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Nice of you to join us! Great Idea! I am an alcoholic, also with a family history of alcoholism, deceased d/t cirrosis etc. more family members than I have time to name. I have small children and what has driven me to AA is my oldest child who started to realize what was going on. Was your mom recovered when you were growing up? will you share your experience as a child of an alcoholic parent? I am curious to know the view of a child. I don;t talk to my son about my going to AA mainly because I have only been sober now for a couple of weeks and have been trying to get sober for 3 years, I don;t want him to see me fail so I don;t talk to him about it. I think it would be to grown up of a responsibility for him at this age to worry about me. Can you help me to know what he is seeing from the eyes of an 8 year old. Thanks

Hello, One of the things I've always cherished about twelve step programs is the honesty I found there. I come from a large family, ten girls and three boys. My mom died of metastatic breast cancer when I was nine, and after that were my first memories of my father's drinking. As a blind child I was sheltered, according to one of my sisters, from lots of things, but his rage wasn't one of them. Or his live--in girlfriend. I live with a lot of physical and emotional neglect, broken windows, horrible living conditions which I won't go in to, unless someone really wants to know. My father was the only one in the family allowed to get angry. He used to introduce me to his alcoholic friends as "my blind daughter,," and one time I made the mistake of pointing out how obvious that was. He was taking most of the money given to me by the state as a disabled child, until one of my older sisters stepped in. When his girlfriend pointed out that I had a broken window in my room, his response was, "She's got money. Let her pay for it." When I first joined Al-Anon, I was very angry, and refused to see my father's alcoholism as a disease. I'm sure my sponsor wanted to strangle me at times, because I wanted to just tell him what a jerk he was. While I never forgave him for the way he treated me, I was able to accept the fact that I couldn't change him. When I moved in with my sister, I thought that all my trouble was over. Little did I know that the effects of my father's drinking would follow me, and they would be things I'd have to work on, be aware of, probably for the rest of my life. My family can't understand why I refused to see my dad when he was dying. I felt nothing for him. He never denied he was an alcoholic, and told my sister he didn't want to beg anyone to come to see him. But he also asked me years ago if I believed he loved me, and I said no. That was very empowering to me. I have lost four of my sisters to illness, and a brother who was shot to death. I think they all went to their graves bearing the scars of my father's alcoholism, but for the most part, they had contact with him before they died. Not my brother, though. He was a pretty troubled young man. Thank you for reading this, if you've gotten this far. Thank you, Green Chrysalis, for this thread. Debbie

If I eat anything that is sugar free by means of sucralose, sorbitol, maltitol, or any other sugar alcohol...Watch out! I could power myself to the moon and back! Even the dogs look at me like REALLY? Beans, especially refried, and pretty much any bean doesn't act well on the insides. They cause great pain, but let it loose and makes me feel oh so much better!!! I've always been somewhat of a tooting machine. Sometimes I even amaze myself!

I've just seen something about no alcohol for 3 months after surgery. Is this true?

