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A great NSV (non scale vicotry) I was feeling my stomach today (and I have always stayed away from my belly button because it is soooooo sensitive~girls you know what I mean) and my belly button is not so deep~wierd the things we notice huh! I had a HUGE inny and now it is not such a huge deep inny. (the things we share) ha ha

Calling all April Bandits of 2006: Let's come together and share our successes! What is your "Bandiversary" goal? I never really set a goal for "Bandiversary" just small goals along the way. What have you learned this past year? I have learned that I can pass up former favorite foods and that the world will not come to an end if I don't eat everything in site. :hungry: Could you share your most rewarding NSV (non-scale victory)? My best NSV for now is buying a pair of designer jeans to wear to the Trace Adkins concert. What is your biggest challenge? My biggest challenge is consistent exercise. I really have to make myself do it and it's still hit or miss most days. What tips would you pass on to the April 2007 newbies? Hang in there! Good things come to those who wait. Oh, and liquids can be your friend. What is your greatest fear? That I will lose my band and regain all the weight plus more. :paranoid What goals do you have for the future? My next goal is to get to 199. When I do, I get a pair of diamond studs. How has your life changed? Life is so much better. I can get up and down off the floor with my students. I don't tire as quickly. I can ride roller coasters again. Has living with the band met up to your expectations? Living with the band has been great. I really can not believe that it has been a year. And due to all of the research I did before hand, there really haven't been that many surprises along the way. :bounce: If you could talk to yourself a year ago, what would you say? Keep at it. Life is only going to get better. I really can't believe that today has been one year. Someone asked me at work yesterday was I going to take myself out to eat to Celebrate. I told her no, that I look for other ways to celebrate now rather than with food. Of course there are still surprises along the way, but that's ok. I'm learning to roll with the punches. I look at how much more some of our group has lost than me, but I also know that they have taken a different road than I did. I started this journey at 300 lbs. and this morning I weighed 255 lbs. When I first started working on weight loss before banding I weighed 348 lbs and had lost down to 280 before it started creeping back up again. After diet, exercise, life style change, and work with a personal trainer for 8 months, I realized that I needed help on this journey. A co-worker was looking into the band for herself and suggested that I go to a seminar and check it out. I did that two days before Thanksgiving and then less than five months later I was banded. Would I do it again? In a heartbeat. I tell anybody who asks me what I've done to lose weight. Because I've been so open at work, some of the others are looking into it as well. No one thinks twice about what I do at work as I think most have even forgotten that I had it done. I'm losing slowly in weight, but the inches are coming off. I bought new tops for work and they are 1X, the last size before I shop in the regular sizes. I found a velvet dress for Christmas for $14.00. It's a Large. I will be wearing it! For now, I'm just working for my diamond earings. :biggrin1: Pic

Great NSV! congrats to you!:clap2: :clap2: :clap2: :clap2:

Thanks everyone. I am feeling pretty (momentarily) defeated right now. But amazingly I think I've had a pre-band NSV of sorts...I haven't picked up a fork or a spoon and shoveled anything into my mouth that I shouldn't have. I'm getting MAD. Now, how to get another 15lbs off in three weeks... (my next PCP appt is 4/25)

WOOHOO!!!! Excellent NSV!!

went shopping at the Avenue last weekend for some capri jeans. 28s - big in the waist just a tad snug in the tummy went to 26s - fit in the waist, bit more snug in the tummy bought the 26s .. they will stretch a bit in the tummy ... :mad: pre band - my size was 44/46 (6x) :cry nowhere to go but down!!!!

