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So, do any of you find that you have lots of gas since being sleeved. I am not talking about burping...LOL. Man, I constantly have gas and it is gross. I seriously pass gass, I know, probably 45 times a day. It is annoying! Is it because our bellys are so small or what? Kelly
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No, the real question is who actually says "titties"?! My pannus is there, but not like a sailcloth. It ends ABOVE my err... girl area. But it's also not completely deflated yet. I don't get lesions there, honestly, because I swipe it with deodorant. If I didn't, I would. My bellybutton is causing me major problems. I can seriously take a qtip, stick the whole thing into my bellybutton, and never touch the end. It's like a freaking bottomless pit. Lately it's been prone to irritation and I'm guessing some kind of yeast infection or something because - "TMI" - if a freaking qtip can't get to the end of it, how the heck can I keep it completely clean? A turkey baster?! I'd love to have plastics. I have the means to have plastics. But it's scary. Kudos to anyone with the cajones to go through with it. The other angle... I'd probably have a tattoo by now, except every bit of line that was crooked or not exactly what I envisioned would bother me. Honestly, lots of people who have plastics are so freaking lopsided or indented or whatever. Granted, I look like a damn used rubber full of quarters. But I'm proportionately & evenly gross. I don't know how I'd react to something like one hip being higher than the other, and some weird indentation on my thigh, etc. And really, I just don't like pain very much.
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Supermom: Thank you so much for your input. It makes me feel a little better with my progress. My hair has also been falling out like crazy and I have been taking Biotin since my second month. I haven't noticed any changes in the hair loss. I still like you, have hair falling out all over the place. Maybe I should also increase my Protein intake and incorporate protein shakes again into my daily meal plans to up my protein intake to more than 70. I believe I have been averaging about 60 grams of protein. I haven't noticed any problems with my energy levels. I am actually a whole lot more active now and I get up so refreshed in the morning with the exception of course of PMS! Which is also horrible for me because sometimes I get it for weeks!!! It had regulated a bit the first three months but now I've been on it for almost the entire month which sucks! But I am used to this. It's my hormone imbalance. That's why I am ALWAYS on Iron pills. Which brings me to another subject... constipation (TMI? lol) I haven't been going to the bathroom regularly. There have been weeks where I would go 5 days without going. I know it could be because of the Iron I am taking but I really can't stop taking that. If I go more than 5 days I have to drink something to help it along. My scale is actually consistant in a way, being that I would randomly lose about 7 pounds but then I would stall up and down near each round number. For example my last weight I was 232. I fluctuate from there up and down 2-3 pounds. Like I would go up to 235 then back down to 230 and up to 232 again and back down to 230 eventually I would drop to 222 in one week and I know the same thing will happen. As it happened in the 260's 250's , 240's and now nearing the 230 mark. In August I noticed I didn't lose a pound but in Sept. I lost 10-12 pounds so far depending on the friendliness of the scale. Thanks again for your encouragement! And I am glad to see you are doing really well too! Keep it up! Coops: Thank you for the support! sleeve 4 me: Thanks for you support, and my Vitamins are always in my mouth right on schedule! I know I have slacked on the protein here and there but I usually get back on track with them. Weekends are especially tough for me to keep my meal plans since I am super busy but during the week i am right on track.
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You have been warned! So I started my period 1 week before surgery I have been flowing for 22 days. I'm tired of it. Anyone else go through this? I have a lady doc appointment Monday but good grief enough already.
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Okay,, this sucks to talk about but it's embarrassing and I want it to go away!!! I am really gassy now. It doesn't seem to make a difference what I've eaten or not eaten. It even happens long, long, long after I've eaten. There seems to be no rhyme or reason to it, but I hate it!!! Sometimes it's really loud, sometimes really stinky ( OMG!! I'm so embarrassed by this!!!) I'm hoping someone has gone through this and has found something that has helped?!?? Please????