I understand why you would wonder that - it's an excellent question. The way being sleeved helps me is that I now have a short list of very simple rules that I have to follow if I want to get to my goal weight and stay healthy. They go into effect when one is released from the post op liquids/pureed/soft foods restrictions. They are: Consume 60-80 gm Protein per day and 60-80 oz of Clear liquids per day. Every day. Do not drink anything for at least 30 minutes before a meal or snack. If you forget and do drink, re-set the timer and wait another 30 minutes before you eat. Eat dense protein first at every meal. Eat a very few bites of non-starchy veggie in addition if you have room. Decide how many meals and/or protein Snacks you're going to have per day, and stick to it. Do not eat between meals. Wait at least 30 minutes after every meal or snack before drinking anything. If your mouth gets really dry you could rinse after eating or brush your teeth. I avoid alcohol because I'm concerned it would decrease my ability to resist bad food choices. Follow those rules at least 90% of the time, and you will succeed. For the other 10%, do not beat yourself up - just get back on the wagon immediately and Sleeve On! I was very fortunate in that I was not hungry at all for 2-3 months post op. I ate because I knew I should. When my hunger returned it wasn't as intense as before, and by then I had established my new eating habits which helped a LOT. Now I eat every 4 hours (8a, 12n, 4p and 8p), and I keep my carb intake as low as humanly possible. Both factors contribute to my never being hungry for very long at a time. What keeps me on track when I could never stick to a diet before: The feeling of satisfaction / fullness after each meal, plus the decreased hunger, is the main thing that makes it possible for me to stick to the plan. I do get head hunger sometimes, and when I can't ignore it I have a big glass of Water, a SF popsicle or some SF Crystal Light. I've lost a significant amount of weight doing this, so I KNOW it works. I will be da**ed if I'm going to throw away the $12,500 I paid out of my pocket to have this done, not to mention all the work I've done (and the goodies I've resisted eating) to get to this point. Sometimes I just repeat to myself, as many times as necessary "I'm not going to eat that. Not gonna do it. There will be goodies available when I'm at my goal." The support available on this site and on the Facebook group I belong to is PHENOMINAL. It helps SO much, especially at those times when family/friends would probably beat me to death if I mention one more thing about the trials and tribulations -- or the NSVs -- related to being sleeved. The above have kept me going even through a 6-week stall, and I am deTERmined to get to my goal. Hope that helps. Best wishes.

Tuesday, August 4, 2009 Dealing with Snack Foods Snack Foods. The perfect food for ADHD people. Grab and go. Don't have to cook, put together ingredients, shop for those ingredients, remember which ingredients to shop for. They're full of all the taste and flavor (mostly artificial) ADHD people crave. They provide the stimulation we seek when the TV shows don't cut it all by themselves (most don't). They also provide the majority of the salt, sugar, and fat that shoot up our blood sugar, cholesterol and blood pressure. Just thought of something slightly amusing--or maybe alarming. My name starts with ch and so do many of my favorite snacks: cheetos, chocolate, chips (taco, potato, pita). It is so much easier for me not to eat them now that they're not in my house and my husband's not eating them in front of me. He might have a secret stash hidden somewhere but I never see it and he never eats it in front of me. America's food industry, like the tobacco and alcohol industries, has a lot to answer for. All of them know they're dealing with addictive substances and do their best to make them even more addictive with chemically designed addictive additives in addition to those old standbyes--salt, carbs and fat. Oh, and let's not forget chocolate and caffeine being increased and put in all kinds of new products. Many are designed to appeal to children and teenagers. Did you know a lot of teenagers are now having lapbands? The obesity epidemic is out of control among our young people. I see the food parents put in their kids lunches or that kids pack for themselves. Some start hauling snacks out of their lunch bags and backpacks as soon as they arrive at school. Those with healthy snacks trade with those with all the unhealthy snacks. Schools are eliminating snacks from their cafeterias and vending machines, but the kids just carry them with them. I don't have an answer for this dilemma. I am nutritionally quite well-educated. Didn't stop me from eating snacks. The best advice I get on the topic is don't expose yourself to the snacks. Keep them out of the house. Ask people not to eat them in front of you. In situations where exposure is unavoidable, it might be better to eat just a little bit of those things that most appeal to you than to ruin your good time spending all your effort not eating those things. Fortunately, I've got the lapband to let me know when I've had enough. Especially if I start with higher protein items the band will help me limit the snacks. The key will be to get right back on the food protocol once the party's over. Right now, I don't have a lot of restriction and have slowed way down on weight loss. I have a family reunion this weekend. All my siblings and some nieces and nephews and their children (along with my own children and grandchildren) will be together. Food will be a big part of the reunion. So, for three days before the reunion I'm eating protein almost exclusively, a protein shake for breakfast, meat for lunch, and meat and a veggie for supper, with milk in my iced latte in-between meals. I noticed yesteday already that when I just eat meat without a lot of moistening agents, I can still feel some restriction in my band. I already lost 2 lbs. That puts me at 30 lbs total weight loss. When the weekend is over, I'll probably go back on high protein until I get my first fill on August 11. I'll probably be back on a liquid protein diet for a few days after that, so my stomach can heal. That should jumpstart the weight loss again. I hope the Dr. puts in enough fill to give me restriction. Otherwise I'll go back 2 or 3 weeks after to get another one. I have few clothes that fit me. I'm going through my closets trying to decide what's worth taking in, which of my "skinny" fat clothes fit me now, and what to give to Goodwill. I've started going to thrift stores, since I will not be at this weight for very long and don't want to spend money on clothes. I can't buy ahead because I don't know how fast the weight will come off. But these are good problems to have. I've dropped one cholesterol med and one blood pressure med. I'm seeing if I can do without my stomach med since I ran out of it and won't be seeing my regular doc for 2 more weeks. I get to see my relatives this weekend and I'm not going to worry about food! God is good all the time. All the time God is good.

