that. For me, I chose to embrace my inner health nut. It's not fear or weakness or lack of self control...it's the desire to live a long, healthy and active life. I'm not depriving myself, or sacrifing. The things I'm doing and the life I'm leading now feel way better than eating pizza and cupcakes ever did (even in moderation). By that I mean that food did not give me pleasure (never did, I just thought it did), so I no longer look to food to satisfy my needs, except nutritionally."

Ok... Back to the post. Specifically, here is what I have had debunked by my brother (Anesthesiologist for bariatric), My mom (nurse and nutritionist), my bro's good friend and bariatric surgeon, and my surgeon..........

* Yes, the liquid PRE OP diet is not to be messed with. It sucked, but we need the liver to be soft and looking like liver in a supermarket. That will happen in most cases with one week.. Many docs do one week only and many do 2 weeks..... So, if you have a 2 week doc, don't worry if you cheat a little and wants some low calorie food.. It's OK!! have the soup... etc. I didn't cheat as mine was only a week and I did not want to have a lifetime of liver issues if it was frail and broke a bit/injured while being moved for my surgery....

* Most docs on here POST OP put you on liquids for 2 weeks.. Why?? NOTHING medical. Really? Many docs, including mine, put me on Clear Liquids only day 1 in the hospital and then put me instantly on pureed foods (tuna salad, chicken salad, egg salad, greek yogurts, ricotta cheese, etc).. Yes. DAY 2! He does this for EVERY patient.. He has had NO MORE COMPLICATIONS than anyone else ever.... It is NOT true that eating this will cause a leak.. It can't get caught in you stitches, lol, as they are on the outside and you can't see them even in your stomach.. The ONLY risk is a)that you eat way too much and thus can cause leaks, so don't do that. and that is WAY too much. Meaning you go out of your way to test the limits. As any surgeon will tell you, stretching the stomach to break the staples is no easy task.... easy enough to follow that rule .. and <img src='http://www.bariatricpal.com/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/cool.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='' /> the risk is that you get nauseated.. Ok.. we are all different. Some take 90 minutes the first time they eat to get down 4 oz of chicken salad.. I didn't . I got it down in 15 min and could have done it in 5..... But the point is, listen to your body. start slowly and if you tolerate it, then screw the rules.....

What does this mean? It means so what if you doc put you on 2 week post liquid. That is soo hard.. so, do it mostly, but don't obsess about cheating. have a friggin plate of tuna salad.. It will taste yummy.. Add some great yogurt. If you can handle it, you are good to go! I did.. They also want you on this liquid to max your weight loss for motivation up front? do you really need that?? I don't care if it takes me 1 more week than you to hit the same goal? Frankly, I decided to keep my calories around 800ish anyway for my first 2 weeks. It was a little hard, but nothing like your liquid nightmare and i lost as much weight... I'm now on 1200 cal full diet plan (less hard carbs and hard veggies) as of last night.

I've heard people say they are craving one Dorito chip.. Then the advice replies were "lick the cheese off" or "take a bit and spit it out...." LOL. Really? This is your diet/lifestyle for the rest of your life. HAVE A CHIP.. See if you get a lot of gas.. Chew it well.. If not problem, then enjoy the one chip. You got here because you at a half bag . One or three chips won't kill you! You need to find a way to eat what you will do.. The docs want you to build your healthy habits now.

*The first year is where you get your max weight loss- Ok. For sure,, so, as noted, build your healthy habits now.. but make it last. So, if I want a Dorito chip. I have one or two.. On my pureed phase, my kids had pretzels at a game. I took 2 small ones....I had a qtr of his hotdog meat.. The point is, if we can seriously lower the number of calories we eat (which, for me, they figured i was eating between 3500-4000 per day and needed to be at 2400 or so.. Now, with 1200, which believe me, with the sleeve is a mini feast, I will be eating half the amount and will lose a lot of weight. So, yes, build good eating habits and i'm working on good food choices that I can live with! Can I eat white bread. Damn right?should I// nO?? it's a waste of calories and spikes your sugar and appetite. But, I sure will if i want a hamburger or great sandwich. A month ago i would have had 2 cheeseburgers and 2 hotdogs at a bbq. .So, guess what, i'll lose weight. Can't make it a daily thing.. But, again, stop obsessing..

