Lap Band Or Gastric Sleeve Surgery...losing My Mind

[Oregondaisy 2,021]

Just go and read the band to sleeve revision forum and you will find out just how much trouble the band causes. If the band didn't cause problems, there would not be so many people having it removed and getting the sleeve. Sometimes the band does so much damage to the stomach, that you can't even get any type of revision surgery at all.

[CowgirlJane 14,259]

Posting here, you are very likely to get pro-sleeve/anti-band sentiments because this is a sleeve forum! Do your own research, get info from people who have had the procedures at least 2-3 years ago!!! Most people are in the honeymoon stage the first year or so and will give glowing reviews of their procedure of choice.

I was banded in 2001, it was never easy, but I did lose 70# the first year. I was looking pretty good, lots of exercise etc. If you had asked me then, i would have been pro-band. Yes, fills were a hassle, and toward the end of the first year the reflux started showing up, but I still thought it was worth it because I loved getting trimmer.

By 2004, I had pouch dialation and really couldn't tolerate any fill without having reflux. I was starting to regain and I was hungry alot. It was such a relief to finally give up and have the fill removed. I had my band surgery outside the country (I lived in Europe at the time) and when I returned to the usa I received very little support - it was hard to find a doctor to take you on so I didn;t get much support in trying to fix whatever the problem was.

So, I lived with an empty band and an ever expanding waistline until this year when i found out my band had slipped. I had to have it removed, along with the adhesions and scar tissue as it damages your stomach! It was nothing like the pictures you see in the brochure, your stomach kinda pushes up through the band. I weigh about 30 pounds more now then i did when i was banded 10.5 years ago.

Anyway, my primary physician has a lapband and is doing okay with it. I have known others who have had long term success, but, the stats look like about 40% of excess weight kept off over the long term - pretty poor results. Based on people I know, that means that many regained everything and some have done really well. Not enough people have done really well or pretty good... too many complete failures (ie insufficient weight loss or a complication like slippage or erosion)

I personally think the band was a reasonable experiment to try, for those of us that didn't want the gastric bypass (or couldn't have bypass) but I would NOT recommend it now based on my personal experience and based on the statistics that are now available. I will also tell you that having a band FIRST increases your complication risk if you later revise to a sleeve or bypass. I would NOT recommend starting with the band if you have it in your mind that it is easy to revise to something else. Yes, people do it all the time, but who needs the extra risk???

[CowgirlJane 14,259]

I forgot to mention. I still have the BioEnterics brochure from 2001 when i had the lapband. Right in there it says that it should be considered temporary, and that most people will need to have it repositioned or removed at some point. I can't believe I didn't catch that the first time through, but i guess you hear what you want to hear.... Anyway, the manufacturer has known this is the case for at least a decade, the band is not a permanent solution and will most likely require follow on surgeries of some sort.

[Shellyac 22]

I am someone that is choosing to do the band but I am doing it along with plication. I did consider the sleeve for a moment because my original surgeon was pushing me to do the bypass which was something I wasn't comfortable with doing because my main concern was doing something permanent to my body. Also i didn't not have a concern about having something implanted, to me it is the same as having a pacemaker or artificial knee implanted, it is a device that I am having put in to help me improve the quality of my life. The only reason that I considered the sleeve was because if the band wasn't the right thing for me then I wanted something that would at least have left me with a normal digestive system. Also my cousin had the sleeve done earlier this year and she is doing well with it. In the end the number 1 reason that I ended up not getting the sleeve is that my insurance would not cover it for me because my BMI was not over 50.

In the midst of doing research about the sleeve, I found out about plication which is a procedure where they fold your stomach into a "sleeve" and the suture it. This is a relatively new procedure and on it is own is not covered by most insurances but because it is being done in addition to the band it will be covered. Another sort of downside with this procedure is that there aren't that many doctors preforming it so you may not have a doctor nearby who will do it, in fact I am having mine done in Florida even though I live in Maryland.

