Too tight? Or is this typical?

[SIJoe 111]

The Lord's Prayer - A Variation

Our MaMa that art in heaven, hollowed be thy name. Thy kingdom come, they will be done on earth as it is in cyber lap band heaven. Give us this day our daily forbidden doughy bread, rice and Pasta, and lead us not in food temptation and deliver us from the evil of every on

[SIJoe 111]

And deliver us from the evils of unfriendly lap band foods, protective burping, gastric ulcers, sliming, excessive gas, incompetent surgeons, nonsterile operating rooms and the most dreaded slipped band

[myjoy420 5]

So I only have 1.8cc in my 10cc band and I struggle with rice but no problems with bread. However bread and rice should be eaten very sparingly. I use to struggle with shrimp, chicken, and steak after enduring that for a few weeks I knew I was too tight for my personal preference.

[Heccat2 154]

It's normal' date=' you aren't supposed to eat bread, rice, Pasta or anything like that because it gets Gummy. I am able to eat them on occasion, but I have to be VERY careful, take tiny bites and chew well - I also take a sip of something while it's in my mouth before I swallow it. I can't eat chicken breast, it's too dry. If you want white meat, you have to add some kind of sauce to it. I usually just opt for a skinless thigh instead. Every time you get a fill, something will change and it will be the trial and error process all over again. That's the case for me anyway.[/quote']

A sip of something? That's band rule number 1: "don't drink 'sip' anything when you eat". Wow

[Heccat2 154]

Oh and NaNa your statistics are wrong because its less then 5% of lapband patients that fail. I don't care if you have been banded for 10 years you must have lost yours or something to be so rude to people. I think everyone knows how to eat. Your insinuating that we will all lose our bands and why because you did? The only reason I could think that you preach what no one should do. We all have mothers you are not a surgeon and if yours turned your back on you its because you probably drove him nuts. I think most people have enough sense if something isn't right to go to their surgeons. We all have made mistakes but it doesn't mean that we all will lose our bands. I can almost guarantee you lost or do not still have your band that is why you feel the need to preach to everyone. For the record I can assure you that 95% of this forum will still have their bands 10 years from now. You have no right to tell people what to eat or how to eat there is no food off limits with the band NONE. Its only what you and only you can not tolerate. I cant eat meat but that does not mean everyone in the forum cant eat meat. Its my personal problem with MY band not all of bandland. Your not educating you are putting people down and most of the time people who do that are miserable with their own selves.

I agree. Hazel bliss is in the same category!

[NaNa 878]

I agree. Hazel bliss is in the same category!

Ah...another newbie AGREEING with a poster that says she can't eat meat, but I wonder if HER SURGEON knows she can't eat meat?

Let's see...over on OH, there is a FAILED LAP BAND board -- with over 1000 lap banders, many whom have already revised to the Sleeve and Bypass, and no longer can get rebanded after removal, due to either esophageal damage, or slippage AFTER about 3-6 years post op.

Their biggest complaint before the band damaged their bodies or slipped? "they never could eat meat", but refused to get saline removed until it way way too late.

So sure, everyone experiences will be different depending on how much saline is in their bands and how tight they are.

Good luck!

[DELETE THIS ACCOUNT! 12,703]

You know, it's sad this thread has gone so off the rails. Not because it's been hijacked by bickering but because the people bickering actually have the same message to share but because of differences in delivery and perception it's turned into a pissing match. It's like one is saying "the sky is powder blue!" and the other is screaming "No it's not! That's cornflower blue!" Isn't the sky still freak'n blue regardless?

What's even sadder is, that message is spot on but it's being lost in semantics.

*sighs*

[☠carolinagirl☠ 18,721]

You know, it's sad this thread has gone so off the rails. Not because it's been hijacked by bickering but because the people bickering actually have the same message to share but because of differences in delivery and perception it's turned into a pissing match. It's like one is saying "the sky is powder blue!" and the other is screaming "No it's not! That's cornflower blue!" Isn't the sky still freak'n blue regardless?

