Complications

[NewSho 20]

Well, I disagree with this particular viewpoint on Mexican surgeries.

There is no need to turn this into a "I think this, you think that" discussion but I have no problem clearly stating my opinion (based on very extensive research) of the situation involved.

A person who is self-pay for whom money is no object? Than sorry, I'll step out and say I'm glad your decision worked out for you.

And it's been, what? 10 days? (By the way - I know how mentioning how long or short a time someone has been banded seems to really bother some members but it's very relevant in this poignant example.)

Well, the good thing is that most gross surgical errors are evident LONG before 10 days. If something goes wrong with a serious medical mishap from the actual surgery, it usually is clear in the first few days (or hours) after the original surgery.

On the other hand, LapBand complications seem to appear a bit later in the game than that.

But length of time banded aside, there is absolutely no way I would inform any friend/relative/acquaintance of mine who had no financial concerns - to go to Tijuana (or TJ as it's called).

Yes this site is full of successful TJ patients :clap2: - I'm happy for them. But there are just a few more exceptions to the rule for my taste. And having had experience as being the exception to the rule, I don't recommend it. It's not sour grapes making me talk about how difficult complications can be - it's the voice of experience. Trust me when I say I realize that bad things can happen right here in the 'States. I didn't have a surgeon error, or other medical mistakes happen to me - yet I suffered mightily.

I did survive. I attribute that to the fact that I was minutes away from my LapBand surgeon (got there in 20 minutes), and minutes away from a Trauma Center in an internationally famous medical facility. I some of the world's best surgeons at my disposal (now whether they all agreed on what was wrong with me was a different story:rolleyes ) and I didn't (in theory) lack for trained quality medical care or facilities.

These options are NOT available to 99% of the patients who have surgery in TJ.

{NOTE: A rare exception is a friend who lives in San Diego and was going to self pay in Tijuana . Now she was just across the border from TJ and would have been in better shape than the average American who goes across for "tourist surgery" (yes, that's what I call it). Even then I found her a comparable surgeon on this end who was more insurance-friendly and more willing to fight. We got her approved and her American surgeon/American hospital surgery was paid by her insurance, at 85% and she is VERY grateful. }

Not one TJ facility is internationally recognized as a level one trauma center. Many TJ patients find difficulty getting treatment on the off-chance they need higher-level medical care back home. I don't espouse being thousands of miles from your surgical team if you can afford it - whether you get your surgeon here or abroad, closer is better if you have the choice of medically-equal facilities and surgeons.

And to be honest, in my opinion Ortiz and Kuri are decent surgeons but they aren't on the level of a Dr Roberto Rumbaut in Monterrey. Plus, nothing about the TJ experience (especially the old shack of a clinic that Kuri USED to practice in) rivals Monterrey's facilities or surgeons. When the US President travels to Mexico, Monterrey's San Jose hospital is the designated Presidential emergency medical facility. Enough said - that is considered to be a world class medical hospital.

So I don't think going to Mexico (or going anywhere far from home) is a great idea. But if 'money is no object' and Mexico is (for some reason) your intended destination, I would only point someone toward Dr. Rumbaut. His experience, his ability and his facility are above par in every way. He's the only Mexican surgeon I can recommend in good conscience, plus he has the most association with US surgeons and facilities. Gzr-Sue's anecdote about him being in Chicago at a bariatric surgery conference is very typical - he answered his cell phone, he was presenting to other surgeons, and he addressed her questions. Not every US patient who goes to Mexico is going to have such experiences, but by far, I've heard more positive Rumbaut stories than from any other Mexican surgeon. (NOTE: And I do not work for, get commission from, or am in ANY way associated with Dr Rumbaut, nor is he my surgeon. But he rocks! )

There's my .02.

Happy Band (and Life) Journeys To All...

