If it were up to you, what laws would you create?

[gentlespirit 1]

I agree with Wheestin that horrible things should happen to "Reverend" Phelps and his group! That goes way past right to free speech...!

I would also pass a law that child molesters would be shot as soon as they were proven guilty. We hear over and over about repeat offenders, and they should not be allowed that chance. And the only way to be SURE it won't happen again (at least by them) is if they are dead. Some things aren't rehab-able!

Emily

[Tired_Old_Man 1]

Like the McMartins?

[JMO 0]

I would also pass a law that child molesters would be shot as soon as they were proven guilty. We hear over and over about repeat offenders, and they should not be allowed that chance. And the only way to be SURE it won't happen again (at least by them) is if they are dead. Some things aren't rehab-able!

I totally agree!!!!!! (or maybe we can ship them to an island all together with no children... )

Tired old man,

The pair were CHARGED with some 100 child molestations at their McMartin Pre-School in suburban Manhattan Beach. Five teachers had also been arrested, on more than 200 charges of child molestation, but the charges against them had been dismissed for lack of evidence. At the trial, only the two Buckeys remained, facing 65 charges.

They were given a FAIR trial and found not guilty... This was a movie on life time and if the movie was anything like what really happen it was heartbreaking the way these people were railroaded... But in the end the courts found them not guilty.....

I have one more law, Tougher abortion laws!!!

I know this is a touchy subject but I enjoy everyones views. I am 100% prolife for me! (don't judge) I have never been in a sitiuation where abortion would have EVER been an option, I think it should be outlawed all together but I know that will never happen. The part of the law I want to change is that you must be 18 or have a parent present before you can have an abortion. I think whatever dummy thought a 13, 14, or 16 years old could understand the long term effects of murdering their child is a moron. Heck you can't even get your belly button peirced with out a parent but you can have an abortion. Just plain stupid..

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[nolagirl2 0]

I have one more law, Tougher abortion laws!!!

I know this is a touchy subject but I enjoy everyones views. I am 100% prolife for me! (don't judge) I have never been in a sitiuation where abortion would have EVER been an option, I think it should be outlawed all together but I know that will never happen. The part of the law I want to change is that you must be 18 or have a parent present before you can have an abortion. I think whatever dummy thought a 13, 14, or 16 years old could understand the long term effects of murdering their child is a moron. Heck you can't even get your belly button peirced with out a parent but you can have an abortion. Just plain stupid..

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What if her legal guardian raped her? Or beat her? Or forced her to carry the baby to term endangering her health? Doesn't a 16 or 14 or 13 year old have rights?

[JMO 0]

What if her legal guardian raped her? Or beat her? Or forced her to carry the baby to term endangering her health? Doesn't a 16 or 14 or 13 year old have rights?[/quote

Yes they have rights but are they mature enough to understand them? Do you know what percent of babies are killed because of rape? LESS THAN 1%... Of the millions of babies that are dying every year 1% of them are from rape... It would be very unfortionate for a child in that sitituation but That doesn't make it right for the other hundred girls whom got pregnant on their own to kill their child. I am also thinking of the pregnant girls, their is a chance she could die having this procedure? Hell if she is in a car wreck and needs life saving surgeries, the hospital can't save her till her mother gets there and allows them to operate? How is this any different? Parent consent is parent consent if you need it for one, you should need it for all.

[gadgetlady 4]

What if her legal guardian raped her? Or beat her? Or forced her to carry the baby to term endangering her health? Doesn't a 16 or 14 or 13 year old have rights?

Would you be happy if abortion were outlawed in all cases except for an underage girl who was impregnated by her legal guardian? I seriously doubt it. This is a red herring. The reality is that the average abortion is used as a form of retroactive birth-control. And the bottom line is we don't, or shouldn't, kill people to solve social ills and unfortunate or even criminal circumstances.

[Tired_Old_Man 1]

Fetus

Baby

Two words.

There is a reason that there are two words.

Fetus does not equal baby.

[gadgetlady 4]

Fetus

Baby

Two words.

There is a reason that there are two words.

Fetus does not equal baby.

Fetus is Latin. There are many translations, but the most common is "offspring" or "little one".

It is common to try to re-name something when you want to de-humanize it. The term "fetus" is used to draw attention away, to try to convince people that the unborn child is something different from a child. There are many different names for children: baby, toddler, child, infant, offspring, etc. Calling an unborn baby a fetus does not change biology. Abortion is legal through nine months of pregnancy. Count backwards from birth for me and tell me when a baby ceases to be human?