*Eating and drinking slowly eating- well, you don't HAVE to eat slowly, but as we have been told our whole lives, eat slowly so that when you are really full, you know it! Also, you need to see what your bod can tolerate and if you eat too quickly, you may not have realized you were about to puke. If you can tolerate it, you can eat and drink quicker than others, but not a good idea for reasons mentioned. so work on it, but don't obsess.. At the hospital, they told me I had to drink in in little tiny medical cups a few cc evry 20 min. I laughed, as Water went down easily in recovery even. ALL NURSES TOLD ME NO. When I saw my doc, i asked why I can't just drink as I can tolerate it at home and get my 64 oz is. HE said dont' chug, but do whatever you can do without discomfort. So, 8 oz bottle of water went down in 5 minutes... etc....

*Chewing your food- ALL true... We have that banana sized stomach.. So, the doughy breads, and stringy veggies and large pieces of non chewed enough food INDEED often get stuck! Not stuck like a lap band, but rather, they move toward the pyloric valve and are too big to pass through it, since there isn't as much acid, etc in your stomach and, well, the route to the valve is now MUCH shorter.. So, it sits in front of it and as soon as the next item goes there, it waits in line. your body puts out gas and then knows there is a problem, so will signal you to vomit it up. not fun... So, chew! All true! Also makes us take longer to eat and thus enjoy the tastes more than ever and have the full signal sent to our brain while we are still eating or pretty close to that!

*Caffein is bad... Ok. Google whether it's an appetite suppressant or stimulant.. It's hysterical.. You'll get equal replies from GREAT sources that say the opposite. I WANT my one cup a day. I'm not an addict. I asked. I am now sipping on my first REAL one. It is indeed a diuretic for some. So, drink a half cup more water than a day! If you feel it makes you hungry after you have it and you don't want to hold back, then stop the coffee.. It doesn't for me. It does for some... But what will you be doing in a year from now??/ There is NO medical reason why you can't have caffein after a few weeks

*ALCOHOL is a no no for 2 months. NONSENSE.. Again, just there so we don't put empty calories. BUT what if I WANT one drink or two on a date tonight?? I am told, go for it, but just know you will have ingested 400 wasted calories. Ok. I get it, but I WILL drink in my life, although never drank a ton and that was not the cause of most of my weight.. Watch the calories and don't do it twice most weeks.. Or if you will, then cut back a bit on your Snacks, etc. Anyway, looking forward to a martini with my date tomorrow at dinner.. Oh, most people on here for a while, will tell you since there is less food to bind with alcohol, it goes into your intestines/blood stream much quicker and you get a nice buzz faster with less! way cool!

* Most other rules and comments on here are just not universal and again, if you feel the NEED to cheat, then well, cheat! How can it be cheating if this will be your new life! WOrk hard at right food choices and don't make this soooo hard. The harder you make it, the more YOU WILL revolt and end up going off the wagon like the good old days... Since I have had no pain, etc and pretty much eat what I wanted (and cheated on my puree period even), I feel this is just toooo easy. I hear so many of you struggling (not because you have pain, but because you want to break a rul) and so many of you "supporting them" to stay strong, that I just wanted to add this post! Also, again, much of the medical advice that our well meaning friends on here provide, just isn't true. Sorry, but it isnt.

I hope this helps some of you enjoy your Pre and Post diets much more than you may be now!

Best, my friends!

You're a brave soul I can hear the puckering already. Lol. I TOTALLY agree. I remember I was 6 days post op and ate some avocado and posted about it and u would have thought I stuck a sword in myself. The reaction was intense. Anyway thank u thank u for the common sense. Much appreciated.

[suzjag 107]

For me it's like a break up after a bad relationship. Once I've made up my mind it's over' date=' I don't look back. And I definitely do not go back for post break up shenanigans. That's just me. I realize some people do.

I know that's a silly analogy, but it's the best I got this early in the morning.[/quote']

Actually that's a great analogy!

[suzjag 107]

It seems that there are two major groups on this forum. Those who get the sleeve and use the tool to eat less and loose weight and those who get the sleeve to kick off a new life of healthly eating' date=' exersice, Protein Shakes and basicly a totally new life. The first group, in which I belong, is a little more laid back, we are going to incorporate birthday cake and margaritas. I would love it if the group of "Sleeve life changer- health nuts" would give us "Laid back sleevers" a break and not accuse of us of being trolls, or giving bad advice. We have a different lifestyle, it is okay not to be just like you, I promise. There needs to be room for both types of people on this forum. When I first started reading I thought the only people on here were health fanatics, I am glad to see there are people who are not running 5k's and drinking Protein shakes 4 weeks out.[/quote']

Great point!