Hello Everyone! Hey, Kim, I live in NE Wyoming. March and April have always been the worst times for blizzards. But when the snow melts, it is so GREEN! I had a NSV on Sunday. We went up to Billings, MT (about 3 hours away) and since we were up there and they actually have a mall and clothing stores, unlike here where all we have is Walmart, I decided to look for a dress for my son's wedding. I found a beautiful skirt that was a large that actually fit without being tight or anything. Then I found a shirt that looked good with it. The sales lady brought me the shirt and another one with a bit different style. I tried on the one shirt and it was too tight across the chest and they brought me back an XL in both. I tried on the one and told the sales lady, "hmmm, no, I don't like it...." and she said, "well, no wonder, it's too big!" Too big??? AN XL too big???? It made my day. Needless to say, I found a nice white shirt to go with my pretty sage green skirt and I'm set for the wedding. The wedding theme is "a casual summer picnic" so the skirt and shirt are perfect. Now I just need shoes. We have to go back to Billings at the end of April and I will find my shoes then. I didn't do my walk/run yesterday because I was building a chicken cage for my 6 chickens I bought last week. My DH isn't very happy with my chickens and they are getting too big to keep in a large tub in my laundry room much longer. They'll go into the storage shed in thier new enclosure until all the snow melts, then I will build them a chicken house. I wonder how long that will take since just building a 3x3x7 cage took me all afternoon and into the evening and I'm STILL not finished. I have to make a door for it still so I can get in and clean it out. I just read back a few pages (I missed some with my internet down) and saw that we have a new challenge! I'll join in. May 1st is my bandiversery. That's about 6 weeks. So a pound a week will be 6 lbs. Sounds doable! That would get me under 190. Have a great day!

You will do alot better if you think about how you look compared to before, vs how you 'want to look'. For myself, there are so many 'spots' on my body that I just hate how they look, and while 'deflated' is better than fat and puffy, it's still not really what I'm going for, you know? Whenever I start to get on myself for that, I just think about what it was before. How much stomach I could grab before, vs now, how I always had a double chin before, and I only do now if I try to put my chin on my chest, or how I CAN SEE MY COLLAR BONES. Those are all NSV's... you should start an NSV list, it's really neat to see all that stuff in one place. I have a before picture from when I was pretty much at my highest, maybe JUST a little less. Yikes. There are plenty of times where I just don't feel smaller and I still feel huge compared to my sisters (even though I'm only 15lbs bigger than one of them), etc, but when I look at that picture, I see the difference and I know I'm doing well. I still have some days where I run from my reflection, but what I've been trying to do lately is look at myself and who I'm walking with and trying to see the comparison. My reflection doesn't completely block their's, even if I'm between them and the window

Okay, Today I bought a pair of size 14 jeans that FIT when I tried them on!!!!!!! I was a sophomore in high school when I outgrew my 14's... YAY!!!!!!!!!

Hi Stephanee, the first thing we have to relearn is being good to ourselves. Our thought become real. So next time you pass the mirror just smile to yourself and say "I'm on my way". Congrats on your NSV. Good job!

LLSibley, that is what we call a NSV, non scale victory! Way to go!

Congrats! Don't you just love those kind of NSV's?:clap2: :clap2:

