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Uh.... why the EF am I having 2nd thoughts right now?! Haven't questioned this once until tonight. I discovered keto diet recently (I know... another diet) and I guess because it's something I haven't tried I'm somewhat entertaining the idea of giving it one last shot on my own. Before this liquid diet I really felt controlled by food. It's just interesting how much strength and mental focus comes from eliminating the comforts of food. Perhaps that's why I'm second guessing it. I feel very clear-headed and my desire to succeed in health is amplified. I honestly don't even know what I'm getting at here. I guess this is more of a ramble, and I really don't think I'll back out. It's just an interesting thought process I'm having at the moment.

Believe me, done that, pretty much all of it. LOL I already drink a minimum of 120 oz of water a day (it's basically all I ever drink). I follow a low carb diet so my protein is already where it needs to be. I have two Pinterest boards full of bariatric and keto recipes (I hate to cook but my husband will cook for me). The only thing is diet soda (haven't had sugary soda in over 12 years), but I already gave up caffeine about a year ago and I've cut WAY down on my soda, so it'll come in time. The dietitian I saw on the 11th said I'm her favorite patient and that there isn't much more for me to be doing except learn to eat slower (I have 3 kids, if I don't eat fast my food goes cold lol). I just feel so ready, I want the surgery now, darn it! LOL

@@sondra2368 I have never used any Keto apps, so I can't offer any recommendations beyond the ones I provided already.

There are so many Keto apps I don't know which one to download. Any advice here? Sent from my iPhone using the BariatricPal App

@@chycky I use this http://keto-calculator.ankerl.com/ to come up with my macros like I said above. Then I set my goals in the LoseIt app/website to match those macros. Like I have 100g of Protein as my minimum, 12-14% of my calories from carbs and 40-45% of my calories from fat.

@@OutsideMatchInside are you using a keto calculator app, and if so which one? Thanks for that background/lesson!

I have been low carbing off and on since 2001, so most of my experience is prior to WLS. I would say once you burn off the sugar in your body and get over the sugar withdrawals you start functioning normally. Maybe 6 weeks you notice you are firing on more than all cylinders. It is subjective and I can only go by my experience and the experience of my friends. If you read the stuff by the Bulletproof guy he swears by it, but he is also into a lot of other bio-hacking, some based in science some whacky. The difference with post-op on WLS surgery is takes you a while to be able to eat enough calories to really be clear in your mind. At least 800 calories daily for me, to fuel working and just regular activities. When my calories were below that I was fatigued a lot. I don't have celiac and I don't have a gluten allergy and most people that claim to have gluten allergies have never been tested. I mean think about it, if people were allergic to gluten, most of the population would be sick, it doesn't make sense. Most people are reacting to too much sugar. I don't tolerate sugar more specifically HFCS. HFCS makes me sick. It is too much sugar too fast and it floods your system. People say sugar is sugar and that is kind of true, but how different sugars react in your body is very different. I try to stay at 25 net carbs per day and no more than 75 on a carb day. I only count net carbs because I really need my Fiber and net carbs makes the most sense. Really with just eating meat and veggies, it is pretty hard to break even into 25 carbs. I really have no idea how people end up eating so many carbs. I had ribs yesterday so today I am just eating fish and a lot of veggies so I will post later what my carb count is with all the veggies I eat. If people are seriously just eating meat and green veggies is impossible to have a high carb count, counting net carbs or actual carbs. I think if you seriously low carb for a long period like WLS patients should be doing you are going to have to carb cycle some, or your body just gets used to it and nothing happens. I am still experimenting with this. This day is bad because I had a Fit Crunch Bar I have one day a week that I usually have carbs, I had to add some carb cycling because I was stalling a lot. Saturday I had fish tacos and pizza all day and it was pretty glorious. This is the nutrient break out for that day. This is a high carb day for me and my net carbs are 32.5. I also went to Starbucks in the afternoon and had a Trenta Cold Brew, but I always order it black and add my own half and half. This is a day I didn't really feel like eating much /r/keto has been a really big help to me. I can't eat the fat they eat, but there are lots of good tips there. I use the Keto Calculator to calculate my macros to set in LoseIt. It is awesome because well most people can't handle the huge fat deficits that we can, they would be too hungry, but WLS patients can go on and take the max fat deficit. The weight loss forecast it comes up with there is also really helpful. It tells you at the points you have to increase your calories. I want to add that I am not just coming up with how and what I eat on my own with stuff I have found on the internet. Things I have researched have lead me in this direction but I also am in contact with two University Professors. My biggest issue right now is I don't eat enough calories for my RMR or my activity level. It is pretty hard to up my calories but I am trying to slowly. I don't have a diminished metabolism at all and I want to keep it that way. The best way to do that is to keep adjusting your calories higher as you lose. Leaving them low for a long period, lowers your metabolism.

