BJean

Oh gosh, you're right Carlene! What was I thinking?? He would be here if he could. We're just too darned entertaining and brilliant for a guy like that to willingly go without reading our diatribes. GREEN! PUT OUT THE APB!!!

I've been seriously concerned about T_O_M's whereabouts the past few days. I'm glad someone else opened this thread again. If anyone has heard from him somewhere else, please let us know that he's okay. I'd like to think he just got bored and went someplace that he's found to be more fun rather than to think there's something wrong.

Engines of Aggression.

LessthanBaxter: Awesome! That was the most eloquent and intelligent response to any of the posts here that I've read. I think I'm especially impressed because of your age and lot in life. I hope as you grow older that you can continue to try to be as open minded as you are trying to be. Discussing politics is a lot like discussing religion or other personal belief systems. We all have certain backgrounds that brought us to our current way of thinking. And you are so right - probably nothing anyone says here about GW one way or the other is going to change anyone's mind or vote. However, there is comfort in being able to discuss these things with people who pretty much agree with your own take them. It is very frustrating to have a President who goes against practically everything you believe in. Being able to have this forum and rant and rave with like-minded people seems to diffuse some of the pent up anger. At least it does for me. So I think you're smart to jump in, have your say, and if you aren't getting anything worthwhile from this forum, move to one that does provide something you can learn from or just flat out enjoy. Best wishes on your success in college.

Well I didn't have bronchitis, but did have laryngitis for 7 days and nasal congestion. I guess I did do quite a bit of coughing too. I can also feel it when I overeat, which is easy for me to do right now with no restriction. When I do that, it is very uncomfortable and I even have to keep some pressure on my port for awhile. Lifelongband: Congratulations! Sounds like you've found your sweet spot. That's great!

Itsuptome: We're the same height. You're inspiring me to go for it. My doc says he'll be happy if I get down to 140. But that didn't seem right to me for a 5'1.5" lady. I'm totally with you about your Marine nephew, who has proven his merit as a human being, a Marine and an American. You should be proud of him. I am. I am embarrassed and dismayed that our government allows our personnel to be exposed to the horrors of war and then doesn't do everything possible to ensure that they able to regain their health in every way possible afterwards.

I feel your pain... I have horribly arthritic knees. I can hardly walk and to exercise putting any weight on them is impossible. I too am hoping that weight loss will allow me more mobility and at least allow me some to build up some muscles again in my thighs and calves. My initial fill was 1.5 ccs and the 2nd fill he added .3 ccs. I have no idea what he will put in next time, but I haven't heard anything about checking to see how much is actually still in the band. I have wondered about it, especially since around a week ago every time I ate anything my port hurt and bulged out. Have you had that problem?

Itsuptome: I don't mean to change the subject but I noticed that your long term goal is 115. If you don't mind me asking, how tall are you? I used to weigh 110, but I think that would be an impossible goal for me after all these years of being over 200 lbs.

Itsgottago: I feel exactly the same way!! I was supposed to go for my 3rd fill today and got snowed in. Now I have to wait until next Tuesday. Since right before Thanksgiving I feel like I've spiraled back into some of the old bad habits. It's frustrating. The doc said this is only a tool - I understand that, but right now the tool isn't working! I'm getting no help whatsoever. I would rather be almost to the point that I can hardly swallow my own spit than go back the way I was. Something seems to have been happening to many of us at right about the same time. I don't know if it has something to do with the psychology of Thanksgiving, or if it is normal for us to have a couple of fills and then lose all of our restriction. I wonder, but whatever the reason, I want my tool to be there for me again!

Emails all over the 'net are asking for us to pray for our soldiers in Iraq. Let's not forget about our soldiers in Canada. They need our prayers too.