Well, I am back to make another entry. I had another "Aftercare" visit yesterday. My Official weight as of yesterday (per doc's scale = official) was 289. My last official weight 1 month prior was 293.5 - so I have officially lost 3.5 pounds. My unoffical weight (unofficial = my scale + 4 lb) this morning was 287.5 pounds. Not exactly supermodel fitness - but a damned site better than the original 357 pound that I started at when I first joined LBT. I was pretty gung ho going into March - but I must say that a number of life's little occurances stood between me and my motivation this month. 1) 1 week of vacation. Vacations are always a trap for me. I am out playing - and I don't want to do anything that resembles work... including exercise. Plus - road food leaves something to be desired in the nutrition and fitness category. I would have been ok - cause I had planned to come home and get back on it however.... 2) DH was sick - REALLY sick - with a high fever for 10+ days... First his temp spiked up to about 103 - then he started throwing up and was unable to keep any foods down - then he got delirious from the fever and lack of food... I took days off to take care of him - and because there were only certain things that he would/could take into his system without throwing up, I had to shop a lot. The longer he was sick, the more desperate I was to get some calories into him - which led to less than stellar foods making their way into my kitchen. Plus, the constant worry about him took all my energy. I just didn't care about diet & exercise at all with him so sick. So by the time he was better enough to start taking care of himself - we were already thru week three in March. 3) Job Hell all month. Lay-offs, program changes, uncertain as to whether I would/will have a job in April. Nothing like worrying about your financial future to stress you out. And what does Irene do when she is stressed out? Well, she EATS, of course. And she eats nachos and donuts - not veggies. *sigh* (spoiled, lazy AND weak.) 4) And just for shits and giggles - my refridgerator stopped working 3 days ago (repairman comes today) which meant I had to throw away almost everything in it and clean it so the repairman can fix it. I have been eating take-out for the last few days, and there is this lovely "rotten food" smell in my house... Hopefully the rain will let up so I can hang the doors open and air the place out, soon. 5) Last, but not least, somebody rifled through my car last night while it sat in the driveway. Nothing like walking out to find all your stuff strewn around the inside of your car to start your day off right. Thankfully, either the door was unlocked (maybe?) or they kids who rifled it just happen to have an electronic lock gizmo that works on my car (somewhat worrying). So, they didn't really do much damage - they didn't even take my crappy stereo, although they broke a piece of plastic facing trying to - and there wasn't a damned thing in the car that they wanted. So far as I can tell, nothing is missing except 20 cents from the change slot. So aside from the worry that they do have an electronic gizmo that opens my door locks, it was just a pain in the ass to have to clean up the mess before I could leave for work. I guess I won't be leaving the Hope Diamond in my car overnight any time in the near future. *sigh* So, the trick now is - what the hell do I do with this big ol' pile of stress? I want to curl up into the foetal position and suck down a couple of boxes of chocolate - but I think that might be somewhat counter-productive to both my attempts to retain my job and my attempts to lose weight. I really can't feel too badly about losing 3.5 pounds last month. March has been FAR too much drama for me. Any one of those things would have been too much drama. All of them is practically overwhelming. I am trying to be proactive at work. There isn't any actual WORK to do (can you say "Sub-Prime Mortgage"? - sure you can) but I am working on an alternative career selection as I wait to get laid off with the rest of my co-workers. I go tomorrow for an informational seminar on getting certified to be a Teacher here in Colling County, TX. I have been spending my days at work researching how to go about that, and brushing up on my once-fluent Spanish. I have a degree in Psychology, a minor in English, and plenty of Spanish Language credits on my transcripts. If I can get certified to teach English & Spanish, I should be able to get a job teaching full time. I want to do Math, too - but I don't think I have the credits for it. I would have to go back to school for that. I guess I might have time to do that if I get laid off! *sigh*. I need to be more proactive about exercise, too. The Aftercare gal reminded me that exercise helps with stress control & relief - so I guess I am going to have to get to the gym and hit the elliptical machine. My eating has been sporadic. Some days I eat proper bandster portions, some days I don't. Unfortunately, I have been making some less than stellar food choices. It would be so much less irritating if I didn't KNOW better - but I DO know - and still choose the wrong stuff. How crazy is that? I am going to have to see a counselor of some kind. I really am. I could be so much farther along in my weightloss journey if I didn't sabotage myself at every turn. But stinking counselors cost money - and I am trying to SAVE money right now - just in case I have to live on unemployment... *shudder* I really, really wish that I could regain the motivation I had when I was battling the insurance company. I was so into the whole thing... I went from 357 to 331 on my own prior to surgery, doing low carb and exercising 4 days a week. But it's hard to do the right things when the weight is sliding off anyway. It doesn't go away FAST - but it goes, even if I eat carbs, even when I don't exercise..... So, for now, I will just keep creeping downward... 3-4 pounds per month... It certainly beats creeping upward. I hope things even out, soon. I planned on needing 3 yrs to get to goal... not 10! NSV's **Weird one - I can feel my port for the first time ever. It was too deep under a layer of fat to feel it, before.

