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Found 15,901 results

  1. I was just getting ready to START Wellbutrin. I am soooo nervous to start it because of weight gain but my doctor thought it might actually help me with binge eating. So fingers crossed.
  2. Shandy79

    Anyone starting over?

    Thanks for the support vlp1968. I do need to get back to working out. I just stopped because I got so discouraged with all the weight gain. Thanks for the advice and Happy Thanksgiving. All the best.
  3. maygoddess

    Would you do it again?

    I thought I would jump in and give perspective from someone who is about to hit my 5 year "bandiversary" in August. Would I do it again knowing what I know now? Yes! I can't say it has been a picnic and my loss was very slow over the last 5 years BUT I did not get this surgery expecting to lose it all in the first 6 months and be done with it. I KNOW we all expect it will be fast and some are very quick losers, but I decided I did not want to be a perfect bandster and I eat crap when I want to..but I don't beat myself up about knowing what the consequences are..slow loss vs fast loss.. I feel sad when I read Zengirl's reply that she is already given up on the band in a few months and wished she had bypass. You REALLY don't, girl. There is absolutely no benefit to losing it faster or what you may think is easier. I have personal experience with both. I was banded in 2002 at 286lbs. I initially lost 20lbs pretty quickly, but then it really came off in slow chunks from there..after a good fill a little came off..I would get the flu and drop 10lbs(not a fun way to lose but it happened) and no matter how "perfect" I thought I was..I would not budge..your body will be like that. You need to reverse your thinking on this band. Not how fast or easy the weight comes off, but how much easier it will be to KEEP IT OFF!! I have not gained back an ounce in almost 5 years..took me as long to lose it, but I managed to maintain it! Okay..fast forward to 2005 when my best friend, weighing around 285lbs at her sugery had gastric bypass. For some medical reasons, she explained to me gastric bypass was a better option(personally I think she made that up because her insurance would not cover the band but would cover the bypass or she felt that bypass was better to her..don't know) At the time of her surgery..I think I was just about 200lbs..can't remember..had already lost 85lbs..but after almost 3 years banded..still had another 50+ to go. My friend quickly lost down almost to her goal in the first year of her surgery. She passed me and kept on going. She was bound and determined to not "cheat" or even have sugar pass her lips in fear of dumping. Well that quickly ended when she did indeed have surgar. She doesn't "dump" and get really sick..she just gets extremely tired. She can quickly pass out after a few drinks..she gets stupid drunk fast and I worry about her dating men she doesn't know who could take advantage of this. I tell her not to drink but a glass a wine at the most when around other people. We eat about the same amount and just about the same foods, but she does watch how much sugar she consumes. I finally did get down to about the same weight..I weigh around 150 now..she got to 140 something, but has since started to gain a little weight. So I think she actually weighs a little more than me now. She just started having to take B12 injections and I really don't think she gets enough Vitamins in as she should. Her doctor told her to take a flintstone Vitamin. Not much in those even for kids never mind a bypass patient. She is almost 50 and will need extra nutritional support as she ages..but we shall see. So..you see..we both reached goal..she has more worry about weight gain than I do. I keep my band pretty snug and if I needed to..still do have some room to make it tighter..but I am pretty set where I am at right now. I don't have the worry about eating certain foods or consuming too much alchohol(and we are not talking ALOT to get her seriously screwed up!..a few glasses of wine can do it!) I would worry about the long term effects of actually bypassing stuff and getting nutritional support to my body..she always seems more tired than I am..but I am 9 years younger..but I know people who are 80 and more active than her! Looks like most of you are pretty recently banded and barely begun getting fills. It can take a while to get to a good fill..depending on how your doctor fills you and how agressive he/she is in keeping up with you. I was banded in Mexico and went down for fills, but I don't think my doctor ever really filled me enough worrying that I may have to come back for an unfill (and I live in Nor Calif!)..I finally started going to a fill doctor in Tahoe area(only a 3 hour drive instead of a 9 hour drive to Mexico) and though he fills "blind"(no flouro)...he gave me excellent fills and I finally started feeling like this was working. He spent more time with me each visit and really laid down the law with me...some of which I listened to and other stuff I was the typical "yeah, yeah, I know it all!"..but mentally..I needed a kick in the pants and it worked. Don't Don't Don't give up on this band and wish for that bypass..DON'T assume to be a hare and be fine with a tortoise as long as you don't gain it back. The journey..your journey will be different than EVERYONE"s elses journey..so don't compare. Don't beat yourself up about being too slow..I think we are more concerned about what our friends and family will think if we don't peel of the weight in a few months and THEY think it is a failure or you made a mistake..tell as few people as possible about the surgery..it will save you some agony on your journey. My in-laws were just told earlier this year! They obviously have seen my loss..but I never admitted to surgery until recently..now that I am done, they can know the truth. Does it feel good to be down to a "normal" weight finally? Yes..it does..lots of times my friend and I complain how uncomfy it is being too bony on hard chairs and feeling bones protrude where they didn't before. I was talking to her about seeing a pair of pants on ebay that I used to buy in size 20..in a size 2 and always thought..no way would I ever be there..but last week I tried a size 4 on at a dept store (I usually wear size 8-10 now with a few 6's and few 12's depending on cut)..so 2 now just does not seem that far off! Very weird. It will happen ladies and gents...don't fight it..don't regret anything..just enjoy the journey! Patty
  4. Hi everyone. I'm a newbie from Michigan and just found out I was approved for surgery. I go on Thursday for my medical and behavorial assessments. I'm hoping to have smooth sailing and have my lap band in a cuople months. Where I'm going I'm required to do Optifast for 4 weeks prior. I have about 90 pounds I want to lose. I gained about 35 after I quit smoking back in June. Even though I've hated all the weight gain, I never once seriously considered smoking again to curb the gains. I'm looking forward to my journey and sharing it all with you and getting to know everyone here. Anyone have any words of advice?
  5. ConnieSings