My DH has been a true patriot. He works for the government. He adopted my son and has taken care of two casualties of the Viet Nam fiasco. I appreciate hearing your story too GeezerSue. I haven't thought about these things for years. Those memories were way too painful to live with every day. I've always been able to shut things out and pretend they didn't happen. I adopted that at an early age due to a verbally abusive father and (probably) typical dysfunctional homelife. Unfortunately my first husband, the Viet Nam vet, was not so well equipped to handle what he saw and did. Green's post is heart wrenching. I had no idea that some of our servicemen and their families were dealing with a similar scenario today. I just cannot wrap my mind around the things these families have had to deal with. Probably many of them were regular Americans, serving their country in the National Guard, only to learn that they had to serve full time. And not only were they told they had to serve in a war zone, they have been made to return time and again after they were promised that they had fulfilled their National Guard duty. And this gives a whole new meaning to the derogatory nickname that the regular military gave our National Guardsmen.

LessThanBaxter: Thanks for your input. It is good to hear a seemingly rational person go about explaining why they believe George W. isn't as awful as so many of us here do. I believe you are very correct when you say that historians will have a whole lot to do with how the world perceives President George W. after he's dead and gone. They will probably take a much softer approach than we do - those of us who are actually having to live with his decisions on a daily basis. I'm trying to look at the big picture, really I am. But I can tell you for sure that the Dow Jones doesn't have a hellofa lot of impact on my personal welfare. Did you get rich yet? That was the one positive thing you said on George's behalf. As for us spouting disinformation, I'm not sure I follow you there. What biased information has been put forth? Not that there isn't some bias going on, but in the context of "information" I haven't seen anything in print here that isn't true. Generalizations? Well I haven't actually seen that either. Criticism? Yes indeed. It must feel pretty lousy when you agree with the President's politics and you observe him being trounced so heavily in a forum like this. That's certainly understandable. I don't blame you for wanting to set the record straight as you see it. You surely can understand why people here are so passionate, can't you? People who were opposed to Clinton and his behavior in office certainly were extremely passionate about removing him from office. They were certainly passionate about the fact that he displayed a major moral flaw with his womanizing while in office. Lots of folks were passionate and extremely vocal, and that was understandable. Surely you can, by the same token, understand why those of us who believe that Bush is a corrupt individual and the worst President ever to have served as President, are so passionate about it.

Ok maybe the Korean WAR ended, but we've had military personnel there since the 50s and we still have people there. Lots of men we knew served in Korea, not in actual combat, but in danger. George W. ain't that much younger than I. Guess the real point is, he didn't really serve ANYWHERE.

Right back atcha, Betsyjane!

Carlene I really don't think that people who either weren't born yet or don't understand how it really was during Viet Nam, can understand why we protest against the Iraqi war and why we think that GW has sold us down the river in so many ways. But even my daughter who wasn't alive during the Viet Nam War, my darling daughter who's a good Catholic endoctrinated girl, can understand how having the legislature and Supreme Court make a completely personal decision for a few pregnant women can impact all American women. She can understand why George Bush and people like him making such extreme right wing decisions for all Americans about abortion, stem cell research, social security, medicare or declaring war on a country can make our blood boil. She doesn't dislike George W., mind you, but to watch people defend his actions at this point, is truly mind boggling to her. All I can tell her is that maybe: 1) They don't understand how he has compromised the freedom that our Bill of Rights and Constitution have promised; 2) That GW wasn't willing to serve in any real capacity during the Viet Nam or Korean Wars but is way too quick to commit Americans to fighting anywhere anytime that HE has decided is prudent, even with all evidence and intelligence pointing to the contrary; 3) That he uses his Christian faith to justify and even glorify the decisions he has made that go against many Americans' beliefs, and that he even thinks that he was given the Presidency because God deemed it his divine right, and 4) That he and his cronies quite loudly pronounce that anyone who does not support the Iraq war is scornful of all American troops and that if anyone disagrees with his war mongering policies that they are labeled traitors and pointed to as anti-American. We've discussed the fact that perhaps those same people who don't find fault with any of the above, and those who claim that George W. is brilliant (truly mind boggling) must obviously agree with his decision-making and agree with his work toward the furtherance of extreme right wing interests. Those pro-Bush people must also be fooled into thinking that a vote for George W. is a vote for less government and lower taxes. We all hoped for that. But while I can understand totally a person's desire for less government and lower taxes, his actions have proven that he has given us nothing but the opposite, to an extreme. Good thing most of us aren't reading his lips. What got me so spun up today you might ask... more bombing, more death, less stability, no possible chance of reasonable negotiations for our withdrawal from Iraq.