[BeacheeGirl 0]

RACISM - I would make a law that racism was a felony. The sentence would be living with a family of a different race for 1 year.

[Tired_Old_Man 1]

It is common to try to re-name something when you want to de-humanize it. The term "fetus" is used to draw attention away, to try to convince people that the unborn child is something different from a child.

If the word fetus was introduced after the abortion debate started, then I would agree with you, however, the word had been around for many years before Roe v Wade.

Calling an unborn baby a fetus does not change biology.

You have it backwards. Calling a fetus an unborn baby does not change a fetus into an baby. It is still not a baby.

Abortion is legal through nine months of pregnancy.

In most states, abortion is only legal during the first 3 months.

Count backwards from birth for me and tell me when a baby ceases to be human?

It never stops being human, but it does stop being a "human baby" just prior to the point of birth or at the point of being viable (to be able to live on it's own) depending on the courts and legislature of the state you reside in.

I am a Christian and I believe that God is a very intelligent entity. I doubt if he would install a precious soul at every mating of a human sperm with a human egg. I think God would wait until he knows that the embryo was actually going to become a baby (by being born).

If I am wrong and God does install a soul after every egg/sperm conception, what would become of these souls? Would they suffer the torment of hell because they carried "Original Sin" because they were not baptized? I doubt it. God is not that cruel. Would they be given a free pass into Heaven, because they had no chance to wipe "Original Sin" from their being? If so, then abortion might be seen as a favor. Skip the misery of the soul's Earthly existence and let it go straight to it's Heavenly reward.

Since neither of those two choices seem like what an intelligent God would do, I doubt God puts a soul into every embryo and therefor, I will stand back and let women decide what to do with their bodies. If I am wrong, I would imagine that God will punish the women who have abortions and the doctors that perform them. I will let God do both the judging and doling out of the punishment.

And by the way, if it were up to me, there would never have to be another abortion. If the people who oppose abortion would sign contracts guaranteeing that they would adopt the babies at birth, no matter what the health, race or other situations that might arise, then maybe many women might go through with the birth. If birth control and the morning after pill were more readily available and sex education was allowed in every school, there might be a decrease in the number of abortion sought. And of course, if people were a little more careful, some abortions might not be required by the pregnant women.

If the people who love babies so much (as shown by their sometimes violent attacks on the abortion laws) would petition their federal congressmen and state legislatures to help poor women with assistance (financial, medical, daycare and food stamps, etc), then maybe some women would give birth to and attempt to raise the baby. But many of the same people who oppose abortion, stop caring about the baby as soon as it actually becomes a baby, which is as soon as it is born.

If the people who oppose abortion are successful and abortion becomes illegal in the USA, the "well to do" will either travel out of the country for abortions or pay off doctors. The poor will either have to have back-alley procedures or have to raise the child in "hell on earth" circumstances without assistance from the government or the people who succeeded in making abortion illegal.

[Tired_Old_Man 1]

RACISM - I would make a law that racism was a felony. The sentence would be living with a family of a different race for 1 year.

But, that would be a form of free educartion.

I think every person should have to live with a family of a different race for a year (though not be law). In a very short time, the ignorance of racial hatred would dissipate.

[BeacheeGirl 0]

I went back and starting reading this whole thread. I APPLAUD Tired Old Man to his stance and opionin on the penal institution. I'm going to tell you my story that is private but I will share in the hopes of enlightening some of you.