I don't think it's cheating at all. Just be careful of carbs and sugar-alcohols. Some of the sugar-free Gummy Bears and Jellybeans I've looked at have more carbs than I had expected. And the sugar alcohols can have a laxative effect...

Paula, I was married to a man who was bipolar - he, too, used alcohol as a way to 'relax' - and he knew he couldn't drink and take his medication - so therefore he fought this decision on a daily basis....I imagine for you to have posted - things are downright unmanageable - anger management classes might help - but are probably not the 'first' step to take - I agree - many towns have sliding-scale fees for 'family' counseling - if I am reading things right your hubby definitely needs to have some ongoing counseling and help via a doctor on staff and YOU my dear also might want to ask for a counselor for yourself - the other option is one counselor who sees both of you together and separately -- not marriage counseling - mental health counseling - I've been through it with my fiance's son and it has changed his life and ours - but it takes time and the right medications that work for him....sorry to rattle on - this is so close to my heart as I have lived it and I know how hard this has to be for you - this cycle of 'anger' and 'depression' needs to be stopped and you both deserve the assistance of a good family counseling center - God bless! I am on all the time - you can PM me anytime - I'll always listen EDIT: after reading another post in this thread -- it hit me in the face - he may be DEPRESSED - that is an entirely different issue -- something to think about and not ignore......

The stretchy part of the stomach is what gets removed during surgery. While there are some cases out there where people have overeaten on a regular basis and stretched their sleeve out to an extent it's not possible to get it back to where you orginally were. There is also the misconception that being able to eat a large portion of slider foods means your stomach is back to its old size. I've avoided things like protein bars because they never leave me satisfied. If anything they make me hungrier too. Finding some good quick-fix options are important to have. For me a lot of times some beef jerky and almonds provide a good fix. Food prepping can be a challenge at times, but also keep in mind when we food prep we can make things last. In the old days when I made chicken salad that might last for 3 meals at best. Now I could make it last for 6-8. I'm on day 2 of a strict low carb diet and it feels good to be back on track. I've gotten discouraged as well since the scale has been stuck. Getting active on the forum again has helped motivate me. I maintain that for many of us this is no different than recovering alcoholics attending AA meetings. It's always going to be a battle. Some days/weeks/months/years will be easier than others. Main thing is to remember that you're not the only one fighting these battles and we can all use support from time to time.

No alcohol since July 4th. No processed foods, carbs (except for a spoonful here and there of veggies and fruit), soda, sugar for 3 months. It's weird and wacky, but I LOVE MY SLEEVE! :-)

Pre op I clenched my teeth and followed directions to the letter. Post op for me was six weeks of liquids. Hard, but I did it without choosing to break the momentum. And momentum was the word my doctor used. He wanted maximum weight loss and a good start right out of the gate. I lost fifty pounds before my first band fill. As the weight came off after that, the high of losing quickly kept me choosing healthy small meals regularly. As time went on, I added foods I hadn't had before. I added alcohol. I added popcorn. I added carby Thai food. I stopped losing weight for five months. I tried a variety of techniques like 5:2, etc. I'd lose and gain the same five pounds over and over again. When I gained eleven pounds over a couple of weeks, it woke me up. No way was I going to lose my focus and return to my old life. I needed to get my food in order, lose the crap that was holding me back, and in order to lose this last fifty pounds, I knew I had to do the hard thing I was putting off. E x e r c i s e. I didn't wanna. But I gotta. If I want what I want, I gotta. And I wanna reach goal and stay there. So I chose to take this next step. I dropped the popcorn, the Thai food, the alcohol, and picked up exercise. I paid for twelve sessions of personal training at the gym I joined. I now exercise. I eat better. I feel better. I know this will get me where I want to go. It's all choices. I wasn't ready until I was ready. I'm glad I stayed around people who are motivated while I floundered around for awhile. In my old life I would have given up and gone back to eating and isolating. No longer.