We didn't have all those other foods to choose from. Optifast at that time was just the foul tasting liquid shake drink. And I know what you mean - if I never have to drink that stuff again I can die a happy woman too! My doc has a Protein shake mix that is really good. I can only get it from him unless I go to the source online. It's called Peak Performance. It is a whey based protein source. That made the liquid diet phase easy for me. Mung Beans? Sure sounds lucious...

Since we're posting about Viet Nam war service, I'll tell you about my experience. My DH (at the time) and I were 2 years into college, i.e. married and in college. He got drafted anyway... luck of the draw? Most of the time. However we knew people who were able to use influence to either get a deferment or get into the National Guard. Some who were totally opposed to the war figured out a way to get a medical deferment with the help of a doctor, or claimed to be of a religious persuasion that killing was against their religion. Some who didn't have influence somewhere to get a deferment or get into the National Guard, or pull one of the other schemes, either got drafted or went to Canada to escape. My DH got drafted and went directly to boot camp in El Paso and after that went directly to combat training in Louisiana. I went down to DeRitter, LA, rented the first available trailer just outside of post. Had a 18 yr. old pregnant girl from GA move in with me so that she could get to know her husband before he got killed in Viet Nam. The pregnancy was a total accident and they barely knew each other. I got to hold her hand and help her with money and tried to help her not miss her mommie so much. I was a couple of years older than she. The whole experience was an horrific nightmare that some still haven't been able to shake off. My DH was so terrified and convinced that he wouldn't come home, he talked my patriotic little self into getting pregnant so that there would be something of him to live on. Can you even begin to realize what that mindset was like? I had our son a couple of months before his father came home. He and one other guy in his platoon were the only guys who survived. His CO's wife was pregnant and supposed to deliver almost to the day that I was. His CO got killed when he was hit going out to meet a helicopter a few days after his wife delivered their little girl and I had delivered a little boy. When DH came back, he was indeed a changed man. Nightmares, yes, incredible, scary, sad nightmares. We tried very hard to make a go of it. But it was like living with a stranger. He was so traumatized that he only wanted to drink and smoke pot (which had helped him and thousands of others be able to live with all the death in Viet Nam). No, he had never smoked pot and never drank before Viet Nam. Not only was the killing traumatizing for them, the realization that most of the Vietnamese didn't want all this killing in their fields, was a hellish thing to realize. They wanted to be left in peace to just live. But none of the Vietnamese were immune to the nightmare that surrounded them every day. And yes, sometimes they took the other side and were responsible for killing the very men who were sent there supposedly to help them. Our men never knew for sure if a car bomb, a bomb planted on a baby or a hole in the ground was going to end their very existence or blow off a limb. Speaking of which, there were men who found the fighting and killing so impossible to endure that they would shoot off their own foot or hand to get out of there. A year after he returned home, we wound up divorced. I became a single parent which I had been, in a way, since the day he was shipped out. He spent years trying to recover and figure out what he should do with his life now that God has spared him and obviously had a larger plan for him. Almost fanatical religion was the road to his future and the end for me as his wife. I was a Methodist and I believed, but I was not ready to live the spartan life and move to a third world country to devote myself and my child in the way that he was. People say that Iraq isn't Viet Nam. But if you are living it, there's very little difference. Death is final, loss of limb or your mind is difficult for those who experience it and the people who love them. And for WHAT?! What did we gain from all that we lost in Viet Nam? If we had even learned a good lesson it might have been for something. But it's been long enough that we Americans have forgotten that nothing good came of that huge mistake. We have thousands of scarred families to underscore that realization, but we don't look at them and we don't talk about it. 9/11 made most of us so mad and made us feel so vulnerable that it took away our ability to reason and think clearly. GW and his cronies took advantage of that sensibility, pure and simple. I for one know what it is like to lose some of my personal freedoms. It's unAmerican and when someone takes away some of those freedoms, it is my job to fight it. If any of you think it is unpatriotic, I am sad for you. Because we let them do it to us in the 60s and they're doing it again to us and our young men and women today. Not only that... they want to take us back to the time of coat hanger abortions. And with our current Surpreme Court, it's only a matter of time before that is revisited in a very real way. They want to stop stem cell research. They can live with the fact that they have put Americans in harm's way for their own personal gain. We should be rising up and marching on Washington instead of venting our spleens here. If you think they're something to be afraid of now, I promise you it CAN get worse! Furthermore, I say hurrah for Nancy Reagan and her daughter for being vocal about the need for stem cell research. At least they're doing something they know is right, in spite of going against their own political party. If you call that unpatriotic I believe you are wrong.

