BJean

...milk....nose....spurt...!!! ROFLMAO All points well taken, kartman! That kind of behavior is human sexual behavior - not exclusively male behavior or behavior committed by only one political party. It is human behavior that people in many countries do not flip out about. In many places it is behavior that although it is certainly given some boundaries, it is generally expected and accepted. It is for these reasons that many Democrats did not feel that it was in the best interests of the country for the Republican dominated Congress to hound Bill Clinton from the moment he ran for president until the moment they caught him with his pants down in the oval office. The Republicans do not play fair when it comes to this topic. But no one said that politics is fair, eh? So now they must reap what they sow.

Kartman I enjoyed your post. I think that the hypocrisy that so many of these public men show who preach personal morality from their high posts, is deplorable. They allow themselves to commit the bad moral behavior that they angrily condemn others for. That's why right now I believe we're hearing so much outrage toward them in the media.

Thousands of men in the highest and most powerful offices in this country have affairs. That obviously does not make them unqualified to do their jobs. They may not be men that you'd like to invite over for dinner or to be a role model for your children, but they can do their jobs well and sometimes in a very stellar way. In this country, we verbally place such a high importance on sexual morals, it has made even the shortest and most inconsequential affair take on great value and it creates a potential for blackmail. I am reminded of the old school communist threat: take advantage of a person who is powerful and who can be blackmailed so that it compromises their choices and their ability to do their job. Make them spy for you. In more recent history - post cold war - greed has become the most prominent problem with blackmailing or luring powerful people into committing acts that are contrary to our national interests or the best interests of their company. Best case scenario, every man and woman would stay true to his spouse. There would be no divorces that harm American families and mostly our children. But alas, that's just not ever going to be in the cards. The best we can hope for is that people don't become obsessed like some of the men whose activities have been brought out in the open lately. Elliot Spitzer's addicition to hookers, for instance, and Sanford's obsession with this Argentinean woman to such an extent that he left the country without making sure that his serious obligations were taken care of. Love and sexual urges are some of the most powerful of our natural instincts - and for some people power is a strong aphrodisiac. Combine the two and you can understand why people (not just men) go astray. However, contrary to what some of you believe, these can be forgivable transgressions. People are weak, people sin. If they are good people, and it can happen to good people, they can atone for their sins and be forgiven; forgiven by their families who love them, forgiven by God who loves them. We should be concerned with the basic morality of the person. I don't think we can legislate morality, I don't think it is any of our business who people choose to sleep with or how they conduct their marriages. But I do think that basic moral values are important because of the honest ability of a person to do his job without committing a crime. I have a problem with any behavior that compromises one's job, particularly if it is a elected job. And anytime, ANYTIME, anyone uses resources that do not belong to them for personal gain, such as enabling them to carry on an affair, then it is wrong and they have to reimburse the company, or the government, as the case may be and that should be followed up with putting them on some kind of probatation or depending on the circumstances, fired from the job. I am of the opinion that no one, and I mean no one, should steal so much as a stamp from their comapny to be used for personal business . We seem to be so obsessed with the sexual behavior of people in the public eye, we've forgotten about the morality of being an honest and loyal employee. Most people would think nothing of stealing a stamp or an envelope from their employer. But people are outraged if their think that one employee might be sleeping with another. I am outraged if I learn of any employee stealing anything on the job, be it an envelope or a hundred bucks out of petty cash. Oh I know, you'll say that there's a big difference between taking an envelope and taking a hundred bucks out of petty cash, but I say that people can justify anything and if you can justify taking a few small material things from your employer, it isn't too much of a stretch that given the right opportunity, you would take the petty cash or milions. What Spitzer and Sanford and many many others have shown us is that they can justfiy their felonious behavior. I think their over-blown egos and their need to have affairs with other women is a weakness and it might compromise their ability to do their job, but it only is against the law if they used public funds or the power of their office in the commission of their dirty deeds. Let's face it, it isn't agains public law to have sexual encounters outside your marriage, but Bernie Maddoff is going down the river for a very, very long time.

Too dumb to take advantage of the spotlight being diverted, I guess. Like I said, with him it's all about HIM.

LMAO - as milk almost shoots out my nose.

EbonyRose, I am curious. You feel that people with the band have less tendancy to rebound after the initial weight loss than people with gastric bypass? The reason I ask is because although I have seen lots of people with gastric bypass lose tons of weight very quickly, and they often regain some of the lost weight, they eventually stabilize at a reasonable weight - not too skinny but not morbidly obese either. With the band, I've noticed that some people lose an initial 30 to 50 lbs. and just can't get much more off. I have also seen lots of people that it has worked really well for, but it hasn't been my experience and I've noticed quite a few others in my doctor's practice and here on LBT, who aren't having the amazing success that some have.

Don't you think that's the mindset of most people about WLS? I mean before they get it, of course. Afterwards reality sets in and you learn that the difficulty of changing your eating habits is still there. She has made the same assumption that many people do. I can't say that I blame her. Frankly I empathize with her about not being able to keep her weight off. I'm no huge Oprah fan, but I'm always surprised at how vehemently negative some people feel about her. Maybe she just is one of those people who is able to capture the emotions of others really well and that partially accounts for her enormous success. She may have it wrong about WLS, but she sure has been able to get a whole lot of things right as far as her business is concerned.