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Well, here goes nothin'. This is my first blog entry, I've honestly never written a blog before but I thought I would give it a shot. I have quite a bit to say and I feel safe saying everything here. Let's start off with my weight loss journey and where my weight problems stemmed from. I was always a yo yo'er. I would be thin, fat, thin, fat all my life. I was into sports then I would stop and balloon back up. In highschool I was a 18 and thought I was fat, little did I know, by the time I was 23, I would be nearly 400 lbs and a size 30 in jeans. I was miserable, I got married young, at 22 and before then I was on a steady incline of weight gain, after the marriage, it got out of control. I was eating my feelings and I didn't know how to stop. The topic of surgery came up when I had blood work done (i'm anemic) and my doctor told me that I was borderline diabetic and when I saw the # on the scale say 394#... I knew something had to be done. He referred me to the Bariatric Institute of Wisconsin. With my insurance I was required to do a 1 year treatment plan and several times within that year, I nearly gave up and thought it wasnt worth it. Boy, I'm glad I stuck it out. My gastric sleeve surgery was May 16,2013. The day that changed my entire life. The surgery was good, the next day in the hospital was torture but again, It was 100% worth the struggle. I spent my time looking at before and after photos and watching youtube videos of people who had the surgery and wondering "will I ever be this person with these kind of results?" and the answer is yes. If you want it bad enough, it will be you and I am living proof of someone who changed their life with one struggle at a time. The first few months are the worst, your life is basically taken on a rollercoaster with no seatbelt. You have to learn slowly what you can and cant handle, how to count protein, and slowly get into a work out regimine. At about 3-4 months, everyone besides me was noticing the weight loss. I honestly thought I was at a stand still and scared of developing body dimorphic because I wasn't seeing it but everyone else was. I just thought everyone was being nice knowing I had this surgery done. At about 8 months, it hit me. I looked through old pictures of myself where I thought I looked great and to my own self, I was unrecognizable, thats when things started to really hit me. The hard work, the 5-6 days a week at the gym, the sacrifices were all making sense and I was ecstatic. It's a strange feeling. okay.... at 10 months, my personal life started to take a bad turn. Before my surgery, my husband told me he would be supportive and was excited for me to go through this and better myself and he promised to take the plunge with me with changing eating habits and working out....that didn't seem to be the case. I was more active and wanting to experience life because well, I got my life back! and all he was concerned with was going to buffets, ordering pizza and laying in bed playing video games. Our sex life (tmi) was non existant, We started to only speak a few words a day to eachother. I was going out with my friends constantly because he would never want to go anywhere. Well.... a month ago I filed for divorce and am moving into my own place tomorrow. It's really liberating to have the strength to do this, I was unhappy for at least 2 years but this surgery gave me the confidence I needed to break free. I'm only 25 and yes, I got married young and I understand, marriage is a commitment but a person can only give so much until they break and try to work on things so much before it becomes a lost cause. I never knew I had this strength in me and I owe it all to the gastric sleeve surgery. It saved my life in more ways than one. So if you're on the fence or not sure about it... think about all the doors it can open in other aspects of your life. I'm now just over 1 year out, almost 190# down, went from a size 30 to a size 14 in jeans and i wear a size small/medium in mens tshirts, when I used to wear a 3x. it's a pretty amazing feeling! thanks for reading
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Hi everyone. I hope someone can help me. I was banded on 6/20/2011, and for the past month I have alot of nausea. Like almost every day I wake up nauseous and luckily I have nausea meds from my doc. It's just weird that it is every day. Does anyone else have this problem? Also, for the ladies, does the surgery tend to make your TOM irregular. Now before surgery I was never completely regular, but usually went a two months with out it.I have had it twice, but they were only about a week and a half apart and have lasted a little longer than normal (however have been lighter). I'm sorry if it's TMI, but I don't have anyone else to ask. Please help!! Thank you in advanced for your responses!
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I'm 3 days out and had been just battling gas, but I heeded the advice to never trust a fart, and boy am I glad I did. My first bm since surgery has been diarrhea. Anyone had this happen to them before? I had 1/2 an Atkins shake mixed with 1/2 skim milk, about an hour ago. Now, explosions. Sorry, if it's TMI. It feels good to not be so stopped up, but now I'm worried about my hydration status? Anyone?
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I haven't been able to go to the bathroom with a suppusoitory the last four times. I bought fiber pill but I am afraid to take it because it might swell up in my stomach. Please someone help any advice would be appreciated thanks in advance.
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What Was Your Ah-Ha (Or Oh Crap) Moment?
