BJean

Whoo baby, intellect is as intellect does. You need to bring back your sense of humor. I liked you better when you weren't so defensive.

Hey AM, I'm not whining, I'm bitching. And I didn't actually observe, on this thread, that you were taking up for the righties. That doesn't mean you haven't done it on other threads - where you did in fact, do it to me and in favor of a right winger that you obviously, by the arguments you make, support. And you're the one who's whining. I do not have to back up anything. I can say whatever I wish, within reason. You can believe me or not - your perrogative. You, as a mod, should be careful about unfairly singling out someone for getting personal by getting personal. Geez, this is fun.

btreiger you're way off base in your sweeping generalizations of liberals. Yes, there are certain things that liberals believe in and want. But you're accusing them of the most odd-ball stuff you can imagine. I'm with CsM, you've been reading the Limbaugh playbook too long and you must be drinking the kool-aide.

patty I understand the stats for home schooled children as compared to public and private schooled children. And you're boasting because...??? What I want for our children and this country are superior educations and learning experiences for all of our kids. Just because home schooled children do better than other children on tests, does not give us the whole picture nor does it in anyway mean that the home schooled children are getting the kind of education that I would like to see that all American children get.

I'm accused of not being able to admit that Congress had a role in Iraq, which is flat out not true. The right leaning folks don't seem to be able to come to grips with what really went down in the Bush administration that caused Congress, including most Democrats, to follow him like sheep to the slaughter. You've done a good job, Cleo's, of telling it like it was. Then there are the ones who can't understand why we keep bringing this up. Well that's pretty amazing considering it cost so many lives and has had such a negative impact on our nation - which is what they seem to be trying to blame the current administration for when they comment on this president's leadership role. Those who ignore the past are doomed to repeat it. I am not sure that anyone has come up with a clever saying for those who re-write the past. And plain, I know you can take a joke. Of course you may have figured out that I'm only half kidding.

Not an opinion, an observation. You're often repremanding folks for getting too personal. But you don't mind getting personal (and rude) with me. I don't mind getting personal when people are stating personal opinions, and you don't seem to if you disagree with someone. But if you like them, you expect everyone else to back off. Ass-munch.

plain you're an ass.

Don't be silly! Of course I know that most of Congress voted to fund the war in Iraq and they voted to give Bush the authority to make the decision of whether to bomb Iraq. That takes no convincing - it's fact. But what you don't seem to acknowledge is that Bush and Cheney and their cronies fudged the truth, they manipulated the facts and it is and was their war due to their decisions and their behavior. Interestingly, the one bright spot in the whole mess is that Senator Obama did not fall for the Bush administration's insistence that it was the right thing to do and he did not vote for it. It is also one reason that I decided to vote for candidate Obama.

Interesting that you have such inexpensive insurance, tdfsl1, I'm envious. You wouldn't believe what we pay for insurance that isn't accepted by most GPs in our area. And although we provide insurance for our company employees (which btw is better than what we have), they won't insure us because my husband and I have "preexisting" conditions, i.e., we've both had major surgery. For us, this system well and truly sucks and we HAVE insurance.

patty it's your approach to public schooling that had led to the apathy and resentment that we've allowed to permeate our schools. There is no reason why we can't have the best schools in the world and thereby create the best educated chidren in the world. We just don't want to have it. We'd rather isolate ourselves and our children and get mediocre results.

Michelle - so your dad owns a huge corporation? His company has enjoyed the incentives and tax breaks that the major oil companies, drug companies, chemical companies, etc., have been given? If he does own one of those companies, which I sincerely doubt, then you should be smart enough to just sit back and enjoy the obscene profits he's been enjoying for the past 10 years or so. No? He doesn't own a huge congolomerate? Then what qualifies you to speak for those corporations? Small companies and individuals are the ones who have suffered from the incentives and breaks that we're talkikng about. Having the incentives and breaks that have been unfairly afforded to corporate America taken away will only help you and your dad, not make you pay more. Nobody wants small businesses and individuals to suffer more than they already have by having to take up the slack for the huge money-makers in America. And if you don't want to call it Bush's war, to whom do you wish to give all the credit? Dick Cheney? Well, yeah I agree it's Cheney's war too. They're the ones who pushed the envelope and lied and led the Congress and America down a merry path to death and destruction in Iraq. It's the truth and my dear, and the Republicans must live with it.

Furthermore, I challenge any of you to purchase new insurance when you turn 65. If you've never had surgery or any kind of hospitalization or haven't been treated for diabetes, hypertension or high colesterol, or other ongoing medical conditions, then maybe you would be able to not only be accepted for a good insurance plan but you might even possibly be able to afford it. Otherwise, you'd thank your lucky stars for medicare. Of course the doctors are beginning to refuse to accept you as a patient if you're on medicare unless you have very specific back up insurance. So just having medicare isn't enough to get you medical care and medications from many doctors these days. The quality of health care in America is just wonderful if you are wealthy. If you aren't, the best medical care and the best medications are just not affordable. That's why so many people have lost their quality of life trying to pay for it when something happens that requires more than just basic medical care. And just because some of you are happy with your insurance doesn't mean that we have the best healthcare system in the world. We may have the best quality of treatments and medications in the world, but we sure don't have the best system for Americans to obtain our top-notch quality health care. Fixing the system we have should be of the highest priority right now. Those of you who are fighting it are out of touch with most peoples' reality. As for education, it too has tumbled into the crapper from the greed-driven way of life we've all been chasing. Inferior public schools haven't come about over a short period of time. It's come from major, major cutbacks and presidents and congress being satisfied with American children getting a little lost in the shuffle. Throwing money at it won't necessarily solve the problems we have in public schools, but jerking our children out and home schooling them and having rich folks refusing to send their children to public schools is adding to the problem. We need a public initiative to make our public schools a wonderful learning experience for our children. People seem to have forgotten that our children are our future. Turning over the running of our corporations and our country to ill-equipped young adults is, right now, a frightening thought.