Sorry to hear that you had such a poor experience at Moulding. Unfortunately, I have to disagree with your charecterization of Dr. Huacuz as being a less than stellar surgeon.I was banded by Dr. Huacuz on May 18th in Tijuana. I have nothing but the highest regard for this man and his team, and that says a lot coming from me. You see, I am an attorney who for the last 15 years has been defending butcher doctors in the United States. I didnt go to Mexico for the "financial" benefit of the cheaper cost. I was self pay and could have written a check for the procedure in the USA as well as in Mexico. I went there for the experience that the Mexican doctors have over the US doctors..who do you think proctored the US doctors once the FDA gave the approval.Given my background I was VERY VERY thorough in checking into the reputations of these doctors..both thru references, Inamed, other doctors,etc..a process that took me well over 7 months.I can tell you that the ONLY issue regarding Dr. Huacuz was related to a women,last July, that was not given nausea medication by Andres Bantacourt, and as ordered by Dr. Huacuz, which led to problems.....this was something completely out of the control of this doctor. I find it interesting that after a surgeon who allegedly nearly cost you your life, you couldnt exactly remember his name. In 15 years of doing medical malpractice I have yet to see any patient who has been harmed by a doctor that could not rattle his name right off the tip of their tongue......and a year post op--you just now find this site..Sorry..smells too fishy..I have seen too many threads and posts on here by people that simply want to scare people from this or that surgeon or from going to Mexico to get the procedure done. Remember people...do your homework..research..research...research....DO NOT PUT YOUR HEALTH IN THE VALIDITY OF THESE POSTINGS....you are responsible for your health and the decisions you make regarding it. With that said, I can, without reservation,recommend Dr. Huacuz and his team..and I can provide you at least a dozen other people who I personally know have used him and have the same feeling........USE YOUR BRAINS PEOPLE......:angry

[Misfortune 0]

NewSho

Glad to see you tiptoe back in also, Feel free to dive in head first next time..LOL

[chabutter 0]

Its really difficult for me to understand why everyone defends or tears down mexican doctors. I dont think anyone is trying to persuade other LBT people to stay away from Mexico -- they are just sharing stories and advising us to DO OUR RESEARCH.

I appreciate all this information, all the stories, and yeah-- to be honest.. Mexico does sound scary but I wouldnt discount it. I would contact a few patients of the surgeon that I wanted just as I would do in the U.S and see their opinion.

But people really... you get what you pay for.

[chabutter 0]

BTW misfortune, I am very happy that you are alive and healing! Thanks very much for sharing your story. Im sure it will definitely stick in everyones mind and we will all continue to pray for your complete recovery

[Misfortune 0]

Thank you very much for your reply and I really really appreciate your thoughts and prayers! I can not say how much i appreciate it. No words can describe!:nervous And like I said before, I am not trying to dog Mexican surgeons at all! But like you said in your last sentence, "you get what you pay for." And all I am trying to get people to do is "think" something I didnt do.. No matter the research and how wonderful the doctor is, it doesnt change that accidents happen. And the facility is not there to take care of those random accidents, then why take the risk! Life is to short and valuable.. You cant put a $ sign on your life. And not everyone has great insurance , or tons of money just laying around. C'mon this is the real world! So if you do decide to do this surgery or any other procedure, just make sure they can take care of you no matter what can happen. And dont be dumb like me , and just take their word! Because when most or rather I say "alot" of people see money signs , they will say what you want to hear. Goodluck to everyone and best wishes.. I really hope everyone has a happy ending!

[Boo 3]

NEW SHO,

Have you ever met Dr. Rumbaut? Have you personally been to the hospital in Monterrey? Do you perform medical research? Have you ever been to the surgical facilities in Tijuana? If not, then true your "opinion" is worth 2 cents.

[Boo 3]

Misfortune,

I am really sorry you had such a horrendous experience. You are that small percentage that makes us all terrified to go under the knife. I am sorry it happened to you.

[GeezerSue 7]

Okay...about the "you get what you pay for" thing. Not always. Insurance sets the fees for most US banded patients...and whether it's Joe Blow, MD doing his FIRST unproctored band placement or George Fielding doing his several thousandth placement, the price is the same.

For sure, Fielding is a good deal. But Joe Blow, MD coming out the gate? Not on MY body. Give me Rumbaut (my surgeon) at the hospital in Monterrey, MX.