Fluffnomore replied to SoccerMomma73's topic in General Weight Loss Surgery Discussions
I broke a chair at someone's house about two years ago. I didn't weigh too much more than some of the men there, but still... I think it's a combination of things. I refused to be in pictures. When I saw myself in pictures I couldn't believe it was me. It must have been the lens, or the angle, or something. Or I was standing next to that skinny person! That said, even employing all of the "tricks" like putting your weight on one leg, being photographed from above, turning my head…it didn't disguise that I was big, and getting bigger. Especially when I knew the person next to me in a photo did in fact look just like that... Two years ago I participated in one of those "have a month free" things at a local (very nice) health club. I loved it, really wanted to do it. But (TMI warning) I had female issues…I peed when jumping rope. Then I investigated that with a local urogynocologist, and had the surgery to correct that about 6 months later. I put off going to the doctor to avoid stepping on the scale. Sometimes refused to weigh if I had to go. This year I realized that the last two surgeries I have had (gallbladder and uro-gyn)--if they were not caused by my being overweight, they were exacerbated by it. And I spent a lot of the last year getting sick in small ways and not just bouncing back. And my weight kept creeping up. I realized that it was really a matter of time before I was staring at a diabetes or heart disease diagnosis. Maybe 10 years, maybe less. And did I want to live my life that way, or take the bull by the horns now? Anyway, here I am. Happy about the choice. Working on myself and my progress. -
Warning TMI...Okay, I am two weeks post op and was going to the bathroom every two or three days...and still am...except two days ago it was very hard and did not move freely. I am drinking lots of Water and exercising and things have not gotten better. I am on day 2 of Miralax but nothing so far. The box said it could take 1 to 3 days, but I'm petrified of things not moving along. I ate Fiber enriched oatmeal and some watermelon..not sure what else to do or when to get worried. Help!!! This is so Embarrssing and not fun to deal with. I feel like I should go back on liquids because I am scared to eat???
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Can you eat more during your period?
wishes replied to sunnyd's topic in POST-Operation Weight Loss Surgery Q&A
See, I am the opposite too. I get nauseous, and I have some "back end" issues. Sorry for the TMI! I normally stall because I can't eat, and I do not want to drink. -
Sorry Maybe Tmi But I Need To Know!
cbarreto posted a topic in POST-Operation Weight Loss Surgery Q&A
I had my surgery on april 18th. Thw first week i had a xouple episodrs of diarreah so i took some imodium. Then i couldnt go for awhile so i stopped. Had maybe a week of normal stool and now bam! horrible gas pains and diarreah for two days! I had the chills and i thought i was gonna throw up at the same time (thankfully i didnt) ..anyone else go thru this? is it normal? -
What does 'full' feel like?
meggiep replied to Jax's topic in POST-Operation Weight Loss Surgery Q&A
I usually burp ;-P I found I need to pay attention to that or I will regret it. I ignored it once and everything came back up. Other report hiccuping, one person even sneezes! Not to be TMI nut it is not like a regular burp, it is a burp with a little of the flavor of what I am eating. It is so hard at frst1 you really have to listen to your body! -
3 DAYS POST-OP GAS!!!!
mistyk73 replied to mistyk73's topic in POST-Operation Weight Loss Surgery Q&A
Time time time...that's what I keep hearing...lol I'm IMPATIENT!!!! Its so much better today after I finally passed some gas last night and today. I just keep reminding myself everyday is only going to get better! @Chef there is no such thing as TMI in this forum in my book...lol -
To put it bluntly....I burp and fart all the time!
