Warning<< Gastric Sleeve Surgery Failure Dr Rod

[waterlover 15]

I agree with the original post. The US has higher standards for health care. Period. (until we go to socialized medicine that is)

As a person who is presently working in the medical field of a "socialized health care" country, I think you are misinformed and insulting.

[kemo46 82]

In the U.S. , the insurance companies run the show. If you do not believe me, have a procedure that the insurance only pays for 2 days and try to stay 3 and see how you are treated. If you have the money, it is no issue but the level of care and the attitude changes greatly once the cash cow runs dry. I just experienced this with a family member at a major hospital in Dallas.

I have two close family members that are Physicians, one a surgeon, the other an M.D.. I have learned a lot about how the medical profession is driven in the states. We have been trained to think that if the procedure is not approved in the U.S. , it cannot be good or safe. That is 100% incorrect. In order for a procedure to be approved in the U.S., it has to have a clinical trial to be approved by the FDA. This is nothing more than bribery. There are procedures that have been performed in other countries safely for many years that are still not approved in the U.S..

The bottom line is you cannot say a whole country has bad surgeons or bad health care, you can find both in all countries along with great surgeons. All you can do is research and make the best educated decision possible. People should not knock other surgeons in other countries unless it was their own personal experience. There is too much hearsay and false information being repeated. I had my procedure in Mexico and was treated very well. I know there are great surgeons here in the states as well. That is why I have never said anything negative about any surgeon in any country because of something I have read. If you were not there, you do not know the situation, period.

I agree with the poster on the socialized healthcare, who are we to talk down about another country's healthcare program, especially since ours is such a winner.

[italianlady13 80]

I come in peace......please don't attack me:)

[italianlady13 80]

By definition a procedure is considered successful in the patient achieves 50% EWL. But If you want to consider 61% a failure then the sleeve should also be considered a failure based on this information from www.sleeveguide.com

A multicenter  study of 163 patients that Dr. Michel Gagner participated in showed the average patient lost 48.97% of their excess weight in 6 months; 59.45% at 1 year (120 patients); 62.02% at 18 months, and 61.52% at 2 years (98 patients). Other studies have shown similar weight loss, with most patients losing the bulk of their weight within the first 6 months--and keeping off roughly 60% of the weight long-term. This is corrorborated by the 5 year results of the Magenstrasse & Mill operation.

In addition 5-9 year follow-up studies have found EWL rates of between 53% and 68% for the sleeves.

The article that you cited also reported that there were no major complications, no weight regain seen in the patients two years out, and that plication had the lowest rate of early complication of all WLS.

I am choosing to undergo this procedure because initial results show that this will be an effective procedure, Also there was a time when preforming the sleeve as a primary procedure was considered experimental, if it weren't for patients like me willing to take a risk the sleeve would still be limited to patients who eventually needed to have the Duodenal Switch. And finally, I am fortunate in that the banded plication is covered by my insurance unlike the sleeve because of my BMI being under 50. I don't think the banded plication is the right procedure for everyone but I think that it shows promise and I would encourage people to consider it as one of their options. If it weren't for banded plication I would either be having the band alone (and based on the reaction of my original surgeon and from what I have read on these boards I would have maybe a 50/50 shot of being successful) or no surgery at all (I did not want to have the bypass, I was not 100% comfortable with the sleeve and when I found out it was not covered it was definitely out)

It's your body shelly...do whatever you think is right. *shrugs* I don't have to live with it and I LOVE my sleeve. THAT is all that matters to me. Please argue with someone else this argument is tiresome and not necessary

[sirensiren 67]

To the OP: PLEASE post this in the Mexico forum, they need to know!

I find the statement about US doctors being a safer or more advanced option to be arrogant, and honestly misinformed. I am a surgical technician in the USA, and I have to respond to this.

Mexico is not a bad place to live for everyone who lives there, and upon investigating their laws and medical practices and training for the past 2 years- it actually rivals the USA. I can seen where a Mexican MD would prefer to raise a family in Mexico, and be around their family. My Dr. (Dr. Kelly) is also a US medical doctor, and visits here frequently to actually train US surgeons- he prefers to be in Mexico, where he was born and his family is. Property is much cheaper there, and the education system is actually much better than our public school system, and cheaper for private school. There are people who choose to live in Mexico, not because the USA isn't an option, but because they genuinely are happy there.

I met a nice couple from Canada who has VSG in Mexico, when I mentioned the USA they gasped and said "I would never let an American doctor perform this surgery!"- also a prejudgement based on bias, but it goes both ways.

It stands to reason that a surgeon who performs 5 sleeves a day for many years is going to naturally be more skilled than a doctor who performs 2 a week- it does not matter what country you are in. There are amazing doctors in the USA and Mexico, and there are shady doctors in the USA and Mexico.