Devana, it's good to hear from you! I know exactly what you mean about your feelings for green. She was really special. I gotta tell you that I miss reading your posts too. Hope you're doing fine.

That's right - this is the USA and we can say what we believe unlike Iran today! And LBT is a specific place where we are free to express our opinions. And that's a very good thing! You're cool. You should jump in and post more often.

I'm an older bandster and I remember when Elvis died. He had lots of problems, but no one could argue the fact that the man had talent. We were shocked and I remember exactly where I was when I heard the news. He was to us, what Michael Jackson was to many of you younger bandsters. His music represented our childhood and all of the fun memories we had growing up and listening to his songs. When the "Thriller" video came out, we had small kids and we bought it as soon as it hit the stores. We played it during the half time of the Super Bowl that year, during our Super Bowl party. We had a big screen TV (one of the first versions) and everybody jumped up in our great room and tried to dance the dance. That John Landis directed video is a masterpiece and it goes down in history as changing the way music was produced and videos were made. It epitomizes the standard by which we enjoy music and dancing today.

ChanginMyStars, I agree that the sleeve looks scary. It is one of those irreversible ways to solve the problem. I haven't given up on the band yet, but I am discouraged. I just got another fill and hopefully, between that and my getting my head screwed on better, I will prevail.

Indiogirl, that was very kind of you and I really appreciate it. Sometimes I think I'm losing it when I get the kind of backlash that Beth posted. I know that my posts can sound harsh - and I do not mean for them to. But I do have strong opinions and I guess that can certainly rub folks the wrong way. I'm with you and Rodney King - we really need to try anyway, eh? (I've adopted Green's use of "eh" which is very Canadian - I think of her everytime I use it.)

I just went back and re-read Cleo's post and mine and I have a strong feeling that your problem isn't so much that you thought I was attacking you, it is that you have no good argument for a rebuttal to anything she said. Whatever. I really would like to get along with you, but I sure can't manage it all on my own.

Okeee, you're out. I did not goad anyone. I opened a thread. Anyone was welcome to participate or not. Fact of the matter is that when I was speaking to Cleo's Mom, I was referring to previous threads not this one. You remember, the ones where the bunch of you ganged up on little ole' me. We don't agree politically and nothing is going to change that. Thinking that we could learn to respect one another in spite of our differences just doesn't seem to be in the cards, does it. I hate that, but if I can't post my thoughts without you deciding I'm insulting you personally, it ain't never gonna happen. Ciao, baby.

Cleo's Mom, I have been biting my tongue to keep from saying what you posted. I'm glad that it was you. I get tired of being ennundated with negative hateful posts when I tell it like it really is. It's like some of the folks here are living on a different planet from me. I appreciate what you posted very much because it is the darned truth! And the swallows have come home to roost with the Republicans and it is about time!

And the ones who are "born again" will rise up and leave the rest of us behind to be smitten, er smoted, er smited. :thumbdown:

Man, don't you know that Sanford is thrilled that Farrah and MJ died right when his stuff was heating up! His story died on the vine.

Sew. Buttons. I'm surprised that you would question that I was just making an attempt at humor. You didn't really buy into the fact that I'm basically a nice person, eh? Your bad. I really am. Aren't you?

I was merely trying to be humorous. Far be it from me to actually jab a person. :thumbup: Especially a person with whom I share a peace treaty. Uh oh, did we forget to smoke the pipe?

As it is I guess I'm only depressed part of the time. lol

Negative Nelly. If I felt that way about the world I would be seriously depressed all the time.

Are you just making a random comment patty or are you misunderstanding my post and trying to correct me?

I've heard shrinks say that when a person has an affair they are completely self-possessed and not thinking about others. His performance at his news conference was really all about him, even when he was saying he owed his wife and boys an apology. It was actually all about him and how it was making him feel. If he were really concerned about them, he would not have chosen to stand up and say the things he did. I am sure that the reason he did is because he knew the emails were about to surface. But seeing an email and hearing your own dad say it outloud in front of millions of people are two different things. Beth you've put your own spin on what I said. Democrats can't be lumped into a clump of folks who lie about affairs or even have them. The only lumping I did was to point out that some of the people who have been the most vocal about embracing family values and having high standards of morality are the ones who have been caught lately making themselves public liars. We all know that Bill Clinton lied. Now we know Sanford did. But please don't paint all Democrats with that brush and I won't paint all Republicans with the brush of hypocrisy.

It really helps to be able to read and post about this with the people who also enjoyed knowing Green. I too have been surprised at how close I feel to some of the people at LBT! I guess it explains why I come here every day. Thank you on behalf of Green's family for all your wonderful comments. What a nice tribute to such a very special person.

Well that's funny because I guess you're saying that because some of the neo-cons got caught and didn't lie about it, it's okay. Is that right? That assumption is no different than you saying that Democrats aren't all about family values and high morals. Okay yeah. Dems are all about devil worship and sinning and immorality. That's what's do funny about the right wing. They believe that if you don't preach, you don't believe. And if you don't preach, you are probably out fornicating. And if you don't pass judgment on others, you must have inferior morals. That's the hyprocrisy of the whole thing that makes people get all upset with them. I can't lump Dems all in the same boat, nor can I lump all Republicans in the same boat. But it's the extremists who want to run the Republican party that are causing the uproar. They're the ones who keep getting caught with their pants down. And by golly, they deserve to be raked over the coals for being such hypocrites.