@@OutsideMatchInside how long did it take you to first notice your mind was sharper from low carbing? I've heard this from other people as well and it fascinates me. And were you ever tested for celiac? One more: what is your threshold for low carb? On the Reddit keto board people say under 50-60 grams, some need to go much lower to notice the positive effects. I'm curious for a WLS perspective to that question.

@@Djmohr Your post really highlights a lot of my feelings about surgery. I had a friend that had open bypass back when that was the thing. They followed no post-op instructions, even up on a feeding tube at 26. That person never saw 35. I knew was doing the wrong thing, but I didn't know to what extent. It scared me. I thought, wow I can never have surgery the risks are too high. I had another friend that had surgery more recently, bypass. They never changed their eating. They never cooked, post-op they were on that Wendy's Chili (which is why it drives me insane that people eat it), keeping the fast food eating out mentality going. They still ate out and ordered the same types of foods, still had sugar all the time (there goes that dumping safety net theory). At that time I was trying to lose weight on my own following a WLS post-op diet, without having surgery. It was pure hell, normal people can't eat those quantities, but I was getting desperate. I eventually just went back to low carbing keto. This person never adopted a healthy lifestyle and just dieted after surgery using some diet plan created by their trainer. Now almost 4 years post-op, they have regained, after never meeting or getting anywhere close to goal, although they did lose over 100 pounds originally. They can't lose now, because they having too many issues making real changes. They never cooked, never learned about nutrition. Like when they aren't eating properly, they don't log it. The days you are eating off plan are the days to really log so you can see in print what you are doing and learn from it. Now they are at then end of the line with no options. RNY is it, there really is no revision from that and if you didn't learn to eat right when it was easy in the honeymoon period, you are screwed. Now you have to struggle like everyone else with very little support from your tool to help you. There is no malabsorption at this point to fall back on. The initial tightness of the pouch is gone since pouches stretch. So it drives me crazy to see so many people wasting their opportunity, because you can't get this time back. I need to learn to care a little less though, because I really need the support of being involved in a bariatric community to keep my focus.

@@kari91 i feel like it's impossible to go back to my old habits. i cannot eat carbs comfortably and that was always my weakness so keeping it keto is super easy for me. i haven't even worked out in a month and i've lost like 4lbs becuz my diet is still good. now do i need to work out? yes. i need to get my ass moving but diet is 80%! you can do it!

@@doppelganger This is one of the harder topics here because in theory everyone should follow their doctors orders, but like you said some doctors seem to cling to old ideals. I think a lot of plans are made in a way to try and break people of bad habits. Personally I have never been a snacker, I got fat eating 1 or 2 massive meals a day. So eating several time a day is a huge change for me from the past. It prevents over eating and keeps me satisfied all day. I often wonder if the people that come up with these plans understand math. A person would have to consume 20 grams of Protein per meal to get the bare minimum amount of protein a human needs to exist just eating 3 times a day. That is basically impossible to do just with food in 20-30 minutes until about 6 months, longer for some people. I have 5 -6 small meals a day now because I need more calories to keep losing weight. I had 4 meals early on, eating 100 to 200 calories per meal. You have to do what works for you in the end. My program was pretty open, protein first, avoid the usual carbs, and once I was mostly healed I just went back to eating Keto. Good luck.