[Kalimomof3 613]

Don't bother posting unless you agree with the op because he only goes back and changes ALL his posts and comments.

That is deceitful and shows your character.

You are editing your entire posts and responses. Much more then adding a disclaimer or quotes from other posters. Unbelievable

Smh

Read the 6th? Paragraph down and he puts a caveat in there and he says "based on feedback from this post" He clearly states that the little bit he added to his original post is based on some feedback on that very post. How do you perceive this to be deceitful when he clearly states what he has done?

I don't think I either completely agree or disagree with what he has posted but I get the feeling that you disagree and are just T'd off...but idk

[Blubel 15]

Ok. Rules are SOMETIMES meant to be broken. So, Here's the deal. I am 2 weeks post op today. I am one of those who had zero issues and had a smooth ride from recovery room to date!! This post is not intended to mean I am sure I will have a long term good go at this! It also doesn't address the future, but really ONLY the many threads that I have read regarding the preo op and post op liquid diets and the Pre and post few weeks Do's and Dont's!

I have read almost every post on here before and after surgery, lol. Here is the point that I will explain. Your/Our obsession over following diet rules is what got us here in the first place.. isn't it?? I mean, it's great to have black and white rules.. Do's and Don's. can and cant's.. That's why we were ALL great on Atkins (remember the carb counting obsession), and South Beach (remember how carefully we chose the meals), weight watchers, low cal, grapefruit, slimfast , yada yada yada......RIGHT?

Sure, it worked. THEN WE WENT OFF THE WAGON and got sick of the rules and restrictions and put weight back on (and then some).... That's because it was a DIET.. Why do so many of you do that on here? I'm not judging, but trying to help! Yes, it's easier for me, since I have had no issues. I come from a strong medical family (i had bio as a minor,4 docs and 2 nurses in immed family) and I always love to understand WHY the rules are in place. If something doesn't make sense, I want to know why and not just follow a rule because it was put out there.

My surgeon told me that "rules" are on here for the lower end of reaction spectrum. meaning, many need not follow them, but since 30%, for ex, will have issues with some things, they want to make a general rule......

As EVERYONE says on here, as well as EVERY doc, ALL OF US ARE DIFFERENT! We heal differently, We tolerate pain differently, foods differently, weight loss differently, etc..... EVERY SINGLE ONE So, the rules need not be applied to the T!

Now, as a caveat and from feedback so far on this post, this is not an excuse to eat junk NOR stay on bad habits. I don't mean to enable anyone. here is what BUTTERTHEBEAN wrote:

"The only reason I say "enabling" is because I think there are some people waiting in the wings to hear someone tell them it's okay to eat whatever they want. They haven't tackled their food addictions and they are hoping for "permission" to go back to their old ways. I know there are some that can learn to eat "all things in moderation." I have no problem with that. For me, I chose to embrace my inner health nut. It's not fear or weakness or lack of self control...it's the desire to live a long, healthy and active life. I'm not depriving myself, or sacrifing. The things I'm doing and the life I'm leading now feel way better than eating pizza and cupcakes ever did (even in moderation). By that I mean that food did not give me pleasure (never did, I just thought it did), so I no longer look to food to satisfy my needs, except nutritionally."

Ok... Back to the post. Specifically, here is what I have had debunked by my brother (Anesthesiologist for bariatric), My mom (nurse and nutritionist), my bro's good friend and bariatric surgeon, and my surgeon..........

* Yes, the liquid PRE OP diet is not to be messed with. It sucked, but we need the liver to be soft and looking like liver in a supermarket. That will happen in most cases with one week.. Many docs do one week only and many do 2 weeks..... So, if you have a 2 week doc, don't worry if you cheat a little and wants some low calorie food.. It's OK!! have the soup... etc. I didn't cheat as mine was only a week and I did not want to have a lifetime of liver issues if it was frail and broke a bit/injured while being moved for my surgery....

