AirLine Security Insight

[Tired_Old_Man 1]

Many of you may be alarmed to hear and read about all the incidences of security problems on board commercial airliners or during the boarding process.

As a person with some inside knowledge of the industry, I want to explain that the news is blown way out of proportion. Yes, we are living in a dangerous time. But because the pilots are reacting to every incident with an “we need to make an emergency landing” call to the air-traffic controllers, does not mean that the skies are any meaner. Because the Captain is afraid to leave the cockpit to investigate an incident that a cabin attendant reports, which prior to the hijacking plot news released from London, would have just been a verbal discussion, does not mean that there are any more problems than earlier.

Everyone is playing it safe and that is good. But when 4 planes return on one day, there are problems. One problem is that people will get disgusted which could lead to an ugly incident and another is that people will get jaded and not really pay attention to real reasons to be alarmed.

The fear of flying is causing a lot of stress which manifests itself as aberrant behavior by the passengers. The fear of flying is causing a lot of stress which manifests itself as cabin attendants having no compassion for the flying public. Put those two together and there will be incident after incident. How many of these recent incidents led to actual arrests? And how many of those arrests led to prosecution? How many of these recent incidents were terrorist related?

Even Friday's arrest of a fool who carried dynamite in checked luggage was not a terrorist issue. What scares me most is, "How did the dynamite get that far?" It was not found until after it had flown. There was dynamite, but it was not a bomb.

While I worked for a major airline for 35 years, there were probably more than a hundred bomb scares called into my airline at the airport that I worked at. No, not 100 bomb threats at the airport where I worked, not 100 at the airline that I worked for, but over 100 at my airline's terminals or hangar at the airport where I worked. It also happened at most other airports and to most other airlines and these nation-wide bomb scares that took place didn't make the news after the first dozen or so.

The airline that I worked for always evacuated the effected building and sent in a search party. Most times, I did not volunteer to be in the search party. There is something unnerving about pushing your hands into areas to search for a bomb, knowing that your hand dislodging the bomb might set it off. But while in management, I was automatically volunteered and I went on my share of searches. After 911, we searched every plane, every day, crawling into the bowels of the planes.

Also there were many times that the police met flights in order to arrest a passenger that had been unruly during the flight. Most times pre-911, the Captain would have settled the passenger down in-flight while the other pilot flew the plane. Captains tend to be much larger and more authoritative than cabin attendants, so therefor they get more respect and the issues didn't develop into a need to call ahead for police to meet the plane to make arrests. But because of the post-911 fear of a hijacker getting into the cockpit when the Captain comes out, the smaller, usually female, less authoritative, less macho (in the eyes of the unruly passenger) cabin attendant is not able to quell the problem and if there is an air-marshal aboard and he breaks cover, there will be arrests and therefor media coverage.

Pre-911, I had to park aircraft on the tarmac to get an unruly passenger off the flight without having the aircraft go back to the gate. I have had to escort police to the meeting place so that they could arrest unruly passengers. I am not talking once or twice, but too many times to remember. None of these stories made the news. Today these incidents would be on the front page of your newspaper and the lead story on the nightly news.

Is it safe to fly? Safer than driving your car to the airport. Even during the 7 day period ending on 911, less people died in commercial airliner crashes than died in traffic accidents. Think about that fact.

[green 6]

This is really interesting to me for a number of reasons. I fly from time to time. I love watching A&E's show, Airline. And I also build aircraft so I am aware of the safety measures that go into them at the time of the build. Thanx for posting the above.

[joliesmom 0]

T-O-M, Do you fly, because if you're in the industry and you fly I'd feel much better? The biggest laugh I got was after the London Incident they were showing on TV women that they were having taste baby food. I sat and thought if they were terrorists would they have a problem with tasting poisoned baby food. I agree that most incidences are blown out of proportion. I have issues with flying not due to terrorism but more due to the idea of something that large staying in the air. I still fly, now with valium so I don't think about it.