@@Vsg_lma @@AvalonNeeCee @@jas84047 @@rainnie1976 @@nads64 @@Heatherrc1 @@Cubancountrygirl @@thinner-me @@bnm4 @@faithful @@rainnie1976 @@nevadapinkprincess @@LauriTX75 @@wheezysmom @@lorilove @@ExcitedButNervous @@Jessicacherry3 @Nurse52 @@jjbowersock @@mgilleo @@lorilove @@Vsg_lma @@mataz78 @@evett @@laceygorrell @@Tricebhasstyle @@AYRW71 @Mention @@nataliearias @@Remix @@Bullydog Mom @@MaryPh @@marypups @@oceanlover I tried to tag everyone but I only made it to page 16 before I got bored. Anyway, some of us are hitting one year today, and some later in the month like myself. How is everyone doing? At goal? Still working towards goal? Are you exercising? Have you switched to any diets like vegetarian, vegan, Keto, Or Paleo? How happy are you with your sleeve? How has your life changed?

@Jess- we are in the same boat from a decision making stand point. I was weight stable for about 2 years and then over the holidays, I gained a few lbs and was 9 lbs (144) above my lowest weight of 135. I decided this summer to take the extra fluff off and a few more. I am currently around 133. I appreciate your sensitivity to Bella and like you, my current WL is 100% vanity, I have no "need" to lose weight. Here's my point on body composition. All WL is not created equal. I don't just want to eat at a deficit, I want to eat at a deficit that will allow me to lose fat and maintain muscle. That is why I am doing a modified Keto- I am trying to spare muscle while losing fat. I don't want to cut calories so low that I cannibalize muscle. Like you, I always have made sure to get my protein in but at least for me, a lot of my recent fluff is from letting too many naughty carbs creep in (cucumber and celery did not do this to me!). So my question to you is, is that 10-15 lb gain, fat or muscle? If like me, you suspect it's mostly fat (and water), then I suggested Keto to go into a "burn body fat for fuel" mode. With this approach, I have also temporarily cut back on my workouts again to spare muscle. If you try Keto, then based on your macros from yesterday, you need to up your fats. Even if you don't want to go Keto, most active women need more than 25 grams of fat for hormonal balance (if yesterday was a fast day, then a day or two of really low fat is no biggie). My ratio has been 1:1 (fat:pro&carbs) daily macro breakdown has been 50% fat, 35% protein, and 15% carbs (by way of comparison, traditional Keto is 3:1 or even 4:1, modified is 2:1 or 1:1). I'm averaging 1300 cals a day. For sanity, I have taken 1 mini diet break (Fri-Sun) where I exceeded my carbs, which gave me some extra energy to workout over the weekend. I am hoping to maximize these last 4 weeks to get down to 130 before I reverse out of this diet- gradually upping my carbs and bringing down my fats along with increasing my activity level. I will gain a few pounds on the scale as my glycogen stores are replenished but I should have re-comped my body to an overall lower body fat level. In your case, I am surmising you would be back to your 17%. Sorry to take your thread totally off topic, 5:2 works well for many people (talking about you @Feedyoureyes, Georgia, Daisy, etc.). I however cannot handle perceived deprivation- seriously, I would count down the minutes and obsess over what time I could eat again!

So I'm pretty much at my goal weight and, as most of us are… I'm saggy. So now I want to build some muscle and lift weights more intensely but my trainer says I have to eat carbs. Carbs build muscle. My problem is I've taken three weeks off from working out basically just to let my body settle after 85 pounds and my mind and now I have very little motivation so if I eat carbs in the morning and then I don't work out do the carbs turn to fat? I think carbs will turn into one of two things fat or muscle. Is there a way to eat carbs right before I work out so I know they're going to the right place? I don't know. I'm afraid to eat carbs after 10 months almost of no sugar no carbs I'm very adept at the keto thing and it's easy for me. Any help is appreciated

Ann- Old vet threads have a ton of links. Jess- I think 5:2 or similar is great. Just wanted to suggest Keto as an option as well. Low carb, moderate fat is working for me currently. I'm certain the first 5 lbs were water but I am now at a new low weight at almost 3.5 years out. Lastly, since your 4s still fit, you may want to focus on recomposition- a diet specific to leaning out and add resistance training to your exercise. I plan on reversing out of my current diet at the end of next month to focus on recomposition, specifically to add muscle.