So treat this case *as* an addiction case. As a society, we all step in right away if we discover that a parent has been supplying their adolescent with alcohol, nicotene, or narcotics. And rightfully so. We also step in (moreso now than in the past) when we discover parents not seeking appropriate medical interventions for childhood illnesses. It's an addiction. I'm happy to say that. Let's treat it as such, then, in the same vein as supplying drugs, alcohol and sex to minors who cannot be expected to have the same levels of self control and maturity we expect adults to exercise.

Donna, These are my concerns, that the surgery to "fix" the band can cause additional problems. While your Dr. was in there wasn't it possible to fill your band and look for leaks before he closed you. I have already mentioned to my Dr. that if he thinks anything else could be damaged to my band, that he should be prepared to install a new one. I will discuss this with him again to be sure and I appreciate your warning about this. I am so sorry you are going through this, I know how alone and defeated you must feel. Is your Dr. willing to go back in? Are you willing to endure another surgery? My Dr. says these are the risks when we chose a "device" to help us instead of a procedure like GBP, but then there are other risks. We are guinea pigs and pioneers in this weight loss surgery struggle and that is because we are desperate for help. Medicine has made big advances in many areas, but I don't think we have progressed enough with helping obese people and based on statistics the world is getting fatter still. How do we explain that one person seems to be able to stop after a reasonable portion and another cannot? OR how do we explain that one person can have two alcoholic drinks and stop but another person can't stop after two? What band do you have?

Like Everyone else said, you should call your doctor. But, for ways to handle the situation until you can get to the doctor, try drinking everything room temperature, nothing cold because the day of my surgery in the hospital I took a drink of cold Water and was fixing to throw up with the nurse held a alcohol wipe under my nose. The feeling instantly went away. So I would try the alcohol wipe if you get that feeling again. She said that some people can't handle cold stuff yet. Now, 1.5 weeks post-op I can drink cold things again.

My projected date is December 18th. My insurance requires 6 months of working with a nutritionist and I have two more of those visits before the coordinator submits to them for approval. I've also completed most of the other requirements that the insurance/surgeon's program have. Really it's just the two more nutritionist visits, the pre-op appts/testing and insurance approval I need. :-) In prep - water intake increase and timing with meals. Increased well but timing is still a struggle. - focusing on food order when eating: protein, veggies/fruits, healthy carbs (overall just reducing my carb intake) - reducing/eliminating added sugar - Testing out protein shakes and sipping broths (haven't tested any broths but purchased some to try this week) - experimenting with foods that I will eat later and ways to change it up + get more protein. Ex. using a protein shake to make overnight oats, adding cottage cheese to meats in lieu of sour cream, etc (surprisingly better than it sounds) I also experiment in ways to make it as convenient as possible. Another surprising thing with the food experiment... freeze dried foods! Especially given portion requirements. Yes, like the ones you might take camping or pack away for emergencies. I got them from a more health-focused site so there aren't additives and such. We need to eat more "moistly" post-surgery as well, so I just added a little extra water. I ended up with a bit of pork broth to have with my pulled pork. It was good. (This is the only meat so far I have tried. Let me know if you have questions about this thought process/experiment.) - Started taking the vitamins. I am not remembering the calcium as well though, but I do have it. - Still struggling to up the exercise. :-/ - Eliminating alcohol, caffeine, soda. I had already eliminated alcohol for the most part anyway. Caffeine was rare and soda even more rare. I would indulge before though when I *really* wanted it. I'm working to not do that. - Thinking of and trying to already apply alternatives to distract me when I think I want to eat. - Thinking of non-food activities to do socially. Sorry, this is a really long list! But I think I have pretty much covered what I've been working on over the past few months.