Now for what I see as the good news: Early results from some patients who have had this procedure show similar weight loss to those who have had the sleeve. For me having a "reversible" procedure made me more comfortable with having surgery, I am going to this without the fear that I may regret what I am doing. I am not saying that people who have it done regret their decision or am I saying that I would have regretted it if I had done it, but it was one of my fears and it's a fear I don't have now. I also feel that the band with plication offers the best of both worlds of the sleeve and the band. The plication reduces some of the risks associated with the band, there is less slippage; also having the plication makes it harder to cheat the band because if you eat some of the slider foods, the food will be going into a smaller stomach so you wouldn't be able to eat as much regardless. In addition the band serves as a back up to the plication, if you aren't getting enough restriction, then you can get a fill but overall you will need to get less fills than the normal band patients and there are some people who don't need to get their band filled at all.

I know that everyone who chooses to have surgery has their reasons on why they chose to have a certain procedure, In the end, I think that you should choose the one that allows you to go into it thinking that you made the best decision for you and one that you know that no matter what happens afterwards you know you won't regret having done it. I think that if you don't feel that way before you start your journey, you are going to fail no matter what you do.

Finally, as other on here have mentioned continue to do your research. It is important that you get the opinion of people who have both succeeded and failed with what they have chosen. It's important to hear what life is like on the other side, to hear why people are happy or unhappy with how life is after surgery. Especially since one person's reason for being happy or unhappy may not be an issue for you. For example I have seen people saying that the gastric bypass dumping syndrome is a reason why they chose the procedure (it helps they stay away from sweets) and the reason that they don't want to have it done. Plus not everyone has the same side effects of the procedure, there are bypass patients that don't have dumping and there are band patients that don't get stuck, and there are sleeve patients that still have to deal with feelings of hunger.

Good luck with whatever you decide.

Michelle

[CowgirlJane 14,259]

Michelle, I completely respect that everyone has their own situation and needs to make the best decision for themselves. I decided I didn't want the gastric bypass and it wasn't because of dumping, it is just because I never got comfortable with everything that is involved - but it is a great choice for other people. I totally understand where you are coming from.

I just want to say that doing that band IS doing something permanent to your body. I had my band removed and have alot of adhesions and damage to my stomach. You are forever changed once that band is implanted and while it is removable, it is not truly reversible. My risk of leaks when i have the sleeve done is probably 4-5x greater then someone who never had the band. I have seen the pictures they took when they removed my band and it was horrifying.

My primary care doc is a band patient herself and cares for many bariatric patients - she is not anti WLS of any kind. Last time I saw her she mentioned that her observation of long term successs is much lower then the studies show. I had a lapband for 10 years and knew quite a few bandsters - ultimately most of them either had to have the band removed due to a complication or very poor weight loss results. My own personal unofficial observation is that MAYBE 1/3 of band patients have long term success, but I think that number is even high. I don't know anything about plication, so no comment there.

Best of luck to all of us as we head down the path to getting healthier!

I am someone that is choosing to do the band but I am doing it along with plication. I did consider the sleeve for a moment because my original surgeon was pushing me to do the bypass which was something I wasn't comfortable with doing because my main concern was doing something permanent to my body.

[omamilam 11]

Here is a video of a Doctor that may convince you.

http://www.youtube.com/user/Endobariatric#p/c/DCC7DC6C03E9469B/14/5rTcnv40efE

, I too had reservations about the Lap Band. So I DUG DEEP into the research between the Band and the Sleeve. Australia just posted their stats of a ten year study on the Lap Band. They stated that the Lap Band fills and unfills COSTS MORE than the surgery itself over a ten year period. It also said with all the complications that many had to have the band removed due to so much scar tissue from the band. The United States has not had the Band as long as Australia therefore; the U.S. does not have the data Australia has on the LB. Many had to get the vertical sleeve procedure or a gastric bypass when their band failed.

I have decided to get the sleeve (VSG-vertical sleeve gastric) it just makes your stomach the size it should be before you stretched it out by over eating for so long. There is no foreign objects in your body, no fills or unfills and no constant trips back and forth to the doctor at $150 a pop which adds up to more than the surgery over time. No food getting stuck, you don’t have to chew your food to mush just to swallow it.

Also, most people that have the band removed due to slipping end up with the VSG anyway. I also do not want to be stuck drinking Protein powder the rest of my life 2 or 3 times a day just to get my Protein requirements in because I can not consume enough food orally.

The sleeve is more natural and is more like having a “normal stomach “after it heals. You can eat whatever you want without any restrictions except maybe carbonated soda everyday.

Having a pouch the size of a golf ball (LB) as compared to a banana (VSG) and the hole to your stomach is normal size instead of restricted by a band so food can't go through easily, I have elected to be more "normal" and just have my stomach reduced to the size it should have been before I got fat and made it the size of a football.