    Anyone Failed With The Sleeve?

    Thanks ya'll... As far as the eating, I'm thinking I'll be okay... since I had the band and learned to eat slowly, small portions and stay busy... I will say, that I know part of the reason for the weight gain since having the band Fluid taken out... (other than the fact that it's like not having a restriction at all) is, I am eating a whole lot more and the "grazing" is back... Just can't seem to stop the never ending "hunt" for something to put into my mouth. That was really NOT the case after the lap band... I was able to feel much more satisfied... So... I'm hoping I'll be one of those folks who can get back on trac with the weight loss...
  6. No weight gain. Enjoyed good Turkey and couple bites of pumpkin pie with rediwhip - yum! Actually lost a pound. Was off work from last Wednesday thru Sunday and was able to walk 3-4 miles each day except Saturday. Now to get thru December!
  7. gowalking

    Fat People programs

    ..except she blames the PCOS for her weight gain. When she says later on that she makes some poor choices, we don't know if she means volume, or the type of food she's consuming, or something else. I knew I had to shut the program off last night and change the channel when I started talking back to the TV.
  8. So I'm almost three months out and have had my share of ups and downs, yada, yada, yada. What I don't get is the physiology of my new stomach. How can I gain weight by eating roughly 1200 calories a day and of those calories, some are carbs? I mean a normal person eating 1200 calories a day would not gain weight but three straight days of "being bad" has resulted in a three pound weight gain. Doesn't make sense to me?
  9. waitingtoexhale

    What was your breaking point?

    My latest moment was at my grandma birthday celebration this past summer 2014..... Our family had identical shirts made and mine was a 2X, when I put it on the day of, it was too tight along with my too tight stretch pants! The kicker was when the photographer posted and tagged me AND everyone that was in the same pictures with me on facebook! I was horrified! My rear end looked like a wide load truck! I looked uncomfortably stuffed and you could see EVERY roll even what I didn't know that I had! Since my substantial weight gain, no one on FB had seen a full body shot of me! The only thing that I could do was untag myself:( I'm scheduled to have my life changing experience (VSG) September 26, 2014
  10. crosswind

    BAD Insomnia

    Well, I took a unisom last night, the sleepmelts. I hate taking those though. They leave you with a hangover and they cause weight gain over time. I don't know if it's the surgery that's causing this or if it's just my zoomy little brain messing with my sleep wake cycle. It's probably unisom again tonight.
  11. ppatterson

    3Rd Day Post-Op, Qs... Is This Normal?

