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I think you may need to go way higher than 800-1000 cals to stop your losses. As far as losing more weight after a week of eating higher cals, I know I see a pretty significant lag between cals/exercise and the scale. It's usually 3-4 days until I see the effect of either low cal and/or high activity days, and high cal off the rails days. Yes, the physical changes from 140 ish to 125/130 were dramatic for me. It was good for my clothed self, but hugely negative for my naked self. I lost two cup sizes. I'm still resentful of that! I can't speak to the body fat scale (mine has error-ed out since I bought it). I would probably take it with a grain of salt though, knowing how inaccurate they are. I would focus on how you look and feel. As you said, that 19% doesn't fit with what google tells you it should be. I would weigh being right in the middle of your healthy weight BMI a lot more heavily than that scale reading.

but don't understand (the week when I was at 1000/day, I lost 2.5 lbs?? 1000 calories is still your weight loss calories. 2.5 loss is because your body needs more calories. See article below. https://www.webmd.com/diet/news/20140529/fast-weight-loss-may-mean-muscle-loss What are your fat percentages? I consume enough calories to build muscle mass. my body fat percentage is in the 19-24 zone. I'm athletic in the fit/lean zone. do you put any importance on this statistic to yourselves, personally?  I put importance on my goal of healthy. I don’t pay attention to my body fat percentage. Many of us lose muscle with rapid weight loss. There is a difference between a low body fat percentage with burnt muscle and with muscle mass. My personal experience after goal, I continued to exercise and not consume enough calories. The result was I burnt muscle and dropped to the 120’s. (not a healthy look for me) Here is the maintance meal plan off of the bariatric pal website: https://store.bariatricpal.com/pages/meal-plans-for-one-week-for-a-weight-loss-maintenance-diet Meal Plans for One Week for a Weight Loss Maintenance Diet Congratulations on getting to goal weight! Now your goal is to stay at this weight and prevent weight regain. This meal plan can help you do that. Sample Daily Pattern: 3 meals, 3 snacks Sample Meal Plan for Week 1, Sample Day 1 Breakfast Cheesy Garden Scramble with 2 large eggs, 1 ounce cheddar cheese, chives, 1 cup diced tomatoes, and ¼ cup avocado slices (350 calories, 22 grams protein) Morning Snack 1 cup fat-free Greek yogurt with 1 cup raw vegetables (your choice, such as broccoli, cauliflower, bell peppers, celery, snow peas, etc.) (130 calories, 14 grams protein) Lunch BariatricPal Protein Soup – Broccoli and Cheddar with an extra 1 cup cooked chopped broccoli and 1 ounce shredded cheese;BariatricPal Lite Bites (360 calories, 33 grams protein) 1 ounce cheddar cheese (190 calories, 22 grams protein) Afternoon Snack 1 large apple plus 1 ounce walnuts (300 calories, 5 grams protein) Dinner Stuffed eggplant with 1 medium eggplant, 4 ounces ground turkey (or beef or soy crumbles), 1/3 cup whole wheat bread crumbs, Italian seasoning; 1 ounce mozzarella cheese melted on top; ½ cup tomato sauce (520 calories, 35 grams protein) Evening Snack Kay’s Naturals Protein Cookie Bites – Mocha Espresso (120 calories, 12 grams protein) Totals: 1780 calories, 121 grams protein Sample Meal Plan for Week 1, Sample Day 2 Breakfast BariatricPal Hot Protein Breakfast – Maple and Brown Sugar Oatmeal made with skim milk; 2 tablespoons peanut (or almond) butter (380 calories, 30 grams protein) Morning Snack Quest Nutrition Protein Bar – Cookies and Cream (180 calories, 21 grams protein) Lunch “Naked Burrito Bowl” with ½ cup nonfat refried beans, 3 ounces shredded chicken breast with taco seasoning, 1 cup shredded lettuce, ½ cup diced tomatoes, 2 tablespoons salsa, ¼ cup guacamole (360 calories, 33 grams protein) Afternoon Snack 1 medium pear plus 1 ounce blue cheese (200 calories, 7 grams protein) Dinner 4 ounces broiled salmon with rosemary and lemon; ½ cup brown rice; 1 cup roasted bell pepper strips with 2 teaspoons olive oil (450 calories, 29 grams protein) Evening Snack BariatricPal Protein Desserts – Creamy Cheesecake (120 calories, 12 grams protein) Totals: 1690 calories, 132 grams protein Sample Meal Plan for Week 1, Sample Day 3 Breakfast Protein shake with 1 cup kale, ½ large banana, 1 container low-sugar nonfat vanilla Greek yogurt, 2 tablespoons peanut butter or PB2 Powdered Peanut Butter, 1 cup skim milk (370 calories, 33 grams protein) Morning Snack 2 hard-boiled eggs (160 calories, 12 grams protein) Lunch Wrap on a low-carb, high-fiber tortilla spread with 2 tablespoons hummus; filling includes 3 ounces grilled chicken, 1 cup raw veggies (such as lettuce, sliced mushrooms, chopped tomatoes, etc.), 1 ounce shredded or sliced provolone cheese, 2 tablespoons sliced black olives (400 calories, 39 grams protein) Afternoon Snack 1 cup Greek yogurt with 1 cup blueberries and BariatricPal Cinnamon Crunch Protein Cereal (290 calories, 23 grams protein) Dinner BariatricPal Beef and Bean Enchilada; ¼ cup guacamole; 1 ounce cheddar or jack cheese; 2 cups lettuce and chopped vegetables (such as tomatoes, mushrooms, cucumbers); 2 tablespoons fat-free dressing (460 calories, 21 grams protein) Evening Snack Hot Cocoa with Marshmallows (80 calories, 