The part of your stomach that senses hunger is removed so you don't get hungry. I would rather go to the doctor every 3 months for a check up with VSG than every month with the band (if not more than that for problems.)

After doing a lot of research monitoring the LB chat room for 4 weeks now, I have noticed that there are a lot of dr. visits to fill or unfill because of discomfort, or not losing, food getting stuck, emergency surgery because the band slipped etc. I became frustrated that there was never anyone in the VSG room to talk to about the sleeve. I had an epiphany one morning that is because no one has anything to complain about after they have healed from the surgery. That spoke volumes to me.Yes, the LB is reversible but if you are not committed, why do either surgery? Are you really going to have the band removed? This is why I am choosing VSG over LB. It’s a personal decision, do your homework and research. Continue to talk to Bandsters and VSG patients before you make your final decision. GOOD LUCK !

[CowgirlJane 14,259]

Oma, although i do agree with your end conclusion, I don't agree with all the statements you have made.

I was banded in 2001, in Germany, just months before it was approved in the USA. There is 10 years of data in the usa. That data shows fairly poor results over the long haul.

I never had to live on Protein drinks when i was banded neither did the many fellow bandsters that i knew - that is a sign that the fill is too tight.

There are many problems with the band - and if you do have to have it removed, it leaves your stomach damaged. I know that a very high percentage of people will eventually need or want to have their bands removed. i honestly would not recommend it.

[swizzly 901]

I am someone that is choosing to do the band but I am doing it along with plication. I did consider the sleeve for a moment because my original surgeon was pushing me to do the bypass which was something I wasn't comfortable with doing because my main concern was doing something permanent to my body. Also i didn't not have a concern about having something implanted, to me it is the same as having a pacemaker or artificial knee implanted, it is a device that I am having put in to help me improve the quality of my life. The only reason that I considered the sleeve was because if the band wasn't the right thing for me then I wanted something that would at least have left me with a normal digestive system. Also my cousin had the sleeve done earlier this year and she is doing well with it. In the end the number 1 reason that I ended up not getting the sleeve is that my insurance would not cover it for me because my BMI was not over 50.

In the midst of doing research about the sleeve, I found out about plication which is a procedure where they fold your stomach into a "sleeve" and the suture it. This is a relatively new procedure and on it is own is not covered by most insurances but because it is being done in addition to the band it will be covered. Another sort of downside with this procedure is that there aren't that many doctors preforming it so you may not have a doctor nearby who will do it, in fact I am having mine done in Florida even though I live in Maryland.

I have to say this, and I hope you won't be offended, but that seems like the worst of both worlds to me. Have you read this thread about complications of Plication? I would be leery of that procedure anyhow, given the early feedback in addition to lack of long-term data -- and adding the band in just seems like it would increase the potential for permanent damage to your stomach. I'm sure you have good doctors advising you, but it never hurts to be super informed. Good luck anyhow.

[Shellyac 22]

Yes I have read that thread and frankly I disagree with your assessment. I have no reservations about it being a new procedure, hence the lack of long term results. There was a time when all of the procedures were new and lacked long term results, but patients and doctors still went ahead with them.

I am not saying that I am making the better choice but I am making the choice that is right for me. The thing that the original poster was looking for the reasons that each of chose the procedure that we chose. I fully understand that they are risks associated with what I am choosing, I understand that there are people for whom the band was the wrong choice but I have also seen people for whom it was what they needed to help them lose the weight.

My intention is not to recruit but to inform. I think that the best thing about these boards is learning from the experiences of the others that have gone ahead. But I also realize that the majority of the people who have had the surgery and are on these boards mainly fall into two categories, those for whom the procedure was a great success and those for whom it was a dismal failure. We all have to keep in mind that the there is probably a huge silent group for whom things are ok and they don't feel the need to share their experiences.

I think the most important thing is to go into this being prepared and to go into this feeling that you are going to succeed with what you do. Another way that I knew that the sleeve wasn't right for me was when one of the things that I researching was if it was possible to stretch out your stomach after the surgery. How could this be the right decision for me if one of the things I am using to make my decision is knowing if I can make this surgery fail?

[LilMissDiva Irene 3,282]

This is a Vertical Sleeve Gastrectomy message board, so you are going to get biased opinions pro sleeve here. Please, do your own research and come to your own decision.

