BJean

Green you gotta be right about that. I feel like I think slow around those video game wizards. You have to wonder how things are going to be electronically in about 10 years. I have to admit that I use 10 words sometimes when 2 will do!

Carlene: Don't you find that most youngsters like to jump in, make a short concise statement that sounds credible enough, and then jump back out again without explaining how or why they came to that conculsion? They don't seem to enjoy a good argument. I think that it may be due to the fact that they've accepted certain things that they've read or heard because they like the sound of them. Life experiences... that's the answer for old ladies like us. Oh yeah, and knowledge.

My Dad worked on the railroad during the war. The importance of the railroad to the war goes pretty much without saying. However when I was growing up and all my playmates and classmates were asked about where their fathers served during the war, my father was discriminated against because he wasn't on the front line. I thought that it was unfair then and I still do today. However reading Bitter's post about how our tanks were no match for the German tanks brings to mind an earlier thread where it was brought up that the American defense industry is unnecessary and out of whack with what may someday be needed. Something about our being able to demolish the entire world X number of times over. The fact that our equipment during WWII was inferior and dealt us a disadvantage is a big reason why the build up of our defense industry has been so important to us. But it is not just important for the numbers of weapons or planes or tanks it makes, but it also shows other nations that we are the leaders in being able to defend of our country. It demonstrates that they should not believe that they can invade our shores without serious and effective reprisal from us. Whether we ever need all these munitions is, to some extent, irrelevant to the argument that we spend too much on defense. Having a strong national defense, in fact stronger than any other nation's, is what makes us the most powerful country in the world. That is important on so many levels in preserving our capitalist way of life. However how we use that strength is what makes us good or bad. Right now we have a bunch of people who believe that we should use our strength to make us richer, not safer. That makes our expenditures on defense look very bad. In fact in that context, you probably can't even call it our "defense" industry. But that's a whole different discussion. I think we should all do what we can to let our politicians and military know how we feel about American aggression and the misuse of our power.

wild_in97: You weight loss is actually a little above average according to my doctor. We are supposed to only be losing 1 to 2 lbs. per week. Those first big losses are due to things that are not all actually accumulated fat. Our fat stores are what we need to get rid of to lose the real weight and losing it over a longer period of time is what helps us get in the position to keep it off. Having a really tight band that doesn't allow you to eat solids for an extended period of time can cause you to not get the proper nutrition and can cause you to lose weight so fast that you will eventually have a lot of cravings that will subbotage your efforts. I'm not an expert, I'm just telling you what I've been told. It makes perfect sense. Like they say, if you keep doing the same behavior you've always done, you'll get the same results that you've always gotten. So if you are anything like me and have done diets that have been really restrictive and caused you to lose weight real quickly, but some time later you gain it all back, and more, you may be doing the same thing that you've always done. And you'll get the same results - unhealthy obesity. I've been having the same struggles as you. I am trying to decide whether to have another fill too. It's a tough decision because you know that if you can't eat, you'll lose weight faster. But I have decided that I'm in this for the 2-year plan that they promised will give me better health and will not cause me to lose my hair. I hope you continue to do as well as you have been and wish you all the success in the world!

Green: Hope you don't lose your pants when you stand up, like someone else here did. Or maybe it would be a cool homecoming demonstration for your husband. I thought we could blame anything and everything on George W.?? That was the way it worked when a Democrat was in the White House. Paybacks are hell. Happy New Year, people!

Green it sounds like you are about as independent as I am. Of course you're having to pay the price - house keeping. Bah humbug! But I don't blame you. I know the decision was made all in the name of meeting your weight loss goals. If you can't go outside for winter sports exercise, you can do some indoor cleaning exercise. heh, heh, heh. Plus (and this is a biggie at my relatives' homes) being able to miss exposure to all the Christmas goodies is a bonus. Let's don't even talk about the noise level stress from being cooped up with little rowdy ones. I am sure that when Dubya and the Mrs. had to spend some time in an armored vehicle as a precaution due to the tornadic activity in the area of their ranch a coupla days ago, they were sorry that they caused the weather to go south of Canada instead of where it belonged. Just trying to stay true to the thread...