    Weight gain is totally normal. I was depressed until someone on the forum encouraged me to really measure myself. My waist alone was 3 inches larger than before surgery. That was an eye opener. I relaxed after that!
  12. sweethot143

    December Bandsters

    stephC Oh how I wish that my signature was my current stat! No, that is my dream stat. I am now at 240 and after surgery hope to be at 180 in the middle and by the end of 1 -1 1/2 years hope to be 140. So i guess that signature is my goal signature, lol. Last year at this time I was 185!! I wish I could go back in time and stop the weight gain. Just an FYI for you, maybe try another type of shake slim fast is very very unhealthy. Last week i bought two cases without reading the ingredients and it is full of sugar and hydrogenated oil, and high fructose corn syrup. Maybe try a healthfood store for something that will work with your body. Keep up the hard work on the liquid diet, I keep starting one, even though the dr. hasn't said to do one, but after reading on here how many people do it, I figure it will give me a jump start. I can't even make it through an entire day!! I'm starving!
  13. TheNewSusie

    Mirena slows weight loss?

    I have the Para Guard and had no problems, then again the paraguard doesn't contain hormones or weight gain. I had it before surgery 1 1/2 years ago and a few pounds from goal.
  14. Matt Z

    2 weeks post op, gained 1 pound..

    You really shouldn't be doing creamed soups typically at all. They are generally very high in calories, carbs, fats, and sugars. You should stick to the list of foods they say you can have, and not venture out into other areas until you are cleared for them. Talk to your nutritionist about your diet and have them tell you want you need to be doing. Firstly, weight gain within the first 2 weeks isn't unheard of.... but lots of sleeve folks are on liquids only for the first month, I get that every doctor is going to be different, but you are also supposed to be on a restricted calorie intake, you should be tracking your proteins, water, etc. Give them a call and ask them how they feel about cream based soups. Are you tracking your protein intake? How much protein are you getting? Are you tracking your water intake? How much water are you getting a day? Are you exercising? How much exercise are you getting each day?
  15. Ahhhh. Hugs and more hugs to you! Reading your thoughts above, you have a very full plate right now and “Ideally, want to finish your studies and then get the surgery”. Repeatedly you express this wish. You deserve to complete your studies uninterrupted, so then you can devote more focus to your next life milestone, WLS. IMHO, I wholeheartedly agree on that strategy. I finished my master’s at age 40 while working full time and recall the dedication, focus and discipline required to keep it all rolling at a very high level. I also had L5, S1 microdiscectomy and laminectomy 18 months ago. To add in WLS and the preparation pre and post op would have stressed me to no end, and yours is a step more intense than mine, PhD and fusion. You’ve put so much into your journey already, and we’re talking a short time frame in the big scheme of things to finish your studies. I would focus on keeping your spirits up right now in knowing and believing it WILL all be accomplished within a very near term time frame. I do recall the horror of the weight gain with spinal surgery, but again, I would strive to eat as healthy as possible but don’t stress over it. Focus on the things you CAN control, finishing your studies without losing your ever lovin’ mind is right there at the top of the list. Throw off those chains of guilt that you’re not prioritizing your health! You ARE prioritizing it in being self loving and practical to not further overload. Breathe.... You got this girll!
  16. Meljp

    Relationship/marriages

    I don't own any full length mirrors and a little over a year ago we were at my Mother in-laws lake house...I took a shower and damn near the whole bath is full length mirrors....I looked at myself in HORROR....I thought My God this is what my husband see's....I came out of the bathroom in tears...sat down at the kitchen table with Mother in-law and hubs and cried my eyes out....what worries me with the weight loss is saggy skin...the only places on my body that are a bit "poogie" are my belly (not too much tho) and the insides of my legs (as well not real bad) so I am hoping with exercise that I will be able to tone those areas up...I see so many that have lost tons of weight and in clothes the look fabulous...I just wonder what they look like when the take off their "Spanks" or what ever they wear...I am 54 years old and have always been fit. Until I was diagnosed with Fibromyalgia in 2000 and that's when the weight gain started....Melanie(
  17. Cazzy

    My Lapband Horror Story

    ''Third major problem: (was not told this ahead of time either) weight gain is guaranteed if you DRINK liquids with your meals, had I been told this I would have never gotten it because I know I drink with nearly every bite I eat. I knew there would be diet changes, etc, but not this! '' In my opinion thats just not normal whether u are banded or not !
  18. Years before surgery I had only tried Depo. I really didn't care about the weight gain, now I do...lol. So I think I've pretty much ruled that one out. My doctor gave me the mini pill to try but she said she had little faith in it and really recommends that Mirena IUD. I'm just so scared of having something implanted. But it would be worse if the mini pill was ineffective...lol! I am such a baby when it comes to pain, but I have to ask......did the actual placement of the device hurt? Can you feel it everyday? Is it uncomfortable? What about the side effects? It says possible hair loss....lol....=0 .....more loss? Ugh! Did that happen to anyone?
  19. aliceinthegardenofpearl

    PLEASE HELP! Been in Plateau for 4 months!