From what I've heard, at least from my surgeon (not sure what yours would say), after a year, once in a while drinks are okay, but be aware that because you have a smaller stomach, the alcohol will hit you differently. You won't need as much to get a buzz. It's also calorie-dense and dehydrates you, so keep that in mind as well.

... you do know that you're not supposed to drink alcohol for the first year after surgery right? My surgeon was VERY clear about that! And even though some surgeons are more lax they tell you to wait at LEAST 6 months before drinking alcohol. It's gonna slow your weight loss down and I'd worry about your liver because 1 glass is like drinking 3 or 4. That's how your system is processing it now. I'm not trying to preach or anything but my uncle didn't think it was a big deal and started drinking a beer every couple of days a few months out of his surgery and in less than two years he was dead of cirrhosis of his liver when he had been perfectly healthy before his weight loss surgery. I really don't want someone elses family to have to go through that!

@@leag78 Don't take this the wrong way; I don't know you or your friend. But almost all of your replies seem to be defending her or your friendship. Almost as though you have to convince us that she's a good person. Or perhaps convince yourself? Someone can have great attributes and only have one flaw; for example if i have a wonderful husband who helps with the house, rubs my feet every night before bed, and surprises me with random gifts and flowers for no reason those are great attributes. But if the one bad thing about him is that he's completely unfaithful to me and will cheat on me given the opportunity, do those good things about him outweigh the bad? WLS is a long, hard road. I'm pre-op and already having issues with my social circle because of my changing eating habits and my avoiding alcohol. My friends don't invite me out anymore, I guess they figure whats the point if she can't eat and drink with us? Also, when I do go out people are always pushing me "one little drink won't hurt. Don't you have a cheat day?" They're excellent people, always there for me when I need someone and have opened up their homes to me and made me feel like family. But pushing me to drink when I'm under a doctor's care not to is just wrong. Offering me food I can't have and trying to justify it by saying "everybody deserves a cheat day." is not supportive to what I'm doing. It's going to be really important that you have support for your choice to have WLS and the journey you're on. If your friend isn't supportive or if you're afraid your friendship with her will change because of your decision, then the best way she can support you is not to stand in your way. I'm not suggesting you stop being her friend, but perhaps you won't be able to rely on her for support as much as you were hoping considering how close you are.

I still drink on weekends. Alcoholic...maybe. Who cares I'm in my own home and I enjoy it!

If you are not particularly a drinker or wine person, grape juice is supposed to provide the same health benefits, anti-oxidents, etc., as wine. Similar amounts (a 4-6oz glass) are fine for the same reason - limiting the excess sugars/calories while getting the proper amount of benefit and lessening the load on your liver during weight loss (some of us are on programs that avoid alcohol altogether during the weight loss period as our livers are already heavily taxed metabolizing the fat that we are losing - can you tell that my surgeon is also a liver specialist?) Addendum: any of the plant based foods with similar colors will have the same healful components - grapes, raspberries, blueberries, strawberries, etc.