Hey everyone - it's been crazy busy here, so I've been off this site for a bit. I'm glad you're having a run of on-plan days @s_suther ! Good going!! Since you asked -- Honestly, I'd think about doubling that Protein (given how your body has adjusted to losing and depending on that protein, it seems unlikely your're converting it to sugar - but I'm no nutritionist!). If so, try to spread it out through the day. It looks like that's not much to run on. (I like adding chocolate Protein powder to nonfat Greek yogurt, sometimes with a bit of SF caramel flavor--it's wonderful! I also like deli sliced Boars' Head Golden chicken as a go-to protein snack with almost no fat or carbs, and since it's moister than turkey it goes down better for me.) My calories are about the same as before, but my nut/trainer is upping carbs slowly as long as I'm still losing. I do 75 carbs, 58 fat, 170 protein and calories end up between 1450 and 1540 most days. A few more carbs might make you feel a little better energy-wise or satiety-wise, but if you're staying keto that may not work. One thing I'd definately say helps is staying very close to the same macros every day. I tried doing that "Staying under X gms" idea, and the fluctuations in carbs caused my body to hold onto fat because it couldn't trust I'd consistently give it all the food it needed as fuel. Maybe try staying right on your 45 g carb goal? I lost a few pounds this month, which is good since a had a week were I had to do dinner meetings four in a row! About killed me, and even though I was careful and planned ahead, and restaurants were nice to tell me portion size, etc., how they cook it varies enough that I know i was way off. Anyway, I popped up to 174, and now am back to 171, so pleased at that today. I've been working my way back down from a vacation gain last year when I just ate whatever junk I wanted for too long (SO not worth it!). I"m still 3 pounds away from being back to my lowest last summer, but I did my measurements today, and they're way better than back then--Hooray! More muscle and less fat. My waist and hips are the biggest areas of loss, which is just fine with me. Good luck breaking your stall, @thecamiraye and glad you're 'accountability-ing' with us. Nice job breaking YOUR stall, @RockinRobin59 ! Funny how our bodies sometimes respond, eh? Hope everyone's doing well this Monday morning. Good to be back on! Kate

Went on a trip with a friend and I actually felt kind of skinny most of the time. I did put on a bathing suit but I never took off the shorts. I've taken about three weeks off from working out. now I have started eating the carbs to lift weights and gain muscle. It is very hard to eat carbs after being low carb/keto for the last nine months. I've only worked out one time since starting carbs SMH. Having a really hard time getting going again

You could probably find a doctor in Mexico. At a 27 bmi, it doesn't seem like a good option for you. Have you tried keto?

I am currently on a 9 week cut. I'm down about 7 lbs with 3-5 more to go. I have been cutting on a lower carb diet. Macros are a very loose Keto with 50% fat, 30% protein and 20% carbs. My cut ends at the end of July at which time I want to have a planned refeed day and then slowly start reversing out for 8 weeks. Has anyone done a refeed? What did you do? Can anyone give advice on the best way to reverse? How much do I increase carbs and lower fats and at what rate? My hope is to begin a lean bulk after reversing out of the cut.

I feel like I am constantly working to maintain my weight loss. I am an avid runner but even that doesn't prevent me from gaining if I get off track. I stick to a keto diet most of the time as that seems to be the most effective way at maintaining. To the original poster - A few years pre-op, I went through this weird stage where I could not lose weight no matter what I did. I tracked every bite and I exercised but my weight loss was very slow to non-existent. I went to the doctor and had tests ran, I could just feel that something wasn't right. Things that worked previously just didn't work for me. All the tests came back fine and though I didn't want anything to be wrong with me, I was so disappointed that I couldn't figure out what was wrong. Needless to say, I got frustrated and gave up and gained quite a bit of weight. Probably a year later, I could tell that things were back to normal and I was able to lose weight again. I never did figure out what was wrong but I can say that I worked harder those 6 months to lose 5 pounds than I did to lose 100+ pounds after surgery. You may not figure out what's wrong but I hope like in my case, your body gets back to normal.