    Hello. I'm not exactly new here but I keep up with the forum quite of bit. I know it's alot of information down below but PLEASE READ and GIVE ME ANY KIND OF ADVICE OR SUGGESTIONS! SW: 227 CW: 205 GW: 155 First of all, I had my surgery in 2010 and it didn't go as well as I would have liked. Since then I've been struggling to find a diet that would actually work well with my body and my metabolic syndrome and have found that a low carb diet works really well for me. I just found this out in February of this year and have lost 22 pounds so far. The weight loss has been incredibly slow and I've tried my best to remain calm with the fact that I've only been able to lose 22 pounds 9 months but sometimes. But anyways, I've stalled at 205 since July and I haven't been able to get out of that range no matter how hard I try. I tried re-doing the induction phase of the atkins program but that didn't work. I tried exercising more and even started running 1-2 miles 3 times a week and that didn't work. I researched my medications. I'm taking Propranolol for high blood pressure, Metformin for type II diabetes, Simvastatin for cholesterol, and Ortho-Micronor which is a birth control. I initially thought that it was the birth control because it's notorious for causing significant gain but fortunately it helped me lose the 22 pounds (I feel personally that it has helped in that aspect) I looked up side effects of this medication and lots of women complain of weight gain but I was fortunate in that regard. So I researched Propranolol and Metformin and Simvastatin on various websites and askapatient.com and of all the 3 medications people had complaints about gaining weight, the inability to lose weight regardless of a healthy diet and regular exercise regimen. So I tried not taking it for about 3 days which was stupid because I felt dizzy but I checked my blood pressure regularly and it was always in the range of 124/76 which is still high. But in those 3 days I was able to lose 2 pounds but I know it's not smart to stop taking medications especially blood pressure so I put myself back on it and quickly went back up to 205 again. I'm thinking of asking my doctor to change my blood pressure medication but at 80 bucks a visit without insurance is kind of hard to afford for just a prescription and short visit, especially since I just went a month ago and spent 80 dollars already. But I've been thinking that maybe it isn't the Propranolol because I was able to lose 22 pounds with taking all my medications regularly. So I'm asking for any suggestions whether it be suggestions on exercise or eating or anything to help me bust out of this weight plateau that I've been on since July. I do eat around 700-800 calories a day and I exercise for an 1 hour & 30 minutes to 2 hours 5-6 times a week. I try to switch my cardio up every week. But a typical day would be Jillian Michael's 30 day shred (30 minutes), Turbo Fire (either 30, 45, or 55 minutes), then I finish it off with 50-60 minutes of another cardio workout plus the running 3 times a week. I do have a calorie counter watch and according to that I burn around 700 to 1000 calories a day. I believe that my body is in starvation mode even though I'm not starving myself. I read that the metabolism slows as you lose weight and it becomes harder to lose weight for every 10 pounds you lose. I don't know if I should up my calories to 1200 or so but I find it very hard to eat 1200 calories physically because of my band's restriction and not being hungry My Menu Breakfast Carb Zero vanilla shake 1 scoop - 105 calories 2 scrambled eggs/no milk - 140 2 slices of bacon - 80 calories Nature's own double Fiber bread - 50 calories lunch 1 can of tuna - 100 calories 1 wedge of light swiss laughing cow cheese (to mix in the tuna) - 35 calories 1 tsp of brown mustard (to mix in the tuna) - 5 calories 34 Degrees Rosemary Crisp bread crackers - 6 of them, 41 calories Hello. I'm not exactly new here but I keep up with the forum quite of bit. I know it's quite a lot of information down below but I just thought I'd thoroughly explain myself and my situation. PLEASE READ and OFFER ANY ADVICE OR SUGGESTIONS First of all, I had my surgery in 2010 and it didn't go as well as I would have liked. Since then I've been struggling to find a diet that would actually work well with my body and my metabolic syndrome and have found that a low carb diet works really well for me. I just found this out in February of this year and have lost 22 pounds so far with a low carb diet. The weight loss has been incredibly slow and I've tried my best to remain calm with the fact that I've only been able to lose 22 pounds in 9 months. But anyways, I've been stalled at 205 since July and I haven't been able to get out of that range no matter how hard I try. I tried re-doing the induction phase of the atkins program but that didn't work. I tried exercising more and even started running 1-2 miles 3 times a week and that didn't work. I researched my medications. I'm taking Propranolol