Day 95: Possibly fat forever?

[Texasmom65 23]

Meg,

How many carbs per day do you use? I know carbs are my downfall. I love bread to much. I also have fallen in love with greek yogurt, lots of Protein, but high in carbs too :-(

And do most of you think the slow weight loss is due to our age too? I'm 46 and since turning 42, its been so hard to lose weight. And now I'm in menopause, its even harder.

[meggiep 57]

I try to keep below 30-40 net carbs. Net carbs is carbs minus Fiber, so that fruits and veggies, for example, yield lower net carbs than crackers and bread (sorry!). Right now that is easy- eating Protein first and then a few fruits and vegetables as I can- I can only eat 1/4 cup so I just don't have the room I log everything on Fat Secret - it lets you customize your nitrition stats so I chose carbs, Fiber, net carbs, fat, Protein, and calories.

I am 58 and I am thrilled with my average of almost 5 pounds a week. Before the sleeve I thought for sure I had slowed down to nothing and I worried.

Someone who has had great results - reaching goal in less than six months, maintaining successfully, etc. mentioned to me that the weight loss period, low carbs and all, is a great opportunity to deal with your food demons. I am looking at it that way too- with no hunger and with Thumbelina , my tyrant sleeve , I can work on the things that have bedeviled me with food. Then as I move into maintaining I can perhaps have worked some of those things out so that I can finally be normal. I also know Thumbelina will still be on duty then too- a great thing to consider! I feel so blessed to have my sleeve!

[ahoy 3]

Thanks for this. It's exactly what I needed to read today... 6 weeks out and only just today did my scale move again, below 285, where I was stuck for almost a whole month. (Or plus 4lbs of Water.)

I'm going to print this out and hang it by my desk. No joke. Thanks again.

[feedyoureye 3,087]

Thanks for this. It's exactly what I needed to read today... 6 weeks out and only just today did my scale move again, below 285, where I was stuck for almost a whole month. (Or plus 4lbs of Water.)

I'm going to print this out and hang it by my desk. No joke. Thanks again.

You know the three week stall is pretty normal? I had it too, and am at 2/3 of my weight lost at 6 months. I know it stinks, but you will be fine!

[swizzly 901]

It's still a long time to wait, but what can you do? Go back to the store and return your sleeve? Go to bed and not wake up til next year? You can either enjoy the ride or hate your whole life until you get to your "perfect" weight but part of the reason I decided to do this was because at 46, I was out of time to be unhappy.

Couldn't possibly agree more! I keep having a very strong suspicion (/memory) that being thin isn't all that exciting and for sure the novelty wears off, but the journey to getting there is engaging, (self-)absorbing and just more interesting than normal daily life, no? This being the case, I see no reason to hurry or stress a ton along the way, though I have my moments of course.

Plus, I really LIKE some of the clothes I've gotten, I'd like to wear them for at least a few weeks/months at a time before I have to bin them.

Yeah, I want to feel good and reach for the brass ring again, GDit, so that's what I'm focusing on. Life is short.

[foxgirl74 5]

Crosswind, I really appreciate this post. I have been feeling very similar for weeks now. But I do have to admit it is a struggle because while I am happy to just be losing weight, I feel like we all have waited so long to be the "skinny" person that it is hard to not try and rush the process. In addition, there is so much pressure for me personally from my surgeon. While I am down 60 pounds in 4 months, I still have a 16 week check-up this coming Tuesday that I am expected to weigh a certain amount at. On top of that expected amount my surgeon expressed that if I worked real hard I could weigh ten pounds less then that goal, so it was additional pressure on top of the high expectation already. It makes it much harder to just live "normal", I did for about two and a half weeks and still lost a few pounds, but since I have this deadline in mind, along with personal desire to just be skinny already, I felt very guilty the entire 2 and a half weeks!! Despite eating way less then I used to and still exercising some. Nonetheless, it's good to know that when I am ready to stop the mental guilt and killing myself over food and work outs, that I should be able to be ok thanks to my sleeve and still loose some weight or maintain it anyway!

[crosswind 134]

Crosswind, I really appreciate this post. I have been feeling very similar for weeks now. But I do have to admit it is a struggle because while I am happy to just be losing weight, I feel like we all have waited so long to be the "skinny" person that it is hard to not try and rush the process. In addition, there is so much pressure for me personally from my surgeon.