Boo, I have met Dr. Rumbaut, he did my surgery at the hospital in Monterrey, and I returned to Monterrey for follow-up. I ALSO went to Kuri's old place--about eight rooms; a birthing center, really; the price listed on the board was $47/night...talk about getting what you pay for! In that case, Kuri was a bargain, but the facility was just not (yes, I'm a snob) good enough for ME. I'm just not a share-the-restoom with the other FOUR patients in your room kind of girl. Some people are fine with that. But for anyone who hasn't visited outside the US to go there without understanding that "hospital" means something different there...more like a kind of rustic urgent care center or something...with a FEW doctors who work out of the place...maybe three or five.

And, I see you are an Ortiz patient. He uses a much better equipped Radiological Center--I've been there several times--than Kuri's x-ray place. But there is no hospital in Tijuana that is on a par, in terms of staff size and training and equipment, with the even the most modest community hospital available in most areas of the US. Mexico City is different and there are banding doctors there in big ol' hospitals just like in Monterrey..and just like every US city of any size has.

I'm not fond of Mexico-bashing. But I'm not fond of Tijuana hospitals, either. Many, many people ARE okay with them, and I'd never say, "Oh! Don't go there!" I just hate to see someone go by what they read online and travel there and then panic when they encounter a four-doctor hosptial or the like.

[NewSho 20]

Oh, you're addressing me?

I rarely get teased or challenged by ghosts, so this is a treat.

How nice to be flagged by a cartoon character. Priceless.

Let's see - recapping my posts (I'll try to stay away from the big words for you) :

• I admitted that I had major complications with my surgery IN THIS COUNTRY
  
• Surmised that I think I was saved in large part, due to my surgeon & top medical facility being minutes away
  
• Am not a Rumbaut patient but have most definitely had the pleasure of seeing him in person (*yum*)
  
• Have been banded 5 yrs. and have mentored literally dozens of patients, including those who were banded both in Mexico & domestically
  
• Am getting my Masters in Health Care Admin - with a nod to Bariatric Specialisation (if only the Academic G-ds will grant me full approval :phanvan )
  
• Speak Spanish fluently, spent time in Mexico and 'peeped out' the facilities in question - for both LapBanding and plastic surgery.
  
• His new place is better but Kuri's old place was a McSurgery Shack. Even by TJ standards, it sucked. I repeat, I refer to it as a McSurgery Shack. Got it?

If there is anything else you want to question me on about Mexican medical facilities? My opinion can be worth 2 cents to you, hon, but I stand by mine.

Enjoy your week.

Happy Band (and Life) Journeys To All...

NEW SHO,

Have you ever met Dr. Rumbaut? Have you personally been to the hospital in Monterrey? Do you perform medical research? Have you ever been to the surgical facilities in Tijuana? If not, then true your "opinion" is worth 2 cents.

[Boo 3]

First of all, Misfortune, I am sorry if I diverted your thread in some way. Your story is so shocking and horrific! It is amazing you survived. You must have a very strong will. Your warning is valid and appreciated.

Sho, I apologize for I am not trying to pick a fight with you. I speak in defense of good doctors. This board can easily ruin doctors' reputations by opinions, and that is unfair. I also have a Masters Degree, so "big words" don't "scare" me away.

We are extremely blessed to live in this country with advanced technology, skilled surgeons, available health insurance, and easily obtainable antibiotics. For many of us, lapband surgery is not possible in the U.S. due to low B.M.I. levels. Yeah, the thought of going to Mexico for surgery, at first, is a "scary" one. Yet, I completely believe that there are highly skilled surgeons in countries that lack the resources available to the surgeons here.

My brother is a world-renowned surgeon. He travels to third world countries to train surgeons and to donate equipment and supplies. I have met some of these surgeons. They can barely support their families working in places like Indonesia, and countries in Africa. They attend seminars in the U.S. and love their profession. They are highly intelligent; they just happened to be born in another country.

My reason for posting on this thread:

1. I want to join other bandsters in wishing "Misfortune" a healthy future. I am so sorry for your terrible ordeal. It could have happened to any of us. We all know the risks, but the percentage is so small, we don't think it will happen to us. For me, it was a risk that I was willing to take because I have felt so miserable being obese. Again, I am so sorry this happened to you! Your warning is extremely important and helpful to all of us!