OMG! That's amazing news about the weather up there! It's probably Dubya's fault. I'll bet a lot of the natives are happy about it though. They usually complain about too much snow and cold! Spring too short and all that. I miss it still.

Uh, okay. NO. I'd rather go skiing in Vail and ice skating in Ottowa. I don't have to worry so much about losing my head (literally).

What about the winter resort they built in Dubai? Now that took some folding money!

Betsyjane: My DH just got back from Abu Dhabi and if ya gotta go to that region, Abu Dhabi and Dubai are definitely the places to spend some time! (Even tho he was in a lux hotel with all the trappings, he'd still rather be in a Raddison deep in the heart 'o Tejas.) In the hotel where he stayed this time, they had a girls group all decked out in red and white Christmas attire (short skirts, even) and they sang American Christmas songs and even some Christmas carols to entertain the guests. It was surreal. But you're right - too bad they don't all catch the spirit of capitalism and enjoy life.

Iran probably couldn't have planned it better if they'd tried.

I guess MOM will post the final tally for everyone on Monday or Tuesday and then we can get our starting numbers, and our commitment to exercise registered for our St. Patty's Day Challenge.

Betsyjane: Some of the very vocal Bush & Cheney supporters in the media are finally admitting that Iraq is really about the oil. They've worked out some spin that they think will make it look like it's the best thing for America. What they don't point out is how many American lives have been sacrificed in the process and what a terrible mess the war is leaving in its' wake.

Tami & Karey: Thanks for your good suggestions. Since the surgery and subsequent weight loss, I can now do floor exercises if I don't put weight on my knees. So sitting or lying down is the plan. Water aerobics is definitely what I should be doing to maximize results. However since it is winter, that takes finding a place that offers it to fat people because I wouldn't be caught dead yet in a class with svelt swimmers! I have a feeling that if I could do some 2.5 lb. weights while I'm in a sitting position and could strengthen my upper body, it would definitely help with my metabolism. I have been seeing the exercise psysiologist and the exercises that she has given me are for water which I was doing at home when it wasn't so cold. She says water exercises are really all I can be safe in doing until I have knee replacements. However I think I can get away with the floor exercises since I've lost over 35 lbs. I don't know if anyone else here is kind of stymied with this problem, but I think that my getting involved in the exercise challenge is one way to get me more motivated. How will the exercise challenge work?

Betsyjane: Not too surprising that Germans supported Hitler, is it? I don't know how we talk sense into Americans. Pat Robertson and others have worked on this outcome for at least 20 years. I wonder if many people who support he and Bush, understand what they're REALLY getting. Even my own children don't really understand why I am so upset about the members of the Supreme Court who have been appointed by Bush. They will unfortunately have to watch it unfold.

lethea g: I hope your first paragraph is sarcasm. Further down, what you seem to be saying is that because you are a Christian, you are quietly asking God's forgiveness for the world (?) or us specifically on this thread (?) for having gotten "off track". I'm not sure of the track that you believe we should all be on. All Christians? All born again? Because all Christian faiths do not believe that one must be "born again" to be worthy of heaven. So is it just your Christian faith that is the right track? Or is it because we aren't "born again" and therefore going to hell? That is so much the point of this discussion, I believe, and I respect the fact that you have your beliefs but you are willing to pray for those who do not believe as you, rather than beating your breasts and screaming in our faces that we are wrong and that we are going to hell. There is a passage in the New Testament that says that (and I'm certainly paraphrasing here) believers in God should quietly worship and pray and if someone should ask about their faith, then they should quietly share their faith with the non-believer. I have not found that to be the case with many people today who find it their mission to discredit or even kill their fellow human beings, if those human beings do not share their beliefs. That's what we've been carping about here. Not about the Christians who care for and pray for their fellow human beings. The bad people aren't the Muslims who just go about their lives and daily prayers praising Allah. The bad people aren't the Christians who are tolerant of other religions and who respect their fellow countrymen. It is the intolerant, the hateful, the mean spirited and the terrorists who I have a problem with. I hope you are praying for them.