Heck yeah, Cleo's Mom! And the number of BILLIONAIRES has increased by massive amounts under the Bush reign of terror. And that is due, at least in part, to cutting out the workers whenever possible, making their employees take salary cuts, decrease in goods and services and in the case of the insurance conglomerates, denying coverage and increasing premiums. These things are why the economy nearly collapsed and why most Americans are not enjoying the fruits of the Bush legacy. And why the Democrats are having to do the unpopular thing - bite the bullet and help right the sinking ship.

Michelle, so you don't make corporations pay their fare share and that's beneficial to whom? Do you think that for one minute that all the incentives and tax breaks that have been given to corporations has been passed on to consumers? Quite the opposite is true. So your theory just doesn't hold water.

Yeah patty, President Obama single-handedly wrote the bill and HATES marriage!! And I have an ocean front lot in Arizona I'd like to sell you. I do really, really appreciate you posting your sources though.

You didn't answer any of my questions. You have no credibility. You have a lot of gall making the assumptions that you make and using such extremely biased sources. Gall. The extremists invented it. In the dictionary by the word "gall" is a picture of Rush Limbaugh.

Cleo's: "Reagan's solution was to convince corporate america that they could make more profits by reducing their workforce and getting more work out of fewer people. And middle america lost jobs and wages and hasn't been able to catch up yet. " And Americans won't get back to work unless there are incentives put in place with corporate America and a new direction for the country that includes creation of jobs. Corporate America has been incentivized, as Cleo'smom said, to eliminate jobs. Corporations have made the American worker irrelvant, and they've created a small upper echelon that has become wealthy beyond belief. That's what the Republicans have given us. And that's what patty's political/economic philosophy promises. It has been proven, there's no mystery involved. It has become popular for the right wing to pretend that they are arguing the merits of no government involvement in anything. Sorry, we can't buy it. They have the same history that we have. They just stand to profit from their stance so they make like we are the ones who don't get it. We do get it and we do need to call them out on it. btrieger, it's a complicated issue. And it would be an unpopular thing for us to discuss here. But we should not turn our backs on women in trouble... complications with a pregnancy, deformed fetuses, inability to carry a baby to term without seroiusly threatening her own life and the list goes on and on. The extremists deny that women have these probems and they turn their back on them because they have their own personal agenda. So it is easy for them to say they want to deny any type of funding for women experiencing a troubled pregnancy. It goes right along with them denying that there is a need for health care reform at all. Heartless buzzards.

Bernadette, I totally agree! But I do know that some people are in love with their band. I think we're all different and our doctors are different too. My best to you. Let us know how your revision is for you. bjean

Btw, I've lifted and pulled and pushed things down low and way overhead, time and time again. I do not believe that you could have pulled your port loose if it was properly installed. I'm no doctor, but if the things were that easy to dislodge, everybody would be in a world of hurt.

Hey Fab, I was very sorry to read your story. But I have to tell you that I am jealous that you're scheduled for revision and I'm not. I can't wait to get mine out and no telling when I'm going to be able to afford to have it done. There is a patient in my doc's office whom I've befriended who had the same symptoms that you have. She had a revision to a sleeve and she is one happy camper!! I hope that everything goes well for you and this is the answer to your problems.

Government isn't the problem. The greedy and powerful jerks who take advantage of others is the problem.

Reagan was an idiot who could deliver a speech. Actually he was smart in that he figured out before his brain went awry, how to take advantage of his star power. But being able to do that didn't qualify him to be governor, much less president. By the time he was out of office, most people knew the truth about Reagan. Now the right is trying to re-write history about Reagan. It somehow gives them comfort. Reagan was a tool of the rich and powerful in America.

Fascinating. A new poll, by whom? How was it worded? How do people know which bill before Congress it is that they're responding to? Anybody can claim anything. Marketing companies do it all the time to sell their products. But I must say that I don't doubt for a minute that Americans would rather not pay for other people's medical treatments. They can't even afford to pay for their own under the current system so why would they say they would like to pay for other peoples medical treatments under some new bill?

What 85% of people are you talking about liking their health care? Well Americans LIKE their HEALTH CARE, when they can get it. But they don't like what they're having to pay for it and they don't like being denied coverage by their insurance companies when they're paying astronomical premiums off the top! You're waaaay out in left field on this. On the right side of the left field, of course. You're always spouting about what our country is supposed to represent and what we're all about. Well, you're saying it's all about greed and disenfranchisement in your posts. I disagree with you. I believe that what has made this country great is people like Teddy Roosevelt - NOT Pat Robertson, Rush Limbaugh and Rupert Murdoch - who are all about keeping the little man down to make themselves more powerful. Merry Christmas oh ye of grumpy thinking.

Theodore Roosevelt said in Syracuse, NY, on September 7, 1903: "Let the watchwords of all our people be the old familiar watchwords of honesty, decency, fair-dealing and commonsense... We must treat each man on his worth and merits as a man. We must see that each is given a square deal, because he is entitled to no more and should receive no less. The welfare of each of us is dependent fundamentally upon the welfare of all of us." Theodore Roosevelt also said in Osawatomie, Kansas, on August 31, 1910: "The object of government is the welfare of the people." and he also said on June 17, 1912, in Chicago, IL: "This country will not be a permanently good place for any of us to live in unless we make it a resonably good place for all of us to live in." The greed and unfair dealings of the insurance companies and lobbyists have made health care "reform" a necessity in this country. The question should not be whether we need or want health care reform. The question should be how do we get the job done for the good of this great nation of ours so that it can be "...a reasonably good place for all of us to live in."