Here are some helpful links of first hand stories you might find interesting:

Lap Band:

Main Webpages: http://www.lapbandtalk.com/

Pro's: http://www.lapbandtalk.com/forum/227-lap-band-success-stories/

Con's: http://www.lapbandtalk.com/forum/70-lap-band-complications/ -OR- http://www.verticalsleevetalk.com/forum/13-band-to-gastric-sleeve-revisions/'>http://www.verticalsleevetalk.com/forum/13-band-to-gastric-sleeve-revisions/

Vertical Sleeve:

Main Webpage: http://www.verticalsleevetalk.com/

Pro's: http://www.verticalsleevetalk.com/forum/14-vertical-sleeve-gastrectomy-surgery-vsg-success-stories/

Con's: http://www.verticalsleevetalk.com/forum/48-gastric-sleeve-surgery-vsg-complications-support-group/

HTH

[Lissa 2,631]

I started out wanting the lap band as well, but changed my mind after my seminar with my surgeon. I did go to a doctor before that (Straxx Rejuvenation, Dr Michael Choi), who told me he would do a band on me, no questions asked. I felt like a piece of meat there, and decided to talk to another surgeon.

Dr. Domkowski, whose seminar I attended, made a statement at the seminar that still rings in my mind. He said that the band was good for people whose problem is "just" that they overeat. He said the sleeve was better for folks whose main problem is being addicted to sweets, which is me.

I immediately switched to researching the sleeve instead of the band. I had been reading the lap band boards for a while, and I went looking for something similar for VSG, and here I am. After reading everything I could find at both places, it reinforced my decision to have VSG.

When I went for my initial consult, the surgeon went over the paperwork I had filled out for him (22 pages!) and we decided together that the VSG is/was the best option for me.

At nearly 61 pounds gone this morning, I'm still convinced we made the right choice for me!

[M2G 1,836]

My personal opinion is that the band should be billed/marketed/sold as TEMPORARY. I just don't know of that many long-term people with the band (like 10+ years) that haven't had complications. While you may not find many sleevers that are 10+ years there are many instances of people have partial or nearly whole gastrectomies for reasons other than weight-loss (as some people have mentioned ulcers, cancer, etc.) and there are plenty of documented cases of people living into their 90's with partial stomachs.

Reversible may seem safer, but as others have pointed out some of the damaged caused by the band is not reversible.

Again (just my personal opinion) I feel like the band should be marketed as a FIRST step in WLS. I'm sure there are some band people who had the band, removed it and stayed the same weight, but I think that is rare. I think more often than not when people have complications they end up revising to the RNY, VSG, or DS.

If you are going to have a band, I would have a backup surgery "plan" in place for 5+ years down the road.

[Maddy 19]

I to weighed the differences... On one hand I didnt like the fact the band had so many troubles. From slippage to the band being so tight. I also didn't like knowing I would have a foreign object in my body. I to was a self pay. I started off looking at the band but in the end I chose the gastric vertical sleeve. I wanted a more permanent solution to my problem. I also wanted to have more control in regards to Portion Control. With the band you can eat anything with the sleeve you can't. I know foo many people now who started out with the lapband and crossed over to the vertical sleeve just for the same reasons I mentioned before. I did a ton of research on the vertical sleeve. From what I had read and the councelling I received the vertical sleeve was the best choice for me in my weight loss decision

[Shellyac 22]

Here is a prefect example of why it is so damn difficult to talk to people who choose a procedure different than the one you have chosen:

The sleeve is more natural and is more like having a “normal stomach “after it heals. You can eat whatever you want without any restrictions except maybe carbonated soda everyday. Having a pouch the size of a golf ball (LB) as compared to a banana (VSG) and the hole to your stomach is normal size instead of restricted by a band so food can't go through easily,

With the band you can eat anything with the sleeve you can't.

Which one of you are correct?

If anything I think that this illustrates that most of us aren't as informed as we think about the other procedures. We hear about these procedures and then there is the one that you know is right for you and then you start researching. For some you're just looking for all of the positives of what you want to do and reject anything negative. For others you see and hear what can go wrong and realize that you want to go with something with less "risk" and never look back. And for others you keep an open mind and acknowledge that you choice as both benefits and risks and work to come to peace with your decision.