Gonnabe: I am supposed to get my 4th fill tomorrow! I am really worried that it's going to put me at that place where some people talk about not being able to eat anything or drink much. But I'm not losing as well as I should be and I'm hungry a lot. So I figure there's no way I've found my "sweet spot" yet. How will the exercise challenge work into it ya'll? I can't do much, but it won't hurt me to be more active than I am, that's for sure.

Betsyjane: I wouldn't have spoken with such a negative tone about the born again Christians quoted above, except for the fact that in some ways they are running things in this country, and except for the fact that some of them are trampling on our freedom. Otherwise I wouldn't care what they say or how they say it. I do get your point about Osteen. You could also mention Billy Graham, who's a born again. I have a lot of respect for him. He is a rational believer who for the most part preaches love and kindness. You may not agree with all of his teachings, but he doesn't spew the hateful venom that those do who are quoted in the post from Carlene.

Yep. Just like you'd get from a rabid dog.

Green: Good idea for Dobson - might strengthen his marriage. As for Clinton, at least we can be fairly certain we had a president with a healthy prostate.

Green: They certainly are weird folk. About all you can do is giggle and take another shot of whatever's handy. My first husband's brother was an evangelist. Of the Southern Baptist persuasion. In 1968, he was absolutely certain that the Rapture was going to happen within the next 10 years. He would preach for hours citing tons of written "proof" that as soon as the Israelites recaptured their lost ground, the Rapture would ensue. Poor dude is still waxing eloquent with the same old tripe. Far freakin' out!

Carlene: I hadn't heard the news. Don't you think they meant that the pages played a "joke" on Foley by the claim that he sent obscene messages? Don't you find it interesting that they would use this as another venue for them to condemn Clinton's consensual behavior with Lewinski? I am amazed that the Republicans still don't get it. They will probably go on forever about how what Clinton did was "illegal" and how sweet little girl Lewinsky was taken advantage of, etc. And the more they go on, and the more they try to make their behavior not look so bad by bringing up the Clinton "affair", the more ridiculous they look to the world. It would be like Clinton saying what he did wasn't so bad because of what Nixon did in the White House . They don't relate in any way. Do you understand what I mean?

Betsyjane: We sure have blown it! With this administration in office for the next 2 years, it is hard to believe that we're going to be able to get this country back on a reasonable path before something catastrophic happens.

Born agains don't believe that it will be the end of THEIR world. Just the end of the world for anyone who isn't "born again". The born agains will float up to join God and live in glory as angels in heaven. They believe that if they are married to a person who isn't "born again", that they will float up into God's realm and look down on their spouse, sleeping and unaware of Jesus's return. Those people who are left will have to endure all of the wrath and misery of the unsaved and unclean... and the end of the world as we know it.

I went there too and read those quotes. They were written and spoken by a lot of people who hate themselves and distrust their own inner feelings. They need structure and fear to keep them from wrongdoing. They need to quote the Bible and put down others for them to feel superior and holier than thou. They are terrified little, little, ignorant people. I always liked the quote, "Be good, for goodness sake." Not be good so you can be saved... smite your fellow countryman if he disagrees with your church's teachings... all in an effort to provie your obedience to God so as to obtain entrance into heaven. I feel really sorry for these ignorant bastards, except in the case of Ann Coulter, she's an ignorant bitch. I only wish it were true that the second coming of Christ is at hand; because Jesus himself would provide an education of love and peace that would reduce these selfish ignorant shells to rubble.