Though we would like to believe that if a US surgeon left us badly injured there would be justice or a revision surgery to correct it, the reality is they are set up for malpractice law suits- those forms you sign aren't just for fun. Though I think most surgeons would jump to correcting a complication here, there is no guarantee you are "safe" in the event of a complication.

That said, it's obviously much harder to pursue a doctor whose surgery resulted in a complication if they are in Mexico and you are in the USA. There is little to no justice you can get, other than alerting other patients.

I will say, when ever I've called or e-mailed Dr. Kelly, I've had a detailed response in 30 minutes or less to my concerns. When I've had concerns that would require a visit, he referred me to an independent bariatric surgery practice in my area (Los Angeles) that is very reasonably priced for visits, and performs VSG. I've felt very, very, very cared for through this process. The only surgeons in the USA I have real cell phone numbers for are friends of mine- a treating doctor rarely gives out that kind of information here.

The OP also did not has VSG, she/he had plication, which is a different procedure altogether. It would be good to alert them on Sleeveplicationtalk.com instead of here.

I chose VSG after my research because I didn't trust the results of plication. nor having a pprtion of my stomach "tied up" in a sense.

[waterlover 15]

i think one of the best parts of the VSG is the way it makes your body produce less grehlin which in turn makes you less hungry. i would find it so hard to still have a huge appetite but have a small stomach. i would compare that to being on a diet. torture for me!

[Oregondaisy 2,021]

If anyone would like to see Dr. Aceves' credentials and the standards he practices under, I would be happy to post them.

[EJStorm 13]

i think one of the best parts of the VSG is the way it makes your body produce less grehlin which in turn makes you less hungry. i would find it so hard to still have a huge appetite but have a small stomach. i would compare that to being on a diet. torture for me!

Amen!

Kudos!

Thumbs up!

....and a standing ovation!!!

All of my life, I contributed emotional eating, binge eating, constant thoughts of food, extreme hunger, etc to personality flaws and lack of will power.

Funny how, after 46 years, all those things just up and disappeared along with grehlin production. My guess, based on my own experience, is that I and many others with weight issues had a problem with overproduction of grehlin. Scientists and drug companies have been working for many years trying to figure out how to block/slow grehlin production because they know that over production is linked to obesity.

In 1982, at only 17, I had my stomach stapled. I lost some weight , but not enough and was still hungry all. the. time. Still had all the same food issues as before surgery. I became bulimic and when I overcame all that, managed to shoot my weight higher than ever. Perhaps because I was still over producing grehlin? Perhaps combined with the fact that my U.S. doctor botched my surgery, using stitches instead of staples, all of which were gone when I went to have my VSG?

Oh....and let me also throw in the fact that my Mexican doctor discovered adhesions and scar tissue that actually fused my stomach to my liver and to my abdominal wall (and fixed it for FREE) after having multiple U.S. doctors blow off my complaints of severe abdominal pain, attributing it to muscle spasms.

[waterlover 15]

oregon daisy: could you do that? i want to go to him. lol. i'd like to write down everything he is accredited for.

EJStorm: man, you have been through enough! i'm so glad you are doing well now. may i ask who your doctor was?

[Shellyac 22]

i think one of the best parts of the VSG is the way it makes your body produce less grehlin which in turn makes you less hungry. i would find it so hard to still have a huge appetite but have a small stomach. i would compare that to being on a diet. torture for me!

Based on this quote from Dr. Watkins the same is true not only for plication but for all WLS

Ghrelin is reduced by pressure on the gastric wall. You do not have to remove stomach to reduce ghrelin. Ghrelin is a feedback hormone meaning when the gastric wall is stretched, ghrelin levels are reduced. The reason ghrelin levels are lower in sleeve gastrectomy patients is due to the smaller size stomach, not from removing stomach tissue. The sleeve that remains still produces ghrelin and levels are reduced by pressure. In gastric bypass, for example, ghrelin levels go to very low levels and the entire stomach is still there. All of the ghrelin producing tissue is still there but the levels are very low due to pressure. No ghrelin level studies have been done in plication, but plication patients describe the same appetite reduction as sleeve gastrectomy patients. There is certainly more data about sleeve gastrectomy, but the plication patients lose weight in the same manner and describe the same appetite reduction. Another important thing to remember about ghrelin is that it is a small part of a very complex appetite mechanism that we understand very poorly and superficially. The only reason ghrelin gets so much press is that the molecular structure of the hormone is know - it has been discovered. We know there are a lot of things floating around in the blood stream that affect appetite that haven't been discovered. All of these hormones are reduced by pressure in the stomach wall, not by resecting stomach tissue. Whereas we don't currently have morbidity and mortality data on the plication, it will be less than sleeve gastrectomy because there is no cutting and no stapling involved. Regardless of the fact that the sleeve gastrectomy has been around longer, many patients do not want to have their stomachs cut and stapled and most of it discarded. The minimal invasiveness of the plication is really resonating with lots of people. Our experience with the plication is that patients are losing weight like the sleeve gastrectomy patients and they are losing weight like the European patients that have had plication. Plication x-rays (barium study) look just like the sleeve gastrectomy x-rays. It creates the same space and works the same way - by pressure with fewer calories. Also, in terms of stomach being folded on itself, we have been doing this for many years with an operation called Nissen fundoplication, an operation done for severe reflux. It is comforting to know that through all of the many years fundoplication has been done, there hasn't been one documented case of a problem with stomach being folded on itself. Though the plication hasn't been around very long, folded stomach has been around a very long time without any issue so we don't anticipate any issue with plication as a weight loss operation. The important truth to keep in mind is that ghrelin levels are reduced by pressure, not by resecting portions of the stomach. Any remaining stomach will produce ghrelin and those levels will respond to pressure, not volume of stomach tissue remaining in the body. Another example is that the Lap Band will reduce ghrelin levels and 100% of the stomach remains. The levels are reduced because the stomach pouch above the band is much smaller and stretching that small portion of gastric wall above the band is creating the reduction in ghrelin levels. Brad Watkins MD