Well, I am back to make another entry. I had another "Aftercare" visit yesterday. My Official weight as of yesterday (per doc's scale = official) was 289. My last official weight 1 month prior was 293.5 - so I have officially lost 3.5 pounds. My unoffical weight (unofficial = my scale + 4 lb) this morning was 287.5 pounds. Not exactly supermodel fitness - but a damned site better than the original 357 pound that I started at when I first joined LBT. I was pretty gung ho going into March - but I must say that a number of life's little occurances stood between me and my motivation this month. 1) 1 week of vacation. Vacations are always a trap for me. I am out playing - and I don't want to do anything that resembles work... including exercise. Plus - road food leaves something to be desired in the nutrition and fitness category. I would have been ok - cause I had planned to come home and get back on it however.... 2) DH was sick - REALLY sick - with a high fever for 10+ days... First his temp spiked up to about 103 - then he started throwing up and was unable to keep any foods down - then he got delirious from the fever and lack of food... I took days off to take care of him - and because there were only certain things that he would/could take into his system without throwing up, I had to shop a lot. The longer he was sick, the more desperate I was to get some calories into him - which led to less than stellar foods making their way into my kitchen. Plus, the constant worry about him took all my energy. I just didn't care about diet & exercise at all with him so sick. So by the time he was better enough to start taking care of himself - we were already thru week three in March. 3) Job Hell all month. Lay-offs, program changes, uncertain as to whether I would/will have a job in April. Nothing like worrying about your financial future to stress you out. And what does Irene do when she is stressed out? Well, she EATS, of course. And she eats nachos and donuts - not veggies. *sigh* (spoiled, lazy AND weak.) 4) And just for shits and giggles - my refridgerator stopped working 3 days ago (repairman comes today) which meant I had to throw away almost everything in it and clean it so the repairman can fix it. I have been eating take-out for the last few days, and there is this lovely "rotten food" smell in my house... Hopefully the rain will let up so I can hang the doors open and air the place out, soon. 5) Last, but not least, somebody rifled through my car last night while it sat in the driveway. Nothing like walking out to find all your stuff strewn around the inside of your car to start your day off right. Thankfully, either the door was unlocked (maybe?) or they kids who rifled it just happen to have an electronic lock gizmo that works on my car (somewhat worrying). So, they didn't really do much damage - they didn't even take my crappy stereo, although they broke a piece of plastic facing trying to - and there wasn't a damned thing in the car that they wanted. So far as I can tell, nothing is missing except 20 cents from the change slot. So aside from the worry that they do have an electronic gizmo that opens my door locks, it was just a pain in the ass to have to clean up the mess before I could leave for work. I guess I won't be leaving the Hope Diamond in my car overnight any time in the near future. *sigh* So, the trick now is - what the hell do I do with this big ol' pile of stress? I want to curl up into the foetal position and suck down a couple of boxes of chocolate - but I think that might be somewhat counter-productive to both my attempts to retain my job and my attempts to lose weight. I really can't feel too badly about losing 3.5 pounds last month. March has been FAR too much drama for me. Any one of those things would have been too much drama. All of them is practically overwhelming. I am trying to be proactive at work. There isn't any actual WORK to do (can you say "Sub-Prime Mortgage"? - sure you can) but I am working on an alternative career selection as I wait to get laid off with the rest of my co-workers. I go tomorrow for an informational seminar on getting certified to be a Teacher here in Colling County, TX. I have been spending my days at work researching how to go about that, and brushing up on my once-fluent Spanish. I have a degree in Psychology, a minor in English, and plenty of Spanish Language credits on my transcripts. If I can get certified to teach English & Spanish, I should be able to get a job teaching full time. I want to do Math, too - but I don't think I have the credits for it. I would have to go back to school for that. I guess I might have time to do that if I get laid off! *sigh*. I need to be more proactive about exercise, too. The Aftercare gal reminded me that exercise helps with stress control & relief - so I guess I am going to have to get to the gym and hit the elliptical machine. My eating has been sporadic. Some days I eat proper bandster portions, some days I don't. Unfortunately, I have been making some less than stellar food choices. It would be so much less irritating if I didn't KNOW better - but I DO know - and still choose the wrong stuff. How crazy is that? I am going to have to see a counselor of some kind. I really am. I could be so much farther along in my weightloss journey if I didn't sabotage myself at every turn. But stinking counselors cost money - and I am trying to SAVE money right now - just in case I have to live on unemployment... *shudder* I really, really wish that I could regain the motivation I had when I was battling the insurance company. I was so into the whole thing... I went from 357 to 331 on my own prior to surgery, doing low carb and exercising 4 days a week. But it's hard to do the right things when the weight is sliding off anyway. It doesn't go away FAST - but it goes, even if I eat carbs, even when I don't exercise..... So, for now, I will just keep creeping downward... 3-4 pounds per month... It certainly beats creeping upward. I hope things even out, soon. I planned on needing 3 yrs to get to goal... not 10! NSV's **Weird one - I can feel my port for the first time ever. It was too deep under a layer of fat to feel it, before.