I find it funny that I have not once questioned a person decision to get the sleeve yet nearly every post since mine and been to tell me why my choice is the wrong one. To me it seems like a classic case of cognitive dissonance in the sense that those with the sleeve have made a choice that cannot be reversed or fixed so there is nothing so in order to be at peace with your choice you have to believe that all other options are inferior. I AM NOT SAYING THAT SLEEVERS REGRET THEIR CHOICE.

For those of you who think I am making the wrong choice do you think that I should just not have surgery because I cannot afford to pay for the sleeve on my own, and my insurance will not cover the sleeve. If I should just get the bypass then why didn't you get it instead of the sleeve? Or should I just stay obese because I can't get the surgery that you have? For those of you who have an issue with having a foreign object inside your body, are you planning on telling your doctor no if she says that you need a pacemaker to help your heart or you need an artificial knee to help you walk? Oh and I thought those staples that were used to form your new stomach were permanent.

If you are going to have a band, I would have a backup surgery "plan" in place for 5+ years down the road.

I already have my back up plan in place. I am having the band with plication. I will not be able eat around the band because of the plication, and initial studies have shown that this procedure results in a lower risk of band slippage, band erosion, and there are fewer fills needed and they don't need to start until much later than with a regular band patient or may not be needed at all. Also I have yet to hear of any banded plication patients that have needed to be revised, the closest I have seen was one person who said that banded plication was a planned first step in her weight journey.

I have honestly learned alot of great info from people on this board. I think that we have several things in common and can share our experiences. We will have the name nutritional needs since we don't have to deal with malabsorption. We should loose weight at similar rates (that is if we all follow our post surgery diets correctly, especially the banders) I think it is important to those of you who needed to revise to go the lapband board and give advice to those that are having problems and frankly there are some people who are on there who you can tell from jump are making the wrong choice but unless they go to the revision forum they won't have anyone to show them the error of their ways. I would be interested in hearing why you chose the band the first time? Was the sleeve not available? Did the reality of getting the fills or how you had to eat and what you could eat differ from what you expected how so? Looking back is there anything in the pre-op process that was a warning you ignored that could have saved you the grief of two procedures? Is there anything post-surgery that could have helped you not need to revise? I always feel like the people who post that their band it tight and think it is a good thing because they need to lose weight are going to be the ones that get in trouble down the line because they'll end up eating around the too tight band or their band will start to erode or slip.

I'm sorry if I tend to ramble but I'd like to hope that we can turn these boards into a place we help get the people who come here for advice to be best for them. I think it is a disservice to discourage someone with a lower BMI who's insurance is never going to approve them for the sleeve from having the band, bypass, or plication. I would rather have someone have a procedure that will help them as long as they put the right amount of work in and do it fully informed than decide to not have one at all or going into a another procedure expecting to eventually fail.

[Lissa 2,631]

Shelly, I appreciate that you are trying to get all the information you can on both procedures. It does sound like you are totally sold on the band with plication, though, so that should probably be your choice. Each of us is an individual and has different goals and different ideas on how to get there.

You quoted two people who seemed to have conflicting ideas in your post. One thought that you could eat more regular food with the band and the other thought you could eat more regular food with the sleeve. The truth is that both the band and the sleeve will allow one to eat regular food. Both will also allow one to eat slider foods like ice cream, cake, etc.

My choice of the sleeve is based on the restriction that the sleeve automatically gives without the need for fills. I can eat all those slider foods, but I can only eat so much of them before I'm too full to continue. THAT is the reason for sleeve versus band for me.

LilMissDiva gave you links to success and failure areas for both lap band and for vertical sleeve. If you are truly interested in reading more about both procedures, those are the areas to check out. And, you are definitely going to get more praise for VSG on this board because that is the choice most of us have made. I'm sure you'll have a similar experience on the lap band board. Those folks have chosen the lap band for themselves and are working their program as well.

I find it interesting that many lap band patients do end up having a revision from lap band to something else...and that revision is often to VSG. I knew that before I had my sleeve done and that was a factor in my decision.

Also, I never heard of plication during my research phase. I definitely never heard anyone suggest a band with plication. I don't know anything about that process at all. It may turn out to be better than either or both the LB or the VSG. I'm all for any process which helps us to lose weight and become healthier.

I hope that you will let us know how you are doing on your journey and I wish you the best of luck with it!