15 grams protein) Totals: 1760 calories, 143 calories Sample Meal Plan for Week 1, Sample Day 4 Breakfast Omelet made with 2 large eggs, 1 cup sliced mushrooms, fresh basil, and 1 ounce Swiss cheese (310 calories, 20 grams protein) Morning Snack ½ cup cottage cheese; 2 tablespoons sunflower seed kernels (170 calories, 16 grams protein) Lunch BariatricPal Beef Stroganoff; 1 cup grapes (360 calories, 21 grams protein) Afternoon Snack Turkey roll-ups with 3 ounces turkey breast spread with 3 tablespoons cream cheese mixed with ½ cup diced apple (290 calories, 18 grams protein) Dinner Veggie burger patty; 1 whole grain hamburger bun; 2 tablespoons hummus (spread on bun); 1 medium sweet potato baked into fries (baked with 2 teaspoons olive oil) (440 calories, 20 grams protein) Evening Snack BariatricPal Protein Oatmeal Cookie with Vanilla Drizzle (170 calories, 15 grams protein) Totals: 1740 calories, 110 grams protein Sample Meal Plan for Week 1, Sample Day 5 Breakfast BariatricPal 35g Protein Shake Meal Replacement – Strawberry (240 calories, 35 grams protein) Morning Snack 1 container vanilla Greek yogurt with Kay’s Naturals Protein Cereal – Honey Almond and ½ banana (290 calories, 26 grams protein) Lunch ¼ acorn squash baked with 2 teaspoons olive oil; ½ cup cooked quinoa mixed with ½ ounce chopped pistachios and 1 ounce parmesan cheese (390 calories, 16 grams protein) Afternoon Snack 1 cup carrots; 2 tablespoons peanut butter (240 calories, 8 grams protein) Dinner 4 ounces lean ground turkey topped with 1 ounce cheddar cheese; 1 cup cooked spinach; 1 medium apple (370 calories, 28 grams protein) Evening Snack BariatricPal Strawberry Cheesecake Protein Bar (160 calories, 12 grams protein) Totals: 1690 calories, 115 grams protein Sample Meal Plan for Week 1, Sample Day 6 Breackfast BariatricPal Hot Protein Breakfast – Maple and Brown Sugar Oatmeal made with skim milk; 2 tablespoons chopped pecans (280 calories, 23 grams protein) Morning Snack 1 cheese stick (string cheese); ½ cup shelled edamame (green soybeans) (270 calories, 24 grams protein) Lunch BariatricPal Vegetable Lasagna; 1 ounce melted mozzarella; 1 cup cooked cauliflower or broccoli (340 calories, 20 grams protein) Afternoon Snack 1 ounce almonds; (290 calories, 18 grams protein) Dinner 1 cup chili made with garbanzo, pinto, and black beans, diced celery and onions, stewed tomatoes, and chili seasoning; ½ cup cooked barley; 1 cup roasted beet root (350 calories, 15 grams protein) Evening Snack Chocolate Chip with Chocolate Drizzle Cookie (170 calories, 15 grams protein) Totals: 1700 calories, 115 grams protein Sample Meal Plan for Week 1, Sample Day 7 Breakfast 1 container nonfat Greek yogurt; BariatricPal Protein Cereal – Cinnamon Vanilla; ½ cup honeydew melon (260 calories, 28 grams protein) Morning Snack 5 cup tuna with 1 serving Moon Cheese (160 calories, 25 grams protein) Lunch BariatricPal Protein Soup – Cream of Vegetable cooked with ½ cup pinto, kidney, or garbanzo beans and ½ cup mixed vegetables; Kay’s Natural Protein Chips – Crispy Parmesan (330 calories, 36 grams protein) Afternoon Snack 1 banana; 2 tablespoons peanut butter (300 calories, 8 grams protein) Dinner Dinner scramble with 1 cup tofu, 1 cup veggies, 1 ounce cashew pieces, and 2 tablespoons teriyaki sauce stir-fried in 2 teaspoons sesame oil (420 calories, 17 grams protein) Evening Snack Chocolate Protein Wafers (200 calories, 15 grams protein) Totals: 1670 calories, 129 grams protein Sample Meal Plan for Week 2, Sample Day 1 Breakfast 1 packet BariatricPal Oatmealwith 2 tablespoons pecans and ½ cup diced apple plus cinnamon. Or other Healthy Breakfast Morning Snack Lunch BariatricPal Chocolate, Strawberry , or Vanilla Meal Replacementor other Healthy Lunch Afternoon Snack 1 bag Protein Chipsor Protein Pretzelswith two tablespoons hummus Dinner Cheese Steak Macaroni1 cup steamed green beans with 2 tablespoons sliced almonds or other Healthy Dinner Evening Snack Sample Meal Plan for Week 2, Sample Day 2 Breakfast Vegetable Omelettopped with 1 ounce shredded cheese, served and with 2 ounce turkey (or vegetarian) breakfast sausage links or other Healthy Breakfast Morning Snack Pancakes with Carbquik Baking Mixand 2 tablespoons of PB2 Powdered Peanut Butter Lunch Salad with fresh spinach leaves, 3 ounces grilled skinless chicken breast, 1 cup sliced strawberries, 2 tablespoons chopped pecans, 2 tablespoons light raspberry vinaigrette dressing or other Healthy Lunch Afternoon Snack or another flavor of Quest Protein Bar Dinner 4 ounces of broiled salmon, 1 cup baked sweet potato fries made with olive oil, and 1 cup of steamed broccoli or other Healthy Dinner Evening Snack Creamy CheeseCake This is a very low calorie diet. Use only under the supervision of your doctor. This diet gives you about 1200-1400 calories per day. You may need more calories, especially if you are a man, if you are a taller person, or if you are especially active.If you need more calories, you can add in extra snacks. Go for protein and nutrition! Here are some suggestions for healthy snacks. Each has 150 to 250 calories, and at least 10 grams of protein. 1 ounce Turkey Jerky plus ½ apple 1 BariatricPal 10 g Protein Bar 1 cup edamame (green soybeans) plus 1 ounce low-fat cheese 1 cup celery sticks plus 2 tablespoons peanut butter 1 package BariatricPal Protein Pretzels plus 2 tablespoons hummus