The OP stated that she does not overeat, that she doesn't eat 1000 calories a day, but chooses the wrong foods to eat (junk food, fried food, pizza, etc.). Just wanted to clarify that. Also, there are many reasons people cannot lose weight. I was one of them. I am diabetic, and severely insulin resistant. This surgery helped to reset my body and my blood sugar is coming down nicely. Yes, I'm still using insulin, but not nearly as much as I was. Hopefully as more weight comes off, the need for the insulin will continue to decrease and eventually I can be without it. I ate keto for a few years, exercised until I continually kept hurting myself, and didn't lose any weight. However, my blood sugar did respond for a bit, but then it just kept going higher and higher. I cannot afford for damage to occur to my organs, so I finally saw WLS as my last option. Now I wish I would have done it years ago. I do have metabolic syndrome, and you can do everything right and still not lose weight. Then it is just frustrating and depressing, to say the least.

It looks like there have been a lot of ppl who don't read. I eat 1000 calories or less and weigh 280. I was bulimic for years. I got the band and list then regained even though I was under 1000 caliries a day. I'm considering the surgery because the doctor says it changes your body's set point. My fear isn't that I won't lose, but that once again I'll regain because my body really wants to stick at this weight. I eat a whole foods diet, not a SAD. I do keto. I just don't lose. Sent from my SM-G935P using the BariatricPal App With a condition as unusual/clearly medical/atypical as yours, a public WLS forum where most of us got fat from overeating junk is probably not going to get you the responses you need and desire. Definitely come here for support and love as you go through the process, but as far as factual scientific advice? Your situation is so far out there in the atypical range, I'm sure there are very few here that are qualified to answer. Best to you!! I'm sure with your desire to succeed, you can make it happen. I wasn't the OP. I was just letting her know she's not alone and that there are said to be benefits for those who are not eating 2 meals at McDonalds for dinner and still unable to lose weight. However, I'm not really sure where else one would look if they were in my situation and looking for answers. I can't possibly be the only one in my situation. And doctors assume I'm showing them my food diary that shows whole foods and then running thru to get a milkshake. No one believes me. I don't care and im not offended. But when I do start a thread with questions it's because of can't possibly be the only one in my situation and I need help too. As far as the doctors are concerned there is no reason and I just need to exercise harder. I did that. 2 hours a day. Where else can I turn? Like I said I wasn't asking questions originally, but where else would I go? Sent from my SM-G935P using the BariatricPal AppY You and the OP are absolutely warranted by coming here and asking your questions as well as sharing your experiences. Sometimes, just saying how you feel and having someone who will listen with concern is all that is needed to help get over a "bump in the road". We are not experts here, but we should always be willing to listen to a member who is "struggling"--physically and/or mentally. Most members on this site are great listeners. We can give no medical advice. We can "round table" ideas and can "suggest" based on our own personal WLS journeys. I hope that is enough. You would be surprised how much more I've learned from social media Than my doctors. I've taken many requests to my doctor for tests and have found answers (not weight problems but other problems), so yes that is enough! I just find it frustrating that people think that just because they can't control what they eat that no one can. That's not my problem. But WLS helps with more than control issues for many. I hope that's the same with me. Sent from my SM-G935P using the BariatricPal App