gotmyeyeontheprize posted a topic in POST-Operation Weight Loss Surgery Q&A
I know, it is a little TMI. Even so, since being banded 5 months ago, I am full of gas! My belly hurts all the time from gas pain. The best relief is to just let it all out! Also, I have not had a normal (as in presurgery normal) bowel movement since being banded. I'm always having to strain to get something going or it is the runs! Geez!! Do you experience any of this?!?! -
I got sleeved this past Thursday December 15th, in Lexington, KY at Central Baptist Hospital by Dr. Weiss. Right after surgery I felt a ton of gas, I was out of it couldn't really focus on family and friends. With every sip I took there was a big bubble of gas that came up from my stomach and out like a belch, I didnt pass gas until my second day and the third day I had a bowl movement that was crazy ( I KNOW TMI). My doctor used the OnQ pump which was great. I never really had pain, except one of my incisions was sore which is till sore today. I stayed in the hospital for two nights and I thought I was going to go crazy with all the tubes running out of me in every direction. I havent been hungry since surgery but I have been really thirsty. In the hospital they served me popsicles, broth, a protein shot and lemonade. I drunk the protein shot, popsicle, and lemonade. Here at home I've been eating Campbells Chicken broth and I add unflavored whey protein to it to help get my protein in. I've also added the whey protein to my juice or drinks. I did purchase some isopure drinks which I will drink half at a time because they have around 40 grams of protein per bottle. The unflavored protein really mixes well with warm food as well as cold drinks. This is the ony way I can manage to get in my protein and my liquids for the day. My doctor sent me home with liquid loratab as well as something for the gas, nausea. Oh yea after surgery my blood pressure went up. Before surgery I always had perfect blood pressure. The doctor said that sometimes the surgery can drive up the blood pressure. Overall I'm doing fantastic. I've slept on both my sides the first night just fine. When I got home I was able to walk up the stairs and sleep in my bed comfortably. The only issues I've had is one of my incisions are sore. I've been walking a lot and sipping a lot. It takes me a while to finishe my liquids but that's not a huge issue. I really can't complain, I've kept everything down, and I have a good amount of energy. I do take all of my vitamins and suppliments so I wont be deficient. Anyway I hope all the December Sleevers are doing well!!!!
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I Just Can't Eat Slow Enough!
Qpdsful replied to DebiC's topic in POST-Operation Weight Loss Surgery Q&A
Take your time....if you don't you will toss up your intake!! I am 4 months post op and I have never been one to eat slow, or toss my food...sadly if I eat too much too fast or something that doesn't agree here it comes...TMI I am sure. I start with protein and fiber in my coffee every am, than my vitamins, I take celery, and high protein as well as yogurt to snack on during the day at work. It is WORK just to eat....so I have two or three nibbles, and move on to something else. READ...or relax this is a transitional life change...YOU CAN DO IT!! Sometimes I am so frustrated in my decision but when I am cleaning out my closet it makes me smile!!! -
This Belching / Gas Is Killing Me
iegal replied to Liliana Arleen's topic in POST-Operation Weight Loss Surgery Q&A
I am so sorry you are having such a rough time. You need to talk to your surgeon to get a stronger PPI and let him/her know about lack of bowel movements. But, TMI - I only had one about once a week postop remember than little input equals little output. A softener helps depending on how far out you are. Walking helps with the gas, really. Yes, lactose intolerant for first three months too, this could be upsetting you. Discuss with a medical professional. You are learning the new you and this is not always an easy path. Learn what you can do now and then later when stable, reintroduce some problem foods/liquids as you move along in this journey. At about 6 months out I was totally normal minus the quantity I could eat. I had learned new habits and new ways of eating. So, understand this is a process now. Wishing you the best and hoping you find answers soon. -
Oh I am glad you shared even with it bordering on TMI..(you weren't too graphic, thankfully!) and I have heard of others who swear they dump with the sleeve. I'm glad you are learning to manage it, as I'm sure you don't want to repeat what has happened.
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Wow - I never meant to let it get this long without another posting. Yet more evidence that the more weight you lose, the more you re-enter the real world and that thing called "a life" that you have been avoiding, which means you just get busier and busier!! SOO.... I have been doing great. I have lost 62 lbs. now but I know that I have been slipping from the right path. One thing is my food choices. Not the greatest lately. Not terrible (I AM still losing weight) but not great - a few too many cookies here and there. And while it hasn't derailed my success (YET), it just shows me that I am getting complacent - lazy! So I need to get back on track. The second thing I have been bad about is exercise. I basically haven't exercised at all since the start of winter. Given that it is now mid-February and that I live in MN, so winter began about September - that is a long