When I began this journey at the beginning of 2018 I was 426 pounds. Can't tell you measurements because all my clothes were in X's and not inches. But for reference, I was in a 5x shirt from Casual Male. I only wore sweatpants and those were also a 5x. People only saw me in clothes and the comment I often heard was that I carried my weight well. Being 6'1" I had the advantage of being tall and heavy vs short and heavy. It was all an illusion. Medically I was prediabetic, on CPAP, could only sleep on my back, had knee pain and sweated like a frog fresh out of the pond in any weather over 72 degrees. 7 months post surgery and I am down 139 pounds. My A1C is 4, off the CPAP, I can sleep on my side, I can walk all day and not have knee pain...unfortunatley I still sweat a lot. My physical appearance has changed in visible ways. Prior to surgery, I use to measure my weight loss and gain by how close I was to my steering wheel. If I was rubbing it then it was a bad week, if I could fit my hand between my belly and the wheel it was a good week (I avoided scales, I knew I was fat and honestly just wanted to get by in life). I look down at my steering wheel now and I see the marks where my belt scratched up the leather. Now there are a good 10 inches between me and the steering wheel. I can get in a car accident and not worry that the airbag is going to kill me. I can see the weight loss in my face: I also see the weight loss around my body. My shoulders are boney, my arms have lots of skin, my butt sags, the skin just hangs everywhere. I'm down to a 2x and my waist is in a 50 pant which needs a belt. I hold these clothes out in front of me as I'm about to put them on and I say to myself, "There is no way this will fit me" or "Boy this is gonna look tight" and the clothes fits perfect. Not tight and hides my sag well. Overall I don't want to sound like I'm not delighted, but I'm realizing just how large I was...and honestly still am. I wish I were brave enough to take a photo so I could show you what I mean, but I can't believe after all this weight coming off I'm still so big. I sit and there is a huge belly still in my lap. My thighs are huge. Maybe as I continue to lose weight these two areas will decrease dramatically, but it seems like there must be 150 lbs there alone. I never thought for a moment that after my surgery I was going to have a thin, fit beach body. I hoped though that it would be less fat looking when dressed and in public. I almost feel like I want to tell people "Yeah, but just half a year ago I was..."