for high blood pressure, Metformin for type II diabetes, Simvastatin for cholesterol, and Ortho-Micronor which is a birth control. I initially thought that it was the birth control because birth control is notorious for causing significant weight gain for some women, but fortunately it helped me lose the 22 pounds (I feel personally that it has helped in that aspect because I started taking it around the last week of February for cystic acne and a cyst on my ovary and that's when I started doing low carb and losing weight before that was near impossible). So I researched Propranolol and Metformin and Simvastatin on various websites and askapatient.com and of all the 3 medications people had complaints about Propranolol causing weight gain and the inability to lose weight regardless of a healthy diet and regular exercise regimen. So I tried not taking it for about 3 days which was stupid because I felt dizzy but I checked my blood pressure regularly during this time and it was always in the range of 124/76 which is still high. But in those 3 days I was able to lose 2 pounds with my regular diet and exercise regimen that I describe below, but I know it's not smart to stop taking medications especially blood pressure so I put myself back on it and quickly went back up to 205 again. I'm thinking of asking my doctor to change my blood pressure medication but at 80 bucks a visit without insurance is kind of hard to afford for just a prescription on a paper and a short visit, especially since I just went 3 weeks ago for my 3 month check up and medication refills and spent 80 dollars already. But I've been thinking that maybe it isn't even the Propranolol because I was able to lose those 22 pounds while on it. Maybe it's just a common plateau? I don't know but I'm very frustrated and I feel like giving up some days and just stopping my exercise all together. But I don't. I can't let myself gain those 22 pounds again. So I'm asking for any suggestions whether it be suggestions on exercise or eating or anything to help me bust out of this weight plateau that I've been in since July. I do eat around 700-860 calories a day and I exercise for an 1 hour & 30 minutes to 2 hours 5-6 times a week. I try to switch my cardio up every week. But a typical day would be Jillian Michael's 30 day shred (30 minutes), Turbo Fire (either 30, 45, or 55 minutes), then I finish it off with 50-60 minutes of another cardio workout plus the running 3 times a week and some of the cardio has weight lifting in there. I do have a calorie counter watch and according to that I burn around 700 to 1000 calories a day. I believe that my body is in starvation mode even though I'm not starving myself. I read that the metabolism slows as you lose weight and it becomes harder to lose weight for every 10 pounds you lose. I don't know if I should up my calories to 1200 or so but I find it very hard to eat 1200 calories physically because of my band's restriction and feeling full. I'm also kind of scared to go up to 1200 calories because I think that it's gonna make me gain weight. My Menu - I do track my food in a journal. It helps me stay on track and I eat anywhere between 20 to 25 or 30 carbs a day. I don't drink sodas whether it be diet or lower calorie, I stay away from drinks that have artificial sweeteners in them as much as possible with the exception of the occasional sugar free mousse I have and the Arizona drink mix I add to my Water. And I drink about 65-70 oz. of water a day. Breakfast Carb Zero Vanilla shake 1 scoop mixed with water - 105 calories 2 scrambled eggs/no milk - 140 or 2 boiled eggs, yolkless - 37 calories 2 slices of bacon - 80 calories Nature's own double fiber bread - 50 calories Lunch 1 can of tuna - 100 calories 1 wedge of light swiss laughing cow cheese (to mix in the tuna) - 35 calories 1 tsp of brown mustard (to mix in the tuna) - 5 calories 34 Degrees Rosemary Crisp bread crackers - 6 of them, 41 calories 6 Armour pepperoni slices - 46 calories dinner Either baked fish, grilled chicken, turkey patty, or salmon patty - Around 140-160 calories 1.5 cup of salad - 30 calories Italian dressing - 1 tbsp, 40 calories Oscar meyer turkey bacon bits - 20 calories That's a typical day. Most of the time I eat boiled eggs for breakfast but do eat scrambled eggs on the weekends sometimes. I don't eat the double fiber bread everyday, and I don't eat a salad for dinner everyday. Sometimes I eat green Beans or mixed vegetables from those steamer bags. Sometimes I eat a sugar free Jello mousse for dessert. I'm not a big snacker either because I feel full after meals and that feeling lasts for good while and I've trained myself to distract myself if I do get the urge to snack on things I shouldn't. If I do get hungry I chew a sugar free gum or I drink lots of water flavored with Arizona mix that is 5 calories. I don't eat after dinner which is around 7 pm or 8 pm. On a more positive note..My A1C has dropped from 12.1 to 5.1 and my doctor lowered my Metformin dose to 500 MG/day
  20. lizonaplane