* Most docs on here POST OP put you on liquids for 2 weeks.. Why?? NOTHING medical. Really? Many docs, including mine, put me on clear liquids only day 1 in the hospital and then put me instantly on pureed foods (tuna salad, chicken salad, egg salad, greek yogurts, ricotta cheese, etc).. Yes. DAY 2! He does this for EVERY patient.. He has had NO MORE COMPLICATIONS than anyone else ever.... It is NOT true that eating this will cause a leak.. It can't get caught in you stitches, lol, as they are on the outside and you can't see them even in your stomach.. The ONLY risk is a)that you eat way too much and thus can cause leaks, so don't do that. and that is WAY too much. Meaning you go out of your way to test the limits. As any surgeon will tell you, stretching the stomach to break the staples is no easy task.... easy enough to follow that rule .. and the risk is that you get nauseated.. Ok.. we are all different. Some take 90 minutes the first time they eat to get down 4 oz of chicken salad.. I didn't . I got it down in 15 min and could have done it in 5..... But the point is, listen to your body. start slowly and if you tolerate it, then screw the rules.....

What does this mean? It means so what if you doc put you on 2 week post liquid. That is soo hard.. so, do it mostly, but don't obsess about cheating. have a friggin plate of tuna salad.. It will taste yummy.. Add some great yogurt. If you can handle it, you are good to go! I did.. They also want you on this liquid to max your weight loss for motivation up front? do you really need that?? I don't care if it takes me 1 more week than you to hit the same goal? Frankly, I decided to keep my calories around 800ish anyway for my first 2 weeks. It was a little hard, but nothing like your liquid nightmare and i lost as much weight... I'm now on 1200 cal full diet plan (less hard carbs and hard veggies) as of last night.

I've heard people say they are craving one Dorito chip.. Then the advice replies were "lick the cheese off" or "take a bit and spit it out...." LOL. Really? This is your diet/lifestyle for the rest of your life. HAVE A CHIP.. See if you get a lot of gas.. Chew it well.. If not problem, then enjoy the one chip. You got here because you at a half bag . One or three chips won't kill you! You need to find a way to eat what you will do.. The docs want you to build your healthy habits now.

*The first year is where you get your max weight loss- Ok. For sure,, so, as noted, build your healthy habits now.. but make it last. So, if I want a Dorito chip. I have one or two.. On my pureed phase, my kids had pretzels at a game. I took 2 small ones....I had a qtr of his hotdog meat.. The point is, if we can seriously lower the number of calories we eat (which, for me, they figured i was eating between 3500-4000 per day and needed to be at 2400 or so.. Now, with 1200, which believe me, with the sleeve is a mini feast, I will be eating half the amount and will lose a lot of weight. So, yes, build good eating habits and i'm working on good food choices that I can live with! Can I eat white bread. Damn right?should I// nO?? it's a waste of calories and spikes your sugar and appetite. But, I sure will if i want a hamburger or great sandwich. A month ago i would have had 2 cheeseburgers and 2 hotdogs at a bbq. .So, guess what, i'll lose weight. Can't make it a daily thing.. But, again, stop obsessing..

*Eating and drinking slowly eating- well, you don't HAVE to eat slowly, but as we have been told our whole lives, eat slowly so that when you are really full, you know it! Also, you need to see what your bod can tolerate and if you eat too quickly, you may not have realized you were about to puke. If you can tolerate it, you can eat and drink quicker than others, but not a good idea for reasons mentioned. so work on it, but don't obsess.. At the hospital, they told me I had to drink in in little tiny medical cups a few cc evry 20 min. I laughed, as Water went down easily in recovery even. ALL NURSES TOLD ME NO. When I saw my doc, i asked why I can't just drink as I can tolerate it at home and get my 64 oz is. HE said dont' chug, but do whatever you can do without discomfort. So, 8 oz bottle of water went down in 5 minutes... etc....

*Chewing your food- ALL true... We have that banana sized stomach.. So, the doughy breads, and stringy veggies and large pieces of non chewed enough food INDEED often get stuck! Not stuck like a lap band, but rather, they move toward the pyloric valve and are too big to pass through it, since there isn't as much acid, etc in your stomach and, well, the route to the valve is now MUCH shorter.. So, it sits in front of it and as soon as the next item goes there, it waits in line. your body puts out gas and then knows there is a problem, so will signal you to vomit it up. not fun... So, chew! All true! Also makes us take longer to eat and thus enjoy the tastes more than ever and have the full signal sent to our brain while we are still eating or pretty close to that!