You know personally I don't understand this. Losing sixty pounds is quite an accomplishment ( I think I'll be roughly where you are at four months -- I've lost 54 in 14 weeks) and the real issue is your health. My blood pressure is way down. I don't have the back/knee issues that I did, and I can exercise and move around more. I was not diabetic but I'm sure my blood glucose levels are better and more stable.

I don't understand the reasoning behind pushing a patient to lose. I can kind of see the "honeymoon period" thing coming in to play, but quite honestly I haven't seen a single study that supports that idea. In fact if you look this up on the internet the only "honeymoon period" that comes up is on Vertical Sleeve Talk! There is also no published proof that in practice the sleeve "stretches", especially not within the first year. There are other possibilities regarding why it is harder to lose after a certain period of time - for example general adaptation hormonally, but...some of this, since the procedure is so new, seems like superstition or theoretical projection.

Published studies reiterate that most people get to where they want to be within two years. All patients have stopped losing at that point, most because they're at goal or under it. People keep saying you have to "work the sleeve" for results and of course eating well and healthily is non-negotiable. This is not a license to eat

tootsie rolls all day. But if you had to work the sleeve *so hard*, why even get the thing? It has to be doing at least some of the work on its own.

[meggiep 57]

That surgeon seems abusive to me! I would love him to have 85% of his stomach removed so he can walk in your shoes. For you to be afraid before you appointments is wrong, plain wrong. You have done really well!

Crosswind my surgeon's experience is from 10 years of sleeves, including working with the surgeon who created the sleeve , and he says that our ability to eat expands in 6-9 months. I got honeymoon period from him, not from VST, though he calls it period of optimized weightloss. I laugh imagining him saying "honeymoon period". If you knew him you would know why!

I actually envy those who are not as carb sensitive as me. But having figured that out rocking my sleeve isn't hard- it's easy- and rewarding. I am never hungry and never have cravings so I feel like a giant monkey is off my back!

[crosswind 134]

Crosswind my surgeon's experience is from 10 years of sleeves, including working with the surgeon who created the sleeve , and he says that our ability to eat expands in 6-9 months. I got honeymoon period from him, not from VST, though he calls it period of optimized weightloss. I laugh imagining him saying "honeymoon period". If you knew him you would know why!

Meggie I believe that is what your surgeon says and I also believe there is a period of optimized weight loss. But there is such a period for any patient who experiences significant weight loss whether they get surgery or not. The thinner you get, the slower it goes, and the harder it is to take off. Anyone who only has twenty pounds to lose is going to take much longer to lose it than it takes for us at 40 plus BMI to lose the same amount of weight. When we're down near goal, it's all going to slow down or possibly stop.

Let me put it this way: A person who weighs 275 pounds is suddenly restricted to one thousand calories per day. if he keeps up that way, the weight is going to fall off *fast* and then stall while the body adjusts. If calories are still restricted, weight will still come off. However, as your weight goes down so does your caloric requirement so...naturally.,..unless you eat even less the loss will slow or stop. So when he gets to 235 things slow down. When he gets to 195, they slow down a lot more. By this time, what time is it? Six to nine months.

I haven't seen any case study showing that a sleeve has stretched -- only the theory that it's possible. And I have also seen surgeons publish skepticism about that. Some say they think it's possible, but unlikely. But even if it's true -- if your sleeve can hold a quarter cup of food at seven weeks but the expectation is that it will double in size -- that's still only half a cup. Double that again. One cup, down from seven to eight cups of food in a normal stomach with the fundus still intact. It's still significant lifelong restriction. It doesn't make sense that with significant lifelong restriction it's going to suddenly be impossible to lose another ten pounds,, even if it's *not as much* restriction. Unless there is some organ or other magical mechanism I haven't read about. In fact, what makes the most logical sense is that since we will forevermore be eating fewer calories than we require over time, *eventually* we all get to goal.

Anyway I think the docs make some of these recommendations based on theoretical possibility. They want to give their patients the best possible outcome for the time, misery and money spent and recommending lowcarb to push very fast weight loss gives a satisfactory outcome in the short term. I don't think bariatric surgeons recommend stuff just because they just had nothing else to do that day.

But there's just no logical evidence I have seen that tells me we're all doomed at nine months, especially if loss is slow or average. In fact what I've seen is the opposite: barring some odd twist of metabolic fate, this time everybody gets there.