Bitter doesn't need my help, but Missy4 was your Dad ever responsible for sending American troops into combat? I believe Bitter's point was that GW didn't put his ass on the line for his country, but he hasn't hesitated one second to put thousands of other American asses on the line in Iraq. Did your Dad show up to do his job when he was in the military? I believe the point was also made earlier in this thread that GW just didn't even show up. How does your Dad's service to our country (combat or not) compare in any way with George W. Bush's?

Gotta jump in here... if GW isn't the worst according to you, who is? His father? Or have you forgotten how GHW used his power to do things through Ollie North and others that were immoral and illegal? In this case the apple doesn't seem to fall far from the tree. Just because people like Rush Limbaugh and Pat Robertson and Ollie North say that GW is not a bad person, doesn't make it so. It only means that they are cut from the same cloth as he is... willing to do whatever they deem necessary for personal gain. Surely to God mainstream Republicans can finally agree that what we're doing in Iraq is wrong. All anyone has to do is watch what is going on there. Of course that doesn't seem to cause GW pause. He's still insisting that we're staying the course. If he were a Democrat, he would have been impeached or assassinated by now. Oh yeah, he has had an overwhelming Republican Congress to back him up. And if you have opposing convictions, you're labeled by them to be un-patriotic and disloyal to the troops. What a lousy thing... to use our military personnel and scream traitor to support your own arguments.

Not to be gross, but now that you mention it, it makes sense because a coke will make me burp and when I get the golf ball only a burp or two or a PB will help. So if it gets the burp up sooner, so much the better! Glad you shared that little tidbit.

That's the first time I've heard anything positive about carbonated drinks with the band. I'm amazed! Why doesn't everyone know about this?

Thanks Kat. I guess it's an "unstucker".

Gloom and doom. I'm up 2 lbs. I seriously lost it over the weekend. But I'm back on track today and cleaning out all of the things in my house that shouldn't be here to tempt me. I'm going to do a grocery run and restock all the good stuff. If the low-fat, lo-cal food is here I will eat it instead of falling back into old habits and running out for fast food. Tami or was it TrueBlue, who is doing so well and exercising 3 hours a day? Anyway I totally admire you and you continue to be an inspiration to me. I have bum knees so I can't do what you can, but I can do the exercises that I am able to and they help a lot. Just gotta keep that conviction to do them on a more regular basis!

Hey thanks a bunch! These will be great to put on my bulletin board. I'm guilty of more than a couple of them. It's easy to forget these fairly basic guidelines.

I'm beginning to realize that if I am exposed to anything that I like or that I know is tasty, then I start to crave it. I have been bad about being a binge person in the past. It's behavior that I am trying to change. Thinking about Thanksgiving foods that I love has made it very difficult for me these past few days. But the good result from it has been that I am realizing that when I was doing so well, I wasn't thinking about foods that I love and I didn't have them in the house at all. I made sure that I had lots of choices of low-carb, sugar free, low-fat foods in the 'fridge and pantry. Than if I saw a commercial or something that triggered thoughts about foods I love, I would allow myself something from the totally acceptable foods that are waiting to support me. And it worked! It is really silly to others, no doubt, but I'm trying to remember that high calorie foods are my enemy and nutritious low calorie foods are my friend.