*Caffein is bad... Ok. Google whether it's an appetite suppressant or stimulant.. It's hysterical.. You'll get equal replies from GREAT sources that say the opposite. I WANT my one cup a day. I'm not an addict. I asked. I am now sipping on my first REAL one. It is indeed a diuretic for some. So, drink a half cup more water than a day! If you feel it makes you hungry after you have it and you don't want to hold back, then stop the coffee.. It doesn't for me. It does for some... But what will you be doing in a year from now??/ There is NO medical reason why you can't have caffein after a few weeks

*ALCOHOL is a no no for 2 months. NONSENSE.. Again, just there so we don't put empty calories. BUT what if I WANT one drink or two on a date tonight?? I am told, go for it, but just know you will have ingested 400 wasted calories. Ok. I get it, but I WILL drink in my life, although never drank a ton and that was not the cause of most of my weight.. Watch the calories and don't do it twice most weeks.. Or if you will, then cut back a bit on your Snacks, etc. Anyway, looking forward to a martini with my date tomorrow at dinner.. Oh, most people on here for a while, will tell you since there is less food to bind with alcohol, it goes into your intestines/blood stream much quicker and you get a nice buzz faster with less! way cool!

* Most other rules and comments on here are just not universal and again, if you feel the NEED to cheat, then well, cheat! How can it be cheating if this will be your new life! WOrk hard at right food choices and don't make this soooo hard. The harder you make it, the more YOU WILL revolt and end up going off the wagon like the good old days... Since I have had no pain, etc and pretty much eat what I wanted (and cheated on my puree period even), I feel this is just toooo easy. I hear so many of you struggling (not because you have pain, but because you want to break a rul) and so many of you "supporting them" to stay strong, that I just wanted to add this post! Also, again, much of the medical advice that our well meaning friends on here provide, just isn't true. Sorry, but it isnt.

I hope this helps some of you enjoy your Pre and Post diets much more than you may be now!

Best, my friends!

The BEST quote I have read on this entire sight! You took the words right out of my mouth. Bravo! Hats off to you. It wasnt the half a cupcake or the two mouthfuls of diet coke that got me here in the first place, it was the slab of cake and 2 cans of real coke followed by a bag of chips and then some Maccas.

Im not going to deprive myself. Im going to still enjoy all my favourite food but in much smaller portions. Have been sleeved for 10 weeks, no complications and still have a steady weightloss.

Life is great

[mylifeinpink 349]

LOL!

Lmao! Someone's so busy talking he doesn't LISTEN! I love people like that!

[NJSleeveboy 212]

I have to say.. 48 LIKES and only 4 naysayers.. ALL of us are entitled to their own opinions, of course. Keep it nice!! It is fun, though, being on the winning side of the debate per the populous :-)

OOPS 18 to 4.. Same point, though

[NJSleeveboy 212]

Read the 6th? Paragraph down and he puts a caveat in there and he says "based on feedback from this post" He clearly states that the little bit he added to his original post is based on some feedback on that very post. How do you perceive this to be deceitful when he clearly states what he has done?

I don't think I either completely agree or disagree with what he has posted but I get the feeling that you disagree and are just T'd off...but idk

@Kalimomo You are so right.. Yes, they don't agree, which is fine, but are ticked off. So, instead of just giving nice, professional and friendly different points of you, they try to get ant agonistical and negative.. People never cease to amaze me. I often feel both pity and sadness for people like that.. Could be a chemical imbalance; A sense of entitlement from being spoiled by family; or perhaps anger over how they were treated when they were heavier.. Who knows..

[PdxMan 4,292]

Neil, I think you may have completely missed my point. You are so obsessed with being "right" and with the populous. If you really want to have a p!$$ contest, then go add the "likes" on my posts and you will see the nubmers even up a bit more.

You still have not responded to my lasts posts, either. Can you do that without being a smart @$$?

Your pride and ego have gotten the better of you in this discussion and blinded you to the points being made. I don't know how I can get this across any clearer, but I'll try one more time.

I completely agree with your original post. Even the one you had before you edited it and softened it up. People should not obsess about falling off the wagon. But you were suggesting that they do not need to follow the Drs guidelines, and I disagreed. I do believe that is irresponsible and to tell people otherwise could have negative consequences in their lives. Can you not see this?

It is my opinion, from my personal experience and reading thousands of threads over the last 17 months on this and other sites, that you are in the minority as far as the foods you are able to eat so early on. I am amazed at what you are able to eat and know that because of this, you will have an easier go with this journey. Since you state that you have read all of the pre- and post-op threads, what do you think? I tried to progress to what you are doing and there was just no possible way. You were able to drink more the first week of surgery than I was after the first month. Am I saying everyone is like me? No way, but surely you don't expect everyone to be like you, either.