I was married at 18 and had a baby at 18. I came from a loving, VERY religious but lower middle class family. Well almost immediately after getting married I discovered my 21 year old husband was doing drugs. It got from bad to worse. He beat me and humiliated me so many times. I finally got the courage to leave him once I turned about 21. Well it got increasingly difficult to take care of my son financially after that. My family didn't have money to really help me. Day care was killing me as was rent, etc. and after struggling for a while (working and paying day care and still never having enough money) I made a very stupid decision. I was given a tantalizing offer from this guy that was the brother of a friend of mine to help me temporarily with my desperate financial decision. To fly suitcases to different states of marijuana for about $1000 per trip. I was so desperate that I decided to go for it (HUGE error in judgement). Well I got busted and did a year in jail. The women were treated horribly. I can't tell you how many times we had to be randomly strip searched for no reason. I can't tell you the # of times I was handcuffed to a fence in the middle of the night wearing only a thin night gown in the cold and rain. I did my crime however, and did my time. I was lucky enough to have a family that cared for my son while I was away and forgave me and let me move back in until I got on my feet. However, it made me so sad to see the number of women, mostly mothers that had no where to go or to turn when they got out. No job waiting for them, no rehabilitation class or job training, nothing. There were turned loose into the streets that swallowed them up, surely to go back and do the same crimes that got them there. I am one of the success stories, only because of the family and support I received after. There is no doubt that if I didn't have that I would have ended up right back there. I went to a job paying $6 dollars an hour and day care was a $100 a week. I slowly built up my career and now over 10 years later I just bought my 1st home. My son is an amazing child with love, morality and hope for his future. I make six figures a year with NO COLLEGE degree and besides having gotten fat over the last few years, I am a very happily married woman to my second husband that I met when I was 29 and has taken over of the role of my sons father (since his biological didn't bother).

[Carlene 12]

But many of the same people who oppose abortion, stop caring about the baby as soon as it actually becomes a baby, which is as soon as it is born.

Quite possibly the only thing ever written by TOM that I totally agree with. I consider this absolute proof that no one is totally wrong all the time. (LOL)

For the record...I don't like the whole idea of abortion, legalized or not, and would never consider it an option for myself. I am Catholic, and I am also the former director of a social services agency (15 years), where I learned that "good" laws often make for bad outcomes.

The very people who campaign against abortions are, sadly, the first ones to propose cut-backs in every single subsidy/assistance program at both state and federal levels. Their solution is just don't get pregnant in the first place. Well, guess what....stuff happens. And the consequences are not laid on the mothers....in the end, it's the child who gets punished.

[RavensRiches 0]

Personally, I could care less about the distinction of baby vs. fetus/ life vs. non-life (as it pertains to the issue of abortion).

Human life only starts in one way so who really cares about the moment of viability as far as the legal issue is concerned. Until the entity can survive on its own (basic life function here---not paying rent and driving a car) this is MY body of which I should have 100% control over.

I'm fine with abortion being outlawed as long as those men and women telling me (all women in general) what I can and cannot do are stepping up to the plate (paying all the fees incured) to transplant that "baby" into their own womb and carry, deliver, and financial support the resulting human. Unless science catches up with this process then keep the termination of life (I'm going to extend this to the old and dying as well but that's another thread) legal.

It IS an option---not for everyone and especially NOT for those who have already MADE their CHOICE against it.

If everyone who is so appalled by the choice is so sure that the women who do choose it are going to hell --- do not pass go, do not collect $200 dollars--- then why don't they do more to help these women? How many of you preaching hatred and damnation are adoptive parents? Foster parents? Volunteers at homeless shelters? Since a woman can usually only conceive during a relatively short period of time every month (48 hour window MAX) and men are able to produce millions of sperm every day (God bless em'!) then why aren't we looking at tougher penalties for men who create unwanted pregnancies? So far, conception occurs with egg AND sperm! Wow! Really you say?! Then why is it that the females are the ones punished----legally and morally?

Bottom line is this, I could care less what anyone else decides to do with their own body as long as they don't tread on me. They will have to live with their life choices and decisions, as I will with mine. I love my fellow humans enough to respect their right to FREE WILL.

I am the mother of 4 bio children and went through 5 years and over $50K to adopt a teenager. I volunteer in my community and in my school. I researched and then exposed my family to the US foster system only to decide against fostering. This was carefully decided, not apathetically ignored. If I were the only person involved and my decisions didn't affect 4 young children, I would adopt more children and foster others.

My point, put your money where your mouth is. Get out and see the life that welfare moms with unwanted children live. Expericence the rage and hurt that those unwanted children feel. Then come back and preach against abortion as an option.

[gadgetlady 4]

And also, you're right about something. There's no way anyone can tell me what to do with my body. What's to stop you from outlawing birth control if you outlaw abortion? Some people think the day-after pill is a form of abortion.

Really, the #1 priority for most conservatives is just to stop people from having sex.

Birth control does not stop a beating heart. It is not a medical procedure that intervenes in a human life. HUGE difference.

The argument that conservatives are just trying to stop people from having sex cracks me up. Sex is one of my all time favorite things in the whole world :rant: What we're trying to stop is people killing people.