[LilMissDiva Irene 3,282]

I just want to quickly chime in here. I find some of these posts offensive. Generalizing an entire country based on one negative experience is not helping anyone. This is a support website, let's keep it that way.

Mexican people are educated too, and my surgeon is one of the best bariatric surgeons in the entire world. The hospital he works out of is by far one of the most attentive as far as staff and the cleanest I've ever seen. My own Mom who has worked in the medical field for her entire career even agreed.

Not only that, please remember there are many who post here who ARE Mexican, myself included. I come from a very intelligent family, and yes we do live in the United States now but our heritage runs very deep. We still have family who lives in Mexico, even my husbands side of the family too, and they are VERY HAPPY!! Please consider others before making generalizing posts. It's unfair and downright untrue to pool everyone into one instance.

I do understand the litigious side of the argument, I am not referring to that at all. It is a very important matter to consider when thinking of going outside of the country to have your surgery. It was a risk I took, but felt comfortable enough to as I went to the best surgeon and felt the risk outweighed the possible outcome, and thankfully everything went well for me.

Let's stay on topic and offer support to the unfortunate occurrence.

Also, anyone reading these posts, please PLEASE do your own research. Not every ONE every WHERE is the same. That would be just as ridiculous as saying someone in the US had an awful experience with their surgery so that means all US Doctors should not be trusted. People ALL OVER THE WORLD have bariatric surgeries. So does that mean every single one of them should fly out to the US and have it here? No, that does not make any sense at all.

[*susan* 1,709]

Just want to give kudo's to Diva, excellent post and I agree 100%!

[EJStorm 13]

oregon daisy: could you do that? i want to go to him. lol. i'd like to write down everything he is accredited for.

EJStorm: man, you have been through enough! i'm so glad you are doing well now. may i ask who your doctor was?

Dr. Aceves

[waterlover 15]

Dr. Aceves

thanks for telling me, how did i know it was going to be him? i've been torn between three different doctors and asking for 'signs' to help me decide. this is a good sign. sorry to hijack the thread.

also, shelly, thanks for the info, i thought the only way to get rid of the grehlin producing places were to cut the suckers out.

[kemo46 82]

I just want to quickly chime in here. I find some of these posts offensive. Generalizing an entire country based on one negative experience is not helping anyone. This is a support website, let's keep it that way.

Mexican people are educated too, and my surgeon is one of the best bariatric surgeons in the entire world. The hospital he works out of is by far one of the most attentive as far as staff and the cleanest I've ever seen. My own Mom who has worked in the medical field for her entire career even agreed.

Not only that, please remember there are many who post here who ARE Mexican, myself included. I come from a very intelligent family, and yes we do live in the United States now but our heritage runs very deep. We still have family who lives in Mexico, even my husbands side of the family too, and they are VERY HAPPY!! Please consider others before making generalizing posts. It's unfair and downright untrue to pool everyone into one instance.

I do understand the litigious side of the argument, I am not referring to that at all. It is a very important matter to consider when thinking of going outside of the country to have your surgery. It was a risk I took, but felt comfortable enough to as I went to the best surgeon and felt the risk outweighed the possible outcome, and thankfully everything went well for me.

Let's stay on topic and offer support to the unfortunate occurrence.

Also, anyone reading these posts, please PLEASE do your own research. Not every ONE every WHERE is the same. That would be just as ridiculous as saying someone in the US had an awful experience with their surgery so that means all US Doctors should not be trusted. People ALL OVER THE WORLD have bariatric surgeries. So does that mean every single one of them should fly out to the US and have it here? No, that does not make any sense at all.

Amen.