You got your back up when I said that if you were saying all this stuff for the sole purpose of stirring the pot, you were a troll. Believe it or not, there are people like that. I've been on forums and bulletin boards since before the WWW existed and have come across many. They have nothing better to do with their time. I was merely saying that if that was your intention, to get everyone riled up. You were a troll. If that wasn't your intention, then you were not.

Please don't read my posts so defensively. As stated in my previous posts, my intention on this forum is to share my experience as I know it. I worry about the person researching the sleeve and reading a post like this and think they do not have to follow their Drs guidelines.

[NJSleeveboy 212]

@PDX.. Ok. I do feel the same about you in terms of not listening, but let me try to answer quickly.. Yes, I so agree that telling people not to follow their docs orders is dangerous! Yes, I so agree that I am not normal in terms of how well SO FAR I have adjusted ...

Tried to tell you that I am not telling people to disregard and only talking about preop and the first 2 weeks. So, yes, if a doc tells them they need two weeks of liquids, I am simply sharing that mine, as well as many others only require one week, so they can do the math or decide if they want to have a healthy snack during that 2 weeks of pre diet liquid hell. Even for me, on one week pre-op, my nurse there told me WHEN I CALLED that I could have chicken noodle Soup and not to sweat it......

Re the next 2 weeks, I am not talking about how well I tolerated purees. That is NOT why he put me on them. I pointed out that he puts ALL of his patients to purees on day 2 post surgery.. NOthing to do with how well I handled my food. NOt saying they will and not saying they should do anything differently if they don't want to OR if their doc specifically told them not to do anything because of their specific issues.. People should know that many docs allow it and that the majority of posts I have read about what it will do to you if you do, as to be BS as a)then no doc would allow purees on day 2 and things like your staples getting caught in a pretzel is comical.. That was my point. People can read the whole thing I wrote (hence what it was a long post) and make their decisions if they need to obsess or just have try for ONE meal on ONE day, some tuna etc (like I or many did)..... I feel they are guidelines and tried to find out which were musts (ie need a majority liquid pre-op for liver to be nice and limber and shiny is a MUST) and which are opinions that many Docs vary on......

Re my back up, sure. But u didn't say I may or may not be a troll. You disagreed with some of my points on my replies and called me on it and also said "I have to call BS on that. No doc would tell you to have meatball".. .. So, your last post was very professional, and hence my reply to yours now is. But that was not the case.. That said.. NO doctor would put "eat meatballs" in their post bariatric diet plan.. He told me that at my two week follow up when I told him where I cheated and how well I tolerated that.. How I can't believe how many obsess and is it ok for me to try some of these things.. He and the NUT explained the risks of not being strict and eating a full bag of chips or a 4 meatballs, but told me that I should live it up and have a half if that makes it easier..". FOR ME, not for the populous.

Things like the alcohol or caffein, etc should not be taken by me at all as what they should do.. HOWEVER< they should , if they wish, ask their docs and get their advice! I asked about the coffee FOR ME and about the Alcohol FOR ME". We had a discussion about the reasons and possible mental risks, but they concurred. I was just sharing.

I hope this both answers your questions and explains my position so that you also finally get what I am saying.. I suggest a truce on the topic, unless we find new material to debate professionally over :-)

[Readytolose2012 88]

I follow my Dr guidelines because I want to change my bad habits and it was to give myself the very best chance at a successful journey. Sure I got tired of full liquids, but as I started progressing between stages I appreciated the guidelines even more. At 5 weeks I have a hard time getting 1/2 cup of solids in and I wouldn't eve want to try beef!! I tried ground turkey and couldn't do it.

Everyone is different for sure but following "Drs order" is always a safe bet.

[PdxMan 4,292]

But u didn't say I may or may not be a troll.

To suggest that others should throw caution to the wind and do it too is just irresponsible. If this is what you are suggesting, then I gotta mark you as a troll and not a true VSG recipient who wants to come on a WLS board and f*ck with a bunch of people's heads.

Actually, from the bold part above, I qualified it. I trust you have re-read my posts perhaps from a less defensive position?

And you have gone back and edited some of your posts to soften them up, and not that you probably really care, but I appreciate that, thanks.

As I have said, I just want to share my experience and help those researching this life altering choice.

Thanks for sharing yours, Neil. This is what makes this community great. We are a family, all disfunctions included!

[NJSleeveboy 212]

@pdx. Agreed! .. and Hold me! :-)