MISS you guys! Things are settling down and I'm feeling better. My company is getting bought out and everyone here is in panic mode because they think lay offs are coming down soon. I am kind of worried, but I can't focus on "I'm getting laid off." I totally believe in the power of positive thought. Anyhow, my fill has worked. Oh man has it. Yesterday as I was coming home from an out of town trip I ate dinner at Wolfgang Puck's restaurant in O'Hare. I had a cup of Soup and grilled salmon. After about 4 bites I had the boulder in my chest and my mouth started watering really bad. I had to get up and run to the bathroom (with my purse and laptop in tow) and ended up throwing up in my mouth on the way there. I stood in the stall puking for a good 6 or 7 minutes. I didn't eat anymore until I got home, and then it was cottage cheese with salsa. I'm on liquids today. I am trying not to weigh myself until next week Friday. I'm trying to do well eating only fish and vegetables for now, and drinking Water, water, water. The weather is nice and I'm walking outside more w/the baby. I'm also looking into buying a bicycle and a baby trailer to pull him - I think that will be a great thing to do this spring/summer/fall. Plus I love to ride the bike. NSV (as I haven't been on the scale since last 3/26) - a guy on my team asked if I have been working out. I said, "Yeah, I have." And he said, "I can tell, you look good." Then 2 more people chimed in and said, "Yeah, you do look good! I noticed too but didn't want to say anything cuz I know it can be a touchy subject." I said, "Why would it be a touchy subject? I know I'm fat." haaha Seriously though, I have been beaming since. And I fit into the seat on the airplane comfortably. Nothing was jammed in my hip or cutting off my air supply. I'm down to a 14/16 top and an 18/20 bottom. My goal for the week is to exercise every day - outside if at all possible. No more wine (after tonight HA!) and focus on eating well (protein and veggies). As for the hair LOSS issue, I went to the dermatologist, and HE said that they think the hair lost post WLS is due to Iron deficiencies. So he put me on an iron pill (which I forget to take most days). I am losing hair, too - but I think mine is change-of-season shedding. Anyhow, I'm heading out. When I put the baby in bed tonight (or tomorrow) I'll check in and read everything I've missed these past few weeks. I also have a DK update. And a few other amusing tales. Hope everyone is doing well. I am happy to report that I can see the silver lining! Love you guys more and more - thanks for supporting me even when I'm not around. I can feel the love, ladies, and I truly do love and appreciate you for it. Nathalie

Totally normal! I have had 6 (is it 6? Or 5??) fills and I have only just felt restriction properly. Like I take a few bites and have to sit back and let that go down before I can assess whether more is ok or not. I think maybe I could do with a teeny tiny more in there. But I'll go with this for a month first and see how my weight loss is. Before this last fill it wasn't like that really, maybe for 24 hours after the fill but then I was back to eating anything and quite quickly. Some people are lucky and don't need much in thier band to feel restriction (like my dad who PB's with 3 mls in his 10ml band) and then theres some like me who can eat most everything even with 8.5 mls in a 10 ml band (except bread and english muffins, they always give me chest pain, I learned that the hard way!). Like EVERYTHING with our bands its a lot of trial and error. You'll get there Susannah!! I want to be one of those 50kg losers yesterday too. God, that would be just so bloody awesome! It would be like dream come true... I often try to picture myself another 20 kilos lighter and I just can't even imagine it. Very surreal!! So an NSV for me today. I went to the gym and jumped on the treadmill this afternoon and before I knew it I had jogged a whole 5kms! I haven't ever done that far before but I kind of wanted to test myself before Sunday's fun run rolls around. I was so chuffed. Burned 500 calories doing it too. Pat on the back to me :clap2: Hope everyone has a great weekend planned!

Calling all April Bandits of 2006: Let's come together and share our successes! What is your "Bandiversary" goal? I dont think I have one, one year ago I thought I would be thin, but thats not realistic since I had like 130-140 pounds to lose. What have you learned this past year? That food doesnt need to be my comfort thing:-) Could you share your most rewarding NSV (non-scale victory)? I havent seen my empoloyee since he left last January, when I met him couple weeks ago he didnt recognize me:-)and also I can finally shop in normal clothes stores:-) What is your biggest challenge? overcoming my cravings and sticking to small amounts of chocoalte:-)plus not weighting myself every day What tips would you pass on to the April 2007 newbies? listen to your body and dont get upset when you hit a plateu,just stick to your excercise and good food choices.dont weight yourself very often just watch sour clothes...and definitely come to LBT cause the support I get here also keeps me going:-)and I must thank to my fellow bandits:-) for all their suppor.THANK YOU ALL!!! What is your greatest fear? That I eat something Im not supposed to eat and that I will fall back to my old patterns (overeating).I guess Im getting a bit obsessed with food,which is not very healthy What goals do you have for the future? losing another 26kgs(57 pounds) and being hot as hell..lol..if needed I might get the TT or breast surgery,but I hope that good excercise with my trainer will help me How has your life changed? Im more confident and happy with myself.I love the attention I get from people, telling me that I lost so much weight:-) Has living with the band met up to your expectations? Yes definitely Bandsters of April 07 if you have any questions or comments feel free to ask because when I was doing my research people here helped me so much and I will be more than happy to help others to my best knowledge:-) Hey and excuse my English Im Czech and English isnt my native language..lol:D