So after the not-so-successful jump from 600 to 1000 cals, I went down to 800 cals daily a week ago in attempt to slowly find my maintenance level. Today I increase my calories to 900 a day (with macros set at 65g P, 56g F, 35g C for now). The week at 800 still resulted in a loss of 1.9 lbs, which i sort of expected, but don't understand (the week when I was at 1000/day, i lost 2.5 lbs??) As I said in an earlier post, I am no longer so occupied with the number on the scale but more so now about how small I am starting to look/am looking to myself. This continues to be an issue, and my level of sagginess seems to have increased at a faster rate these last few pounds. Now, my newest concern is my reported body fat percentage. I have one of those scales that measure all that, and while I know that it fluctuates greatly depending on water retention and recent exercise activity, but for the past week I'd say I averaged about 19%. Now, I am not what someone would say is a "fit" person (where a "fit" woman averages 21-24%), so this gives me some pause. I mean, according to what I've read, I should be at 25-32% for a normal/average woman. What are your fat percentages? And do you put any importance on this statistic to yourselves, personally?

Way behind here! I'm going to try to catch up on all the exercises, from the 8th through today. I hope there aren't people in the room below me! I am doing well on my walking a mile a day, a majority of days goal, I'm 9 for 11! Day 8 - Small things that make me excited Keeping two house plants alive for over 3 months now (a miracle!). Butterflies in my yard. Climbing into a bed with fresh, clean linens. Day 9 - Things that cause me pain GOT, ever expanding "to do" lists, my deflate chest Day 10 - What do you want to be remembered for My sense of humor and empathy Day 11 - Good cry/drawing/painting Nope Day 12 - Smile as much as you can Working out of town, don't want to look like a grinning idiot all day, we'll see B side - What is your current absolute favorite article of clothing? I can't pick just one! I have become a complete nightmare about my clothing! I take so long to pick an outfit to wear, packing for a trip has become an ordeal. It's all cause I'm insanely full of myself currently, and I think I look cute in everything 🤣 One thing I did not predict, is how much I'd love patterned pants

Thanks everyone for your feedback!! I wasn't sure if it varies from patient to patient. my S-N-L said on the paperwork given to her they require an ekg, something about a breath test and a dye test. not sure what she means by the dye test as it can be multiple things. And do the visit with PCP have to be back to back or does it just have to be within the last year. example I will see my pcp 2 times this month regarding weight loss 6/5 and 6/19 will those both count or will they only be considered one?

You have been preparing for this day for years. Don’t let someone’s actions make you question your decisions. I am scheduled for 7/8/19 and I only told my husband. I had an appt for a sleep apnea mouthpiece and when I told the dr. Why I was there she was very nice but an office worker who is larger than me had changed the way she talked to me and looked at me like in disgust. Then I went to my dermatologist and I went over my info with the nurse and did not tell her about planned surgery. When Dr. came in I didn’t realize nurse stayed in the room and I asked him questions about vitamins etc. for my upcoming surgery. (I have psoriatic arthritis and rosacea) when I said who my surgeon was she bursted out with groans etc. it was so uncomfortable. I asked if something was wrong with my surgeon or anything I should know about etc. I am still upset about it. The dr. Was not happy with her reaction. I don’t think I will be telling anyone at this point. This is my decision and my health. So I see exactly what you mean especially in a medical setting. You are ready. Best of luck to you and please update how you are doing.