2. I value first-hand experience. The many patients of Rumbaut praise the Monterrey experience and his skill. I completely believe them. Ortiz is my surgeon. I received excellent care, and had no complications in an immaculate, modern surgery center.

3. I live in SoCal and speak in defense of our Mexican neighbors. For me, Tijuana is minutes away from top medical facilities and fairly close to home. Monterrey would be quite a distance for me to travel. Also, I am confident there are many excellent surgeons to select in Mexico. When I was going under for my surgery, I felt completely at peace in the hands of Dr. Ortiz.

Wishing a healthy future to all!

[hootiebelle 0]

Jboy...I too live in Las Vegas and I called Fisher/Atkinson place since they are the best in town and been to the seminar twice.... ......I was told by the lady who answered the phone don't go to Mexico they sometimes put the bands in upside down! And Fisher charges a 3000 up front payment to take you on as a paitent after going to Mexico .... fills extra...........I guess its his little slap on the wrist......Considering I know from Inamed saying they have sat on the same "board of experts" at times........So even though Fisher is all warm and fuzzy and loves Ortiz you still get charged 3000......Sure I would love to stay and have the Fisher group do my band but HPN does not cover bands:mad:

[HeatherGurl 0]

First of all I would just like to say that I am so sorry that you had to go through something like this Misfortune. My thoughts are forever with you. I have never read anything so disturbing as your story.

Second, to the others that were jumping on Misfortune for telling her story... gimme a break. I don't even know this person, but my heart goes out to her and for you to say that she can't bad mouth the Dr. that did this to her is BS.

I be damned if I have a surgery and almost die and don't tell the whole world about it. She had every right to. I don't care if your Surgery was in Mexico, U.S., or any other place. I wouldn't touch this Dr. with a ten foot pole just because of this horrible story and you can tell from her post that she was simply stating her story, and that we should all do our research.

THANK you for sharing this with me!!!! Misfortune!

[Marimaru 7]

Misfortune (Miss Fortunate),

Thank you for sharing your story. It's completely amazing to me. It's also amazing that the doctor who did that to you could be so uncaring. I mean, sure, mistakes can happen, and yes, they may not have been prepared for it, but beyond that, there is so much more they could do for you.

I hope that you'll stick around so that we can help support you through your healing process and going forward.

[Murphles 0]

Last thing that I should do is weigh in here but.... here I go.

Complications are awful in health care. Some are preventable. Some are not.

In choosing a surgeon, your best bet is someone who has done the procedure many, many times (research supports this) and who still cares. Because if they are experienced and they still care, your likelihood of serious complications is decreased.

Now how the heck is the average consumer going to discover this.

My big gripe with lapband in the US is that these surgeons just are not trained to do it. In Mexico and Europe and Australia, they have ten years on us. Our surgeons have not been trained in residency to do it. They moslly have not done it in fellowships. Finally, our insurance structure in the US drive Gastric Bypass and disallows lap band.

I am a self pay individual for whom location was not a barrier, i.e. I can pay to rates here and in Mexico. I also thought about Europe. Didn't think Australia would "fly" on the home front. I went with the trainer of trainers. I am very happy with my decision. I had a minor problem and I was glad that I was near the hospital. Most of the late complications of gastric banding do not require surgeon to necessarily work them up. And the treatment is usually fairly simple-removal of the band. Simple medically-but really cruddy if it is you (and not simple).

Post op complications can happen at any time-any medical person can tell you about the kid in for a knee scope who develops a PE during anesthesia and dies. Or the gall bladder that goes septic and dies. Or a prosthesis that becomes infected years after implantation. Always seems to happen to nice people.

I think the real issue in this thread is how do people choose. Consumers really do not have all of the facts. You don't get a report on you physician saying how he or she has screwed up in the past. I was researching one well respected local US doctor and contacted a woman on the boards and she admitted that this doc perforated her stomach. And yet the burden is on all of us.... And we get defensive about our decisions.

Tragically, I also think this is a disease that makes people desparate on so many levels. That is not a place for good decision making.

[Murphles 0]

Oh and misfortune-I am so glad you survived. I hope you continue to recover-it will get better.