time and, again, a bad habit. It has been so cold that walking outdoors wasn't an option. And I joined the YMCA with the intention of swimming (the only exercise I actually enjoy!) but it has ended up being a hassle to get the truck. We only have the one SUV and Pat uses it to go to work. Normally it isn't that big of a deal because we live so close to the base that I can take the truck anytime. But it means getting everyone up really early (about 5:30am) to bring Pat in and then come home. So I recently bought a treadmill on Craigslist for $50 (great deal!!) and I am excited. Imagine that - me excited about exercise!! But I am! I feel that I have already had a lot of success with my weight loss and can you imagine the results if I actually got off my butt and did some exercise?? Well, I can and I like it!! It will be nice to be able to go to the den downstairs and put my ipod on or watch TV while I walk and Molly can play, etc. So my exercise is now completely in my hands - no excuses about the truck or weather. And I am looking forward to the challenge. (Which is shocking to me that I even wrote that sentence!!) The last thing that I am being bad about is going to the lapband doctor. I don't need a fill (I don't think so anyway. I am pretty happy where I am at. I already skip meals at times because I just forget and I'm not hungry. *I am NOT advocating that as a good idea!!* I'm just being honest. But I also feel that when I do eat, I can eat more than the one cup that I should be eating. But I am more concerned that if I get the fill any tighter, I might stop eating even more, which is obviously not healthy. So I think I'll stay where I am for now.) But what happened was I missed the first appointment because I flaked out. So I rescheduled and it was about a month later before they could get me in. So next thing you know, I freaking flake on that one too!! (I often ask myself if I am really an adult and so far, I can't answer myself!) So I was really disappointed in myself and embarrassed that I did that twice. So then I didn't want to call and make another appointment - I felt like I'd be scolded or they'll be mad at me. Which is ridiculous. They have so many patients they probably don't remember that I missed the dang appointments anyway. And even if they do - what are they going to do?? Make a comment and we all move on. But I have let it go on for so long now, that I really don't want to face them and have to admit how long since I've seen the doctor. (Hello?? Will Claire the adult please stand up??) This is childish and I know it, but I can't seem to get over the feeling like I've let them down and I don't want to show my face there. So I think I will call and schedule an appointment and make my husband go with me. He is really my rock - he is a no-BS type of guy and helps me overcome these types of issues and see how silly it really is. So that is how I have been bad. BOO!!! :w00t: Now onto the good stuff!! I have lost 62 lbs baby!! I used to wear a 26/28 and I am now in a 22/24!! I just bagged up the last of the too big clothes from my closet and with our tax return we got me some clothes. Which I loved. Not only shopping for smaller sizes, but the way clothes looked better on me, the fact that there are cuter clothes to choose from, that there is more variety to choose from, etc etc. So that was pretty awesome. My husband spent a fortune on lingerie for me!! Every pair of panties are adorable now (or sexy) and I even have some actual lingerie. Which brings me to a side point that someone else mentioned and I figured I should talk about it. If sex is TMI for you, skip to the next paragraph!! Okay - sex is GREAT! I mean, I've always enjoyed sex, but for quite awhile before the surgery, I had NO sex drive. I just never felt like having sex. I still enjoyed it when I did have it, I just never felt much like having it. But now, it is so different! Not only do I have a normal sex drive, but the sex is better. Why? Well, for one thing, there are positions and stuff like that we can do now that we haven't been able to do in awhile. But now we can because I have lost so much weight. I don't know whether it is hormones or what, but the "grand finale" is much better too. Which of course makes me want sex more often, etc. So that is a great side effect of all of this - my husband thanks the surgeon every night!! Back to the normal great stuff - in losing so much weight, I am beginning to literally and figuratively "find" myself. I am seeing parts of my body that I haven't seen in ages (not always a good thing, but the novelty is nice!). I am discovering my body and beginning to feel like we are friends again. For so long I felt like I battled my own body all the time - being sick all the time, all the problems and medications I was on, and the constant battle to lose weight with no results. But now I am beginning to feel like my body and I are working together and now that we are on the same side, I am beginning to actually be proud of my body - despite the imperfections. I feel like I earned those battle scars and that despite the abuse my body has endured, it is still here and we are on the right track now and my body is still going! I don't know how else to describe it. But I also am finding ME. The actual person and personality that has been smothered for so long under all that fat. I've begun to realize that I have a sense of style and individuality that is beginning to be reflected in my clothes - for so long it was all about the clothes that fit and would flatter as much as possible while still