I had a RNY because of a previous failed surgery (10 years ago) to correct my L shaped esophagus. 1/2 of my stomach was above my diaphragm. Food was getting stuck just about every day. My BMI was about 34. I didn't have to do any of the pre-op things that people with high BMI’s have to do. My doctor wasn’t a WLS surgeon. He was a thoracic surgeon & told me to find all of my info on the internet. After I decided I wanted to do the surgery it was only 2 months til I had it. I spoke with a nurse and a nutritionist through my insurance (Cigna) several times before & after my surgery. I am 13 months out from my surgery. I have lost 65 lbs. I would like to loose 5 more to get me to the top end of a healthy BMI for my height. The weight has dropped pretty easily & I know it’s gotta be exercise that takes off the last 5. I also know I would not have lost 65 lbs on my own. Now I just got to keep it off & that scares me Good luck in whatever you decide to do.

Check in 6/12/2019 - I am back on the high end of my maintaining bounce range. I'm here to get my weight back down - VSG June 2014 /2017, High weight 254, - Goal for this month is to lose 4 pounds this challenge. 6/10 weight is 139 6/11 weight 137 6/12 weight 136

I had a 12-lb bounce back (as you probably know, a 10-20 lb regain after hitting your lowest weight is unfortunately very common, although not inevitable), but other than that, yes, I've maintained my weight. After I was about a year out, I switched over to calorie counting, which I still do. I can maintain my weight as long as I average 1700 kcal/day or less. I can eat pretty much anything other than a lot of fat or sugar at one sitting (which I shouldn't be doing *anyway*). I do eat healthy (other than the very occasional treat), and I track everything that goes into my mouth and will for the rest of my life. During my numerous pre-op weight loss attempts, once I quit closely monitoring myself (frequent weighing and tracking what I was eating), the weight came back. Not happening this time...

It took a couple months to get my energy and strength back to pre-op levels. Now at almost 10 months out, I have more energy than I’ve had in over 29 years.

I don’t remember how quickly I lost weight with my Gastric Sleeve 10 years ago, but I am losing fairly slowly with the bypass. Since I went on the pre-operation diet on April 30, I have lost about 9 kgs - nearly 20 lbs - but in the last couple of weeks, only about 1 kg per week. Not worried though - I am in this for the long haul. The doctor and dietician are telling me I may only lost another 7-8 kgs, but I plan on proving them wrong. I am currently just over 80 kgs (176 lbs) and my first goal is 75 kgs, but my actual goal is to get into the 60s. I’d like to be somewhere between 65-68 kgs (143-150 lbs). I will enjoy proving them wrong!

Thank you Sheri! I mean I guess this is all relative. It’s not like we are eating tons of food. But compared to when I was eating a month ago I would say my quantity is almost doubled in the last week. Prior to this past week I would get nauseated after I would eat almost every time. I could barely get anything down. Then suddenly out of nowhere maybe I healed? Because now I can eat with no pain and no nausea afterwards. I get full faster than a normal person but it’s very bizarre. So for my recap for the day is two slices of bacon for breakfast, all rolled up bunch of turkey meat for lunch, now I have eaten about 10 shrimp. Very small cocktail shrimp with cocktail sauce. But 10!? I could never have imagined eating 10 shrimp a month ago. I also had a medium sized sugarfree red bull and a few glasses of tea. Maybe the caffeine is amping it up. Probably need to bring on the water water water water water.