It looks like there have been a lot of ppl who don't read. I eat 1000 calories or less and weigh 280. I was bulimic for years. I got the band and list then regained even though I was under 1000 caliries a day. I'm considering the surgery because the doctor says it changes your body's set point. My fear isn't that I won't lose, but that once again I'll regain because my body really wants to stick at this weight. I eat a whole foods diet, not a SAD. I do keto. I just don't lose. Sent from my SM-G935P using the BariatricPal App One thing I learned through this process is that my obesity is at least partly due to under eating as much as to overeating. Overeating is my bodies response to under eating (skipping meals, restricting, etc.). One of the biggest gifts of this program for me so far is a deeper understanding of nutrition and what my body really needs. Eating under 1000 calories in a day is no longer an option for me. Of I go over 1000, even on slow small increments, I gain. Ive been on many diets with many "coaches". I've been through different nutrition classes while in training for holistic health, while in college, and with docs. I understand the metabolic system. My doctor recently ran labs and told me how surprised she was to see sugars, and everything else perfect. I realize that for most people 1000 is not enough. I apparently have a really efficient metabolism. It doesn't take much to make me go. Sent from my SM-G935P using the BariatricPal App What is your resting metabolic rate? Have you ever had it tested?

It looks like there have been a lot of ppl who don't read. I eat 1000 calories or less and weigh 280. I was bulimic for years. I got the band and list then regained even though I was under 1000 caliries a day. I'm considering the surgery because the doctor says it changes your body's set point. My fear isn't that I won't lose, but that once again I'll regain because my body really wants to stick at this weight. I eat a whole foods diet, not a SAD. I do keto. I just don't lose. Sent from my SM-G935P using the BariatricPal App With a condition as unusual/clearly medical/atypical as yours, a public WLS forum where most of us got fat from overeating junk is probably not going to get you the responses you need and desire. Definitely come here for support and love as you go through the process, but as far as factual scientific advice? Your situation is so far out there in the atypical range, I'm sure there are very few here that are qualified to answer. Best to you!! I'm sure with your desire to succeed, you can make it happen. I wasn't the OP. I was just letting her know she's not alone and that there are said to be benefits for those who are not eating 2 meals at McDonalds for dinner and still unable to lose weight. However, I'm not really sure where else one would look if they were in my situation and looking for answers. I can't possibly be the only one in my situation. And doctors assume I'm showing them my food diary that shows whole foods and then running thru to get a milkshake. No one believes me. I don't care and im not offended. But when I do start a thread with questions it's because of can't possibly be the only one in my situation and I need help too. As far as the doctors are concerned there is no reason and I just need to exercise harder. I did that. 2 hours a day. Where else can I turn? Like I said I wasn't asking questions originally, but where else would I go? Sent from my SM-G935P using the BariatricPal AppY You and the OP are absolutely warranted by coming here and asking your questions as well as sharing your experiences. Sometimes, just saying how you feel and having someone who will listen with concern is all that is needed to help get over a "bump in the road". We are not experts here, but we should always be willing to listen to a member who is "struggling"--physically and/or mentally. Most members on this site are great listeners. We can give no medical advice. We can "round table" ideas and can "suggest" based on our own personal WLS journeys. I hope that is enough.

It looks like there have been a lot of ppl who don't read. I eat 1000 calories or less and weigh 280. I was bulimic for years. I got the band and list then regained even though I was under 1000 caliries a day. I'm considering the surgery because the doctor says it changes your body's set point. My fear isn't that I won't lose, but that once again I'll regain because my body really wants to stick at this weight. I eat a whole foods diet, not a SAD. I do keto. I just don't lose. Sent from my SM-G935P using the BariatricPal App One thing I learned through this process is that my obesity is at least partly due to under eating as much as to overeating. Overeating is my bodies response to under eating (skipping meals, restricting, etc.). One of the biggest gifts of this program for me so far is a deeper understanding of nutrition and what my body really needs. Eating under 1000 calories in a day is no longer an option for me. Of I go over 1000, even on slow small increments, I gain. Ive been on many diets with many "coaches". I've been through different nutrition classes while in training for holistic health, while in college, and with docs. I understand the metabolic system. My doctor recently ran labs and told me how surprised she was to see sugars, and everything else perfect. I realize that for most people 1000 is not enough. I apparently have a really efficient metabolism. It doesn't take much to make me go. Sent from my SM-G935P using the BariatricPal App