fitting in my budget. That doesn't really allow for style and personality. But now, I am discovering that I am pretty off beat. Maybe it is also a reaction to having to wear fat girl clothes for so long, which are often kind of older and dowdy, but I am really throwing that aside. I realized that I love the Rockabilly look (very old school, Bettie Page hair, pencil skirts, peep toe shoes, etc.) which I'm still not small enough to pull off, but I still like more edgy clothes and styles. I have begun to shop exclusively at Torrid. Now, there are a lot of clothes there that are not my style AND way too young for me, but there is a lot there that I really love. I am dressing younger and hipper. I painted my nails purple the other day!! Which, if you knew me, is pretty extreme. I was always so conservative. But I loved it. For my 32nd birthday in January, I got the top of my right ear pierced AND my nose pierced!! I have always wanted to get it done - I love the way it looks. But I always felt like I was too fat and too old. A mother of two who is 32 does NOT get her nose pierced. But when my husband found out that THAT was the reason I haven't done it, he was adamant that I was getting it done. That was my birthday present from him. He said, "Who says you are too old?? Who cares what anyone thinks?? You want to get it done, it would make you happy - what does anyone else's opinion matter??" It might be different if I worked at a very conservative job, but I don't!! I'm a stay at home mom and I'm going to college online for graphic design. My hubby said that my nose ring and new look are perfect for an "artsy" career. He said that looking young and being your own person and slightly unconventional will probably be a plus in my job field, when I get that far. So I am happy about that - I feel like I am developing my own style and learning all over again what I really like and what works for me. Of course I am still busy with the kids - James is in third grade and he just had his 9th birthday party. Molly is about to start kindergarten in September (boo hoo!!:smile:) and her 5th birthday party is in a month, which I am still trying to get my butt in gear and finish planning everything for. (Get my butt in gear - are we sensing a theme here??) Patrick is frustrated at his job, but we are actually all really happy. Life for our entire family has steadily improved since I got this surgery. It has changed our lives in so many ways - many of them unexpected. So, that is about it for now. As usual, I'll end with - I LOVE MY LAPBAND!! :tt2:
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For the past 2 weeks the scale hasn't moved, I have been loosing inches, and that makes me super happy! What I find weird is that I am drinking more Water now but I go less to the bathroom to pee. I keep track of what I drink everyday and I have been working on drinking more, I am up to 80 oz this week, and none of it is coffee. I drink 20oz of Protein shakes and 60 oz of water. Before my scale stopped moving I had a direct route, I would drink some water and 10 mins later go pee it, yesterday I drank 40 oz before I went to the bathroom. Is this normal? The only time I sweat is during my 30 mins exercise in the morning. Any thoughts are welcome!
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3 Days Post Op, Having Regrets
Jim1967 replied to Traci01's topic in POST-Operation Weight Loss Surgery Q&A
Hello All, I also had surgery on the 16th and had no problems. I have had slight headaches here and there but I assume it is my harsh withdrawal from caffeine. Fighting to reach my daily Fluid intake but working on it. Need to stay hydrated. My pain was pretty tolerable and only took pain med twice since getting discharged on the 17th. Only problem I am having is the major gas pains in the lower belly and lets just say lots of trips to the bathroom. Sorry for the TMI but the cramps have been bad. -
Starting To Love My Sleeve
Meljp replied to Reddi4change's topic in POST-Operation Weight Loss Surgery Q&A
Huge Congrats to YOU!!! I feel the same way!! I was sleeved on 2-27 and the only thing that bothers me is swallowing (some) pills...capsules are not my friend and yesterday one came back up..TMI I know, but important for some..it was the first time I have thrown up....small tablets are fine, so I will have to find other brands that will go down without problems...I love the restriction....the feel of being full after a small amount of food!!! I told hubs today at dinner...I love it!! I used to wake up EVERY morning and I swear the very first thing I would think of was food....Not now...that in itself is such a blessing!!! -
10 days post op is this all normal?
Bandedlaura posted a topic in POST-Operation Weight Loss Surgery Q&A
Wow, I have been reading these forums for weeks and this is my first post. I have a few "is this normal" questions. If anyone can help, I would so appreciate it!! 1. Gas- I did not have shoulder pain like most, but I seem to still have gas. I wake up in the morning fine, but as the day progresses, I get bloated and gassy again. Is it something I am eating? I am only on liquids. 2. From what I understand, I have no restriction. How come when I drink, I sometimes feel pain in my chest as if I have swallowed to much? 3. This might be TMI, but did anyone have a problem with diarrhea at this stage? I was banded on 9/23. I guess I am in this bandster hell. I am feeling better now, but was seriously having bandster remorse the first week. The gas, the discomfort, the hunger, ugh! Will I ever feel completely normal?