I am 19 months out. Pounds lost 166.0 . Highest weight was 320.0. Sent from my SM-G930V using BariatricPal mobile app

I only packed my charger, a little extension cord, headphones, deodorant and a change of underwear. I wore sweats to the hospital and that's what I planned to wear home. The only thing I ended up using was the deodorant and the change of panties. They put me in my room at 10 am and I didn't turn my phone back on till midnight. They were giving me IV pain meds and I was in and out all day. So I didn't need the charger, the headphones or extension cord. I wore their slippers to walk in and took them off when I got back in bed. They gave me Gas X, face wash, a tooth brush and tooth paste. Good luck with your surgery! Sent from my moto e5 plus using BariatricPal mobile app

Sleeved 3/11/2019, age 63. Finally, someone else admitting issues with CPAP! :) I hated mine with a passion. Used for about 6-7 months and I put it away. I took two Benadryl nightly in order to sleep with it, otherwise very restless sleep and exhausted the next day. I did not have a mask, used the nasal pillow but still bothered by it and the hose. I requested to view the two sleep study results; I am still waiting. The surgeon and pulmonary physician insisted I needed CPAP. My primary told me it was an insurance requirement and to put up with it as long as possible. The extensive PFT administered in the pulmonologist's office had excellent results. Check your insurance and surgeon requirements. I wouldn't stop using prior to surgery without their blessing. You don't want to have jumped through all the hoops only to be denied because of that darn CPAP! Sorry for the wordy response. I started at 234 and have lost 41 lbs so far. I am happy with the slow, steady downward trend. My surgeon believes I should have lost twice as much by now. He can be annoying at times. :) Hope all goes well for you!

I’m now 17 weeks post sleeve surgery and I’m down 59 pounds from surgery day. I’m thinking if there is anyone who has averaged 5+ pounds weekly over a few months, that person will probably make the record books. It’s a major win for me if I lose 2+/week. SW:  246CW: 187 Sleeved 2/6/19

Okay so I got this wish pre-WLS because of breast cancer 10 years ago and the ensuing reconstruction. When it was time for reconstruction (free of course, but the admission price was to ensure a year of chemo/radiation) I opted to go from a 40g to a 40b. It was the best decision I’d ever made and the first time I put on a “regular” bra I cried tears of joy. Now that I’ve lost almost 60 pounds, the girls are basically the same size. I guess whatever the surgeon left me with is gonna stubbornly stick around at least for now because I still wear a b cup, but now it’s in 38s, which are getting very very loose around the band.

Check in 6/11/2019 - I am back on the high end of my maintaining bounce range. I'm here to get my weight back down - VSG June 2014 /2017, High weight 254, - Goal for this month is to lose 4 pounds this challenge. 6/10 weight is 139 6/11 todays weight 137 Day 11 – drawing or painting a good cry. This is my last week with my grandkids. My son’s divorce is finalized. I don’t even know where to begin. How do you explain to a four and one year old that they won’t be seeing dad and grandma often. Grieving for what they are going through. Cried while running six miles.

Hello Everyone, I am from Miami Florida and flew to Medellin Colombia to get my gastric sleeve surgery. Dr. Carlos Alberto Lopera is well known and recommend by 5 coworkers who also flew to Medellin to get the surgery. After seeing how well everything went for all of my 5 coworkers I decided to contact him and make my initial consultation. I did my surgery on March 19 and have lost 35 pounds since then. It has been the best decision ever. For anyone who is interested in more information I'll be more than happy to try to answer your questions. the Dr normally has a standard price of 15,000,000 pesos (Colombian money) which is about $5,000.00 US dollars. If anyone is interested in contacting his secretary; her name is Claudia and her email address is: consultoriovegas315@hotmail.com

And how are your preparations going @Lisamarie517? Do you think you are going to be all ready. for August 2019?

I started walking on the treadmill one week after surgery. I am now in my 3rd week of spinning and had a spin class on Sunday that used weight so I used two 5lbs. I am waiting to get clearance for all other when I see my surgeon on the 19th. Surgery date 4/29/19

I'm 10 months out and I still drink Miralax in my tea every morning and will make sure I'm getting plenty of fiber in my diet. I'll throw benefiber in my yogurt and premier shakes when I drink them. Congratulations on your poo!

I had my gastric sleeve surgery done on March 26th 2019 not too many issues but the fact that my incision stayed open okay I don't think that's the case I was never informed of having do the follow-up blood work the follow-up nutrition classes and also as I said in my last post today or well yesterday as of June 10th 2018 I had to have emergency gallbladder removal from the vertical sleeve gastrectomy so my go to intake on my surgeon is probably a 5 out of 10

Hello everyone I has VSG on March 26, 2019 and as of June 10, 2019 I had to going for a emergency gallbladder removal has anyone had this issue after their sleeve?