What's even sadder is, that message is spot on but it's being lost in semantics.

*sighs*

i prefer tarheel blue.......just saying

[DELETE THIS ACCOUNT! 12,703]

i prefer tarheel blue.......just saying

Wolverine blue here!!

[Banded Dan 9]

Heccat: re sipping? That's not true. Sipping is allowed. Maybe your doctor does not allow it but others do.

[jennybean 175]

I am not sure why it went off the rails in the first place. I think all the advice here was generally good

My surgeon says to wait 45 seconds before drinking and I have also read, don't drink during meals at all....not for 30 minutes before and after. I think there is still a lot of learning to do when it comes to the band, even the surgeons don't necessarily agree with each other.

p.s. sky blue

[NaNa 878]

I am not sure why it went off the rails in the first place. I think all the advice here was generally good

My surgeon says to wait 45 seconds before drinking and I have also read, don't drink during meals at all....not for 30 minutes before and after. I think there is still a lot of learning to do when it comes to the band, even the surgeons don't necessarily agree with each other.

p.s. sky blue

JennyBean you are going into this with your eyes open and knowing the pitfalls of banding and how to avoid them, and how to use your band wisely and I am hoping you have a very long successful banded journey.

[NaNa 878]

You know, it's sad this thread has gone so off the rails. Not because it's been hijacked by bickering but because the people bickering actually have the same message to share but because of differences in delivery and perception it's turned into a pissing match. It's like one is saying "the sky is powder blue!" and the other is screaming "No it's not! That's cornflower blue!" Isn't the sky still freak'n blue regardless?

What's even sadder is, that message is spot on but it's being lost in semantics.

*sighs*

Exactly! They are yet ACKNOWLEDGING what I am saying "is true" but don't like the tone of my posts...LOL....

Never listen to my tone, I would never lead you the wrong way....my tone gets over the top because I've seen people lose their bands over and over again over the same issue, when it can be easily avoided.

So I guess if we could get that color to match...we'd all be happy!

[GuyMontag 1,264]

Not to upset anyone but I did hear the word statistics so I would like to throw this out there so we can have a discussion based on actual studies rather than anecdotal evidence alone:

1.1. Allergan, the manufacturer of the Lap Band, published the following as part of their Patient Safety Information.

“In the United States clinical study, with 3-year follow-up reported, 88% of the 299 patients had one or more adverse events, ranging from mild, moderate, to severe. Nausea and vomiting (51%), gastroesophageal reflux (regurgitation) (34%), band slippage/pouch dilatation (24%) and stoma obstruction (stomach-band outlet blockage) (14%) were the most common post-operative complications. In the study, 25% of the patients had their band systems removed, two-thirds of which were following adverse events.”

1.2. Published in the journal Obesity Surgery in 2008, the study Long-Term Results of Bariatric Restrictive Procedures: A Prospective Study lap band failure rates were documented at 54% with the most frequent complications being pouch dilatation (21%) and anterior slippage (17%). 44% of the patients required repair or revision.

1.3. In the study Analysis of poor outcomes after laparoscopic adjustable gastric banding published in June of 2010 by George Washington University[ii], the authors indicate a high complication rate for gastric banding procedures including reoperation for 16.7% of the patients in the study. The majority of the patients also failed to achieve a 50% excess weight loss. They also noted that 11% of the patients in the study required revision to the sleeve gastrectomy.

1.4. In another study that included patients observed over 9 years, Long-Term Results and Complications Following Adjustable Gastric Banding[iii], 52.9% patients had at least one complication requiring reoperation and the band was removed for 28.6%.