[meggiep 57]

I hope you are right. I think you mean everyone committed to getting there though. There is a significant incidence of regain, tiny tummy or not. And my surgeon does have a lot of experience following patients for ten years- so I trust is advice.If he is motivated by wanting the best results for me- then he and I are alligned on that!

Here"s the thing....For ME- I want to use this time to work on my food issues. Carbs are obviously a huge trigger for me , and I want to try to deal with my danger areas while I get to goal. Already I find I am not attracted to those foods anymore and as I said- I am not feeling deprived. This is just MY way- I would never think it was what anyone else should do.

[ahoy 3]

You know the three week stall is pretty normal? I had it too, and am at 2/3 of my weight lost at 6 months. I know it stinks, but you will be fine!

I do! I did, of course, I've read every post on this forum I knew, logically, that I should expect to stall for a week or two. But I didn't expect to get stuck for nearly 4 weeks, doing all the right things. (I am very heavy, young and now, fairly active so I expected to lose fast at first.) My period had made my whole stomach area swell to the point where I couldn't keep anything down, then I had 2 infection outbreaks in a row -- sinuses got worse and a NASTY gum infection.

For me, the weight loss is ALL about my health so I just felt screwed on all counts for the last 3 weeks.

Down another 2lbs as of today, and my gum infection has been beaten back so I can chew. I'm finally feeling better.

[feedyoureye 3,087]

I do! I did, of course, I've read every post on this forum I knew, logically, that I should expect to stall for a week or two. But I didn't expect to get stuck for nearly 4 weeks, doing all the right things. (I am very heavy, young and now, fairly active so I expected to lose fast at first.) My period had made my whole stomach area swell to the point where I couldn't keep anything down, then I had 2 infection outbreaks in a row -- sinuses got worse and a NASTY gum infection.

For me, the weight loss is ALL about my health so I just felt screwed on all counts for the last 3 weeks.

Down another 2lbs as of today, and my gum infection has been beaten back so I can chew. I'm finally feeling better.

Thats a lot to deal with! Glad things are getting better for you. My stall lasted almost 4 weeks. No fun, but I got through it...just a heads up to others that are stuck in the stall... things will pick up!

[Rev Me Up! 75]

Great post!

Couldn't agree with you more. After going through the lap-band roller coaster, I was so happy to find that I am able to eat whatever I want after having the sleeve for a few months. The awesome thing is, I crave healthier food in general. When I feel weird, I eat some chicken and I feel better. I carry string cheese and Peanut Butter filled pretzels in my purse and that will get me through several HOURS of the day. I can say that I never feel hungry, but I start to feel weird if I don't eat for a few hours.

Most of all, I can't compare my weight loss to a lot of people on the board because I was a lap-band revision and I don' t have as much to lose. However, I think the percentages are extremely similar for everyone. I am 4 months out and I have lost 66% of the excess weight. I am on target to lose it all in 6 to 8 months. But, if someone hears I have only lost 40 pounds in 4 months, they might think I was a slow loser.

Bottom line: you are right, it all comes out in the end.

I don't count carbs, but I have more of a yearning for healhty food. I eat a lot of cheese, I have developed a weird craving for Starbucks iced mocha lattes (which I can only handle about 1/3 of then I throw it away), I have rekindled a torrid love affair with chicken, and I eat one serving of oatmeal every day (for fiber) which I have never done before in my life. I focus on Protein first because it makes me feel better - that's it. If chocolate made me feel better, I would probably eat that first :-)

Nice to hear from you and really happy you are cruising right along!

[SleeveStalker 2]

I have to thank you for posting this. Out of every article I have read, every recipe that I have printed...Your thoughts are the most valuable to me. I had my surgery on 3/7 and I was 240 lbs today at a bit over 4 months I am hovering at the 193 mark...It is coming off. I make sure to use Summer to its full advantage and live at the pool as much as I can. With that being said, I do look at the people on here that are loosing at such a rapid pace that I can not help but compare myself.

Thank you for posting this ....

[lyndynojo 140]

I totally agree with you all, what is the point of having surgery and being on a strict diet the rest of your life. I could have done that with my stomach intact. I am almost 4 wks post op and my philosophy is the same as Disney's. I have koolaid with sugar, one pack in a bottled Water is 60 cal. I don't see that hindering my weight loss esp as I can only eat 4 or 5 bites every 2 or 3 hrs. I have lost 34 lbs since surgery and I know that will slow way down but I'm not in a race of any kind. I just want to live life and enjoy the few bites of food I can eat. I