Muscle Depletion?

[massindex 346]

So I just finished my second half marathon and I've noticed something consist with each race. About half way through, my body seems like it completely depletes of any energy stored. I don't seem to be able to store enough energy to keep me powered, my legs begin to cramp and my toes stand straight up. I don't feel like its fluids because I'm pretty well hydrated and I'm drinking both Water and electrolytes on the course.

Has any one got tips or ideas what is going on? I don't seem to have these with my sprint triathlons, which are shorter distances (at least on the running and swimming side). I'm wondering if my inability to consume enough calories because of the VSG will prevent me from running these half marathons all the way. I end up having to walk in the last 5-6 miles, which goes against my 'overly' competitive nature.

Thoughts?

[KellyL 173]

Are you taking a Multi-Vitamin? How about Calcium and Magnesium and Vit D3 and B12? Also have you had any bloodwork done lately? I'm not sure, but it sounds like maybe Vitamin related.

[massindex 346]

I take multi-vitamins every day and I double up the two weeks leading into a race. I also take Magnesium and Potassium supplements. My blood work was done a couple of months ago and everything was perfect. I think I'll see my doctor anyway and see what he has to say.

[KellyL 173]

Yeah, I don't blame you for checking with your Doctor, just to be on the safe side. Oh and congrats on the marathons, that's awesome!! OMG! you lost 201 lbs?? Amazing, you rocked your sleeve! You are such an inspiration. Let us know what you find out.

[massindex 346]

Thanks, KellyL. I had the help of a lovely wife who supported me. She was sleeved two weeks ago and now I get to repay her!

[Ms skinniness 3,003]

a really good person to check with is Pdxman. He has done marathons and is currently training for one. He does alot of research on things also.

[massindex 346]

Thanks dorrie. I'll do that. He must have some info on this.

[KellyL 173]

Awww that's great that she supported you and now you get to support her. Tell her congrats, I hope her recovery is going well!

Thanks, KellyL. I had the help of a lovely wife who supported me. She was sleeved two weeks ago and now I get to repay her!

[Dooter 1,457]

I agree. PdxMan is the one to ask.

[massindex 346]

I agree. PdxMan is the one to ask. :smile1:

I sent him a message. I'll wait for his response.

[PdxMan 4,292]

Hey all, I responded to MassIndex, but I thought I would post my message here as well:

For me, I had been hitting the wall right around the 5-6 mile mark. I am in a running group here in Portland training for the Vancouver Marathon and spoke to our coach about this very topic as it is a concern. Here is what he suggested:

• Slow my pace down by 1 minute/mile and see if I can go further. I had been running between 8:15 - 8:45 per mile, so I am slowing down by 1 minute and am able to run farther. I haven't bonked yet, but my long distance at this point is 8 miles. We have an 11 mile run the week after next. I'll let you know how it goes.
  
• Start carbing up (good carbs) and drop Protein supplements on Wednesday for a Sunday long run/race. Since it difficult to refresh glycogen stores, we need to start the process earlier. Limit running/exercise effort until race day.
  
• Increase calories, increase Water. Needless to say, this is difficult. Whatever level you are getting, get more.
  
• Use the energy supplements GU, Roctane or the like 15 minutes before a race. If race is over 45 minutes, take another at the 30 minute mark.
  

This is what I have been doing and it has been working for me. I have an 8K race this weekend, and am starting my carb load today. I'll let you know how it goes.

Please keep me posted on yourself. There isn't a lot of info out there for VSG runners. I think we're a small group. What is your pace currently? How many calories are you able to get in each day?

[massindex 346]

And here is what I shared....

Thanks so much for sharing. As you said, there isn't a whole lot out there for us VSG runners.

I started with the Sprint Triathlons because I like the variety so the longer distance running is newer to me. I had so much damage to my knees from Div 1 football that I wasn't sure I could do it anymore. So, on a lark, I did a 13.1 on January 15th in LA. I finished it but ran into the issues I described although my knees didn't bother me at all. I figured it was my training (non existent) so put myself on a regime. Then I scheduled the last marathon I did 3 weeks later (I know, I'm an idiot, but that's my style).

I'm running at an easy 10 min per mile pace right now. I'm around 1200 - 1500 calories a day, mostly Protein (80-100 grams per day) but I hadn't done any carbs (swore off most carbs) until the day before race (old style). I have a 5K coming up in 2 weeks and another Tri in a month. I'll try the process and see what happens. Maybe we can break some new ground here :biggrin5: .

[Dooter 1,457]

There isn't a lot of info out there for VSG runners. I think we're a small group.

I only run when chased! (maybe that will change one day

[PdxMan 4,292]

and my response ...

Oy, I think I found your problem. Carbs. For the average Joe, yes, swear off carbs (greatly reduce). Totally agree. For a runner, carbs are the gasoline. They are essential. I am trying for 150-175 grams on the average day, but pre-race, I'll be shooting for 200-225. I am exercising enough so weight loss/gain isn't a concern anymore. I do what I need to do to keep my training up. Looking at your stats, it is my opinion you should be there, too. I run about 20 miles/week and know I wouldn't be able to be anywhere near that if I didn't eat a bunch of carbs. Gotta have em and in quantity. Not good for weight loss ... excellent for running.

I can go into detail about how the body converts carbs/protein/fats into glycogen, stores them in the liver ... blah blah blah, but you may have already done some research on this topic. Of course, there are a million opinions out there and nutrition is not an *exact* science. Find any study and I will find another stating just the opposite. You have to find what works for you, but Protein heavy I know does not work for runners. It takes a lot of energy and time to convert. That is why we are to avoid any Protein supplements leading up to a race. Now, post race is another thing all together. Protein ... YES! Carbs ... YES! You must repair any muscle damage and refill your glycogen stores. That is why at the post race tables they have bananas, Bagels and Protein drinks.

[massindex 346]

This is all good to know. I'm going to meet with my doctor and nutritionist tomorrow and work on a plan. I'll let you know what we work out and then I'll share how my training goes. I think there are a number of people who need this kind of education, especially myself.