1.5. Most significant is a recent study A 10-year experience with laparoscopic gastric banding for morbid obesity: high long-term complication and failure rates[iv]. In this study, a group of physicians from Switzerland led by Dr. M. Suter, MD, PD, FACS, examined the long-term complications related to LapBand weight-loss surgery. The study demonstrated that LapBand long-term complications increase over time. Overall, 33.1% of patients had at least one long-term complication related to gastric banding. This study concludes:

“LGB appeared promising during the first few years after its introduction, but results worsen over time, despite improvements in the operative technique and material. Only about 60% of the patients without major complication maintain an acceptable EWL in the long term. Each year adds 3-4% to the major complication rate, which contributes to the total failure rate. With a nearly 40% 5-year failure rate, and a 43% 7-year success rate (EWL >50%), LGB should no longer be considered as the procedure of choice for obesity. Until reliable selection criteria for patients at low risk for long-term complications are developed, other longer lasting procedures should be used.

Long-Term Results of Bariatric Restrictive Procedures: A Prospective Study

Schouten R, Wiryasaputra DC, van Dielen FM, van Gemert WG, Greve JW.

Obesity Surgery, 2008

[ii] Analysis of poor outcomes after laparoscopic adjustable gastric banding.

Kasza J, Brody F, Vaziri K, Scheffey C, McMullan S, Wallace B, Khambaty F.

Surg Endosc. 2010 Jun 30.

[iii] Long-Term Results and Complications Following Adjustable Gastric Banding.

Lanthaler M, Aigner F, Kinzl J, Sieb M, Cakar-Beck F, Nehoda H.

The Journal of Metabolic Surgery and Allied Care, 2010

[iv] A 10-year experience with laparoscopic gastric banding for morbid obesity: high long-term complication and failure rates

Suter M, Calmes JM, Paroz A, Giusti V.

Obesity Surgery, 2006

[v] Weight Loss and Quality of Life After Gastric Band Removal or Deflation

Lanthaler M, Strasser S, Aigner F, Margreiter R, Nehoda H.

Obesity Surgery, 2009

From the post: http://vsgappeal.blogspot.com/

Our bands are surgical devices and we need to remember that. We can screw them up and they do screw up on their own so to speak. We don't need to go giving them reasons to fail like throwing up all the live long day. I hear the term, baby your band, and I think that's good advice.

[NaNa 878]

Not to upset anyone but I did hear the word statistics so I would like to throw this out there so we can have a discussion based on actual studies rather than anecdotal evidence alone:

1.1. Allergan, the manufacturer of the Lap Band, published the following as part of their Patient Safety Information.

“In the United States clinical study, with 3-year follow-up reported, 88% of the 299 patients had one or more adverse events, ranging from mild, moderate, to severe. Nausea and vomiting (51%), gastroesophageal reflux (regurgitation) (34%), band slippage/pouch dilatation (24%) and stoma obstruction (stomach-band outlet blockage) (14%) were the most common post-operative complications. In the study, 25% of the patients had their band systems removed, two-thirds of which were following adverse events.”

1.2. Published in the journal Obesity Surgery in 2008, the study Long-Term Results of Bariatric Restrictive Procedures: A Prospective Study lap band failure rates were documented at 54% with the most frequent complications being pouch dilatation (21%) and anterior slippage (17%). 44% of the patients required repair or revision.

1.3. In the study Analysis of poor outcomes after laparoscopic adjustable gastric banding published in June of 2010 by George Washington University[ii], the authors indicate a high complication rate for gastric banding procedures including reoperation for 16.7% of the patients in the study. The majority of the patients also failed to achieve a 50% excess weight loss. They also noted that 11% of the patients in the study required revision to the sleeve gastrectomy.

1.4. In another study that included patients observed over 9 years, Long-Term Results and Complications Following Adjustable Gastric Banding[iii], 52.9% patients had at least one complication requiring reoperation and the band was removed for 28.6%.

1.5. Most significant is a recent study A 10-year experience with laparoscopic gastric banding for morbid obesity: high long-term complication and failure rates[iv]. In this study, a group of physicians from Switzerland led by Dr. M. Suter, MD, PD, FACS, examined the long-term complications related to LapBand weight-loss surgery. The study demonstrated that LapBand long-term complications increase over time. Overall, 33.1% of patients had at least one long-term complication related to gastric banding. This study concludes:

“LGB appeared promising during the first few years after its introduction, but results worsen over time, despite improvements in the operative technique and material. Only about 60% of the patients without major complication maintain an acceptable EWL in the long term. Each year adds 3-4% to the major complication rate, which contributes to the total failure rate. With a nearly 40% 5-year failure rate, and a 43% 7-year success rate (EWL >50%), LGB should no longer be considered as the procedure of choice for obesity. Until reliable selection criteria for patients at low risk for long-term complications are developed, other longer lasting procedures should be used.