    Can We Talk About...Birth Control?

    I think the type of pill makes a big difference in weight gain. Pills that have several different levels of hormones throughout the month may be worse, and are also worse if you have migraines or PMDD. At least that was what I was told. I've been taking birth control pills continuous cycling (I don't take the sugar pills) for more than a decade so I never get my period at all because I would get terrible mood issues (I have bipolar disorder), migraines, nausea, cramps, etc when I got my period. I am so terrified of having to stop the pill for surgery. I am considering getting an IUD when I stop the pill. I'm not at risk of pregnancy because I don't have sex, but I hate having my period.
  21. Circus321

    Can We Talk About...Birth Control?

    I had an always-been-skinny friend who gained about 80lbs on the depo shot, and I’ve known of other girls who have gained a lot from it too. I’m glad it’s worked well for you but unfortunately substantial weight gain is a very common side effect with that one
  22. Vicki Loichinger

    Trying To Decide Btwn Rny And Vgs

    Deb I have had the lap band for seven years it has never helped my diabetes, I would just lose gain lose gain the same 30 pounds I am having a revision on Nov 7 to RNY, my decision is based on the diabetic factor. I am very insulin resistant I have to take massive doses of insulin which in turns causes weight gain and inflammation through out my body. I am putting all my eggs in the RNY basket. You will find a lot of info on here, just type some search words in and you will find so much info, And everyone here is so supportive, Welcome
  23. IMFine

    "normal" food intake after a fill

    I just posted on another thread, then found this one. Here's what my other post said, "I was banded on July 19, lost 15 lbs from surgery to 2 1/2 week post op. I've gained back 5 lbs! I have my first fill on August 20. I'm feeling like a failure at having gained 5 lbs. Did anyone else experience this? I eat, I don't feel full EVER...could I have already stretched my pouch? I'm just really scared and ashamed that maybe I've done something wrong." After reading what y'all have posted here, I do feel a little bit better. I still am a bit concerned that I've stretched my pouch or something--or is that normal post-op paranoia? I have no restriction, have never had a PB, eat pretty much anything I want, and honestly haven't started my exercise yet. I do get all of my Water in and most of my 70 grams of Protein. I guess I just need to knuckle down and get serious. Maybe do my Protein drinks for a few days. I'm embarrassed to think I'll go in for my first fill showing a weight GAIN! Aargh! Any ideas?
  24. catwoman7

    Question for the ladies

    screwed up menstrual cycles seem to be very common in the first few weeks or months after surgery. It's supposedly due to the fact that estrogen is stored in fat cells, and it starts flooding your body during rapid weight loss. It'll stabilize once your weight loss slows way down. a couple of people mentioned Depo-Provera. I don't know about the side effects after WLS as I didn't have WLS until I was post-menopausal, but I was on Depo when I was in my 30s. I gained about 45 lbs on it, and I switched to another birth control method after my ob/gyn couldn't guarantee that the weight gain would eventually stop. It has to do with its effect on hormones.
  25. Sojourner

    Jenny Craig & the Lapband?

    I have never looked into any of those diet programs. What I can tell you is that unhealthy carbs are major culprits in weight gain. I did not review your profile, so I am unaware of your status regarding band surgery. I have done my best to avoid processed foods in all areas of my diet since being banded. With processed foods, your observations are correct. Too much sodium and too many unhealthy carbs. There are usually many additives which one would need a degree in chemistry to understand. I prefer those chemicals to be in a science lab, and not on my plate! Best wishes...

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