Well right now I am wearning a size 20 pair of jeans. They are snug on me, but as loose as the 22s were getting, I decided it was better to go with snug for the moment. They aren't as tight as they were even a few days ago! I can sit in the comfortabley and so forth, so really not bad. Just snug. I think a few more pounds will help them get to that not snug spot. So I figure this is a good NSV! I can fit in smaller jeans!

What is your "Bandiversary" goal? My goal is to be "overweight" instead of "obese" - I'm close! If I don't make it I promise not to "beat myself up" - I will soooooon! What have you learned this past year? That it is not "all or nothing" - before one slip would send me over the top and to making all the bad choices again. That I have to slow down in my expectations - I want it all off right now!/want to be able to exercise for 2 hours and feel like a kid again - For me, that does not work. God willing I have time to make this life changing adjustment to the way I eat and the way I make my body move. Could you share your most rewarding NSV (non-scale victory)? My ankles are no longer swollen, my knees do not hurt, my blood pressure is normal, I handle stress so much better.....................I can walk miles.........I love to exercise (amazing)! I fit into a size 12 pants (that are getting a bit baggy).....and a M/L top..............bra size went from a 44DDD to a 36DD.... What is your biggest challenge? To listen to the full signs - still have a tendancy to put more in than I can handle..............at times still forget to chew my food good (yes, even after almost a year)...usually when I'm talking and not paying attention. What tips would you pass on to the April 2007 newbies? Follow the bandster "rules" - get the fills that you need - it does so work! I love my band....use this tool correctly and it will do the trick for you. START EXERCISING - JOIN OUR EXERCISE GROUP...............for me this has been the second best tool. What is your greatest fear? Losing my band! If I did - I'd have it replaced as soon as possible. What goals do you have for the future? To continue on my road to better health thru more weight loss (this year's new goal - and additional 20 - 40 lbs) and keeping myself as fit as I am now and possibly adding additional fitness classes (more strenghth building). How has your life changed? I'm a healthy 67 year old grammy of 8.............I feel "light" - I don't hurt - I like myself - I look forward to a healthier older age! Has living with the band met up to your expectations? YES, YES, YES. For those of you who don't know - this has been a verrrrrrry stressfull year - my 44 year old son AND my 71 year old husband both had heart valve replacement surgery...........they're both doing great................AND any other year I would have gained weight!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Yipee - thank you band and all my band friends!

OH my gosh....id take the camera back while he was at work, then rebook the vacation for myself...mail him a letter after ive arrived. man. seriously..whered she go! i wanna find out how that one ended. seriously, id take the piece o sh$t right back, rebook THAT day, even pay for it with the money from the camera. man. if that isnt a NSV i dont know what is... and i agree with you that its actually two. ONe for not killing her husband and two for not going directly to the all night deep fry cafe. holy criminies, that would tick me right off. I think id even lose my sense of human blessed forgiveness or mercy too. dang.

Yes, if you think about exercising now and you don't want to sit around that is definitely an NSV. Good for you!

nsv= non scale victory

ladydi way to go on the NSV! It does feel great when you make it to a size you haven't been in awhile. My thoughts are with you for your surgery! A question to you all, do we ever get rid of "mental" hunger? I find there are still times when I think that I'm hungry but instead of reaching for food I now reach for Water or take a walk. I think that it is fill time for me so I'm going to go make the call. Ya'll take care!

What's an NSV? sorry for being so dim Yvonne x

Definately...a nsv it means you have been doing your 'mind' work. which is just as important as your eating work. Well done becky