Long-Term Results of Bariatric Restrictive Procedures: A Prospective Study

Schouten R, Wiryasaputra DC, van Dielen FM, van Gemert WG, Greve JW.

Obesity Surgery, 2008

[ii] Analysis of poor outcomes after laparoscopic adjustable gastric banding.

Kasza J, Brody F, Vaziri K, Scheffey C, McMullan S, Wallace B, Khambaty F.

Surg Endosc. 2010 Jun 30.

[iii] Long-Term Results and Complications Following Adjustable Gastric Banding.

Lanthaler M, Aigner F, Kinzl J, Sieb M, Cakar-Beck F, Nehoda H.

The Journal of Metabolic Surgery and Allied Care, 2010

[iv] A 10-year experience with laparoscopic gastric banding for morbid obesity: high long-term complication and failure rates

Suter M, Calmes JM, Paroz A, Giusti V.

Obesity Surgery, 2006

[v] Weight Loss and Quality of Life After Gastric Band Removal or Deflation

Lanthaler M, Strasser S, Aigner F, Margreiter R, Nehoda H.

Obesity Surgery, 2009

From the post: http://vsgappeal.blogspot.com/

Our bands are surgical devices and we need to remember that. We can screw them up and they do screw up on their own so to speak. We don't need to go giving them reasons to fail like throwing up all the live long day. I hear the term, baby your band, and I think that's good advice.

I agree with this study and it is VERY TRUE. I love my band and want to keep as it long as I can, but I am not living in a "bubble" and ignoring FACTS.

The thing is ...why those STATS of failure long term is so high, many people use the band the opposite of how it IS suppose to work.

I NEVER kept a too tight band for long periods of time, my surgeon used the Pars Flaccida method 8 years ago, my band never did slip...BUT...my pouch got dilated VERY QUICKLY after being too tight for about 1 month, but -- I guess you can argue that the 4cc bands were more prone to pouch dilations than the AP bands are...reason that surgeons no longer use them in the US.

But there are still many people are still doing well with their 4cc bands, and have had no issues, BUT -- MANY STILL HAVE REFLUX that is controlled with PPi's and Protonix. I had heartburn from DAY 1 with my old 4cc band and had to be on PPi's for over 8 years.

Since I've gotten my new AP band -- no heartburn or reflux at all, and I don't need to take Protonix...also I had a hiatal hernia repaired that I don't believe my first surgeon repaired...so there are so many variables on why complications occur.

But -- one of the biggest mistakes and will occur with ANY band -- 4cc or AP, you cannot keep it adjusted too tight, in the red zone for long periods of time and not expect some damage to the esophagus or other issues.

Also, constantly vomiting puts pressure on those sutures and they can come loose from the band, I've seen this reported this too over the years. --

A few stuck episodes (Pbing) will not cause damage, but if this is done repeatedly daily, it can damage either the esophagus and the pouch, you actually don't have to be too tight to cause band damage, you can vomit daily to cause damage too.

Ideally, most lap banders SHOULD be able to eat moist lean meats of about 1-3 oz per meal, if and a few bites of soft veggies per meal that average about 1/2 cup to 1 full cup and sometimes 1-1/2 cups of solid food per meal, THAT IS THE GREEN ZONE.

Restriction will never be the same each day, some days most bandsters IN THE GREEN ZONE can eat a bit more and sometimes a bit less, depends on the ebb flow of the band and what is going on with them personally.

Also this still does not keep complications from occurring, events in the stomach, or other issues can cause complications, so nothing is full proof, but staying in the green zone most of the time, and avoiding vomiting, will lessen the chances of band complications.