[green 6]

JMom, I am not the person you asked the question of but I do build aircraft, and I can tell you that at every stage of the build they are being checked by inspectors who have to approve the work and then sign the work off. In fact, both the inspector and those who are involved with the build have to put their names to the paperwork concerning the construction of that part of the aircraft, no matter how large or small. This means that they must take responsibility. This is part of the reason why aircraft are so expensive, this system of checks and double-checks and maintaining documentation on every little thing that goes into the build (including washers, nuts, and bolts). When the buyer takes the aircraft over all this paperwork goes with the aircraft. In addition, the buyer's own team of specialists go over the new aircraft with a fine-toothed comb. One of the reasons for this is to find mistakes; any mistakes that they may find mean that they can request thousands of dollars off the plane from the manufacturer. The mistakes are fixed of course.

When a plane does go down, this is usually a fluke. Aircraft are a much safer mode of travelling than cars. Still, the idea of flying is unnatural to most of us, and that is why we feel a little antsy. It is only normal.

And by the way, I do fly a lot.

[joliesmom 0]

Still, the idea of flying is unnatural to most of us, and that is why we feel a little antsy. It is only normal. And by the way, I do fly a lot.

Thank you, you worded it correctly with the unnatural. I feel better when I hear of people in the industry (pilots, stewards excluded) that fly. Thanks for the info on the inspections, maybe I can decrease the valium some when flying.

[Tired_Old_Man 1]

T-O-M, Do you fly, because if you're in the industry and you fly I'd feel much better? The biggest laugh I got was after the London Incident they were showing on TV women that they were having taste baby food. I sat and thought if they were terrorists would they have a problem with tasting poisoned baby food. I agree that most incidences are blown out of proportion. I have issues with flying not due to terrorism but more due to the idea of something that large staying in the air. I still fly, now with valium so I don't think about it.

I have flown more than 400 times.

More people die in their bathrooms taking showers and baths than die in commercial airliner crashes.

More people died in the 7 day period ending in (and including) 911 in auto crashes than in plane crashes.

[joliesmom 0]

I have flown more than 400 times.

More people die in their bathrooms taking showers and baths than die in commercial airliner crashes.

More people died in the 7 day period ending in (and including) 911 in auto crashes than in plane crashes.

Thanks guys for your answers. When I went for my band I had to fly from Philly to San Diego, people would say are you scared about your surgery and I would say no I'm scared about flying. Thanks to your answers I do feel better.

Thanks again,

Patti

[Tired_Old_Man 1]

Many years ago, I was leaving the hangar to go home on my motorcycle and I walked past a pilot who was waiting for the bus that went from the hangar to the terminal in order to catch his flight. He saw me and said, "TOM, I didn't know you rode a motorcycle. Isn't that dangerous?"

I answered with a question, "Captain, has any of your neighbors (upon finding out that you were a pilot) said, "I didn't know you flew airplanes. Isn't that dangerous"?"

[Bettina 0]

I was in London during the bombings...i was at that square..just missed it by a few hours. I was very nervous on the plane, but glad to be going to a safer place.

[Tired_Old_Man 1]

Many years ago, I was leaving the hangar to go home on my motorcycle and I walked past a pilot who was waiting for the bus that went from the hangar to the terminal in order to catch his flight. He saw me and said, "TOM, I didn't know you rode a motorcycle. Isn't that dangerous?"

I answered with a question, "Captain, has any of your neighbors (upon finding out that you were a pilot) said, "I didn't know you flew airplanes. Isn't that dangerous"?"

By the way, that Pilot's name was Jack.

One day he was walking up the jetway to the plane as I was leaving the cockpit. The 747 pilot was with his co-pilot and flight engineer. They all said, "Hello TOM". I knew all three of them well and said, "Hi Bill. Hi Dany. Hello Jack."