I'll try to present my case better today (I'm just so damn frustrated these days that, yes, my knee-jerk reaction IS to ditch all programs) and try to sound reasonable while doing so. Should many programs be ditched? Yes. Should all? No. However, I am of the mindset that if you abuse it, you use drugs or alcohol while on it, you get caught cheating, stealing, or in any way manipulating the system, if you are a criminal or become a criminal while on services, it's a one strike and you're out. If you can't prove you live here LEGALLY, I don't care if you're bleeding in the friggin' street, you get NOTHING. NADA. ZIP. We are bleeding here and can't take care of our own, yet we have to take care of thieves who don't belong here? I don't think so. If you get services and are able-bodied, you WILL work. I heard somebody on the radio yesterday mention something I could live with: Start out working one day a week, then after a period of time that is reasonable, they begin working two days a week, and so on and so on until they are working full-time. If you choose to have babies while ON welfare, you get cut off (unless you give the child up for adoption). There is free birth control on virtually every corner (ALSO paid for by tax dollars). Use it or lose everything. Let your mama take care of you because I WON'T. I think the biggest problem we have in this country is the utter apathy of so many. And that apathy has been CREATED by the government hand-outs, in my opinion. There was a time when legal immigrants came here with nothing in their pockets, and by sheer willpower and determination, they made it work. They worked hard, they learned the language, and they became productive members of society. Very few sat around just waiting for handouts. If they chose to do so, they probably died. I feel if you're able-bodied and choose to sit around collecting your monthly check while watching cable and drinking beer all the time, you are worthless to society and I frankly don't give a crap what happens to you. You can starve, you can rot, you can fall off the earth for all I care. I care NOTHING for you. Every tax dollar of mine that is going to feed and clothe and house your fat ass is a dollar that is taken away from me and mine. The fact is, there has always been the poor. There always WILL be the poor. Redistributing wealth from the rich to the poor does not make the poor any less poor -- it just makes the rich, those who have worked for it (because let's be real, what's considered "rich" these days is not what I would consider rich) less rich. It is NOT my job to be my brother's keeper. It is NOT my job to be sure that some loser on the street has cable TV or food on their table. If they can't do that for themselves, then they are a useless waste of space, in my opinion. I know it's harsh, but I don't care. I am NOT a bleedin' heart, and I know this about myself. And I'm fine with it. If we were talking about a relatively minimal percentage of society that this referred to, it could more easily be ignored. But our states are DYING, and I see many of the reasons they are dying. And the answer is NOT to continue pouring good money after bad on the lowlifes and illegals while cutting services to the poor sap who is sitting here footing the frikken' farken' bill! Okay, I'm sure I don't sound as reasonable as I had hoped, but damnit, I've had enough of this already.

There were five kids in my family and my mother died of cancer when I was 14, 2nd from the bottom of the line but eldest girl so I suppose I took on the nurturing role in the family. I was also the "good girl" out of the two girls, lol. Possibly being raised a Catholic it added to my guilt when it came to dealing with my father and still trying to be the good girl. Others in my family could give up on him but I just wasn't capable. He had some form of psychological disorder also compounded and medicated with alcohol. Of course I over compensated with my own kids never to be like him and make them feel the way I did growing up. For me I used his alcoholism as an excuse as to why he treated people as he did especially his own family. It's hard to take back the years where you let a sick parent rule your life. I probably didn't get the help from therapy I needed to deal with it but still recommend it if possible. Maybe it will help with the strength factor I never had. Good luck, Nancy.

Mine says not for 6 months and never any carbonated! Makes me sad as I really really love Crabbies ginger beer... They say that alcohol affects you differently as it passes into the gut more quickly, so a little goes a long way.

Several individual on this site have reported the condition. It is officially called "reactive hypoglycemia". Here is a link to the condition and the recommended approaches to deal with it. http://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/diabetes/expert-answers/reactive-hypoglycemia/faq-20057778 For the majority of people, reactive hypoglycemia usually doesn't require medical treatment. It may help to pay attention to the timing and composition of your meals: * Eat several small meals and Snacks throughout the day, no more than three hours apart during the waking hours. * Eat a well-balanced diet, including lean and nonmeat sources of Protein, and high-Fiber foods, including whole grains, fruit and vegetables. * Avoid or limit sugary foods, especially on an empty stomach. * Be sure to eat food if you're consuming alcohol and avoid using sugary soft drinks as mixers.

I had my first glass of wine this past weekend at 10 weeks out. I only had one glass of white wine. I drank it slow and did just fine. Fair warning: I have not struggled with anything I've ate or drank so far(besides bread- yuck!). So, I may not be the best person to go by. I was very thirsty the next day though. There have been a few threads about alcohol consumption in the past few months, you may want to search for those. Regardless of whether you get to have a drink, I hope you enjoy the heck out of the wedding! Amanda