[green 6]

Yep, I have flown to a lot of foreign countries, and then I have flown with domestic airlines inside these countries. A lot of these countries are third world countries, and yet here I am alive and well, and I am gonna get banded this Thursday.

[Carlene 12]

I fly a lot, but I am still a white-knuckle, Xanax popping passenger. My DH is a retired maintenance crew chief with 35+ years in the industry. He says that there has only been ONE crash in the history of commercial aviation that was attributed to a maintenance crew error. Something about changing both oil filters at the same time. Now they can only change one (or two, if the plane has four engines).

Even though Bob is always the voice of doom - whatever can go wrong, will go wrong, if you ask him - he is never anxious on an airplane.

[Tired_Old_Man 1]

If you read the investigation report of any aircraft accident, you will notice that one thing never dooms a plane to crash. In fact two things don't. It normally takes 4 or 5 or more things.

If one person doesn't do his job properly, there are usually three or more people who have the chance to pick up the error. A fully loaded 747 from my airline blew two engines on take-off. The plane was a few hundred feet off the ground and over Water, so the pilot nosed the plane down, applied more power to the other two engines until the plane was stabilized and then climbed as slowly as possible until he was high enough to dump about 30,000 gallons of fuel, and then he landed the plane safely.

You probably didn't hear about that one. But why should you? Except for a few "white knuckles", no one was hurt.

[Wheetsin 714]

A couple points...

My father spent 20 years military working on, and then chiefing a group that worked on, military aircraft (jets, and then anti-submarine helicopters). When he retired from the military he obtained his A&P license and started working for TWA as a mechanic supervisor until they started to take a nose dive & he was laid off. After TWA he worked for a brief period at AA until deciding that the civilian airline industry was too unstable to be a career, and pursued a different line of work. Point being - he spent the majority of his life building or fixing military & commercial airplanes, and never thinks twice about stepping on to one as a passenger.

I fly relatively frequently, perhaps 20 times a year for work and another 5 - 10 for personal. In my lifetime I've probably flown 150 - 200 times. I've had four bad experiences: two were weather-related and two were seemingly pilot-related.

I think there are a few things behind the uproar that plane issues elicit. One is that, for the most part, people feel helpless on a plane. While not necessarily in control of what happens to them in their car, people feel in control of it. On a plane there's no doubt that you are in the hands of the pilot, equipment, etc.

Another thing is that when something goes wrong, it goes wrong on a large scale. Maybe two or three people die in a single car crash, but 185 die in a single plane crash. Sometimes no people die, sometimes just a few, but when it does happen it makes a much bigger ripple.

Just remember - there's no reason to be scared of flying. It's the crashing that gets ya.

Here's a twisted way of looking at it that I shared with my MIL (there are 9 non-stop hours of flying between us), that actually helped her. The odds of dying in a plane crash are so, so slim -- like slimmer than winning the lottery. I have no reason to think my chances are that GOOD.

Now in 3 weeks when I take off to Chicago, never to be heard from again, you guys can quote this message as part of my eulogy. :heh:

[Carlene 12]

After TWA he worked for a brief period at AA until deciding that the civilian airline industry was too unstable to be a career, and pursued a different line of work. ]

My DH rode down with Braniff, after almost 20 years, then signed on with AA for almost as long. It is a VERY unstable industry for the employees, but the passengers are not endangered by the cut backs, bankruptcy filings, etc. Airlines don't cut corners with respect to maintenance when they get in financial trouble. They just stop feeding the passengers, ask the employees (except for top management) to give back vacation, take less pay, etc. Don't be afraid to fly on an airline just because they are financially in the red.

I will say this, however. Some airlines are seeking permission to out-source some routine maintainance work to Mexico, where the mechanics do not have to have individual A&P licenses - only the supervisors are required to be licensed. That would worry me, as a passenger, whether I was paying or flying non-rev. I think those carriers should be required to disclose to the public that they out source maintainance, if they are ever allowed to do so.